2583 réponses à ce sujet

[Kronner]

Yeah, my current NG+ insanity Vanguard is:

Inferno Ammo 10
Squad Cryo Ammo 10
Heavy Charge 10
Champion 10
Area Reave 10
Shockwave 1

Shockwave is nice, but on Insanity, I never used it anyways so Squad Cryo Ammo wins out.

When I start my fresh Vanguard, though, I am not gonna take the Claymore unless there is some patch that makes it better because after some more testing, I think Evi is just as good or better than Claymore and Evi+Vindicator (or other AR) easily beats Claymore imho.

Modifié par Kronner, 12 février 2010 - 10:17 .

[Kurupt87]

the difference in playstyle is small in my experience, using scimitar/claymore/evi you find yourself charging enemies for the majority of fights. the only difference being that taking the claymore negates your ability to soften up enemies before charging. like i said, this softening up is generally only 1 or 2 cd's time before charging as you normally would, and makes things much safer as they die faster while you're in the open, which means you're in the open taking fire less . in the claymore's favour, there is little need to soften up most enemies due to its massive dmg. claymore build is a great style of play, and it feels really good 1 hitting things, but i find the versatility of AR/scimitar/reave, along with the added safety, to be worth it. also, against ymir mechs and the praetorian, you actually have something to do rather than whack out a heavy weapon, which i prefer not to use, or resort to smg/hvy pistol. vindicator with inferno chews through armour/shields/barrier due to the dots hitting instantly, but isn't a replacement for up close shotgun work.

[mundus66]

Kurupt87 wrote...

the difference in playstyle is small in my experience, using scimitar/claymore/evi you find yourself charging enemies for the majority of fights. the only difference being that taking the claymore negates your ability to soften up enemies before charging. like i said, this softening up is generally only 1 or 2 cd's time before charging as you normally would, and makes things much safer as they die faster while you're in the open, which means you're in the open taking fire less . in the claymore's favour, there is little need to soften up most enemies due to its massive dmg. claymore build is a great style of play, and it feels really good 1 hitting things, but i find the versatility of AR/scimitar/reave, along with the added safety, to be worth it. also, against ymir mechs and the praetorian, you actually have something to do rather than whack out a heavy weapon, which i prefer not to use, or resort to smg/hvy pistol. vindicator with inferno chews through armour/shields/barrier due to the dots hitting instantly, but isn't a replacement for up close shotgun work.

Incinerate only does damage to health and armor afaik.

[Kurupt87]

Dannok1234 wrote...

You wouldn't have to reload so much I suppose, and for the bubble part you'd have a bit more powerful weapon. Here's the first part of it with scimitar.

(edit: it's a bit clumsy tho' and slow due to frame rate issues, it's easy to do better)

oh and Kurupt87, it was an excellent summary of whats been happening in this thread. My earlier comment was meant to be positive I failed

eheh, thanks for compliment then

[_Dannok1234]

Inferno health damage is very very minor. The "panic" or stun/flinch/dance effect is whats imporant. Won't notice the dot damage unless you sit around and wait for it

Modifié par Dannok1234, 11 février 2010 - 03:28 .

[thisisme8]

Dannok1234 wrote...

Inferno health damage is very very minor. The "panic" or stun/flinch/dance effect is whats imporant. Won't notice the dot damage unless you sit around and wait for it

And there's just no time to wait.

Edit:  Not with a Vanguard, at least.  "I've lost shields!"

Modifié par thisisme8, 11 février 2010 - 03:33 .

[Kurupt87]

from my experience, and what i've learned from the forums, inferno is best on armour, i think the dots do double dmg or something instantly. on health the dots, like dannok1234 says, are minor and wont be noticed due to it being a dot, and only 1 being able to be active, and that it takes time to do its dmg, the flinch is whats important here. against shields/barrier, the dots do the dmg that they would do against health, but because each hits instantly you get the extra dmg from each dot, thats why inferno is effective against armour, and shields/barrier even if its not supposed to be, especially with shotties, 8 instant dots per shot adds up.

[sinosleep]

Just tested out the evi on the collector ship. I again, could not come close to duplicating what I did with in my collector ship vid with scimitar on the first platform. I've died on the first platform like 10 of the last 12 reloads and harbinger always takes over the guardian. With the scimitar harbinger NEVER showed up till the 2nd platform, and only showed up then because he shows up before the damned thing is even down. Even when I took barrier to try and extend my time the reload is just too costly and gets me killed. With the scimitars huge clip I waste no time. Just charge the middle drone, 2 shot him turn left 1 shot plus melee or 2 shot the other the guy, then finish the clip on the guardian and all three are dead.

