151 réponses à ce sujet

[Lukertin]

Kosmiker wrote...

Lukertin wrote...

Kosmiker wrote...
*All aliens speak english.

This is explained in the codex...

Ups.. sorry about that.
Another "unrealistic" example:
*Many things seem to be "codex-dependable"

Or it's just an idea stolen from the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy...

Modifié par Lukertin, 09 février 2010 - 11:14 .

[wulf3n]

ZennExile wrote...

When you say things like "a Disney Movie" it makes me believe you never played the first Mass Effect and just read about it on forums.  After I get to that point I just can't decide whether I should play into your little game or just ignore you.

No i've definitely played it, probably close to 10 times, on both xbox and pc (own it on pc)
I just think you misunderstood but what i meant by "disney movie" (disney movie probably was a poor choice of words) i'll try and put a few points down.

While ME1 did have mature things in it, drug abuse, slavery, etc. for the most part it felt (at least in my paragon playthrough) very black and white, good versus evil. While Saren showed signs of his former humanity(or in his case turianity) i felt no remorse for killing him. I still haven't explained it very well, but i hope you understand my use of disny movie a bit better.

[ShadowWolf_Kell]

On the otherhand, games based purely on science don't exactly go over super well either.



Outpost and Alpha Centauri come to mind here. Both were rather overhyped, and while they were interesting games in their own right... the storylines just didn't quite convey as much as you'd expect.



Most FPS games have a relatively weak background story. The first hybrid RPG/FPS games to truly break that mold were Deus Ex, and System Shock 2. ME is simpy an extension of the ground those two games paved to combine the two genres.

[dan107]

None of them are even remotely plausible. Space marines running around with guns shooting things are a theoretical impossibility. The technology required for interstellar travel (assuming its even possible) is far outside our limits of comprehension. Nano-technology and genetic engineering which will allow for the creation of tiny machines and viruses that will be able to kill people by the billion is something that we're on the cusp of mastering. The ME universe has that represented in the form of the genophage.

One question that no one seems to ask is why on earth would you need soldiers, armies, and warships, when an entire species can be wiped out by a small team of scientists? That's where the wars of the future will be fought (assuming we survive that long) -- in science labs and computer networks, not on the battlefield.

The ME world is a pretty fantasy though, if you don't think too hard about it.

Modifié par dan107, 09 février 2010 - 11:18 .

[Niorcs]

Kosmiker wrote...

Lukertin wrote...

Kosmiker wrote...
*All aliens speak english.

This is explained in the codex...

Ups.. sorry about that.

Another "unrealistic" example:

*Many things seem to be "codex-dependable"

Moreso speaking English (even translated) and having it sync up perfectly. It should look like a horribly dubbed kung fu film.

That, and Element Zero, along with biotic powers. Come onnn, it's way too out there-- being able to manipulate dark matter and energy with an implant?

[Lukertin]

dan107 wrote...
None of them are even remotely plausible. Space marines running around with guns shooting things are a theoretical impossibility. The technology required for interstellar travel (assuming its even possible) is far outside our limits of comprehension. Nano-technology and genetic engineering which will allow for the creation of tiny machines and viruses that will be able to kill people by the billion is something that we're on the cusp of mastering. The ME universe has that represented in the form of the genophage.
One question that no one seems to ask is why on earth would you need soldiers, armies, and warships, when an entire species can be wiped out by a small team of scientists? That's where the wars of the future will be fought (assuming we survive that long) -- in science labs and computer networks, not on the battlefield.
The ME world is a pretty fantasy though, if you don't think too hard about it.

Lulz.  So when you fight an enemy that decides it will reorganize its tactics to exclude dependency on computers, you're ****ed.  And nobody is going to use biological warfare (besides its being illegal under international law) when they will have so little control over what it does.  A weapon you can't control is useless.  If the pathogen mutates and goes out of control, that could wipe out a huge portion of the population.  Cybernetic warfare is realistic but you need to be able to capitalize on it.  Wiping out your enemy's communications doesn't defeat him, it only puts him in a position where he can be more easily defeated.

[Lord Atlia]

You are not alone TC. Now I am not giving halo more credit than ME, because ME is way more realistic but some things in ME just rub me the wrong way, I think it is the codex which tries to make ME more plausible than it deserves to be (no offense to the ME writers as you have done a better job than most most science fiction writers and film makers of the last 20 years). I think it might be the biotics or the fact that they are trying to make the biotics seem plausible. Also the Asari, I believe an alien as alien as the Asari should not have evolved to look the way it does but than again it could be just me.

[kallikles]

One thing that might play a role is the lack of vibrant cities and non-hostile settlements.

