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[xRAYZ0Rx]

When a Justicar submits herself under an Oath of Subsumation, it allows the Justicar to follow that code, and that code alone. There is no moral dilemma that could occur within her, there is no loop holes or fine print, there is only the code in which she has sworn to uphold. Therefore she has the ability to make the right decision all the time by following this.

[Flamewielder]

volus4life wrote...
i don't get the point of the oath of subsumation. if she works with someone, why does she have to follow his or her moral conduct? i truly fail to see how this oath helps a justicar perform her duty.

A justicar is required to swear many oaths that serve to bind her to the tenets of the Code. For example, the first one is the Oath of Solitude, in which the justicar forsakes all ties to family (such as Samara's children and former spouse). In this case, the Oath prevents the justicar from being coerced through immediate family members ("We have your precious daughter, justicar... Give up the case or we'll return her to you... in 5 separate boxes.").

While the Code appears widely accepted among asari as the essence of what they believe to be right/virtuous, few non-justicar follow it rigorously. It is likely that asari law is based on the Code itself but is not consistently or strictly enforced. After all, Illium appears to be mostly law-abiding in spite of the presence of criminal elements like Eclipse and smugglers. Some cops may let you off easy for minor traffic infractions and such, if they're in a good mood or believe your explanation.

Justicars are zealots when it comes to following the strictures of the Code. This might be a source of conflict with the lenient cop I mentionned above. The justicar might also take issue with the cop's superior, the police comissionner, the mayor, the legislative assembly, the president.... in short, anyone they felt showed laxity in applying the Code/Law.

That's a problem, you see: all these people were selected or elected democratically because the asari felt they did a good (enough) job... should the Justicar waste time struggling against the will of the people? That's where the Oath of Subsumation come in.

The Oaths of Subsumation (there are at least 3) are designed so that Justicars will display sufficient leniency in their application of the Code, so that it matches appropriately with local law enforcement and thus minimize the chances of conflict. The First Oath likely acknowledges the authority of the asari participative democratic governement. The Second Oath likely concerns the acknowledgement of varying tolerance in local law enforcement and allows the Justicar to overlook minor offenses or tolerate things such as plea-bargaining. The Third Oath concerns working with non-justicars towards an appropriate goal, presumably allowing the justicar to tolerate shaking down informants, stealing mission critical items, breaking and entering, etc... as long as the justicar feels this is necessary to achieve the goal.

Anyway, there are Codex entries for this, you should check them out and shape your own opinion!

[Flamewielder]

Ahem... the "physicality" is... er.. maybe I'm just so caught by "dem eyes" that I don't notice the "bluebies" anymore... Samara's not that... "generously endowed", is she??



The face is certainly beautiful and appropriately strong... How's her acting? Can't say I follow many TV series...

[Xilizhra]

Flamewielder wrote...

Ahem... the "physicality" is... er.. maybe I'm just so caught by "dem eyes" that I don't notice the "bluebies" anymore... Samara's not that... "generously endowed", is she??

The face is certainly beautiful and appropriately strong... How's her acting? Can't say I follow many TV series...

For some reason, I found this post adorable.

[Flamewielder]

Yeah... it's funny how one's perception of the character's personality kinda influences your mental image of her. Her figure is statuesque, something the creators no doubt intended, but I simply don't notice specific features. Aside from dem eyes, of course... *___*



Funny... I just realized that I'm doing the same with Miranda!

[Xilizhra]

I wonder what Samara is likely to get in a theoretical next alternate appearance pack? Will it involve more visors everywhere?

[Ashira Shepard]

Since the Bioware peeps gave TALI a visor, inside her visor, then its most likely that Samara will also be getting a visor.

[Flamewielder]

I don't mind visors, as long as they "fit" the whole appearance concept. My main beef with AAP1 was: why hide Jack's beautiful eyes behind those ugly shades? The boots were great, the leather jacket was awsome. Garrus definitely deserved a new undamaged suit of armor...

There's a funny motivational about Grunt's dual visors... I think they work well visually, unlike Tali's.

Dem eyes are such a striking feature of Samara's character, it would be a shame to hide them behind shades or visors. Samara's armor is original and has interesting textures, reminiscent of studded leather. It's got a rigid collar and shoulder guards; the only clashing feature is this... er... opponent-distracting cleavage.

So, my recommendation for any AAP3: Keep the trademark textures, collar and shoulder guards, seal the front end, lose the high heels and don't hide the *___*

Modifié par Flamewielder, 09 février 2011 - 08:32 .

