16 réponses à ce sujet

[Jaekahn]

For those who have the experience of an Engineer, what type of playstyle do you prefer? The demolisher where you scrap their shields and armors, or the tech master where you focus on CCing and distracting?
 
I'm still early in my playthrough. I've been playing on Hardcore and I just got Garrus and Mordin as squad mates. I've been running with Jacob and Miranda and my strategy consists of distracting the targets with drone, wear down their armor, then finish the target off with warp explosion. My bonus ability is barrier up until I am able to recruit Morinth for Dominate. I think I am going to focus on the Demolisher playstyle up until that point, then switch to Tech master with dominate.

[Grand_Commander13]

I went with Demolisher: I have two direct damage abilities that benefit greatly from another +15% damage, while the only ability I have concerned with duration is Combat Drone which rarely lasts its full time anyway. Simple math.

[The_mango55]

Plus the drone has an incredibly short cooldown anyway.

[IceSavage]

AI Hacking Benefits from duration increase, but while AI Hacking worked well enough in ME1, you fight more organics in ME2.



I never bothered with AI Hacking or cryo-blast (Why stun someone when I can kill him just as good)

[Murmillos]

Demolisher - and max out Overload and Incinerate. And at least two points into drone, AI hack and Cryo blast (for the fun) - but I do area cryo blast do deal with the groups of mass rushing husks. Then pick a good barrier reducing bonus skill. Pick a squad member that gives you a good squad ammo bonus (either AP or Incinerate) and you are good go to deal with any problem in the game.

[SonsofNorthWind]

Like everything, it depends on your difficulty.



Veteran -: Grabbing Dominate and AI Hacking is great fun, as it gives you some of the best CC in the game in conjunction with your Attack Drone. Even with the lack of enemy defenses on these difficulty modes, the AoE on CC abilities has gone down dramatically in this game. Getting them angry at their allies, though, has great effective radius.



Hardcore+: Demolisher is the way to go, as the majority of your effect on the battlefield will come from Incinerate, Overload, and blazing away with your Avenger into the enemy backside while they deal with your Explosive Drone. AP Ammo is probably the best bonus.

[Jaekahn]

Why AP and not Warp ammo?

[themaxzero]

SonsofNorthWind wrote...

Like everything, it depends on your difficulty.

Veteran -: Grabbing Dominate and AI Hacking is great fun, as it gives you some of the best CC in the game in conjunction with your Attack Drone. Even with the lack of enemy defenses on these difficulty modes, the AoE on CC abilities has gone down dramatically in this game. Getting them angry at their allies, though, has great effective radius.

Hardcore+: Demolisher is the way to go, as the majority of your effect on the battlefield will come from Incinerate, Overload, and blazing away with your Avenger into the enemy backside while they deal with your Explosive Drone. AP Ammo is probably the best bonus.

I'm also torn better Reave and AP Ammo. Reave is just so great against Collectors (who tend to give you the most problems) but then again AP ammo is such a massive DPS boost.

Tough one.

[PatchWorks]

On my insanity run I also did demolisher.



The extra damage for stripping enemies defenses into health is more important than longer duration. This holds true even for Dominate/AI hack control style engineers on insanity, as the sooner you can strip defenses with Overload/Incinerate the sooner you'll be able to Dominate/AI Hack and chain strip defenses from the rest of the baddies with your SMG (and hopefully a squad ammo ability from an ally) while your attack drone and newly mind controlled slave distract them. By the time Dominate/AI Hack wears off on your first victim you'll be able to easily reapply it anyway, or better yet use it on someone new and finish killing off your used up flunkie.



For Reave Engineer, its fairly obvious demolisher is the way to go. Drone for drawing fire or moving guys out of cover, then Reave/Overload depending on whether or not they have barriers, armor, or shields respectively. Shoot them in the back while they're distracted by the drone as your abilities recharge.

[Jaekahn]

PatchWorks wrote...

On my insanity run I also did demolisher.

