By end game, we know that the Dark Ritual was Flemeth's plan all along, and the whole reason Morrigan went. That surprised me actually. Morrigan's reaction to being told to leave the wilds seemed genuine, as did her confusion as to why Flemeth would let her go if she planned on taking her body. But during the Dark Ritual conversation, Morrigan admits that was the case.
So what was Flemeth's plan, what was the end purpose? Is Morrigan's the same, or something different? She refuses to say what it actually is, fobbing us off with a spiel about saving an old god--which I think she believes. But it's clear that's not all of it. Is it a plan to bring down the Chantry in some way? To empower Apostates? To somehow gain power through her connection to the god-child?
Flemeth and Morrigan: Different Plans Or The Same One? (Big Spoilers to the Endgame)
Débuté par
errant_knight
, févr. 09 2010 01:05
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#2
Posté 09 février 2010 - 01:26
Kimarous
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If you have the option to confront/kill Flemeth, that means that Morrigan has learned about the life-transfer ritual. Who's to say that she can't learn it herself from Flemeth's true grimoire?
Regardless of whether Flemeth possesses Morrigan or if Morrigan learns the ritual herself, the result is the same: Morrigan is impregnated with the soul of an Old God. When that extremely powerful fruit has ripened, who's to stop (either of them) from taking over Little Miss Divine?
Regardless of whether Flemeth possesses Morrigan or if Morrigan learns the ritual herself, the result is the same: Morrigan is impregnated with the soul of an Old God. When that extremely powerful fruit has ripened, who's to stop (either of them) from taking over Little Miss Divine?
#3
Posté 09 février 2010 - 01:48
errant_knight
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Kimarous wrote...
If you have the option to confront/kill Flemeth, that means that Morrigan has learned about the life-transfer ritual. Who's to say that she can't learn it herself from Flemeth's true grimoire?
Regardless of whether Flemeth possesses Morrigan or if Morrigan learns the ritual herself, the result is the same: Morrigan is impregnated with the soul of an Old God. When that extremely powerful fruit has ripened, who's to stop (either of them) from taking over Little Miss Divine?
Well, I don't see that as helpful to her. It's the soul of the old god that has value, not the human body it inhabits. From what we know of the ritual, the stronger and more knowledgable the host, the easier it is for a powerful mage to 'settle in', but we don't know that any of the host's own knowledge and skills survive the transfer. Morrigan certainly believed that all she was would be entirely replaced by Flemeth.
Heh, it was a struggle to resist saying 'nothing of the host survives.'
Modifié par errant_knight, 09 février 2010 - 01:50 .
#4
Posté 09 février 2010 - 01:53
Demx
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Well in my case she did it partly because she loved my character. The other part could be that she wanted to revive the old gods, before they were corrupted.
Modifié par Siradix, 09 février 2010 - 01:54 .
#5
Posté 09 février 2010 - 02:03
errant_knight
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Siradix wrote...
Well in my case she did it partly because she loved my character. The other part could be that she wanted to revive the old gods, before they were corrupted.
That's what she says, but it's in the context of refusing to tell you her whole plan. She asks if preserving an uncorrupted old god isn't a worthy goal, but she never says that's the whole plan, or even that it's her reason for doing it.
In your playthrough, she loved your character, but she will do it even when she doesn't, so while it might be a plus, and something she's very glad to be able to do, it isn't her actual reason for wanting to do the ritual.
The fact that she doesn't want to tell the warden what she's up to makes me think that it may very well be something the warden may not approve of, or possibly approve, but want to interfere in the execution of that plan. It would depend on the warden, wouldn't it?
Modifié par errant_knight, 09 février 2010 - 02:05 .
#6
Posté 09 février 2010 - 02:04
SusanStoHelit
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errant_knight wrote...
