192 réponses à ce sujet

[Dethateer]

toezz wrote...

Dethateer wrote...

That Reaper died a hundred million years ago, not 25k. Lrn2listen2TIM, plox.

No YOU need to LRn2ListN

The Reaper ship is believed to be over 37 Million years old.
And i don`t think they`ll miss by 63 Million years

you just got wacked with self inflicted heavy burn

i gain 20+ renegade points

No, you failed. The shot that scarred Klendagon is 37 mil years old (yes, I did f**k up on that 100 mil year thing, MY BAD), and that's the shot that killed the Reaper. Therefore, it died 37 mil years ago. Clear?

[dissonance-zaon]

Balek-Vriege wrote...

*major snip*

In some twisted savior complex they feel the need to "save" other species from their ultimate mortality by doing the same thing to them.

My theory is not too different from yours.

I believe I heard Harbinger say something along the lines of "We're the saviors of your destruction".

[Jzadek72]

R0ck3t33r wrote...

It would explain away most of these inconsistencies, except for Vigil's miscommunication. That one seems kind of unforgivable.

Thoughts?

Vigil doesn't know everything. There, problem explained.

[General Battuta]

Fair enough, but it's as if Empire had ended with the revelation that Vader didn't kill Luke's father, but then failed to explain that Vader was his father.

[Kyria Nyriese]

Haven't read this all the way through so not sure if someone else said anything about this or not, however, in ME1 there is reference to the Rachni Wars - 2000 years prior or more - that they were started by an outside force. It is quite possible that the Citadel signal failed millenia ago and that Soveriegn was trying to find a way to get access to the Citadel then.



While I don't have insight into Bioware's story, personally I believe this has been going on longer than anyone thinks. That is why we are seeing the things we are seeing. As for the shapes of the Reapers, they assume in ME1 - no one but Saren actually studied a Reaper - that they are sentient machines, there is nothing saying that we don't have all the information on them, and they very well could be exactly what they were trying to turn the Protheans/Collectors into.



As for choosing humans, maybe it is said more times than it should be, however, the fact that we are apparently a genetically diverse group, much more so than the other species in the galaxy, could have something to do with why the Reapers decided to 'Harvest' us instead of the other species. There could also be the fact that with the exception of the Rachni and the Krogan (Pre Genophage) we tend to be a fairly prolific group, makes even more sense. Though again I could be reading more into than there actually is.



Just my 2 cents worth anyway.

[Rilke21]

It seems like the apologists for the Governator reaper are willing to believe just about anything...anything that helps them to accept an utterly hashed-together story. Like the OP, I was puzzled right away when the armada of Reapers all turned out to be squids. I also wondered why the omnipotent god-machines would have any trouble making Prothean reapers. The explanation is simple: there isn’t one. (But feel free to come up with as many convoluted back-stories as you like. They’re really quite amusing.)



Legion (the only interesting character in the game) does mention something interesting if you choose to preserve the Collector base. He suggests that the human-reaper would have incorporated the minds it “ate” into a consciousness that’s similar to the Geth (granted, I’m reading between the lines here.) This actually sounds like a pretty noble idea, considering the Geth are about the only species capable of objective judgment...then again, since judgment is based on combing many perspectives, and a finished reaper would only have one perspective, the omnipotent god-machines sound a little short-sighted here.



But I digress. The ending is ridiculous. ‘Nuff said.



(Oh wait, one more thing. If the human-reaper is supposed to be stuck inside a squid exoskeleton, then why did the well-preserved but hole-filled derelict reaper have nothing but squid parts inside? And why would the fetus be decked out with high-powered beam guns? Maybe so it could tear a hole through its own hull? Must be like a cyanide pill. That’s gotta be it. Suicide mission ftw!)

[Thermorium]

The main problem with creating prothean reapers would probably be the opposite of why the humans are so damn useful for creating them. The prothean were pretty much done evolving. Humans still had a lot of different genes.

