13634 réponses à ce sujet

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

Flamewielder wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...
I have a feeling that if they aren't an immediate and dire threat (or didn't contravene the thousands of sutras in some other way) they don't have to be killed. And since justicars only kill and don't arrest, I doubt they'd be called in.

I share the same view: I don't expect Samara will blow you up in your car for speeding 5 mph over the limit, or forgetting to use your signal lights before changing lanes... BUT I would expect her to Pull your car to prevent a crash, or pull a child out of the patch of a speeding vehicle.

The Codex actually suggests that Justicars are only called in to fight the worst possible kind of criminals, and only when all chances of a peaceful solution are exhausted, or to hunt down a murderous ardat-yakshi. Their mandate is first and foremost to protect the innocent and, failing the first, to punish the unjust responsible for hurting/killing the innocent.

In the meeting scene, Samara executes an unarmed Eclipse mercenary for refusing to answer her question about Morinth, even after explicitly telling the merc she would let her go if she answered. Why is this? Because I think that by refusing to answer Samara's question, she made herself an accomplice to murder after the fact by aiding and abating a convicted murderer.

The fact that Eclipse mercs earn their colors by killing someone must be known to Samara, yet she's willing to let the merc walk if she collaborates. Why? Because I think that Samara doesn't concern herself with crime not committed in her presence unless facing a known convicted murderer.

I don't believe Justicars randomly enter penal institutions to shoot inmates either... even the worst murderous scum is safe from them unless they escape.

Hmm. I always saw the situation with the merc as "IF you tell me where Morinth is, I'll leave immediatly. Which in turn, will mean that you'll live" rather than "I'll spare you".

But still. I think earthborn Shep did worse things than driving 5 KM/H faster than allowed. Even if those things were out of a need of survival. And I think it would some sort of extra dynamic.

Hell, it could perhaps be a parallel to how Morinth might be in the very start.

[xRAYZ0Rx]

I really doubt Samara or any Justicar would concern themselves with petty crimes committed years ago. Even if Justicars did deal with those kind of situations, I honestly don't think she's going to apprehend or attempt to kill Shepard when everyone knows life is riding on his shoulders. If you played Shepard as an Earthborn, he's more than made up for his life of crime on earth. I mean, you dont see Samara going after Wrex for being a Merc in ME1, or Jack for her past.

[SlottsMachine]

Flamewielder wrote...

I don't believe Justicars randomly enter penal institutions to shoot inmates either... 

Picturing this gave me a good laugh. 

[AdmiralCheez]

Juuust droppin' in to say that Samara's awesomesauce. I'd love to type up a TL;DR about why (which is pretty much everything about her save for the heels), but for now I'll drop the first thing that popped into my head when I saw her:



DEM EYES.



Hypnotic, I tell you!

[garrus and ashley fool]

did anybody romance samara

[SlottsMachine]

garrus and ashley fool wrote...

did anybody romance samara

Nope

[xRAYZ0Rx]

garrus and ashley fool wrote...

did anybody romance samara

Lol... i beat the game the first time. went on youtube, found out you can romance Samara (and fail). Looked at my save history. Time Played: Autosave: 26:42 Time Played: Normandy SR-2: 23:09

Yeah.... i ended up reloading it. played through 3 hours of gameplay just to knowingly get rejected by Samara...

I'm dedicated

[garrus and ashley fool]

xRAYZ0Rx wrote...

garrus and ashley fool wrote...

did anybody romance samara

Lol... i beat the game the first time. went on youtube, found out you can romance Samara (and fail). Looked at my save history. Time Played: Autosave: 26:42 Time Played: Normandy SR-2: 23:09

Yeah.... i ended up reloading it. played through 3 hours of gameplay just to knowingly get rejected by Samara...

