376 réponses à ce sujet

[SuperZombieChow]

jason9880 wrote...

cashogy wrote...

cronshaw8 wrote...

BioWare has said numerous times that this trilogy is "Shepard's story" as such if Shepard dies in your ME2 game you will not be able to import that save game. You will definitely be Shepard in ME3 not some other person.

I know Bioware has said that this is Shepard's story.  However, I dont understand why theyd include the possibilty of Shepard dying, and then state that his living/dying will have consequences later, if they were just going to keep him alive in ME3 regardless. If they do that it leaves a lot of plot holes for people whose Shepard does die

It's a sucide mission, whats wrong with serious consequences if you're not prepared. Shepard is dead, you don't get to carry anything over, that's how your story ends.

Unless Cerberus (Shadow Broker/Your Deus Ex Machina Here) clones dead sheperd back to life. That way there are consequences for Sheperd dying at the end of the mission, but the story can still contine. I strongly suspect that sheperd dying will be the default for players starting fresh without importing from ME2, and the benefits and consequences of survival are only for those who import a survivng character.

[inversevideo]

cashogy wrote...

cronshaw8 wrote...

BioWare has said numerous times that this trilogy is "Shepard's story" as such if Shepard dies in your ME2 game you will not be able to import that save game. You will definitely be Shepard in ME3 not some other person.

I know Bioware has said that this is Shepard's story.  However, I dont understand why theyd include the possibilty of Shepard dying, and then state that his living/dying will have consequences later, if they were just going to keep him alive in ME3 regardless. If they do that it leaves a lot of plot holes for people whose Shepard does die

My take on this, Cerberus has much vaster resources than anyone suspects.
Heck it's possible the Illusive Man is the Shadow Broker, and gets a piece of everyone's action, to fund his activities. Even if he is not the SB, T.I.M, has funding that no one can calculate.

What this means, is that T.I.M has Shepard's genetic code now.
I firmly suspect, that if Shepard dies, in Me2, T.I.M will use Shepard's DNA to do the 'CYLON' thing, and make a genetic twin, complete with Shepard's memories, but perhaps dedicated to Cerberus.

Much in the same way that Miranda's father made a younger genetic twin of her; identical in every way.
Miranda's twin does not share her memories, but Shepard's twin would. They would download the information, into the new body (BSG style - like Boomer & Athena sharing memories and experiences, yet being two different people).

So Bioware will be correct, there will be a 'Shepard' , in ME3, if your Shepard dies, in ME2, it just will not be 'your' Shepard; s/he will belong to and fight for T.I.M. , against the Reapers.

Which could make for an interesting dynamic all on it's own. As the 'new' Shepard seeks to reconcile his/her current existence, with what they know of their predecessor, while figuring out how best to put an end to the Reapers.

Just my theory, but it seems to make sense, extrapolating from the given  technology displayed by T.I.M (in bringing you back) and Miranda's, yet to be named 'father' (in the creation of his offspring).

Heck, even if your Shepard survives, s/he may be in for a shock, if T.I.M turns loose his own version of Shepard, to further his agenda. After all, whats the best way to stop Shepard, and maybe even infiltrate the Council/SPECTRES? With ones own genetic duplicate of Shepard? 

Just a nasty thought... would not put it past BIOWARE.

Modifié par inversevideo, 08 février 2010 - 05:50 .

[KainrycKarr]

inversevideo wrote...

cashogy wrote...

cronshaw8 wrote...

BioWare has said numerous times that this trilogy is "Shepard's story" as such if Shepard dies in your ME2 game you will not be able to import that save game. You will definitely be Shepard in ME3 not some other person.

I know Bioware has said that this is Shepard's story.  However, I dont understand why theyd include the possibilty of Shepard dying, and then state that his living/dying will have consequences later, if they were just going to keep him alive in ME3 regardless. If they do that it leaves a lot of plot holes for people whose Shepard does die

My take on this, Cerberus has much vaster resources than anyone suspects.
Heck it's possible the Illusive Man is the Shadow Broker, and gets a piece of everyone's action, to fund his activities. Even if he is not the SB, T.I.M, has funding that no one can calculate.