[DirtyVagrant]

Tali has a HUD on her helmet visor, not so much a visor IN a visor. It's weird. Ahem. And given the tendency in these Appearance Packs to add eyewear, I suppose it would only be an appropriate prediction that Samara might end of up with some of her own. Maybe attached to her forehead doo-dads.

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

Flamewielder wrote...

I don't mind visors, as long as they "fit" the whole appearance concept. My main beef with AAP1 was: why hide Jack's beautiful eyes behind those ugly shades? The boots were great, the leather jacket was awsome. Garrus definitely deserved a new undamaged suit of armor...

There's a funny motivational about Grunt's dual visors... I think they work well visually, unlike Tali's.

Dem eyes are such a striking feature of Samara's character, it would be a shame to hide them behind shades or visors. Samara's armor is original and has interesting textures, reminiscent of studded leather. It's got a rigid collar and shoulder guards; the only clashing feature is this... er... opponent-distracting cleavage.

So, my recommendation for any AAP3: Keep the trademark textures, collar and shoulder guards, seal the front end, lose the high heels and don't hide the *___*

I said it a few pages back. But Samara in armor akin to the Eclipse captain's but with a medieval-knight or samurai feel to it would be fooking badass. And there will be hell to pay if they cover dem eyes up!

[Flamewielder]

The female templar blademaster armor is still my favorite concept for an alternate Samara appearance (assuming automatic helmet toggle, of course, so I can bask in the radiance of the *___*)

[Captain Iglo]

*sniff*...seeing this pic I always have a little tear in my eye...
such potential...this game had such potential

And yes I would LOVE seeing Samara in an armor comparable to this.
Would be great if the armor would reveal some kind of official Justicar symbol.
Edit: And I think that kind of armor is way mor sexy then cleavage armor,

Modifié par Captain Iglo, 09 février 2011 - 10:54 .

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

Flamewielder wrote...

The female templar blademaster armor is still my favorite concept for an alternate Samara appearance (assuming automatic helmet toggle, of course, so I can bask in the radiance of the *___*)

Hmm. Not that bad, but needs more plate-armor covering rest of the torso, also needs to be made slightly more mass-effect'y and something to give her the holy warrior look.

Still, a decent base line for the knight armor. Now we just need something to base the samurai armor on!

[Siansonea]

yorkj86 wrote...

Flamewielder wrote...

Ahem... the "physicality" is... er.. maybe I'm just so caught by "dem eyes" that I don't notice the "bluebies" anymore... Samara's not that... "generously endowed", is she??

The face is certainly beautiful and appropriately strong... How's her acting? Can't say I follow many TV series...

She played Saffron, in "Firefly," and plays Joan Holloway, in "Mad Men."

I don't know if anyone has ever put forward Melinda Clarke, but I think she has Samara tendencies. She really did back in the days when she played Velasca on Xena: Warrior Princess.

[Flamewielder]

Siansonea II wrote...
I don't know if anyone has ever put forward Melinda Clarke, but I think she has Samara tendencies. She really did back in the days when she played Velasca on Xena: Warrior Princess.

Mmm... yes, eyes, facial structure, in her 40's (and a mom)... would the voice be a good match as well? Her "feminine attributes" are also more... modest... than Christina Hendricks, which might allow viewers to focus on the character's personality more than the obvious visual... er...distraction?

I think Melinda would benefit from being a mom and of "matron" age herself, to appreciate the tragedy and give the character the required emoptional depth.
www.melindaclarke.org/images/Melinda-Clarke-Picture.jpg

[Flamewielder]

Captain Iglo wrote...
*sniff*...seeing this pic I always have a little tear in my eye...
such potential...this game had such potential

And yes I would LOVE seeing Samara in an armor comparable to this.
Would be great if the armor would reveal some kind of official Justicar symbol.
Edit: And I think that kind of armor is way mor sexy then cleavage armor,

Armor can be faily light, given the proper advanced tech. Light armor means less fatigue, more freedom of movement... attributes that might be desirable depending on one's fighting style. In the case of the blademaster (who fought with 2 blades and used dodging/parrying for defense) armor plates protected the upper body (head, shoulders, arms & upper torso) and legs, with only the ballistic/ablative bodyglove covering the abdomen and hip joints, which allowed the full range of abdominal flexion/rotation.

If you're a straight-up fighter who's fighting style takes after main battle tanks, like Wrex, Grunt or Ashley... You might want to forsake dodging/parrying and speed for extra protection plates like the N7 armor.

In the case of Samara, heavy armor would require more effort to "levitate" herself. She's going to do most of her fighting from a distance and avoid melee combat as much as possible, Pushing or Throwing back opponents. So, light armor would make sense in her case (and flatter her figure).