The extra damage for stripping enemies defenses into health is more important than longer duration. This holds true even for Dominate/AI hack control style engineers on insanity, as the sooner you can strip defenses with Overload/Incinerate the sooner you'll be able to Dominate/AI Hack and chain strip defenses from the rest of the baddies with your SMG (and hopefully a squad ammo ability from an ally) while your attack drone and newly mind controlled slave distract them. By the time Dominate/AI Hack wears off on your first victim you'll be able to easily reapply it anyway, or better yet use it on someone new and finish killing off your used up flunkie.

For Reave Engineer, its fairly obvious demolisher is the way to go. Drone for drawing fire or moving guys out of cover, then Reave/Overload depending on whether or not they have barriers, armor, or shields respectively. Shoot them in the back while they're distracted by the drone as your abilities recharge.

Did you focus on AI Hacking / Dominate style of play? At the moment, I am focusing on Incinerate / Overload and it seems to be doing fairly well, espacially with Miranda and Jacob as my squad. I've only died maybe twice and both were due to my own mistake. Suprisingly enough, I think Engineer makes it very easy, but then again, I haven't reached horizon yet.

[lessthanjake9]

Demolisher is probably the way to go, I THINK. But the dynamics of the game are unclear enough that I cant be sure.

I really like an engineer that relies heavily on Combat Drone + AI Hack + Dominate, but Mechanic doesn't really help this style as much as it should. The reason is that those abilities do not actually generally last their entire duration anyways.

Combat Drones last 24 seconds at their highest level. They will basically never last that long anyways before they die, so adding 15% duration onto that is irrelevant. Similarly, an AI Hacked/Dominated enemy will be your pet for 12 seconds at the highest level. They won't typically last that long before they die. They might SOMETIMES, but it will be rare, and probably only in battles that are easy anyways. Lastly, increased duration on Cryo Blast isnt that useful either because when an enemy is down to health AND more vulnerable to damage due to Cryo, they will typically die before the Cryo wears off anyways. So the CC style doesnt really gain that much from higher duration because the duration is typically irrelevant.

HOWEVER, there is something I am not sure about. Incinerate does damage over time. Therefore, it is unclear to me whether increasing the duration of the power effectively increases the damage too. If so, then +15% duration and +15% damage for Incinerate would essentially be the same thing (ie. 100 damage a second for 1.15 seconds is the same damage as 115 damage a second for 1 second). The same question goes for Reave, if taken as a bonus power. I am not sure whether a 15% duration increase on that power increases overall damage 15%. If so, then Mechanic and Demolisher versions of that power are basically the same, with Mechanic Reave actually having a longer incapacitation.

If Incinerate's damage is increased by Mechanic, then it might be worth it to take Mechanic. The only real advantage Demolisher would get in that case is +15% damage on Overload. Mechanic will have +0.5 seconds of stun and +1 second of weapon overheat for Overload, so its Overload won't be completely inferior, just different. On top of that, a Mechanic will get the increased durations on the Drone, AI hack, Cryo, and Dominate. As I said, those will typically not be relevant, but it will be relevant occasionally. Lastly, Mechanic will have an extra 5% health and 30% paragon/renegade points, both of which are quite nice obviously. As a result, Mechanic would probably be the better choice, especially if you were wanting to focus on CC (and thus aren't too bothered by an Overload that does less damage).

Modifié par lessthanjake9, 08 février 2010 - 10:22 .

[SonsofNorthWind]

Jaekahn wrote...

Why AP and not Warp ammo?

I don't tend to have biotic abilities with durations affecting enemies on Insanity, so it's straight up 50% bonus damage vs barrier, health, and armor vs. 70% vs health and armor.  

If you're fighting an enemy with barrier, warp is better than AP, but not crazily so, as every enemy with barrier either has armor or health going along with it, so you're at 150% effectiveness of AP ammo for the barrier portion and 88% effectiveness for the remainder.  If you're fightning anyone else (shield/health, shield/armor/health, armor/health), AP is better.  Even the collector missions feature scions, abominations, and husks that have armor without barrier, and in particular husks and abominations are some of the larger threats to my Engineers -  powerful single enemies like Scions and Harbingers are ideal Drone targets, while husks come in groups and therefore can overwhelm the Engineer.  In most other missions, barrier is comparatively rare (with notable exception on Samara's recruit mission).  I prefer not to constantly respec and spend eezo, and therefore AP ammo is generally more useful across more of the game - I'd simpy rather vary my group makeup to punch through enemy defenses when needed, bringing warpers/reavers in as needed.