What this means, is that T.I.M has Shepard's genetic code now.
I firmly suspect, that if Shepard dies, in Me2, T.I.M will use Shepard's DNA to do the 'CYLON' thing, and make a genetic twin, complete with Shepard's memories, but perhaps dedicated to Cerberus.

Much in the same way that Miranda's father made a younger genetic twin of her; identical in every way.
Miranda's twin does not share her memories, but Shepard's twin would. They would download the information, into the new body (BSG style - like Boomer & Athena sharing memories and experiences, yet being two different people).

So Bioware will be correct, there will be a 'Shepard' , in ME3, if your Shepard dies, in ME2, it just will not be 'your' Shepard; s/he will belong to and fight for T.I.M. 

Which could make for an interesting dynamic all on it's own. As the 'new' Shepard seeks to reconcile his/her current existence, with what they know of their predecessor, while figuring out how best to put an end to the Reapers.

Just my theory, but it seems to make sense, extrapolating from the given  technology displayed by T.I.M (in bringing you back) and Miranda's, yet to be named 'father' (in the creation of his offspring).

Heck, even if your Shepard survives, s/he may be in for a shock, if T.I.M turns loose his own version of Shepard, to further his agenda. After all, whats the best way to stop Shepard, and maybe even infiltrate the Council/SPECTRES? With ones own genetic duplicate of Shepard? 

Just a nasty thought... would not put it past BIOWARE.

No...you just won't be able to import the save. They have already said this.

[jason9880]

SuperZombieChow wrote...


Unless Cerberus (Shadow Broker/Your Deus Ex Machina Here) clones dead sheperd back to life. That way there are consequences for Sheperd dying at the end of the mission, but the story can still contine. I strongly suspect that sheperd dying will be the default for players starting fresh without importing from ME2, and the benefits and consequences of survival are only for those who import a survivng character.

Well that's just wrong, dev's have said you don't import anything if Shepard died.

[SuperZombieChow]

You don't have to import to make Sheperd's death have consequences. If Shepard dies, so does everyone else on the mission. Thus you can write them all out. Anyone starting a new character without importing defaults to "Dead Shepard, dead ME2 Team".



Of course, then that also invalidates your ME1 choices. That's a shame, since I think the whole thing could have been more gracefully handled.

[SharpEdgeSoda]

Here's a simpler solution.

New game means new characters. Good luck dealings with your Tali cameos.

It's more likely that through some glorious bit of horribly inconvinient (fan rage inducing) coindences, Sheperd will need a new team. Some old favs might return (Does Garrus and Tali REALLY need to be 3 for 3 though?), most will not. Yet all of them, who survive that is, will have an appearance somewhere. 

That's how I believe it will be handled.

Modifié par SharpEdgeSoda, 08 février 2010 - 05:57 .

[cdsmith0]

Ok i know we all want a character back.....Personally if Tali vas normandy is back in ME 3 as a squadmate I will flip the **** out..... But you have to remember that ME 3 is a culmination of 1 and 2. So it is safe to say most of your squad in 3 will be of characters in 1 and 2.



Bioware has been pushing the example of your choices in 2 effect everything in 3......I am sure they are planning way ahead of time to include a crap load of story and characters in the game.

[NoUserNameHere]

I can fix all the OPs problems in one blow:



Default ME3 Shepard gets all but *insert least likely to return squaddies here* to survive the mission. If you import a save with everyone alive, then the excess squaddies make cameos and appear in a sidequest.



If you happen to have lost any of the squadable members in ME2, then tough luck, you just made ME3 that much harder for you, Commander Failure.

[SidNitzerglobin]

It seems like a no brainer that Liara and Ash/Kaiden will be back as squad mates at some point in ME3. They could be NPCs again, but I highly doubt it.

Assuming he's alive for you in ME2, Wrex might play a role leading the united krogans against the Reapers, but as an NPC again.

Tali has a logical out of going back to the migrant fleet, but will almost assuredly be back due to the revolt among her supporters if she wasn't. At the very least she'll play a big role as an NPC.

Jack could easily disappear for no reason at all. Samara could continue her justicar-ing. Grunt could go back to hang w/ clan Urdnot. Thane is probably dead regardless of the outcome on the Collector base. Legion could easily go back to his collective.  Zaeed was a hired gun in the first place, so I would assume he's gone.

