1769 réponses à ce sujet

[PyroFreak301]

A lot of this could be avoided by making Shepard initiate any form flirting/romantic interest. Make it a very clear choice on the dialogue wheel so people will know what they are getting themselves into and cant select it by mistake.



By doing this, the only way you'll see gay/bi sides of an established character is if you go searching for it. For those that choose not to initiate the flirting, the relationship will remain straight as an arrow. Both sides win at no loss to character.

[sw33ts]

O_o

I think you people are arguing wheather sexualitly is fluid.  I think it is.  I mean I'm bi...and there are certain times when I'm just like WOMEN.    And then I'm like...meh...both...and then I do something like MEN.   

It is possible to be straight early in your life and then gay and then bi or any sort of combinations.  At least in my experience, I've met people who were straight as an arrow and then soemone opened their eyes to the gay/lesbian world and then they're like...what have I been missing?  That doesn't mean they weren't straight to begin with...it just means that now they're gay.  I means ure there are people out there who are "straight" because of society but there are people who were honestly straight.  I personally was never straight...I WANT IT ALL.

[Ryzaki]

PyroFreak301 wrote...

A lot of this could be avoided by making Shepard initiate any form flirting/romantic interest. Make it a very clear choice on the dialogue wheel so people will know what they are getting themselves into and cant select it by mistake.

By doing this, the only way you'll see gay/bi sides of an established character is if you go searching for it. For those that choose not to initiate the flirting, the relationship will remain straight as an arrow. Both sides win at no loss to character.

You'll get people whining about how the choice shouldn't even be there though. <_<

OH NOES! My Shep can choose to be gay! I'm somehow unable to resist!!!!

NOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!

*sighs*

Modifié par Ryzaki, 13 février 2010 - 12:26 .

[IMTrick]

JamesMoriarty123 wrote...

Sabul wrote...

JamesMoriarty123 wrote...

Have you played that portion of the game? That woman was EVERYTHING to him. Get a grip dood, give up the goat. I'd have more time for you if you just accepted a new gay character. As long as people like you keep lobbying to change what IS, then I will always be erring on the side of the big bad green troll.

I actually played the game twice thus far. Sky from Jade Empire loved his wife too. Hell after his wife and daughter were murdered he spent years searching for their killers. He still fell in love with the male player character. My point was just being married does not make your strictly straight. Just as loving someone does not do so. I am all for a new gay or bisexual character in Mass Effect 2. It just seems like it would be easier for them to reenable all the work they did making previous characters bisexual than creating a whole new one. Either way though I would be happy.

You're referring to an extremely isolated example. The VAST, and I mean VAST amount of men who genuinely love and start a family with a woman are not Bi. As hard as that may be for you to grasp, its the truth.

Like I said, if people stopped trying to screw with the game, and guided the discussion toward a new character inclusion, I would be more open to the debate.

I gotta tell you, your repeated use of "it's not very common" as an argument against a point you don't like really doesn't do much for your case.  It's a non-issue.  If you're looking for common, try the Sims.  That game's chock full of common. The ME series? Not so much.

The ratio of straight to bisexual and/or gay men who leave their wives has obsolutely no bearing whatsoever on the sexuality of characters in a game. It just doesn't, no matter how much you keep trying to imply that it does.  Pick a character in ME2, any character.  Now, show me how they are an amalgamation of common characteristics (and only common characteristics -- because obviously the game designers wouldn't include any characteristics that fell into the "unusual" category) found in modern human society.  Ready?  Go.

...

Sorry, time's up.  Really, it's just a silly argument.

[comicfan22]

JamesMoriarty123 wrote...

Well, I really am out this time. Spent waaay too much time arguing the toss in this thread over the last week.
From this point on, dead horse and all that. Everything that can be said, has been said. All the problems, arguments, counter arguments, trolling, flaming, etc.
To repeat yourself ad infinitum is just daft.

See you soon!

