2583 réponses à ce sujet

[thisisme8]

Kurupt87 wrote...

Yeah, reave is a good power in many ways, but it stops me, or at least limits, playing the vanguard how "i" prefer, which is repeatedly charging and shotgunning things to death. That is just the way i enjoy playing most, so i don't pick reave. If you prefer to strip a few defences yourself before going in, or play a ranged/controlling type of vanguard like sabre and thisisme8 have started to demonstrate, then reave could be just what you're looking for. If you prefer to be the primary source of damage, mixed with tank, and want to use shotguns, avoid reave.

Then you're just Charge Shotgun spamming!  Hehe, I'm just kidding.

Contrary to what that last video shows, my runs are a lot closer to the Painseeker Team Player and the How Not to Play a Vanguard 2 vids.  The Complete Control vid was just me goofing off on that mission because those Krogans had so much health and didn't stand a chance vs. Sniper + Pull.  Throw in Cryo on any build for more fun.  Charging, no matter your build, should be what you are doing 90% of the time.

[RamsenC]

Kurupt87 wrote...

If you prefer to be the primary source of damage, mixed with tank, and want to use shotguns, avoid reave.

This is one of the reasons I don't use warp explosions as much anymore. Unless it's staring me in the face as the only option I'd rather do the killing myself. It is also something that can be done by any class, take reave/energy drain as a bonus power and bring a puller and a warper. That's part of the reason I like drone so much, all it does is compliment my killings.

Also reave isn't THAT bad, its only OP when setting up warp explosions on barrier/armor enemies, but that's more because warp explosions are OP. I've never seen a reave Vanguard video with no warp explosions, but I'm sure it would be subpar. 

Modifié par RamsenC, 12 mars 2010 - 04:06 .

[Kronner]

Iz Stoik zI wrote...

I like reave, but I'll never use it again. It's the definition of an "I Win" button in this game, and I want to stay away from that. I like to stay away from what's most powerful in most games, and in Mass Effect 2 that's Reave.

SImply put, it's TOO useful, and I don't like any ability that I can spam ad nauseum to clear a room. The Vanguard has all the tools it needs already built in.

That is pretty much my opinion too.

RamsenC wrote...

This
is one of the reasons I don't use warp explosions as much anymore.
Unless it's staring me in the face as the only option I'd rather do the
killing myself. It is also something that can be done by any class,
take reave/energy drain as a bonus power and bring a puller and a
warper. That's part of the reason I like drone so much, all it does is
compliment my killings.

Also reave isn't THAT bad, its only OP
when setting up warp explosions on barrier/armor enemies, but that's
more because warp explosions are OP. I've never seen a reave Vanguard
video with no warp explosions, but I'm sure it would be subpar. 

haha, same here, some time ago I was using Reave as a weapon against guys I cannot charge, but when sinosleep suggested Pull Field, I never looked back at Reave

[RamsenC]

I might be using pull field over squad cryo as well, just because I want to try Grunt w/ Tali's drone for massive enemy distractions. Don't want to give up cryo, but since Grunt is just going to keep switching to inferno might as well.

[_Dannok1234]

A bit off topic, but does sort of relate to the last few posts about game being too easy at times.



Been musing a bit about the difficulty levels in the game. When you've played a lot it almost doesn't matter what difficulty you play at, because if you play without making mistakes insanity feels almost like "normal". I know there are differences due to how powers work against protection etc, but it's only when you mess up in some way or get a glitch that you really feel the difference.



Which made me wonder how the game would have been if the enemies had the abilities they should have. Such as Asari biotics having throw, pull, slam, singularity and tech's had cryo etc. Would probably make the game incredibly frustrating and painful to play, but some sick and twisted part of me really would like to experience it. Maybe have Hardcore like insanity is now, and insanity being enemies with full power usage. Then again, it's probably a horrible idea and thats why it's not in. Getting stun-locked does tend to get old fast.

[padaE]

I gave the Claymore another chance and now I feel that every time I spent without it was a waste.

[Iz Stoik zI]

I've yet to try the Claymore. From what i've heard, the Evi is almost as strong as it anyways, and with longer range and a 3 shot clip to boot. I've taken the AR once and Sniper twice at the Collector ship and never looked back.



Besides, I'm not twitchy enough to pull off the reload trick consitently.

[Kronner]

padaE wrote...

I gave the Claymore another chance and now I feel that every time I spent without it was a waste.

hehe welcome to the Dark Side, we have cookies

Iz Stoik zI wrote...

I've yet to try the Claymore. From
what i've heard, the Evi is almost as strong as it anyways, and with
longer range and a 3 shot clip to boot. I've taken the AR once and
Sniper twice at the Collector ship and never looked back.

Besides, I'm not twitchy enough to pull off the reload trick consitently.

Yeah, Evi is pretty good. So is Scimitar, it really comes down to personal preference, but you may want to try all shotguns just to be sure which one is for you.