Speaking in terms of body stealing as recorded in myths, legends, and other tales, that is exactly what happens. If Morrigan took over the child's body - she would destroy the soul of the old god, two souls not being able to inhabit the same body. There are a few exceptions recorded, but since we're told in various places that in Thedas, two souls cannot inhabit the same body, I think we're safe to make that assumption. This would leave her in control of a 'normal' body. And not necessarily even the body of a mage. Do we have any reason to suppose that the child will be born a mage? After all, the Warden father may be a warrior or rogue.
For this reason, I think it's highly unlikely she aims to steal the body of the child.
Now, if she could guarantee that the child was a mage, I might rethink that. Because although the soul of the original inhabitant is destroyed, tales do indicate that the memories and knowledge of the original inhabitant persist. This makes sense even from a modern perspective, because memory and knowledge are stored in the brain, not in the 'soul'. In this scenario, Morrigan would have the body of a mage, with all her own knowledge and power - and the knowledge and memories of an old god.
Generally speaking, though, I think she's after something else altogether.
Perhaps she wants to save the last remaining old gods (all 3 of them) and overturn what the Chantry teaches about the Maker and so much else. After all, the old gods - whether they are truly gods or something else - are very ancient, were around when Andraste was, and I would assume may be able to reveal all kinds of things about Andraste, the Maker, the Chantry, and much else.
If she managed to undermine, or completely destroy, the power of the Chantry, that would free up mages, there'd be no such thing as apostates, and oh so much more. The changes to Thedas would be phenomenal: politically, religiously, socially, economically.
Well, I don't see that as helpful to her. It's the soul of the old god that has value, not the human body it inhabits. From what we know of the ritual, the stronger and more knowledgable the host, the easier it is for a powerful mage to 'settle in', but we don't know that any of the host's own knowledge and skills survive the transfer. Morrigan certainly believed that all she was would be entirely replaced by Flemeth.
Speaking in terms of body stealing as recorded in myths, legends, and other tales, that is exactly what happens. If Morrigan took over the child's body - she would destroy the soul of the old god, two souls not being able to inhabit the same body. There are a few exceptions recorded, but since we're told in various places that in Thedas, two souls cannot inhabit the same body, I think we're safe to make that assumption. This would leave her in control of a 'normal' body. And not necessarily even the body of a mage. Do we have any reason to suppose that the child will be born a mage? After all, the Warden father may be a warrior or rogue.
For this reason, I think it's highly unlikely she aims to steal the body of the child.
Now, if she could guarantee that the child was a mage, I might rethink that. Because although the soul of the original inhabitant is destroyed, tales do indicate that the memories and knowledge of the original inhabitant persist. This makes sense even from a modern perspective, because memory and knowledge are stored in the brain, not in the 'soul'. In this scenario, Morrigan would have the body of a mage, with all her own knowledge and power - and the knowledge and memories of an old god.
Generally speaking, though, I think she's after something else altogether.
Perhaps she wants to save the last remaining old gods (all 3 of them) and overturn what the Chantry teaches about the Maker and so much else. After all, the old gods - whether they are truly gods or something else - are very ancient, were around when Andraste was, and I would assume may be able to reveal all kinds of things about Andraste, the Maker, the Chantry, and much else.
If she managed to undermine, or completely destroy, the power of the Chantry, that would free up mages, there'd be no such thing as apostates, and oh so much more. The changes to Thedas would be phenomenal: politically, religiously, socially, economically.
#7
Posté 09 février 2010 - 02:05
TheBlackBaron
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Gah, can't say away...I swear I'm becoming obsessed...
Well, Morrigan herself admits that Flemeth rarely if ever tells her the entire plan, and aside from stubbornly insisting that everything she says must be a lie I can see no real reason to doubt that. So, while Flemeth may have told her to get pregnant by a Grey Warden, she may not actually have known she would be going with them right at that moment, nor the true purpose behind the plan.
To me this is abundantly clear once Morrigan gets her hands on the Black Grimoire and begins to tell you of Flemeth's own plans for her. If you waffle on the subject or hesitate, she quite literally begs you to kill Flemeth. Now, as well know, Morri is a very proud woman and not the kind to resort to that unless in a truly desperate situation. The Robes of Possession only reinforce that she's telling the truth in regards to this. After this she might have been able to guess at what the real purpose behind the Dark Ritual itself was, but it would be moot at this point since she is temporarily free from Flemeth.
