428 réponses à ce sujet

[Myusha]

A lot of people are asking about Return to Ostagar for PS3, and complaining about Bioware. Here's some info.

-Bioware sent it to be registered by Sony. They can do nothing about it at this point, except pull it again, and that's pointless.

-Bioware also sent the PS3 version of "Return to Ostagar" the same time as the PC Version, and X-Box 360.

-Sony's registration process is also longer then the X-Box's or PC's.

-Sony updates the Playstation Store every Thursday.  Meaning that if RTO got pass registration this Friday, we'd have to wait another week.

-Originally the PS3 version of Ostagar wasn't even intended to be released alongside the X-Box, or PC users, before it got pulled. They probably anticipated the delay from Sony before hand, or the PS3 is harder to make content for.

-Another reason is because the problem that caused the 360 version to be pulled was in the PS3 version as well, and it "made more sense" for it to be solved on 360 first. So they worked on the 360 version, and THEN they started working on the PS3.

So to everyone saying that RTO isn't on the PS3 yet due to Bioware, I'd like to believe it's Sony's fault.
[^My Original Post^]
This is now the Offical PS3 RTO Debate, since this seems to be the only one allowed to discuss it..

Modifié par Myusha, 22 février 2010 - 05:10 .

[BanksHector]

Thank you for information.

[cmathews03]

Thanks, Myusha. However, this information is almost commonplace for anyone on these forums who is willing to dig around and search a bit. That being said, the disgruntled PS3 players find it easier, or "funner," to lambaste Bioware--and no explanation to the contrary will abate this.

[Abriael_CG]

Actually they clearly stated that the biggest reason is because the problem that caused the 360 version to be pulled was in the PS3 version as well, and it "made more sense" for it to be solved on 360 first. So they worked on the 360 version, and THEN they started working on the PS3.

The time it takes for certification may be longer at Sony, but not weeks longer.

[Myusha]

Abriael_CG wrote...

Actually they clearly stated that the biggest reason is because the problem that caused the 360 version to be pulled was in the PS3 version as well, and it "made more sense" for it to be solved on 360 first. So they worked on the 360 version, and THEN they started working on the PS3.
The time it takes for certification may be longer at Sony, but not weeks longer.

I'll add this into the post then. Thank you Abriael.

[Abriael_CG]

Myusha wrote...
I'll add this into the post then. Thank you Abriael.

The crux of the matter is that it's not just "sony's fault", Bioware isn't necessarily innocent in this problem. To work on the 360 version first was their decision, hence your final point is kinda voided.

Mind you, they are fully entitled to privilege a console over the other, but the owners of the "other" console are fully entitled not to be happy about Bioware's decision <_<

Modifié par Abriael_CG, 10 février 2010 - 12:36 .

[Fexelea]

Abriael_CG wrote...

Actually they clearly stated that the biggest reason is because the problem that caused the 360 version to be pulled was in the PS3 version as well, and it "made more sense" for it to be solved on 360 first. So they worked on the 360 version, and THEN they started working on the PS3.
The time it takes for certification may be longer at Sony, but not weeks longer.

Very true.

Also the PSN store *can* update any other day, they have done it plenty of times.

[Sandtigress]

Fixing the 360 version isn't necessarily a privilege over the PS3 version, it could have just been the one they decided to fix first, for a variety of reasons. As it is, the fix for the PS3 version went a lot faster for having done the 360 version first, and now we wait for Sony to finish with it.

Yeah, I'm frustrated its not out yet too. I've got an HNF playthrough that's stalled until it comes out, as long as I can bear it. But playing the blame game just frustrates people more without actually solving anything, so what's the point?

If Bioware learns how better to go through this process because of the mistakes and flubs made through RtO, then so much the better. Its probably got to happen somewhere along the line. Maybe I'll make a fuss or change what platform I play on if it keeps happening in the future, but I don't foresee that happening. There's no reason at this point to think that the Bioware team is not as upset about what is happening with the PS3 RtO version as the PS3 owners are.

Modifié par Sandtigress, 10 février 2010 - 12:48 .