Modifié par Kronner, 12 mars 2010 - 06:57 .

[Nexolek]

mmmmm cookies

[Kronner]

OK so after 3 days without ME2 I felt like killing some geth bastard and after I enjoyed it enough I thought I'd try something different so here is the whole Tali's Loyalty Mission -  The Cheap Way, I think I picked up all important stuff (upgrade, credits, ship model, medigel), but the vid also shows just how easily can Vanguard avoid most of the geth in this mission. Squad Cryo Ammo is really great against geth. And I was not nice to Tali

[Sabresandiego]

At first people claimed that my "tactical" style was not an optimal way to play. I proved them all wrong with my videos by consistantly beating the same levels in less time and with no health damage taken. So now what do they say? My tactics make the game too easy. I'm sorry but that is a cop out. This entire guide is about how to make the vanguard perform optimally. If you want to claim that the way I play makes the game too easy, you might as well undo all of your talents and only use a pistol. Also do the opposite of everything this guide says because it makes the game too easy. These arguments are getting to be ridiculous.

[Kronner]

Sabresandiego wrote...

At first people claimed that my "tactical" style was not an optimal way to play. I proved them all wrong with my videos by consistantly beating the same levels in less time and with no health damage taken. So now what do they say? My tactics make the game too easy. I'm sorry but that is a cop out. This entire guide is about how to make the vanguard perform optimally. If you want to claim that the way I play makes the game too easy, you might as well undo all of your talents and only use a pistol. Also do the opposite of everything this guide says because it makes the game too easy. These arguments are getting to be ridiculous.

Who says so? I don't think I ever said that. I merely posted that I do not enjoy using such combos. Just wondering towards who is this post ment.

[TheBestClass]

I really wish I could get Pull without putting those 3 points into Shockwave. I'm using Reave now and it is pretty overpowered and I feel like such a skank for using it. Is Squad Cryo worth sacrificing for Pull?

[Kronner]

TheBestclass wrote...

I really wish I could get Pull without putting those 3 points into Shockwave. I'm using Reave now and it is pretty overpowered and I feel like such a skank for using it. Is Squad Cryo worth sacrificing for Pull?

Depends on your playstyle

[RamsenC]

Sabresandiego wrote...

At first people claimed that my "tactical" style was not an optimal way to play. I proved them all wrong with my videos by consistantly beating the same levels in less time and with no health damage taken. So now what do they say? My tactics make the game too easy. I'm sorry but that is a cop out. This entire guide is about how to make the vanguard perform optimally. If you want to claim that the way I play makes the game too easy, you might as well undo all of your talents and only use a pistol. Also do the opposite of everything this guide says because it makes the game too easy. These arguments are getting to be ridiculous.

Who ever said warp explosions aren't the optimal way to play? I've been saying for a long time warp explosions are the best thing to do to health only enemies.

At first I thought your tactical style was reave spam by the way you described it, but it's not. It's about settings up warp explosions. That's why I wanted you to make a video with energy drain as a bonus power vs. some shielded enemies, but you never did

The only problem with the reave build is that it limits when you can do the warp explosion combo. You need one stripper, one set upper, and one warper. If you have reave your job as the stripper doesn't work on blue shield enemies, hence why pull is better on Shepard. However, you can just respec to energy drain when needed and it's no problem. 

Modifié par RamsenC, 12 mars 2010 - 08:21 .

[TheBestClass]

Kronner wrote...

TheBestclass wrote...

I really wish I could get Pull without putting those 3 points into Shockwave. I'm using Reave now and it is pretty overpowered and I feel like such a skank for using it. Is Squad Cryo worth sacrificing for Pull?

Depends on your playstyle

I Charge a lot. I guess that can be said for any Vanguard though. I guess my question is: does Pull have enough synergy with Charge that it's worth maxing out? Or sacrificing Squad Cryo?

[Kronner]

TheBestclass wrote...

I Charge a lot. I guess that can be said for any Vanguard though. I guess my question is: does Pull have enough synergy with Charge that it's worth maxing out? Or sacrificing Squad Cryo?

After you Charge, Pull is not really good option, you usually wanna charge again just to get your barrier back and kill some more guys. Pull (on Shep) is great range talent. I'd go for rank 3 Pull on Shep, just in case you need it and take Samara or Jack with Pull field (if you wanna do Warp explosions, its pretty handy), and I'd keep Cryo Ammo, you do not have to worry about it after you put it on for your squad and sometimes it can surprise you how effective it is.

Modifié par Kronner, 12 mars 2010 - 08:21 .

[Sabresandiego]

My video encompasses everything I wrote in my Tactical Vanguard guide. Nobody is paying attention to how I set up those warp explosions (mainly with charge and scimitar), how I avoid taking any damage completely (using cover and tactical charges), how I use alternate methods of engaging targets which are bad to charge (harbinger with sniper, reave on clustered enemies), etc...

[Kronner]

Sabresandiego wrote...