I'm dedicated

lol i wanted her to but wasnt upset about getting tali but i want to see her face so badly

[xRAYZ0Rx]

garrus and ashley fool wrote...

xRAYZ0Rx wrote...

garrus and ashley fool wrote...

did anybody romance samara

Lol... i beat the game the first time. went on youtube, found out you can romance Samara (and fail). Looked at my save history. Time Played: Autosave: 26:42 Time Played: Normandy SR-2: 23:09

Yeah.... i ended up reloading it. played through 3 hours of gameplay just to knowingly get rejected by Samara...

I'm dedicated

lol i wanted her to but wasnt upset about getting tali but i want to see her face so badly

Tali reminds me too much of a... well, a virgin. I mean i know that sounds piggish of me to say but shes just so nervous and innocent that it doesnt attract me. Samara is just... amazing to say for lack of a better word. Mysterious, powerful, deep, wise, I could go on. and not to mention she is just down right sexy

[garrus and ashley fool]

xRAYZ0Rx wrote...

garrus and ashley fool wrote...

xRAYZ0Rx wrote...

garrus and ashley fool wrote...

did anybody romance samara

Lol... i beat the game the first time. went on youtube, found out you can romance Samara (and fail). Looked at my save history. Time Played: Autosave: 26:42 Time Played: Normandy SR-2: 23:09

Yeah.... i ended up reloading it. played through 3 hours of gameplay just to knowingly get rejected by Samara...

I'm dedicated

lol i wanted her to but wasnt upset about getting tali but i want to see her face so badly

Tali reminds me too much of a... well, a virgin. I mean i know that sounds piggish of me to say but shes just so nervous and innocent that it doesnt attract me. Samara is just... amazing to say for lack of a better word. Mysterious, powerful, deep, wise, I could go on. and not to mention she is just down right sexy

yes samara is but tali sweet innocents attracted me to her as well

[Xilizhra]

I'd be willing to if she becomes an LI in ME3.

[Sabariel]

garrus and ashley fool wrote...

did anybody romance samara

I tried, but she sent me packing

[Flamewielder]

xRAYZ0Rx wrote...
I really doubt Samara or any Justicar would concern themselves with petty crimes committed years ago. Even if Justicars did deal with those kind of situations, I honestly don't think she's going to apprehend or attempt to kill Shepard when everyone knows life is riding on his shoulders. If you played Shepard as an Earthborn, he's more than made up for his life of crime on earth. I mean, you dont see Samara going after Wrex for being a Merc in ME1, or Jack for her past.

That's pretty much the impression we all get. Justicars dispense on-the-spot justice to caught-red-handed criminals or known-to-have-been-previously-convicted criminals. Whatever Earthborn Shep or Jack did in their youth is now irrelevant to a Justicar: what they're concerned about is the direction you take while they're with you, not the path you travelled to get here.

[Flamewielder]

garrus and ashley fool wrote...
did anybody romance samara

My canon Shep is a War Hero Spacer Paragon (ok, with strong Paragade tendencies...) and went for friendship. Ash is still LI.

I also have a Sole Survivor Colonist Paragade who chose friendship, with Liara still LI.

I do have a Ruthless Earthborn Paragade that tried it though. But Kaidan is still LI.

[Xilizhra]

One of the numerous tragic aspects of the whole Samara/Morinth issue, I've realized, is that it's impossible to get both sides of the story in-game. If you kill Morinth, you find out that Samara always did love Morinth and hated the idea of killing her; if you kill Samara, you find out that Morinth was convinced that her mother never loved her at all even at first, and then came to hate her for her condition (yes, Morinth could be lying, but I choose not to believe it because her being honest makes the story more interesting to me), presumably extending that to Morinth's own sisters as well. It's telling that the last time Morinth was anything close to a "normal" asari was when she was the human equivalent of a young teenager, and her addiction has been warping her perceptions for four centuries thereafter.

[Xilizhra]

Oh, I don't think Morinth was correct; I completely believe Samara when she says she always loved her. I just don't think Morinth ever knew it.