[ZennExile]

wulf3n wrote...

ZennExile wrote...

When you say things like "a Disney Movie" it makes me believe you never played the first Mass Effect and just read about it on forums.  After I get to that point I just can't decide whether I should play into your little game or just ignore you.

No i've definitely played it, probably close to 10 times, on both xbox and pc (own it on pc)
I just think you misunderstood but what i meant by "disney movie" (disney movie probably was a poor choice of words) i'll try and put a few points down.

While ME1 did have mature things in it, drug abuse, slavery, etc. for the most part it felt (at least in my paragon playthrough) very black and white, good versus evil. While Saren showed signs of his former humanity(or in his case turianity) i felt no remorse for killing him. I still haven't explained it very well, but i hope you understand my use of disny movie a bit better.

Not so much.  But you spelled Disney like disny, after spelling it correctly twice previously; which means you used the Disney reference not once but three times now, rendering everything you have to say 3 times less likely to be taken seriously.

But I digress.

Your "disney movie" reference is unique to your perspective, which I feel very confident in suggesting is actually your interpretation of other people's perspective gone terribly awry.

Either way I officially declare a "Cool Story Bro!!!" rule violation, wherein the declaration of a clearly announced "Cool Story Bro" was responded to without inclusion of said "Cool Story Bro" as well as an amended secondary "Context Exclusion" violation resulting in a vague, and might I amend unsettlingly poor, attempt to make excuses that support nothing but a plee of complete insanity.  And since there has been no such plee, I sentence you to no less than 2 weeks of forum timeout time. 

Good day to you Bro what brings Cool Stories.

[Jimbe2693]

binaryemperor wrote...

It's more plausible than Star Wars.

You don't believe in the force, do you?

[Wolverfrog]

The thing I find most unrealistic about Halo is that a modern Abrams tank today is more powerful than a Scorpion tank 500 years in the future.



A lot of things are like that.



Still, I love both the Mass Effect and Halo Universes. I write fan fics on the latter.

[Unit-Alpha]

Talogrungi wrote...

It's the Asari. Everyone knows they're green in real life.

QFT

[MasterSolo]

wulf3n wrote...

Before i get started im not bagging either ME1 or ME2 they are still some of the best games i've played.

However, while playing the game, theres something nagging me, i can't quite put my finger on what it is, yet it somehow sucks me out of the illusion that this is real.
Other sci-fi games like the Halo series(even  though i think mass effect is better) have me believing that the future they've created is one that COULD exist, it feels real to me, but for some reason Mass Effect doesn't.
At first i thought it may have been the squeeky clean feel to ME1, almost like a disney movie, it didn't really show the darker side of nature, however that issue was addressed in ME2, yet i still feel the same way.

Im wondering if anyone has the same feeling, or may know what the reason could be.

I'm sorry, but have you read the codex? Mass Effect is one of the most believable, if not the most believable, universes ever(from a scientific point of view). Almost everything is explained pretty well, and the laws of physics are very much respected. They don't pull stuff from thin air like in other universes. And I just loved the phrase "Newton is the deadliest son of the b*tch in space."

Modifié par MasterSolo, 10 février 2010 - 02:32 .

[MasterSolo]

double post...

Modifié par MasterSolo, 10 février 2010 - 02:31 .

[hubris0]

Hmm, for me one of the great things that makes ME so wonderful and immersive is that it is so believable. Despite what some posters have said, there's really no fantasy elements at all in the game, unlike nearly all modern SF. Pretty much all the Science Fiction, including FTL travel, FTL communications, biotics, kinetic barriers, artificial gravity, and weaponry all spring from the same source, the namesake of the series, the Mass Effect.

The application of positive or negative electric current to Element Zero increases or decreases mass, allowing the manipulation of items as small as a bullet, as large as a warship, or even of space-time itself. When eezo is manipulated by the nervous system, biotics emerges. Pretty much all the SF in the game is an application of the Mass Effect to existing technology. There are some extreme examples of AI and genetic engineering as well, but for the most part, it's amazing what a rich landscape Bioware has managed to eek out of one Science Fiction innovation.

One might argue that eezo itself is fantasy, but it's at least as feasible as hyperspace, nearly as feasible as warp drive, and far more so than transporters, replicators, telepathy, prescience, handheld energy weapons, and many other SF elements.

As for the society, it's elegant and dirty, civilized and brutal, artistic and violent, loving and murderous, at times extraordinary and at others deeply mundane. While I am infuriated at the gameplay elements used to woo shooter fans and I think the Bypass minigame is an abomination, if I had to pick one complaint with Mass Effect, it would be that the series isn't enough of a sandbox for me to explore to my contentment this amazing universe Bioware has created.