My video encompasses everything I wrote in my Tactical Vanguard guide. Nobody is paying attention to how I set up those warp explosions (mainly with charge and scimitar), how I avoid taking any damage completely (using cover and tactical charges), how I use alternate methods of engaging targets which are bad to charge (harbinger with sniper, reave on clustered enemies), etc...

Hm, I still do not get where does this come from, no one in this thread ever said your style was not ok, optimal, effective etc.
Some people refuse to use Reave, but that's about it though.

Modifié par Kronner, 12 mars 2010 - 08:25 .

[TheBestClass]

Kronner wrote...

TheBestclass wrote...

I Charge a lot. I guess that can be said for any Vanguard though. I guess my question is: does Pull have enough synergy with Charge that it's worth maxing out? Or sacrificing Squad Cryo?

After you Charge, Pull is not really good option, you usually wanna charge again just to get your barrier back and kill some more guys. Pull (on Shep) is great range talent. I'd go for rank 3 Pull on Shep, just in case you need it and take Samara or Jack with Pull field (if you wanna do Warp explosions, its pretty handy), and I'd keep Cryo Ammo, you do not have to worry about it after you put it on for your squad and sometimes it can surprise you how effective it is.

Hmm... I think I'll stick with Area Reave and Squad Cryo. Those 3 points in Shockwave to get Pull are a killer for me. Thanks for the help.

[_Dannok1234]

Sabresandiego wrote...

At first people claimed that my "tactical" style was not an optimal way to play. I proved them all wrong with my videos by consistantly beating the same levels in less time and with no health damage taken. So now what do they say? My tactics make the game too easy. I'm sorry but that is a cop out. This entire guide is about how to make the vanguard perform optimally. If you want to claim that the way I play makes the game too easy, you might as well undo all of your talents and only use a pistol. Also do the opposite of everything this guide says because it makes the game too easy. These arguments are getting to be ridiculous.

I think you are giving Reave way too much credit to be honest. You could probably get the same speed using warp explosions off your charging. Also how fast you are able to beat that level has way more to do with your own reaction time, how well you know the layout of the level, skill and your pc to some degree for decent fps.
Much more so then which skills you pick. While I personally can't beat your time, I can do the same area in the very nearly same speed, regardless if I use reave or not. Hell I can do it nearly as fast with just the shotgun as I can while using Warp Combo's. (Something i personally find very entertaining). 
Bottom line, how fast you can do the place, says more about how well you know the level and your skills at playing this game, then which ability you use.

One thing I'm wondering about. Are you under the impression that others don't play their vanguard tactically just because they do not always use Warp combo and reave? Playing in a "tactical" way doesn't really have anything to do with which abilities you make use of, but how you use the ones you have. 

[Iz Stoik zI]

Sabre, we all know that a Vanguard with Reave is a very powerful class. Nobody is denying it. I just don't like abilities that can single-handedly win a battle by spamming a button over and over and Reave is one of those abilities. For me, it makes the game TOO easy, regardless of the situations in which it is most effective. Simply having an ability (a bonus power no less) that can win a battle on it's own is not for me.



So use what you want and post all of the Reave promoting videos that you want but it wont change my opinion of Reave: it's as close to an "I Win" button as there is in this game, and I won't use it because of that.



On another note, that was quite excessive self promotion in your post.

[Sabresandiego]

I only use reave effectively 3 times in the entire video, and I probably charge upwards of 20 times. My video is promoting charge, scimitar, reave, tactical use of cover, ranged attacks, essentially "tactical gameplay" which reave is only one element of. If I sound self promoting I apologize but I get tired of people misrepresenting my tactics, it is far more than reave spam.

[RamsenC]

Again to clear things up, I'm down on warp explosions because it feels like its the dominant strategy for this game no matter what class you are. It homogenizes the classes because they can all do it. Not trying to hate on anyone. 

Even as a soldier you can pick Reave/Energy drain as a bonus power depending on mission or just strip with weapons and set up warp explosions all day. Every single class can do this, because every single class can be one part of the three part combo if needed. Reave can only be part of this combo some of the time, hence me thinking it's not the best option all the time, but there's always respec.

edit: It reminds me of the force field exploit in dragon age. It worked VERY well and I used it at first, but gave it up because it made the game less interesting to me. 

Modifié par RamsenC, 12 mars 2010 - 08:49 .

[Sabresandiego]

Ramsen, warp explosions are one of the "features" of this game and are the premiere biotic combo. They are not some glitch like forcefielding a tank in dragons age (which was fixed) they are designed by the developers to be used abundantly. Saying you are down on something because its effective only would make sense if it was broken/buggy. And Ive stated before that many things in this game are extremely powerful besides reave and warp explosions. Adrenaline Rush can be spammed every 3 seconds and basically wins you the game. Using slow motion widow head shots as an infiltrator is also the biggest I win in the entire game. Just cloak if you are ever in danger.