[Kurupt87]

epic facepalm, 4th NG+ run, reading this thread every day, and i have only just realised that a respec gets you enough points to get max cryo at the cost of pull/shockwave, which is definitely worth it, along with maxing the other skills. excuse me while i go to sit in a corner facepalming myself for a good half hour or so.

so yeah, i'll edit my post to change it to kronners build.

be back in half hour...

[thisisme8]

Kurupt87 wrote...

epic facepalm, 4th NG+ run, reading this thread every day, and i have only just realised that a respec gets you enough points to get max cryo at the cost of pull/shockwave, which is definitely worth it, along with maxing the other skills. excuse me while i go to sit in a corner facepalming myself for a good half hour or so.
so yeah, i'll edit my post to change it to kronners build.
be back in half hour...

I feel you.  Especially in the early levels where one point can make a huge difference.

[Graunt]

I'm still not seeing the point of Cryo since it doesn't work until they are to the health bar.  Unless it prevents enemies from spawning while you're moving around the screen because you didn't kill what a new spawn would replace yet.  Also, I read somewhere that if you keep your squadmates abilities to manual that they won't overwrite squad ammo with their own if they have one.  Yet Zaeed is constantly turning on disruptor automatically when I have powers set to manual?

Modifié par Graunt, 11 février 2010 - 05:01 .

[GCreature]

Graunt wrote...

I'm still not seeing the point of Cryo since it doesn't work until they are to the health bar.  Unless it prevents enemies from spawning while you're moving around the screen because you didn't kill what a new spawn would replace yet.  Also, I read somewhere that if you keep your squadmates abilities to manual that they won't overwrite squad ammo with their own if they have one.  Yet Zaeed is constantly turning on disruptor automatically when I have powers set to manual?

Unfortunately you can only set it to fully active, or just use defensive and ammo powers. Unless I'm missing something, they're the only two options for me.

[thisisme8]

Graunt wrote...

I'm still not seeing the point of Cryo since it doesn't work until they are to the health bar.  Unless it prevents enemies from spawning while you're moving around the screen because you didn't kill what a new spawn would replace yet.  Also, I read somewhere that if you keep your squadmates abilities to manual that they won't overwrite squad ammo with their own if they have one.  Yet Zaeed is constantly turning on disruptor automatically when I have powers set to manual?

I guess you just have to try it and see if the effect is enough for you.  As for Zaeed...  I've got a similar problem with Grunt turning his Inferno amm off.

[Kurupt87]

maybe try activating his first then overwriting it with the desired squad ammo? you've probably tried it but if not give it a go and see if that works. otherwise, i dno.

[voidcommander9111980]

guys !!! slow down ...



The best armor to be true is the armor that you make by yourself

with bits of equipment



as for the most powerfull armor



is the collector armor only



cause i have vanguard also OF COURCE



and i recommend for special ability take Morith's DOMINATE



and you will be pain in the ass to your enemies



Joker out XD

[voidcommander9111980]

As for my powers ... hehe



i have heavy charge 10

cold bullets 2

inferno bullets 2

pull field !!!! (that rocks for husks - you kill them with one biotic shot -

cause of their fragile body)

master dominate 10

( you mesmerize your target - give him shields and he fights his allies heh)

champion 10 (renegade)

so now you understand that paragon SUCKS !!!!!!!!! BIG TIME

[voidcommander9111980]

BUT ONE LITTLE DETAIL ....



DONT MAKE SEX WITH MORITH ... cause the cipher that you you have inside you

will not save you this time

[Kurupt87]

good for veteran and below maybe, not for hardcore and above.
i could pick apart a couple of things, but the one that sticks out most is your point about pull field and husks. 1. first you'd need to strip the armour off of multiple husks to make pull field better than rank 1 pull, and with dominate as your bonus you have no way to do it, 2ndly, husks are in no way frail, tougher than normal enemies in my experience, both in regards to the amount of armour they have and the amount of health they have, although they are susceptible to having their legs blown off. plus, they are only in 3 or four battles throughout the entire game, so not really worth 10 talent points.
edit: also, on the lower difficulty levels, a pull field plus unstable warp combo is great, but you can achieve the same effect without help by just having hvy shockwave.

Modifié par Kurupt87, 11 février 2010 - 06:23 .

[ChaoticBroth]

All right, I take back my words. The Scimitar is a ton better than the Evi, especially for my playstyle. The larger clip size is a life saver, IMO. I don't have independent weapons tests, but the Scimitar's large clip size prevented me from getting turned into a doormat plenty of times.