Miranda and Jacob might be back by virtue of them being LIs in ME2, but I could only really see this in a paragon ending where they have tendered their resignation from Cerberus w/ extreme prejudice.

I honestly can't see an out for Garrus, short of offing him in a cut scene in the beginning of ME3. Seems like he wouldn't miss fighting the Reapers w/ Shep short him being dead. There's nothing else to pull him away from the Normandy.

I also don't see what Mordin would have going on that would preclude his staying on the Normandy, as either a squad member or an NPC science officer.

I think BioWare will probably be including relatively significant roles for all of your potentially living team members from ME1 and ME2 except for possibly Jack, Samara, Thane, Zaeed, Grunt, and Wrex (although I would think we'd wind up w/ at least one krogan crew member). I don't think this would be nearly as impossible a task as the OP believe it would be. Those who killed of most of the crew members would just have a lot less potential crew mates in ME3.

.02

Modifié par SidNitzerglobin, 08 février 2010 - 06:55 .

[cdsmith0]

As long as Tali has a major lover story in the game i don't care what they do....but remember a large part of the games have been the Romances. They will probably conclude those as well, meaning conclude with an ending to the romance you have in the games.

[CubemonkeyNYC]

I think the solution will be to have 3-4 new members in ME3 so that you can have a team in the event that you got almost everyone killed in ME2.

[jedierick]

I think that it is possible to have all of your current crew in ME3. The only thing that would have to be programmed is two alternatives for each character.



1. Did they survive

2. Did they die



If they survived, then they can be on your ship, if they died, they cannot. Simple as that. I can see sending your crew out in different directions to rally the troops so to speak, so maybe they are not with you in ME3, similar to what they did with ME1 characters.

[KainrycKarr]

SuperZombieChow wrote...

You don't have to import to make Sheperd's death have consequences. If Shepard dies, so does everyone else on the mission. Thus you can write them all out. Anyone starting a new character without importing defaults to "Dead Shepard, dead ME2 Team".

Of course, then that also invalidates your ME1 choices. That's a shame, since I think the whole thing could have been more gracefully handled.

What part of "that's incorrect" doesn't make sense? Bioware has stated that the trilogy is Shepard's story.

You seriously think they'd kill him off twice, in the beginning of the game?

[Kenthen]

SharpEdgeSoda wrote...

Does Garrus and Tali REALLY need to be 3 for 3 though?

Yes.
Garrus and I have a serious bromance going on. Bros stick together. Tali is too useful not to keep around and, besides, my Shepard's tapping that.

[Archereon]

Tooneyman wrote...

I have to state this one just as a personal reference. YES and YEs bioware does have the man power and the resources if they wanted too to plus that off. They would need all of the KOTR Team who are busy working on the MMO here in Austin, TEXAs BAby to do it but they do have the resources. Plus the monsta. EA IS also their main funder now and they are doing just fine. So know your role and shut your mouth plus you need to read the link above you They tell you right their! holla at ya boys!

Are you kidding?  EA is doing so bad that Disney is looking to a point in the future when Electronic Arts may be an affordable buyout...DISNEY!!!  (That would be the only circumstance that I'd ever hope for EA to make a finnancial recovery, having Disney dominate the game market would be unacceptable.)

[cronshaw8]

It actually could be less work to bring back the ME2 squad-mates. There won't be as much to talk to them about.

Shepard: "So jack tell me about your tattoos"

Jack: "Didn't we go over this already"

[SuperZombieChow]

KainrycKarr wrote...

SuperZombieChow wrote...

You don't have to import to make Sheperd's death have consequences. If Shepard dies, so does everyone else on the mission. Thus you can write them all out. Anyone starting a new character without importing defaults to "Dead Shepard, dead ME2 Team".

Of course, then that also invalidates your ME1 choices. That's a shame, since I think the whole thing could have been more gracefully handled.

What part of "that's incorrect" doesn't make sense? Bioware has stated that the trilogy is Shepard's story.

You seriously think they'd kill him off twice, in the beginning of the game?

Yes, I expect a company that puts a suicide mission at the end of a game, with every intention of creating a sequel, in a series that bases a large amount of it's appeal on players making lasting choices, could conceivably use a simple Deus Ex Machina to bring Sheperd back without invalidating the possibility of his/her death. Perhaps they will, perhaps they wont, but saying that just because you can't import a dead Shepard means that Sheperd dying couldn't possibly have consequences is an unnecessary assumption.