Now then, as for the Dark Ritual itself. Flemeth's original plan is no doubt what the most obvious answer is - get Morrigan pregnant with an Old God's soul, then jack her, have Voodoo Child, raise her (I'm pretty sure Voodoo Child is going to be a girl - have to keep the Witch of the Wilds tradition alive, after all), and then, when the time is right, jack her. End result: Flemeth has the power of an Old God.
To assume Morrigan wants the same thing, however, ignores a couple of key facts. For one, we know from Riordan that two souls cannot inhabit the same body, at least not when we're dealing with something as powerful as an Old God soul. So, if she were to possess the child, then she would be displacing the soul of the Old God that made the child so valuable in the first place, thus negating the whole plan in the first place. Flemeth can make use of the Old God's soul (most likely by bonding with it in some fashion), but we know that Flemeth is not "merely" an extraordinarily powerful witch with the ability to extend her lifespan by possessing people; she is some kind of abomination that has managed to reach a symbiotic relationship between human and demon. Morrigan, awesome as she is, is simply a woman.
Personally I subscribe to the "Bring Down The Chantry" theory, which has the benefit of helping out apostates everywhere and shaking Thedas and the Chantry's grip over its past history to the core; I freely admit that might just be wishful thinking on my part. Moreoever, I do believe her when she says that truly does care for the Warden and has no wish to see him dead (I'm coming at this from my HNM playthrough, which is the only one I've gotten this far on). In any event, Morrigan values freedom above everything else, and has regularly expressed her hatred of the Chantry throughout the game; I sympathize entirely, so again I'm probably viewing this with a good deal of bias. Besides that, in keeping with that value I highly doubt she wants to simply trade one form of prison for an Old God (as a corrupted Archdemon) for another.
Additionally, since they couldn't have made it any more obvious that Flemeth is far from dead, Voodoo Child also represents freedom from Flemeth.
As for why the Warden can't come with her, well...it's the same reason why the Reapers' motives for doing a drive-by on the Milky Way every 50,000 years are unknown: it's plot-vital information being reserved for a future installment.
Well, Morrigan herself admits that Flemeth rarely if ever tells her the entire plan, and aside from stubbornly insisting that everything she says must be a lie I can see no real reason to doubt that. So, while Flemeth may have told her to get pregnant by a Grey Warden, she may not actually have known she would be going with them right at that moment, nor the true purpose behind the plan.
To me this is abundantly clear once Morrigan gets her hands on the Black Grimoire and begins to tell you of Flemeth's own plans for her. If you waffle on the subject or hesitate, she quite literally begs you to kill Flemeth. Now, as well know, Morri is a very proud woman and not the kind to resort to that unless in a truly desperate situation. The Robes of Possession only reinforce that she's telling the truth in regards to this. After this she might have been able to guess at what the real purpose behind the Dark Ritual itself was, but it would be moot at this point since she is temporarily free from Flemeth.
Now then, as for the Dark Ritual itself. Flemeth's original plan is no doubt what the most obvious answer is - get Morrigan pregnant with an Old God's soul, then jack her, have Voodoo Child, raise her (I'm pretty sure Voodoo Child is going to be a girl - have to keep the Witch of the Wilds tradition alive, after all), and then, when the time is right, jack her. End result: Flemeth has the power of an Old God.
To assume Morrigan wants the same thing, however, ignores a couple of key facts. For one, we know from Riordan that two souls cannot inhabit the same body, at least not when we're dealing with something as powerful as an Old God soul. So, if she were to possess the child, then she would be displacing the soul of the Old God that made the child so valuable in the first place, thus negating the whole plan in the first place. Flemeth can make use of the Old God's soul (most likely by bonding with it in some fashion), but we know that Flemeth is not "merely" an extraordinarily powerful witch with the ability to extend her lifespan by possessing people; she is some kind of abomination that has managed to reach a symbiotic relationship between human and demon. Morrigan, awesome as she is, is simply a woman.