[Realmzmaster]

It was a business decision that made sense. The Xbox and PC are not that different when it comes to the basic code (Intel microprocessors). The interface is different. Since most development occurs on a PC solving the Xbox problem may not have been as difficult.

The PS3 is a different beast since it uses the Cell microprocessor. Solving the problem on the PS3 first does not mean the same fix will work on the Xbox, even if the problem is the same. Due to different APIs. The PC and Xbox share roughly the same APIs.

Not that any of this matters if you are a PS3 owner waiting for RTO. What they could have done is delayed the release for every platform, but that runs into contractual obligations to EA and Microsoft.

[Abriael_CG]

Realmzmaster wrote...
Not that any of this matters if you are a PS3 owner waiting for RTO. What they could have done is delayed the release for every platform, but that runs into contractual obligations to EA and Microsoft.

And if they do have such contractual obligations, that's definitely something they can be blamed for.
When you chose to sign an agreement that brings you to priviledge a platform over the other, you willingly accept that the owners of the "other" platform won't exactly be pleased with you

Modifié par Abriael_CG, 10 février 2010 - 12:58 .

[Fexelea]

^

Which is probably why we will never hear if such agreement is in place.

[rogue1983]

if bioware sent it at the same time we would have it already. victor or fernando already said the xbox takes one week cert and the ps3 takes 2 weeks cert and if that is the case the sent it off a week after (maybe if it comes out this week) so according to bioware your fact right there is wrong. oh and plus the pc version didn't need cert so if they released it at the same time the pc would have been out a week before the xbox.

ps: other add ons have been put on the psn network on a non-thursday so again another point where you are mistaken sorry.

Modifié par rogue1983, 10 février 2010 - 01:22 .

[Strykzilla]

I'll chalk this up to growing pains I'm not sure of any other ps3 bioware games Im a ps3 user didn't know much about bioware and I took a chance on DAO. I'm glad I did it's a good game and the future looks bright let's just hope they learn from this instead of shafting a new audience in the future with funky late releases and little feedback but whatever.

[AngryFrozenWater]

From a technical point of view the architecture of the PS3 is more complicated than the 360 and PC. At least it is more alien. Also, the PS3 part of the engine could contain a problem which is not present on the other two platforms. This could cause bugs to pop up on one platform that (even though the same engine is used) wouldn't appear on another. I am not suggesting this is the case, but there *might* be reasons for the delay other than certification or delay on purpose. Also, if certification fails then the causes must be addressed and the DLC must be offered again.

[Lakmoots]

Considering the misleading and contradictory statements made by Bioware... I would hesitate to blame Sony.



They also blame Sony for "giving them a choice" for dlc or disk with a PS3 version of Awakening - they chose dlc and it is "Sony's fault".



This sounds like Obsidian blaming Lucasarts for Kotor2... it is not good enough.

[Fexelea]

There could be many reasons for the delay... but we have been given few and contradicting information.

Also a lot of people want to throw the "It's Sony's fault!" line which I am not buying. These are two serious corporations we are talking about, and it would be expected that they partner to bring appropriate delivery, which would mean an understanding of processes and appropriate time management requirements.

So whatever the reasons are, the OP trying to lump it up to Sony being slow is not really true.

[Special_Agent_Goodwrench]

I gotta go with Fex on this one.



Maybe, when RtO is FINALY released we'll get an answer on who's fault is it, eh?

[Realmzmaster]

Abriael_CG wrote...

Realmzmaster wrote...
Not that any of this matters if you are a PS3 owner waiting for RTO. What they could have done is delayed the release for every platform, but that runs into contractual obligations to EA and Microsoft.

And if they do have such contractual obligations, that's definitely something they can be blamed for.
When you chose to sign an agreement that brings you to priviledge a platform over the other, you willingly accept that the owners of the "other" platform won't exactly be pleased with you

Actually, I should say since EA owns BioWare, EA decides on the contractual obligations and yes they can favor one platform over another depending on which one will bring in the greater profit or more favorable contract terms. Do they? I don't know. I can only speculate.
But I am sure Sony did not sign the same contract that Microsoft did. Sony likes to control the process, pricing etc. Probably more so than Microsoft. But, I could be wrong.