Or maybe they couldn't use the 4strand DNA

[Cpl_Facehugger]

Rilke21 wrote...

It seems like the apologists for the Governator reaper are willing to believe just about anything...anything that helps them to accept an utterly hashed-together story. Like the OP, I was puzzled right away when the armada of Reapers all turned out to be squids. I also wondered why the omnipotent god-machines would have any trouble making Prothean reapers. The explanation is simple: there isn’t one. (But feel free to come up with as many convoluted back-stories as you like. They’re really quite amusing.)

Uh, the reaper armada isn't all squids. There are many, many different shapes of reaper. 


For instance, take a look here. The guy in the lower left corner doesn't appear to have arms at all. The one in the lower right looks asymmetrical, while the one in the middle has four tentacles while the one to the lower right of him has two pincer-like claws. And then there's the one that's shaped like a crescent back in the upper left. 

(Oh wait, one more thing. If the human-reaper is supposed to be stuck inside a squid exoskeleton, then why did the well-preserved but hole-filled derelict reaper have nothing but squid parts inside? And why would the fetus be decked out with high-powered beam guns? Maybe so it could tear a hole through its own hull? Must be like a cyanide pill. That’s gotta be it. Suicide mission ftw!)

Of the vast multi-kilometer form of the dead reaper, we saw, what, how much of it? And then when we got to its eezo core, we were certainly too close to see whether it looks like any organic species' body. 

As for the beam guns... Good question, best guess is that reaper repurposed energy distribution system into death rays for great justice and Shepard-slaying. Defense mechanism most likely. 

 

Modifié par Cpl_Facehugger, 08 février 2010 - 08:02 .

[IamDanThaMan]

Some have Suggested that the protheans weren't genetically diverse enough to be turned into a reaper, but consider the fact that the two races that operate in that same way, the collectors and the keepers, are both insectoid in nature. So it is probable that their physiology is incompatible with turning them into a reaper. Put that together with the fact that the Collectors had been abducting hundreds of people before this and never created a reaper before this, there could be something inherent to the human race that is compatible with making a reaper. Maybe we are fundamentally similar in some way to the original reaper species that other races are not.

[Balek-Vriege]

Rilke21 wrote...

It seems like the apologists for the Governator reaper are willing to believe just about anything...anything that helps them to accept an utterly hashed-together story. Like the OP, I was puzzled right away when the armada of Reapers all turned out to be squids. I also wondered why the omnipotent god-machines would have any trouble making Prothean reapers. The explanation is simple: there isn’t one. (But feel free to come up with as many convoluted back-stories as you like. They’re really quite amusing.)

Legion (the only interesting character in the game) does mention something interesting if you choose to preserve the Collector base. He suggests that the human-reaper would have incorporated the minds it “ate” into a consciousness that’s similar to the Geth (granted, I’m reading between the lines here.) This actually sounds like a pretty noble idea, considering the Geth are about the only species capable of objective judgment...then again, since judgment is based on combing many perspectives, and a finished reaper would only have one perspective, the omnipotent god-machines sound a little short-sighted here.

But I digress. The ending is ridiculous. ‘Nuff said.

(Oh wait, one more thing. If the human-reaper is supposed to be stuck inside a squid exoskeleton, then why did the well-preserved but hole-filled derelict reaper have nothing but squid parts inside? And why would the fetus be decked out with high-powered beam guns? Maybe so it could tear a hole through its own hull? Must be like a cyanide pill. That’s gotta be it. Suicide mission ftw!)

There are a couple problems with your post.  First of all every human skeleton that's cybernetic is going to look like the terminator.  Why?  Because that's what our skeletons look like.

Second, very few of the Reaper ships are squid like in the last sequence.  Search youtube Mass Effect 2 Reaper Ending or something a long the lines.  What they all have in common is an arched back.  The lengths and forms of the Reaper ships are mostly different and a lot don't even have tentacles.  Again, it seems a ship/carapace/armor is built around each Reaper after its completion.