Personally I subscribe to the "Bring Down The Chantry" theory, which has the benefit of helping out apostates everywhere and shaking Thedas and the Chantry's grip over its past history to the core; I freely admit that might just be wishful thinking on my part. Moreoever, I do believe her when she says that truly does care for the Warden and has no wish to see him dead (I'm coming at this from my HNM playthrough, which is the only one I've gotten this far on). In any event, Morrigan values freedom above everything else, and has regularly expressed her hatred of the Chantry throughout the game; I sympathize entirely, so again I'm probably viewing this with a good deal of bias. Besides that, in keeping with that value I highly doubt she wants to simply trade one form of prison for an Old God (as a corrupted Archdemon) for another.
Additionally, since they couldn't have made it any more obvious that Flemeth is far from dead, Voodoo Child also represents freedom from Flemeth.
As for why the Warden can't come with her, well...it's the same reason why the Reapers' motives for doing a drive-by on the Milky Way every 50,000 years are unknown: it's plot-vital information being reserved for a future installment.
Modifié par TheBlackBaron, 09 février 2010 - 02:10 .
#8
Posté 09 février 2010 - 02:17
Demx
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The child will have to listen to her mother, so I guess technically she has control of an old god.
#9
Posté 09 février 2010 - 02:21
errant_knight
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Siradix wrote...
The child will have to listen to her mother, so I guess technically she has control of an old god.
Heh, children often don't listen to their mothers, and the older they get, the less they listen.
And that's normal children, not old gods. I'm not sure Morrigan can count on being able to control it.TheBlackBaron wrote...
Personally I subscribe to the "Bring Down The Chantry" theory, which has the benefit of helping out apostates everywhere and shaking Thedas and the Chantry's grip over its past history to the core; I freely admit that might just be wishful thinking on my part. Moreoever, I do believe her when she says that truly does care for the Warden and has no wish to see him dead (I'm coming at this from my HNM playthrough, which is the only one I've gotten this far on). In any event, Morrigan values freedom above everything else, and has regularly expressed her hatred of the Chantry throughout the game; I sympathize entirely, so again I'm probably viewing this with a good deal of bias. Besides that, in keeping with that value I highly doubt she wants to simply trade one form of prison for an Old God (as a corrupted Archdemon) for another.
Additionally, since they couldn't have made it any more obvious that Flemeth is far from dead, Voodoo Child also represents freedom from Flemeth.
My only reason for not fully subscribing to this is that it seems too likely, too...obvious. I can't help but think there's an unpredictable plot twist in here somewhere.
Modifié par errant_knight, 09 février 2010 - 02:24 .
#10
Posté 09 février 2010 - 02:28
Demx
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*Scratches head* Okay, let's say hypothetically the anvil of the void was preserved. Morrigan could take the child to it, have it turned into a golem, and get herself a fancy control rod. 
#11
Posté 09 février 2010 - 02:35
SusanStoHelit
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Siradix wrote...
*Scratches head* Okay, let's say hypothetically the anvil of the void was preserved. Morrigan could take the child to it, have it turned into a golem, and get herself a fancy control rod.
Okay, you owe me a new keyboard. I just spat coffee all over this one.
That is wildly improbably, but incredibly funny too. Thank you. I love it.
#12
Posté 09 février 2010 - 02:37
SusanStoHelit
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TheBlackBaron wrote...
To assume Morrigan wants the same thing, however, ignores a couple of key facts. For one, we know from Riordan that two souls cannot inhabit the same body, at least not when we're dealing with something as powerful as an Old God soul. So, if she were to possess the child, then she would be displacing the soul of the Old God that made the child so valuable in the first place, thus negating the whole plan in the first place.
That is essentially what I said, yes. But I assume you were writing at the same time that I was, and didn't see that.