In all likelyhood you're right, but I'll keep hoping you aren't.

Modifié par SuperZombieChow, 08 février 2010 - 06:09 .

[CommanderShawn]

they might just bring back 2 or 3 people from ME2 and put them in ME3 like they did for this game they bring back 2 people from ME1 as squad mates and the rest are people you might run into while playing

[Console Cowboy]

i will be very disappointed if Jack and Mordin aren't squad members.



come to think of it i'm pretty sure i said the same about Wrex and Liara at one point. hmm...

[Nozybidaj]

Cutlass Jack wrote...

If none of your ME2 squadmates are available in ME3 I wouldn't bother buying the game, because clearly none of the choices you made in the second game had any relevance whatsoever. I wouldn't care at all what happened in ME3 because my decisions had no impact. It would completely disconnect me from the story.

Just saying.

LOL that's almost exactly how I felt in ME2, weird.

[Nozybidaj]

Ragabul the Ontarah wrote...

Surely, that would be feasible unless someone imported an epic fail save in which they managed to kill 2/3 of the ME cast.  But again who the heck does that?  Then, you would have REAL consequences. 

I'll be doing that ON PURPOSE for my ME3 import just to trim the fat so to speak.

[KainrycKarr]

SuperZombieChow wrote...

KainrycKarr wrote...

SuperZombieChow wrote...

You don't have to import to make Sheperd's death have consequences. If Shepard dies, so does everyone else on the mission. Thus you can write them all out. Anyone starting a new character without importing defaults to "Dead Shepard, dead ME2 Team".

Of course, then that also invalidates your ME1 choices. That's a shame, since I think the whole thing could have been more gracefully handled.

What part of "that's incorrect" doesn't make sense? Bioware has stated that the trilogy is Shepard's story.

You seriously think they'd kill him off twice, in the beginning of the game?

Yes, I expect a company that puts a suicide mission at the end of a game, with every intention of creating a sequel, in a series that bases a large amount of it's appeal on players making lasting choices, could conceivably use a simple Deus Ex Machina to bring Sheperd back without invalidating the possibility of his/her death. Perhaps they will, perhaps they wont, but saying that just because you can't import a dead Shepard means that Sheperd dying couldn't possibly have consequences is an unnecessary assumption.

In all likelyhood you're right, but I'll keep hoping you aren't.

The trilogy is Shepard's story. cloning him, via Cerberus, or whatever, in any way shape or form, is just plain bad storytelling.

bioware is not a one-trick pony. Killing him in ME2, again at the end, and at the beginning of ME3 BY DEFAULT is just a bad story.

[TSamee]

Personally, I'd like the previous LI to stick around a bit. I mean, between ME1 and 2, you've been separated for two years, I can understand them not being sure about you, both as a person and about the fact that you're with Cerberus. But I feel that both Tali and Jack (if you went through the Paragon romance) both feel pretty attached to Shepard, and unless he decides to die again, they should stay.



Tali trusts you enough to take off the mask. In Quarian culture, it's the deepest symbol of trust, friendship and love you can show anybody. You're exposing yourself to disease, to something that, at best, will cause a severe allergic reaction, and, at worst, kill you. But you don't care; this person's worth it.



Jack ends up showing you another side of her personality, and you gradually find that she's lonely. She seems all hostile, and then she opens up to you, and eventually you find out why she's hostile towards you later; it's because she's afraid of letting someone else get close and then die for her. Survivor's guilt. Now, she's made up her mind, and seems to really love Shepard. As in, not just for a fling but in a proper, deep sense... and she still stays tough as bloody nails towards everyone else. No typical "vulnerable female" development there, and I loved that.



Any way you look at it, both of them can easily be really attached to Shepard, so seeing them just bugger off wouldn't be all that great. Oh, and I think we might have Garrus too, seeing as there's nothing for him to do besides kick Reaper arse at Shepard's side.



Also, I'd like Legion. Finding out more about the Geth would be really cool. Let's assume that, behind the Veil, most Geth are as advanced as Legion due to there being so many of them in close proximity. That means that the Quarians could negotiate with them, and possibly manage to repossess the homeworld. Bit far-fetched, I know, but it's a dream.