I agree with most of second paragraph, but again like I mentioned in my last post the Reapers might be the result of what happens to mortal lifeforms when their turned into a god-like hive mind:  They take on the uncaring, arrogant and god-like facade that Reapers seem to all have in common (Although Sovereign seemed much more self sentred then the Harbinger does in ME2).  This goes into the whole "If you took away the bad parts and downsides of what makes you, is the result still you or are you now something/someone else entirely"?

Edit:  Also quite frankly we don't even know what were looking for when it comes to a lifeform inside the Sovereign design Reapers.  From the outside the "ship" part is mostly intact and when we get into the inside of it the scale is too large.  At some point  Shepard must have passed from the ship into the actual Reaper "brain" when he/she reached the core.

Modifié par Balek-Vriege, 08 février 2010 - 08:03 .

[toezz]

Kyria Nyriese wrote...

Haven't read this all the way through so not sure if someone else said anything about this or not, however, in ME1 there is reference to the Rachni Wars - 2000 years prior or more - that they were started by an outside force. It is quite possible that the Citadel signal failed millenia ago and that Soveriegn was trying to find a way to get access to the Citadel then.

While I don't have insight into Bioware's story, personally I believe this has been going on longer than anyone thinks. That is why we are seeing the things we are seeing. As for the shapes of the Reapers, they assume in ME1 - no one but Saren actually studied a Reaper - that they are sentient machines, there is nothing saying that we don't have all the information on them, and they very well could be exactly what they were trying to turn the Protheans/Collectors into.

As for choosing humans, maybe it is said more times than it should be, however, the fact that we are apparently a genetically diverse group, much more so than the other species in the galaxy, could have something to do with why the Reapers decided to 'Harvest' us instead of the other species. There could also be the fact that with the exception of the Rachni and the Krogan (Pre Genophage) we tend to be a fairly prolific group, makes even more sense. Though again I could be reading more into than there actually is.

Just my 2 cents worth anyway.

I personally dont believe that we are more genetically diverse but more psyically diverse than other species or that migth go hand in hand with DNA, im no scientist.

If you compare the different species by looks, history, ages (Krogan and Asari), and soforth.
But what do i know about a made up DNA compared to our DNA.

As ive seen it, humans in the ME universe seems to be the only species who are not afraid or defensive, nor have any great weaknesses + we have a great mindset and maybe thats what the reapers like (or dislike) about us.

Maybe we are in some way like them, if you draw lines between the reapers and:

Udina
Cerberus/Tim
Alliance (which has funded cerberus or are still funding them)

And the fact that humans have made it so far so fast in the gallactic politic may be a threat to the whole galaxy, and by being like this the reapers migth fear the humans will take over their godly role in the galaxy.
Or simply kick their asses, which we have done a couple of times allready, and no other species has done this since who knows.

Also many humans have that "need to rule" personality.. we are a power race, which i haven`t feelt the other races are.
All wars in the galaxy have either started with/or involved the Reapers(Rachni Wars And Extinction every 50000 years) or humans (First Contact War, and that **** with the batarians), except quarian/geth which seem like another topic.

Before that there was peace as far as i remember, except when reapers have come to erase all galactic life.

Basically the Reapers are as much threat to us as we are to them! 

I may be wrong or missinformed on things here but it`s my opinion.

Modifié par toezz, 08 février 2010 - 08:15 .

[BattleVisor]

Its amazing how most of the people and OP who are arguing against the story, know very little of it to begin with.



Ignorance is bliss.



If you're not going to read the codexes, and the books, and pay attention to the game, at least read

the wiki

[Brand New]

I'm pretty sure that vigil is only on one planet in one location, how would he know. His assumption as an AI is that all the protheans were taken and disappeared. He only knew as much as programed and told on Ilos.