#13
Posté 09 février 2010 - 02:39
Demx
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Hey, she was last seen in the Frostback Mountains, I had to go here.
#14
Posté 09 février 2010 - 02:48
TheBlackBaron
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errant_knight wrote...
TheBlackBaron wrote...
Personally I subscribe to the "Bring Down The Chantry" theory, which has the benefit of helping out apostates everywhere and shaking Thedas and the Chantry's grip over its past history to the core; I freely admit that might just be wishful thinking on my part. Moreoever, I do believe her when she says that truly does care for the Warden and has no wish to see him dead (I'm coming at this from my HNM playthrough, which is the only one I've gotten this far on). In any event, Morrigan values freedom above everything else, and has regularly expressed her hatred of the Chantry throughout the game; I sympathize entirely, so again I'm probably viewing this with a good deal of bias. Besides that, in keeping with that value I highly doubt she wants to simply trade one form of prison for an Old God (as a corrupted Archdemon) for another.
Additionally, since they couldn't have made it any more obvious that Flemeth is far from dead, Voodoo Child also represents freedom from Flemeth.
My only reason for not fully subscribing to this is that it seems too likely, too...obvious. I can't help but think there's an unpredictable plot twist in here somewhere.
I know, but it's at least less obvious than the "She wants to posess the kid and gain its power" theory. I would certainly like there to be an unpredictable plot twist somewhere in the mix, be a shame if I had it all figured out now.
SusanStoHelit wrote...
TheBlackBaron wrote...
To assume Morrigan wants the same thing, however, ignores a couple of key
facts. For one, we know from Riordan that two souls cannot inhabit the
same body, at least not when we're dealing with something as powerful
as an Old God soul. So, if she were to possess the child, then she
would be displacing the soul of the Old God that made the child so
valuable in the first place, thus negating the whole plan in the first
place.
That is essentially what I said, yes. But I assume you were writing at the same time that I was, and didn't see that. [smilie]../../../../images/forum/emoticons/wink.png[/smilie]
When I first started writing errant_knight had the only post in the thread. [smilie]../../../../images/forum/emoticons/tongue.png[/smilie]
Modifié par TheBlackBaron, 09 février 2010 - 02:49 .
#15
Posté 09 février 2010 - 02:51
SusanStoHelit
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TheBlackBaron wrote...
When I first started writing errant_knight had the only post in the thread. [smilie]../../../../images/forum/emoticons/tongue.png[/smilie]
Comparing our posts all I can say is: great minds think alike.
#16
Posté 09 février 2010 - 02:54
Demx
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Is it possible for Morrigan to use the child as a source of power that she can tap into?
#17
Posté 09 février 2010 - 02:56
SusanStoHelit
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Siradix wrote...
Is it possible for Morrigan to use the child as a source of power that she can tap into?
We don't know. Blood Mages can certainly draw on other people's life force. It's theoretically possible, I suppose. But if I were even a super powerful mage, I wouldn't want to risk ticking off a god.
#18
Posté 09 février 2010 - 03:00
Demx
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SusanStoHelit wrote...
Siradix wrote...
Is it possible for Morrigan to use the child as a source of power that she can tap into?
We don't know. Blood Mages can certainly draw on other people's life force. It's theoretically possible, I suppose. But if I were even a super powerful mage, I wouldn't want to risk ticking off a god.
No one said Morrigan was the smartest cookie in the cookie jar.
#19
Posté 09 février 2010 - 03:08
TheBlackBaron
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Siradix wrote...
Is it possible for Morrigan to use the child as a source of power that she can tap into?
Could she? Yes, probalby.
Would she? No. Like Susan said, bad idea to try and do that with a god, even if it is your daughter/son. Morrigan is much smarter than that.
#20
Posté 09 février 2010 - 03:13
Demx
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Well then, I think the answer is kinda obvious. The child is to grow up, not knowing about what Flemeth did in the past. That way Morrigan is able to perform the ritual to place her soul in her granddaughter's body. Making her, I'm guessing, a demigod.