[Spuro]

I doubt EA will be favouring one console over another. The one redeeming quality of EA is that they're all about equal platform support. Bioware should be aware of the procedures involved when getting DLC or patches through with Sony. I believe Bioware is still mostly at fault here.

[Strykzilla]

Like I said it's growing pains this is biowares only ps3 title let them figure the system with Sony out. If the next dlc is lamed with delays and excuses then the hate can be justified. Because bioware will be aware of how long things take with Sony and it would mean ****** poor planning on biowares side. So for now give em a pass and look forward to awakenings and rto eventually.

[Eurypterid]

If you guys want to get the dev posts on this issue. head to This Forum. Click on the BioWare logo under any of the threads to pull up only the dev posts. All of the info provided by Myusha can be found there in those dev posts. Whether you believe them or not is your choice, but they stated 10 days ago that RtO has been sent to Sony for certification. Specifically, the second to last post by Victor Wachter Here states unequivocally that RtO was sent to Sony 10 days ago for certification. If you believe that, then it IS Sony's 'fault' that RtO is not out yet for PS3. If you don't believe that, then I guess you'll have to formulate your own explanation.

Modifié par Eurypterid, 10 février 2010 - 05:16 .

[Abriael_CG]

It's exactly because we do believe them that we know that it's not entirely (or even in large part actually) Sony's fault. RTO has been released 10 days ago on PC and 360. It's been sent for certification to Sony 10 days ago. This tells us that, since Microsoft's certification isn't instant (and PC certification doesn't exist), bioware took the decision to privilge the 360 version over both PC and PS3. With the result that the PC version came out the same day as the 360 (while it should have released before, given the lack of need for certification) and the PS3 is still in limbus.

And since we do click on the "bioware" button, we also noticed that Victor confirmed explicitly that the work on the 360 version took precedence over the PS3.



Now, as I said, they're entitled to their business decisions, just as customers that take the short end of the stick are entitled to be unhappy about them.

[Realmzmaster]

We have to remember that BioWare is not alone in this decision. EA owns BioWare. I doubt there is any decision at BioWare that does not have to get approval from EA. Like I said there are contractual agreements we know nothing about. For example Microsoft may take less of a cut than Sony. So in terms of dollars and sense who do you favor? BioWare may have been told what it is going to do.When you give up your independence, you lose ability to make your own decisions.

[Residentz]

Sooo, any chance it'll pop up this week's thursday? :/

[Abriael_CG]

Realmzmaster wrote...

We have to remember that BioWare is not alone in this decision. EA owns BioWare. I doubt there is any decision at BioWare that does not have to get approval from EA. Like I said there are contractual agreements we know nothing about. For example Microsoft may take less of a cut than Sony. So in terms of dollars and sense who do you favor? BioWare may have been told what it is going to do.When you give up your independence, you lose ability to make your own decisions.

For all we are concerned Bioware IS EA. Trying to "forgive" bioware for every single misstep putting the blame on EA is overly simplistic. To begin with, no one forced the Bioware bosses to sell out to EA at a gunpoint, I'd reckon.

Even in the scenario you paint with Microsoft taking less of a cut than Sony (quite farfetched but let's consider it for argument's sake), this still doesn't mean it's not Bioware/EA's fault. If they took the business decision to favor the 360 over the competing console, then they willingly put PS3 owners at a disadvantage. They chose more money over the customer satisfaction for the PS3 owners. It's their right to do so? Sure. People that got shafted due to it have full right to be pissed as well? Just as sure.

Business decisions are a trade-in that companies accept often at the cost of customer satisfaction.
For instance Microsoft gave Rocktar a lot of bribe money for the exclusive DLC's for GTA4. Rockstar took a business decision in accepting the deal. PS3 users are rightfully pissed at that, despite the fact that Rockstar got more money. Rockstar traded in the customer satisfaction of half their customerbase for more money. That half of the customerbase is entirely entitled to be miffed about it.

And mind you, I have the game on PC, so I'm not even involved, but telling PS3 owners "it's not Bioware's fault! You are not entitled to be pissed at them for dealing with you as second-rate customers!" Is a very, very farfetched statement.

Modifié par Abriael_CG, 10 février 2010 - 08:22 .