Also the derelict reaper, you can say exactly. We don't really see it from many angles. Also the fact all of the reapers at the end of the game look slightly different. You can tell the variation of their upper shell area. The codex states that the human looking reaper was simply a prototype. Where are you people missing the fact it was a prototype & not meant to be what the reapers are.

[Rilke21]

BattleVisor wrote...

Its amazing how most of the people and OP who are arguing against the story, know very little of it to begin with.

Ignorance is bliss.

If you're not going to read the codexes, and the books, and pay attention to the game, at least read
the wiki

Brilliant! Blame the glaring plot holes of a video game on books that 99% of people who play the game will never read!

[Dethateer]

BattleVisor wrote...

Its amazing how most of the people and OP who are arguing against the story, know very little of it to begin with.

Ignorance is bliss.

If you're not going to read the codexes, and the books, and pay attention to the game, at least read
the wiki

Then enlighten us, O master of the ways of Mass Effect.

[Rilke21]

Cpl_Facehugger wrote...



 

Dunno mate. It looks to me like the 4 most prominant repears here are basically squid-things shown from different angles. The one on the far right could also be a squid thing, but we can't really see it. The ones in the background? All squid-things. So we've established that 11 out of 12 reapers are squid-things, and the one on the right is a maybe-squid-thing. hum.

[Alien1099]

Rilke21 wrote...

Cpl_Facehugger wrote...



 

Dunno mate. It looks to me like the 4 most prominant repears here are basically squid-things shown from different angles. The one on the far right could also be a squid thing, but we can't really see it. The ones in the background? All squid-things. So we've established that 11 out of 12 reapers are squid-things, and the one on the right is a maybe-squid-thing. hum.

Oh my god do I have to open up photo shop and show the blatantly different designs on them? Open your eyes.

[BattleVisor]

For the last time, the protheans look nothing like the collectors!!!






Colllectors = mutated protheans, that look more like reapers/crab like

Modifié par BattleVisor, 08 février 2010 - 08:47 .

[Dethateer]

You rip on people for not knowing ME lore when you don't know RL biology? LOLWAT?

[Annihilator27]

Yes the collectors were heavily modified. I think they only had one strand of D.N.A related to the orignal protheans.

[toezz]

Rilke21 wrote...

Cpl_Facehugger wrote...



 

Dunno mate. It looks to me like the 4 most prominant repears here are basically squid-things shown from different angles. The one on the far right could also be a squid thing, but we can't really see it. The ones in the background? All squid-things. So we've established that 11 out of 12 reapers are squid-things, and the one on the right is a maybe-squid-thing. hum.

And all chinese people look the same.. Yellow things

All insects with wings are the same thing.. Flying things

If you had 6 arms, 10 legs and were shaped differently than everyone else, but you had a shell you`re automatically a tortoise.

[Annihilator27]

toezz wrote...

Rilke21 wrote...

Cpl_Facehugger wrote...



 

Dunno mate. It looks to me like the 4 most prominant repears here are basically squid-things shown from different angles. The one on the far right could also be a squid thing, but we can't really see it. The ones in the background? All squid-things. So we've established that 11 out of 12 reapers are squid-things, and the one on the right is a maybe-squid-thing. hum.

And all chinese people look the same.. Yellow things

All insects with wings are the same thing.. Flying things

If you had 6 arms, 10 legs and were shaped differently than everyone else, but you had a shell you`re automatically a tortoise.

Nice

[Brand New]

BattleVisor wrote...

For the last time, the protheans look nothing like the collectors!!!






Colllectors = mutated protheans, that look more like reapers/crab like

Why do the protheans appear as collectors in the vision on that prothean ruin then? This is one very odd thing  i don't get.

[Dethateer]

Because the vision is trying to tell you the Protheans have been turned into Collectors. Don't ask how or why, 'cause that I has no idea.

[Alien1099]

Dethateer wrote...

Because the vision is trying to tell you the Protheans have been turned into Collectors. Don't ask how or why, 'cause that I has no idea.

I think it was just supposed to be forshadowing.