Modifié par Siradix, 09 février 2010 - 03:13 .
#21
Posté 09 février 2010 - 03:15
errant_knight
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Siradix wrote...
Well then, I think the answer is kinda obvious. The child is to grow up, not knowing about what Flemeth did in the past. That way Morrigan is able to perform the ritual to place her soul in her granddaughter's body. Making her, I'm guessing, a demigod.
Why would Morrigan want to do that? It both destroys the soul of the old god and make Flemeth more powerful.
#22
Posté 09 février 2010 - 03:35
Demx
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Wait what? I said place her soul in the granddaughter, meaning wait until the old god gets pregnant and send Morrigan 's soul to the fetus. Just like how the old god's soul was sent to her infant. That is how it happened right?
#23
Posté 09 février 2010 - 03:41
Kekse2k
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One thing that should be considered is the ending that doesn't include conception of the child (at least, one of which we know). If I recall correctly, the ending results in someone of Morrigan's likeness entrenching herself within the court of Orlais or something along those lines. My memory doesn't fare too well when I habitually do not pay attention.
Anyways, assuming her story is going to be massive and that she still has plans to achieve whatever goal she had concerning the baby, it would be logical that her taking up residence in Orlesian politics is a means of somehow achieving the goal (unless...she just...gives up and has decided a career in shenaniganning with the Orlesian nobles).
Continuing the speculative train, the only reason I can think of as to why she needs/wants to be in the Orlesian court is to get the backing of a nation. One thing that could happen is the exploitation of military resources to start some sort of corrupted Exalted March, but since Val Royeaux is the home of the White Divine, then...that's kind of improbable. She may be able to corrupt key Chantry members, however, so this gives credence to any "freedom-from-religious-oppression" theories out there.
Then again, another theory could be that there is something in Orlais, a piece of the puzzle, that we are missing. There is, after all, a stronger Grey Warden presence in Orlais compared to Ferelden, and my memory leads me to believe that they are more accustomed to darkspawn incursions outside of Ferelden.
Whatever the issue is, there is something to be gained by being in a powerful position in Orlais. Boom.
Anyways, assuming her story is going to be massive and that she still has plans to achieve whatever goal she had concerning the baby, it would be logical that her taking up residence in Orlesian politics is a means of somehow achieving the goal (unless...she just...gives up and has decided a career in shenaniganning with the Orlesian nobles).
Continuing the speculative train, the only reason I can think of as to why she needs/wants to be in the Orlesian court is to get the backing of a nation. One thing that could happen is the exploitation of military resources to start some sort of corrupted Exalted March, but since Val Royeaux is the home of the White Divine, then...that's kind of improbable. She may be able to corrupt key Chantry members, however, so this gives credence to any "freedom-from-religious-oppression" theories out there.
Then again, another theory could be that there is something in Orlais, a piece of the puzzle, that we are missing. There is, after all, a stronger Grey Warden presence in Orlais compared to Ferelden, and my memory leads me to believe that they are more accustomed to darkspawn incursions outside of Ferelden.
Whatever the issue is, there is something to be gained by being in a powerful position in Orlais. Boom.
#24
Posté 09 février 2010 - 03:47
BlazingSpeed
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Heh, I was just going to touch on this in a new topic and still will because of the addition material that I want to address...
But you guys are on the right track but some info is missing I kept trying to get some kind of reaction out of Flemmeth since she made it seem like Morrigan had tried to pull something like the Warden going to the hut before.
Plus, the robes of possession examination text is somewhat telling as to exactly when Flemmeth was expecting Morrigan to come back to the swamp, the fact that Flemmeth is "apparently" dead as the codex entry said and Biowares file save importing (Awakening...) style.
Question, does the crow/raven appear at the Landsmeet if you skipped Morrigan's side quest (like I did in my first playthrough...) of if Flemmeth just happened to die from second hand smoke cloud?