Modifié par hubris0, 10 février 2010 - 02:54 .

[Landline]

It's more believable then Star Trek, and it doesn't spit as badly in the face of science as Star Trek does.

[Shinigami013]

Lukertin wrote...

Maybe it's the whole biotics thing which is basically space magic?

The technology in Halo (except for slipspace) is based on current technology only fast-forwarded 200 years so the developments are 'believable'. (edit: ME does a good job at this as well, not denigrating the tech aspect of ME, but the whole biotics thing requires some suspension of disbelief)

The Human brain uses 10% of its potiental. With the full 100% who knows what it could do?

[ScooterPie88]

I don't see anything wrong with either the Mass Effect or Halo universes.  Both are good pieces of science fiction with intricately woven backstories, supporting characters, and a main hero.  Just suspend your disbelief and you'll have more fun.

[WrathWinters]

I found Halo truly amazing and immersive, but it was the first science fiction game I had ever played some 8 years ago. Also, not everyone speaks english in Halo. We just got to the galaxy and convinced everyone else to speak english in a matter of years? That and the lack of females in the world throws it off for me. Literally every female you meet, just about, is romanceable, which is great except theres only 3 females. Kinda draws me out of the illusion, for me at least

[easternswordman]

wulf3n wrote...

Before i get started im not bagging either ME1 or ME2 they are still some of the best games i've played.

However, while playing the game, theres something nagging me, i can't quite put my finger on what it is, yet it somehow sucks me out of the illusion that this is real.
Other sci-fi games like the Halo series(even  though i think mass effect is better) have me believing that the future they've created is one that COULD exist, it feels real to me, but for some reason Mass Effect doesn't.
At first i thought it may have been the squeeky clean feel to ME1, almost like a disney movie, it didn't really show the darker side of nature, however that issue was addressed in ME2, yet i still feel the same way.

Im wondering if anyone has the same feeling, or may know what the reason could be.

For me it's the other way around. I'm always a si-fi guy and actually chose science as my major. However out of all the si-fi I encountered before, I think ME has the most believable universe, backed up by lot of credible technology theories and biology backgrounds. It always gives a "reasonable reason" to explain everything, and it seems no one else did this.

[Space Shot]

wulf3n wrote...

Other sci-fi games like the Halo series(even  though i think mass effect is better) have me believing that the future they've created is one that COULD exist, it feels real to me, but for some reason Mass Effect doesn't.

 Halo (for example) just copies existing tech and pastes it into space (following the sci-fi school of thought set by the movie Aliens.)  It's unambitious and derivative, and consequently is the more "believable" game, but that certainly shouldn't be thought of as any sort of credit to  the game or the fiction.  It is simply a product of a lack of creativity (at least as far as the UNSC is concerned) and should only be regarded as such.

Modifié par Space Shot, 10 février 2010 - 05:09 .

[Empiro]

I'm the exact opposite.

I never found Halo's universe all that believable or well developed, at least from playing the games. More precisely, I felt the universe was pretty generic, with tons of gaps left open. This is probably because you never encounter anyone or anything outside the context of shooting them or about to be shooting them.

Mass Effect has tons of backstory and history, and you experience it firsthand when playing the game.

People speaking English (or whatever language you play the game in) is a common sci-fi convention. That's something I can suspend disbelief in, and would prefer to have in order to experience the great voice-work.

Modifié par Empiro, 10 février 2010 - 05:12 .

[FlashedMyDrive]

Shinigami013 wrote...

Lukertin wrote...

Maybe it's the whole biotics thing which is basically space magic?

The technology in Halo (except for slipspace) is based on current technology only fast-forwarded 200 years so the developments are 'believable'. (edit: ME does a good job at this as well, not denigrating the tech aspect of ME, but the whole biotics thing requires some suspension of disbelief)

The Human brain uses 10% of its potiental. With the full 100% who knows what it could do?

Oh my god, people need to stop perpetuating this myth. Humans use 100% of their brain.

http://en.wikipedia....%_of_brain_myth


I mean damn, there is an entire wikipedia article dedicated to it...

[ODST 3]

I believe Mass Effect a lot more than Halo. Mass Effect is a little too clean, but Halo has cars that run on gasoline and guns that fire bullets and rocket launchers that are much worse than what we have today. And it's supposedly 500 years in the future.

[Lukertin]

Shinigami013 wrote...
The Human brain uses 10% of its potiental. With the full 100% who knows what it could do?

Speak for your own brain.