[Flamewielder]

Which is exactly how the Codex describes asari who suffer from A-Y syndrome: sociopaths (which doesn't equate murderous or even violent behavior). I share Xilizhra's view that both are expressing their own perspective of the whole situation.

So an adolescent Morinth chose running over lifetime seclusion... you can't exactly blame her for running; it's the numerous deaths she's responsible for, wether she could control herself or not, that put her on the Justicars lists.

An A-Y suffers from a lack of empathy towards other sentient beings and thus has trouble "reading" their emotions. For humans, it's a skill we learn through social contact; A-Y can be expected to learn the same way, but will never achieve the empathic communion normal to their species. I think Morinth, like many adolescents, genuinely believed Samara abandonned her and later convinced herself that her mother didn't love her. There is no contradiction in the facts, only in their respective perceptions.

Modifié par Flamewielder, 04 février 2011 - 06:04 .

[Xilizhra]

Actually, I think that Morinth has trained herself to read other peoples' emotions fairly well, if only so that she can manipulate them. It's just that she's incapable of feeling them as if they were her own, whether because it's learned, caused by her addiction, or what. And against Samara, who deliberately puts up an extremely cold facade whenever meeting Morinth, she can't really see what Samara actually feels.



As an aside, and I apologize for pulling this thread away from Samara even further, but I'm going to say that probably Morinth's most powerful line (definitely the one with the most genuine emotion) is "I can't choose to stop being your daughter, mother."

[Flamewielder]

Xilizhra wrote...
Actually, I think that Morinth has trained herself to read other peoples' emotions fairly well, if only so that she can manipulate them. It's just that she's incapable of feeling them as if they were her own, whether because it's learned, caused by her addiction, or what. And against Samara, who deliberately puts up an extremely cold facade whenever meeting Morinth, she can't really see what Samara actually feels.

For myself, I don't think Morinth reads other people THAT well, as she would have been more suspiscious of Shepard. I'm more of the opinion that Morinth uses her Domination skill to manipulate others. That, and the "aura" of self-assurance that comes from 400 years of accumulating experiences drained from her victims.

But I agree that the steely resolve Samara has forced upon herself to do what has to be done makes her emotions unscrutable, from Morinth's perspective. Her mother cannot let her love interfere with her duty, so she keeps it bottled up. Morinth, not able to read anything from Samara, naturally assumes there's no love there in the first place.

Curing Morinth and letting them brush eachother's mind would shock/surprise Morinth and likely overwhelm Samara with emotions she would no longer have to suppress.

[Xilizhra]

Morinth is too used to people being genuinely enthralled by her when they meet her; I think she grew complacent.



I also think that if they melded as a first-time thing for Morinth, she would either die of shock or go completely insane; the input would be too much and too personal.

[Flamewielder]

Xilizhra wrote...
I also think that if they melded as a first-time thing for Morinth, she would either die of shock or go completely insane; the input would be too much and too personal.

However, were she to survive it, I think it would definitely qualify as a redefining moment for both. I believe Samara's relief upon "knowing" Morinth was cured and Mirala returned to her would largely outweigh her pain and sadness. Morinth would be shocked, for sure, but it's the kind of experience that could set her on the path to redeption.

[Xilizhra]

I'd say it'd be better for Morinth to be sort of coached with the melding process by another asari, but being able to successfully meld with her mother at some point would be a very good thing for her.

[Flamewielder]

For both of them, I think. Samara was looking forward to motherhood and seeing her daughters grow up. I don't think she'd turn down the opportunity if it presented itself to bond and have her daughters "know" how much she loves them, and how painful her decision to take up the Oath of Solitude was.



Thane and Kolyat have pitifully few years to say what needs to be said... Samara and her daughters would only need an hour, were they ever cured.

[kelmar6821]

What are y'all talking About? Nevermind, Lalalala! I still have yet to play tLoSB.