But you guys are on the right track but some info is missing I kept trying to get some kind of reaction out of Flemmeth since she made it seem like Morrigan had tried to pull something like the Warden going to the hut before.
Plus, the robes of possession examination text is somewhat telling as to exactly when Flemmeth was expecting Morrigan to come back to the swamp, the fact that Flemmeth is "apparently" dead as the codex entry said and Biowares file save importing (Awakening...) style.
Question, does the crow/raven appear at the Landsmeet if you skipped Morrigan's side quest (like I did in my first playthrough...) of if Flemmeth just happened to die from second hand smoke cloud?
#25
Posté 09 février 2010 - 03:54
errant_knight
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Siradix wrote...
Wait what? I said place her soul in the granddaughter, meaning wait until the old god gets pregnant and send Morrigan 's soul to the fetus. Just like how the old god's soul was sent to her infant. That is how it happened right?
So... Wait until the child is able to bear a child, get her knocked up, Morrigan goes into the fetus.... I still don't get it. That just puts Morrigan in another human body--and it makes a huge assumption, that the child is female.
She could use Flemeth's ritual to do it, I suppose, but it wouldn't be how the old god ended up there. That was the corrupted soul trying to leap into a darkspawn.
Kekse2k wrote...
One thing that should be considered is the ending that doesn't include conception of the child (at least, one of which we know). If I recall correctly, the ending results in someone of Morrigan's likeness entrenching herself within the court of Orlais or something along those lines. My memory doesn't fare too well when I habitually do not pay attention.
Anyways, assuming her story is going to be massive and that she still has plans to achieve whatever goal she had concerning the baby, it would be logical that her taking up residence in Orlesian politics is a means of somehow achieving the goal (unless...she just...gives up and has decided a career in shenaniganning with the Orlesian nobles).
Continuing the speculative train, the only reason I can think of as to why she needs/wants to be in the Orlesian court is to get the backing of a nation. One thing that could happen is the exploitation of military resources to start some sort of corrupted Exalted March, but since Val Royeaux is the home of the White Divine, then...that's kind of improbable. She may be able to corrupt key Chantry members, however, so this gives credence to any "freedom-from-religious-oppression" theories out there.
Then again, another theory could be that there is something in Orlais, a piece of the puzzle, that we are missing. There is, after all, a stronger Grey Warden presence in Orlais compared to Ferelden, and my memory leads me to believe that they are more accustomed to darkspawn incursions outside of Ferelden.
Whatever the issue is, there is something to be gained by being in a powerful position in Orlais. Boom.
You bring up some very good and interesting points, and I think we do have to look at the different endings. Not all endings involve conception of the child. On the other hand, we know that how you defeated the archdemon will have some effect in Awakening, although we have no idea what kind of effect that might be. The fact that Morrigan goes to Orleis in some endings may be just as significant.
BlazingSpeed wrote...
Heh, I was just going to touch on this in a new topic and still will because of the addition material that I want to address...
But you guys are on the right track but some info is missing I kept trying to get some kind of reaction out of Flemmeth since she made it seem like Morrigan had tried to pull something like the Warden going to the hut before.
Plus, the robes of possession examination text is somewhat telling as to exactly when Flemmeth was expecting Morrigan to come back to the swamp, the fact that Flemmeth is "apparently" dead as the codex entry said and Biowares file save importing (Awakening...) style.
Question, does the crow/raven appear at the Landsmeet if you skipped Morrigan's side quest (like I did in my first playthrough...) of if Flemmeth just happened to die from second hand smoke cloud?
Y'know, I really wondered about that raven. I even clicked on it to see if anything happened. It seemed odd, didn't it?
I know what you mean about Flemeth's dialogue. It made me wonder if Flemeth had lived through that before with the other daughters.... Or if Morrigan was all the daughters.... Or if Morrigan and Flemeth are different aspects of the same person.... There was something going on there, but I couldn't put my finger on it.
Modifié par errant_knight, 09 février 2010 - 04:05 .