YMMV. 

[SonsofNorthWind]

themaxzero wrote...
I'm also torn better Reave and AP Ammo. Reave is just so great against Collectors (who tend to give you the most problems) but then again AP ammo is such a massive DPS boost.

Tough one.

It's the DPS + AP ammo not requiring you to use up a cooldown that completely seals it for me on Insanity.  While there are exceptions, I generally try to have a drone up at all times, and I don't want to lose my ability to do that  - particularly not in exchange for an ability which doesn't add all that much more utility to the class for the way I play it.  I find that in dynamic combat situations (where enemies are actively trying to flank me) I need to rely primarily on  my Avenger, not my powers (although starting off with a nice burst of Incinerate or Overload is a nice front end), while in long range standoffs Incinerate's ability to curve around cover is it's best attribute.  Reave doesn't noticeably change outcomes much in either situation, while AP adds a lot to the former. 

Modifié par SonsofNorthWind, 08 février 2010 - 11:30 .

[Jaekahn]

Is AP ammo superior than Squad Incinerate ammo? If so, than I may consider it so I don't have to carry Jacob with me.

[Murmillos]

also remeber for your shotgun, it has bonus damage to shields, but not to Armor.. so having AP helps out a ton.

[SonsofNorthWind]

Jaekahn wrote...

Is AP ammo superior than Squad Incinerate ammo? If so, than I may consider it so I don't have to carry Jacob with me.

Certainly, damage-wise - it's both a larger bonus and faster.  Tungsten AP ammo is +70%.  Squad Incendiary is +40% additional damage spread out over 3 seconds.  

[themaxzero]

SonsofNorthWind wrote...

themaxzero wrote...
I'm also torn better Reave and AP Ammo. Reave is just so great against Collectors (who tend to give you the most problems) but then again AP ammo is such a massive DPS boost.

Tough one.

It's the DPS + AP ammo not requiring you to use up a cooldown that completely seals it for me on Insanity.  While there are exceptions, I generally try to have a drone up at all times, and I don't want to lose my ability to do that  - particularly not in exchange for an ability which doesn't add all that much more utility to the class for the way I play it.  I find that in dynamic combat situations (where enemies are actively trying to flank me) I need to rely primarily on  my Avenger, not my powers (although starting off with a nice burst of Incinerate or Overload is a nice front end), while in long range standoffs Incinerate's ability to curve around cover is it's best attribute.  Reave doesn't noticeably change outcomes much in either situation, while AP adds a lot to the former. 

The other reason I like Reave is that it is lighter on the points and lets you mature your character faster. ME 2 is different then 1 in that the harder fights come much earlier and the game tends to get easier rather then harder as you go along.

Take for example Horizon, usually the first major challenge a character faces. Due to imports and potential +25% exp bonuses character levels can vary a lot but most people hit Horizon around level 10. With a Reave build you can have Area Reave and Explosive Drone by 10. A AP ammo build can't reach level 11 for Area Incinerate and Explosive Drone till 11, which can't be done if you start from level 1 even with +25% exp (need to start from at least level 3). Dropping Area Reave or Explosive Drone for a point in AP ammo would of made Horizon harder for me rather then easier.

Something similiar happens on Tali's recruitment mission, which tends to happen around 15 (this obviously varies even more). A Reave build can have rank 4 Overload by then where a AP build is going to be at least 1 level behind. This mission is also important because it gives a Engineer their first decent weapon (Tempest SMG). One of the strengths of Soldiers and Infiltrators is that they get good weapons from the start of the game (and an upgrade super early on in the case of Soldiers). Engineers have to wait much longer. Once you get a Tempest or Assault Rifles then respeccing into ammo makes good sense since you have a good enough weapon to justify it.