[PyroFreak301]

Ryzaki wrote...

PyroFreak301 wrote...

A lot of this could be avoided by making Shepard initiate any form flirting/romantic interest. Make it a very clear choice on the dialogue wheel so people will know what they are getting themselves into and cant select it by mistake.

By doing this, the only way you'll see gay/bi sides of an established character is if you go searching for it. For those that choose not to initiate the flirting, the relationship will remain straight as an arrow. Both sides win at no loss to character.

You'll get people whining about how the choice shouldn't even be there though. <_<

OH NOES! My Shep can choose to be gay! I'm somehow unable to resist!!!!

NOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!

*sighs*

I'd consider unsettling those that aren't comfortable in their sexuality a bonus.

[KumoriOokami]

.

I gotta tell you, your repeated use of "it's not very common" as an argument against a point you don't like really doesn't do much for your case.  It's a non-issue.  If you're looking for common, try the Sims.  That game's chock full of common. The ME series? Not so much.

Of course in the Sims everyone is bisexual...

[FataliTensei]

JamesMoriarty123 wrote...

DaeJi wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Is it just me or did Shep's dancing get WORSE? 

Like honestly I can't help but cringe.

It got worse. A lot worse.

Hmmm, maybe Shepard really isn't gay.

QTF. Straight guys can't dance to save their lives. Sheperd is as straight as they come with that dance.

Have you ever seen America's Best Dance Crew, the straight guys are the best dancers on there

Modifié par FataliTensei, 13 février 2010 - 12:31 .

[Collider]

Jimmy Fury wrote...

Collider wrote...
Because you have to have a fetish to be attracted.

"I don't have a human fetish or anything" means he does not find human sexually attractive and his interest in Shep is based purely on Shep as a person. Pay attention now.

No it doesn't dude. Look up the word fetish. You don't need a fetish to be attracted to someone or whatever gender. Come on. :l

Romeo+Juliet have nothing to do with Tali...

No, it's a perfectly fit comparison. The Romeo and Juliet play is one play. Mass Effect 2 is one game. Get it? You are saying that one could consider Tali romancing male shepard IN MASS EFFECT 2 as being inconsistent.
a) We have no indications of Tali's sexuality in ME1.
I am talking about going back to ME2 and changing the coding so previously heterosexual or heterosexual-only romances are now bisexual. Not Kaidan being bisexual in ME3 or whatever.

Tali stated, on multiple occasions, that she can't take off her mask without suffering an extreme allergic reaction that would very likely end in her death.

Because no one has ever committed suicide or done dangerous things, right? Think for a second.

Yet again... not attracted to humans... in his own words...

In Mass Effect 2, not Mass Effect 1. As an addition, people are not necessarily knowing or willing to admit their feelings. There are assuredly plenty of closet gays out there. Garrus made no indication of whether he was attracted to human females in Mass Effect 1, so Garrus is not in the least bit being inconsistent.

The irony was the point. i was using your reasoning to show how your argument doesn't work.

No, I'm afraid you weren't using my reasoning, instead you were using a caricature of my reasoning. In the end, you looked like you didn't know what you were talking about.

[Beregar]

Collider wrote...
No, you are misintepretating me, like I said. I have nothing against Bioware having Kaidan admit being bisexual in ME3. What I WOULD have a problem with is Bioware going back to ME1 and making him bisexual/bisexual romance option, therefore changing his character. Get it? If he was always bisexual, they are changing his character in that he was originally
a) Not attracted to male shepard at the time
or
Did not want to reveal his bisexuality at the time.

Ahh, then we have an agreement. I would prefer him admitting it in ME3 anyways should our path's cross. I thought the entire argument was that he can't be bi or gay or whatnot at all because of some masculine crap. I don't think going back to ME1 and rewriting him would be a good idea either. I mean that would force me to go through the game again and I very much prefer ME2 - and he is not a playable character currently. Maybe if they added him... hmm...