[mozez101]

I know I asked this before, but since many people are changing their minds I want to ask again. Scimitar or Evi? For me I am leaning towards the Scimitar because of the larger clip size and the 2x fire rate.

[Seblun]

Just fell in love with the M-451 Firestorm. On Horizon I just took out the two Scions with absolutely no problem. Charge line them up shoot, they shoot Shockwave I charge right back in, shoot. It takes BOTH of the Scions down in a matter of seconds. Not to mention any of the Husks that were in the line of fire died as well.

Firestorm is under-rated and it's the best looking weapon on your back imo.

Modifié par Seblun, 11 février 2010 - 08:12 .

[_Dannok1234]

mozez101 wrote...

I know I asked this before, but since many people are changing their minds I want to ask again. Scimitar or Evi? For me I am leaning towards the Scimitar because of the larger clip size and the 2x fire rate.

It doesn't matter. Both will do the same job in about the same amount of time. It's all about what you prefer. We have vanguards posting vids that have been successful with scimitar, claymore and Evi. It's more about different flavors then which is better then the other. Though most will agree that the scimitar is the "safest" choice. As you yourself point out, it has more bullets, it fires faster. That makes it the easier choice when handling groups or if you miss a shot it doesn't matter as much as with the other two. For whatever it's worth personally I always use the scimitar.

[thisisme8]

Dannok1234 wrote...

mozez101 wrote...

I know I asked this before, but since many people are changing their minds I want to ask again. Scimitar or Evi? For me I am leaning towards the Scimitar because of the larger clip size and the 2x fire rate.

It doesn't matter. Both will do the same job in about the same amount of time. It's all about what you prefer. We have vanguards posting vids that have been successful with scimitar, claymore and Evi. It's more about different flavors then which is better then the other. Though most will agree that the scimitar is the "safest" choice. As you yourself point out, it has more bullets, it fires faster. That makes it the easier choice when handling groups or if you miss a shot it doesn't matter as much as with the other two. For whatever it's worth personally I always use the scimitar.

I don't think people are changing their minds with which is a better built weapon as opposed to which fits better to their playstyle.  I'm a huge Claymore advocate, but I'm doing a run with the Scim (although I used Evi up until Samara's recruitment mission.)  I'm really starting to like the Scim, but I have to play a little different to be successful with it.  I still lean towards the Claymore, but we'll see.

As a side note, the Evi does feel like a Claymore light.  I really do like it, but I promised myself I'd stick to the Scim for this run...  we'll see.

[sinosleep]

Dannok1234 wrote...

mozez101 wrote...

I know I asked this before, but since many people are changing their minds I want to ask again. Scimitar or Evi? For me I am leaning towards the Scimitar because of the larger clip size and the 2x fire rate.

It doesn't matter. Both will do the same job in about the same amount of time. It's all about what you prefer. We have vanguards posting vids that have been successful with scimitar, claymore and Evi. It's more about different flavors then which is better then the other. Though most will agree that the scimitar is the "safest" choice. As you yourself point out, it has more bullets, it fires faster. That makes it the easier choice when handling groups or if you miss a shot it doesn't matter as much as with the other two. For whatever it's worth personally I always use the scimitar.

I want someone to do the collector ship with a claymore or evi on insanity. As I've been saying for the last two days, I can't even come close to duplicating this with the evi or claymore, but can do it repeatedly with the scimitar. I seriously can't even make it past the very first platform most times without the scimitar, and it's got nothing to do with missing.

The issue is constant damage. With the scimitar's large clip I can charge the middle drone, 2 shot, turn left 2 shot, turn right and empty the clip into the last guy while taking minimal damage (constant damage results in staggering) and not allowing harbinger to take over. With the slower weapons even though I am one shotting the mobs there's no damage in between. I charge the middle mob and one shot him, but while the damned evi and claymore are either reloaded or just taking forever to get to the 2nd shot I'm getting riddled with bullet holes. By the time I make it to the guardian I'm pretty much already dead and he's NOT going down in one shot. At that point I either die due to damage, or he turns into Harbinger and then I REALLY get screwed. I mean, I'm sure it's beatable, but I can;t employ the strategy I know mercs the level so quickly with the scimitar with either of the other two.

Modifié par sinosleep, 11 février 2010 - 11:41 .

[DesolCobra]

Maybe it is because scimitar does 1.5 multiplier dmg to barriers and shields while claymore does 1.25 only. Drones are "Health + Barrier"!