[Siansonea]

Flamewielder wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...
I don't know if anyone has ever put forward Melinda Clarke, but I think she has Samara tendencies. She really did back in the days when she played Velasca on Xena: Warrior Princess.

Mmm... yes, eyes, facial structure, in her 40's (and a mom)... would the voice be a good match as well? Her "feminine attributes" are also more... modest... than Christina Hendricks, which might allow viewers to focus on the character's personality more than the obvious visual... er...distraction?

I think Melinda would benefit from being a mom and of "matron" age herself, to appreciate the tragedy and give the character the required emoptional depth.
www.melindaclarke.org/images/Melinda-Clarke-Picture.jpg

More than likely Movie Magic/"chicken cutlets" would be used to Samara-ize the actress' bosom if she doesn't happen to have the requisite curves.

[Ramirez Wolfen]

I have a question for you all. Exactly how old is Samara? In the game she says she is nearly 1,000 but [link] http://masseffect.bi...e/squad/samara/ [/link] says she's around 600.

[DirtyVagrant]

I couldn't put an exact number on it, but I believe she is still a matron. Look at her class power when you advanced to rank four and look at the description for Sapiens Justicar:

"Samara's biotic abilities now rival those of an asari Matriarch, further reducing the recharge time of her powers. "



That, to me, implies she hasn't reached the matriarch stage of her life yet.

[Ramirez Wolfen]

DirtyVagrant wrote...

I couldn't put an exact number on it, but I believe she is still a matron. Look at her class power when you advanced to rank four and look at the description for Sapiens Justicar:
"Samara's biotic abilities now rival those of an asari Matriarch, further reducing the recharge time of her powers. "

That, to me, implies she hasn't reached the matriarch stage of her life yet.

It also seems to be a bit of a hole on BW's part.

[xRAYZ0Rx]

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

I have a question for you all. Exactly how old is Samara? In the game she says she is nearly 1,000 but [link] http://masseffect.bi...e/squad/samara/ [/link] says she's around 600.

Honestly i think 600 would be too young to put her at. As she constantly is reminding Shepard she is near 1000 years old.  Insinuating that she'd be more near 1000, I'd say around 800ish. because considering Morinth was 440 (atleast) when we met up with her at Omega, (considering she ran away at age 40, and Samara has been pursuing her for 400 years) and Samara didnt have children till the Matron stage (around 350 years old).

Edit: Btw, since Samara has told us she melds very rarely with anyone, we can assume that even though 700 is typical age for Matriarchs, she may have suppressed this by not melding frequently. The same goes for Matron stage though I'm not positive about how Samara acted in her Matron stage other than her discovery of her combat abilities.

Modifié par xRAYZ0Rx, 10 février 2011 - 04:31 .

[Flamewielder]

yorkj86 wrote...
A certain poster on the forums likes to say that Samara is, for any kind of Shepard, more dangerous than Morinth.  Discuss if this is the case, and why you think it is, or isn't.

Though they're both dangerous, I think the danger is irrelevant.  It's either Grunt, or Wrex, who says that you don't stop using a weapon just because the recoil stings.  Also, saying that Samara is a danger to the crew, demonstrates a misunderstanding of the way Justicars work.

While I doubt the writer bothered pushing the ethical ramifications of such a thing as a Justicars to the point we have, we may attempt to draw logical conclusions about aspects of Justicars and their Code from the Codex, Samara's actions and words, and what outsiders say about her and Justicars in general. I think I've rambled enough about my rationale for believing Samara doesn't bother with crimes not resulting in the suffering/death of innocents.

Justicars are absolutely confident about their judgements. The only way they can be certain is if they catch the perp red-handed, or they are executing sentence from a legitimate prior conviction. In my opinion, Justicars do not attack mere criminal suspects on a whim, not before validating these suspicions in some way. Nor would she attack Shepard as soon as her Oath of Subsumation to him/her concluded. Shep and crew are no immediate threat to innocents, and the galaxy is full of worse criminals. All she has to do is step out of the Normandy and focus on the first goon she sees molesting someone. Were I a renegade Shep, I'd toss her off on Omega and just wait in orbit to watch how quickly the scum rats will start running for the space docks. That would be much more entertaining than just releasing Morinth on Omega... people would just die and there'd be no fireworks involved. No, Samara's still my choice for renegade Shep. Dangerous like a cannon, but you can tell the business end from the other and point it in the right direction easily enough.
 
Samara's no danger to Shep's crew, unless said crew deliberately tried to provoke something. In which case, I'll mix myself a drink in Kasumi's bar, put in one of them funky pink parasol things and watch the chaos on the docks thru armored portholes. If any of the crew are stupid enough to try and start something with Samara, they deserve whatever lumps they get.