Also I don't think I'm a hypocrite in a sense that I don't generalize but I see your point. Hard to say that someone gives a "bisexual vibe" when you first argued that behaviour can not be connected to sexual preference. Hmm, dang, seems I got myself (in)conveniently cornered. Still I'm sure Kaidan will be back in ME3 and confess his undying love to my male Shepard!

(I also think I'll win the jackpot in next lotto... seems like both are as likely to happen).

[NightLad]

I’d fully support a same-sex option for Shepard, male or female.

I think BioWare gave a sly ‘wink’ to the idea with Mordin in ME2. I mean, the guy sings Gilbert & Sullivan for god sakes! And he even said that if he was ever interested in ‘trying human’ Shepard would be his pick.

Hmmm… possible ME3 romance option?

On a related note, according to the APA sexuality isn’t a matter of Black & White, gay/straight. (Source.) There are people who are totally str8 and totally gay, but in-between there are many levels of bisexual. To note the Kinsey Scale, sexuality can be broken into 6 levels: 0=100% straight, 6=100% gay and in-between we find levels of bisexual. Maybe Shepard ranks a 1 or 2 on the Kinsey Scale, which is usually str8 but there might be one or two guys in the whole universe that could invoke a more-than-platonic relationship with him.

Having said all of this; this is a sci-fi fantasy RPG. God god sakes, if we can have space ships and aliens, I’m sure we can have a same-sex romance option. LOL

[Beregar]

DaeJi wrote...
It got worse. A lot worse.

Hmmm, maybe Shepard really isn't gay.

Hey! I resent that remark! I'm a gay and a horrible dancer.

[biddypocket]

Beregar wrote...

DaeJi wrote...
It got worse. A lot worse.

Hmmm, maybe Shepard really isn't gay.

Hey! I resent that remark! I'm a gay and a horrible dancer.

Come.

We dance.

I teach you.

[tmelange]

Ryzaki wrote...

tmelange wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

tmelange wrote...

On another note, since there was a Kelly, I wanted my male Shep to be able to dally with the engineer -- Donnelly? He was cute, and if Shep was going to run around sexing subordinates, assistants and aliens, I didn't think it should be too much to ask to flirt with the cutie on engineer deck. )

He had a lovely accent. <3

Yet Shep is predefined to be straight. <_<

Yes he did! He is a cutie, and I'm sure my male Shep noticed. Plus, he came equipped with his best gal pal/beard.

I could even imagine him doing a male version of Kelly's dance. And Sheploo being all ":mellow:" like FemShep.

Also: I can't help but lol at the "there's no way they're bisexual!" Like...at the end of the day. Its a video game which means the characters likes and dislikes are totally left to the creator's hands and the player's interpretations Which may or may not depending on fandom mix well together.

Exactly. My male Shep is gay if I say he's gay. That's that. 

[Sabul]

NightLad wrote...

I’d fully support a same-sex option for Shepard, male or female.

I think BioWare gave a sly ‘wink’ to the idea with Mordin in ME2. I mean, the guy sings Gilbert & Sullivan for god sakes! And he even said that if he was ever interested in ‘trying human’ Shepard would be his pick.

Hmmm… possible ME3 romance option?

I actually made a post quite a few pages back about how this would be a good way to unlock m/m romance option in ME3. Since it does not happen less Shepard does not romance anyone. Would solve the problem of teenage boys being 'tricked' into a gay romance. So yeah. I agree with you wholeheartedly.

[Ryzaki]

PyroFreak301 wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

PyroFreak301 wrote...

A lot of this could be avoided by making Shepard initiate any form flirting/romantic interest. Make it a very clear choice on the dialogue wheel so people will know what they are getting themselves into and cant select it by mistake.

By doing this, the only way you'll see gay/bi sides of an established character is if you go searching for it. For those that choose not to initiate the flirting, the relationship will remain straight as an arrow. Both sides win at no loss to character.

You'll get people whining about how the choice shouldn't even be there though. <_<

OH NOES! My Shep can choose to be gay! I'm somehow unable to resist!!!!

NOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!

*sighs*

I'd consider unsettling those that aren't comfortable in their sexuality a bonus.

True.

Still Kaidangaymance for ME3!

[DaeJi]

Beregar wrote...

I'm a gay and a horrible dancer.

You're contradicting yourself.

[Beregar]

Come.

We dance.

I teach you.

I'm always embracing opportunities to learn new things!

(Is this a good time to mention I seem to have horrible fashion sense too?)
(...I sense identity crisis approaching... whee!)

[biddypocket]

Beregar wrote...

Come.

We dance.

I teach you.

I'm always embracing opportunities to learn new things!

(Is this a good time to mention I seem to have horrible fashion sense too?)
(...I sense identity crisis approaching... whee!)

Come.

we shop at H&M.

I teach you .

[Endurance_117]

FataliTensei wrote...

JamesMoriarty123 wrote...

DaeJi wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Is it just me or did Shep's dancing get WORSE? 

Like honestly I can't help but cringe.

It got worse. A lot worse.

Hmmm, maybe Shepard really isn't gay.

QTF. Straight guys can't dance to save their lives. Sheperd is as straight as they come with that dance.

Have you ever seen America's Best Dance Crew, the straight guys are the best dancers on there

actually they are lol

[DaeJi]

Okay, Shepard not being able to dance doesn't mean that he can't be gay; he does have amazing fashion sense.

[Jimmy Fury]

Collider wrote...
In Mass Effect 2, not Mass Effect 1. As an addition, people are not necessarily knowing or willing to admit their feelings. There are assuredly plenty of closet gays out there. Garrus made no indication of whether he was attracted to human females in Mass Effect 1, so Garrus is not in the least bit being inconsistent.

No, I'm afraid you weren't using my reasoning, instead you were using a caricature of my reasoning. In the end, you looked like you didn't know what you were talking about.

The emphasized line is the point.
Expressing interest in 1 person does not equal sexuality.
And that is the only interest every mentioned and is therefore the interest you used to claim the character are all heterosexual. 1 interest. Thane's wife. The girl from jump Zero Kaidan helped (he actually never said he loved her. It was infered the same way people infered Kaidan was attracted to male shep. Not the point though!), FShep+Garrus, Tali+MShep.
The reasoning you used. And yes, it was your reasoning. Was that the characters expressed interest in a person and therefore it defined their sexuality.
Altering their interests only alters their sexuality is you assume one interest defines their sexuality. Since not a single solitary member of the squad has ever claimed to only be interested in one gender, then altering which version of Shep they can be attracted to does not actually change anything that has been established.

(As a side note... I actually hate the idea of retconning the romances back into the game. I want a new char. I'm just trying to point out the error of your argument)

Modifié par Jimmy Fury, 13 février 2010 - 12:46 .

[Beregar]

biddypocket wrote...
Come.

we shop at H&M.

I teach you .

I usually shop at *looks around shiftily* ... umm.. Dressmann.

[FataliTensei]

Endurance_117 wrote...

FataliTensei wrote...

JamesMoriarty123 wrote...

DaeJi wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Is it just me or did Shep's dancing get WORSE? 

Like honestly I can't help but cringe.

It got worse. A lot worse.

Hmmm, maybe Shepard really isn't gay.

QTF. Straight guys can't dance to save their lives. Sheperd is as straight as they come with that dance.

Have you ever seen America's Best Dance Crew, the straight guys are the best dancers on there

actually they are lol

Lol it's funny when you think about it, cuz the sterotype really is that straight guys can't dance

[Ryzaki]

DaeJi wrote...

Okay, Shepard not being able to dance doesn't mean that he can't be gay; he does have amazing fashion sense.

And hot pink armor