133 réponses à ce sujet

[Splinter Cell 108]

Even if it was intended that way I don't see how giving us more armor without the option is a good idea. They should give us more armor parts instead of giving us armor sets or they should give us other customizable armors. They could give us ME1's armor variants and it woudn't be too hard either since they are already in the game but can't be used. I'm pretty sure the helmets on those armors can be toggled otherwise all the mercenaries would be wearing helmets and they're not.

[Pagey30]

I see nothing wrong with the concept that the N7 armor would be the best available. It is, after all, designed for supposedly some of the best soldiers in the galaxy.

[ArcanistLibram]

It wouldn't be anywhere near as annoying if Dragon Age didn't toggle helmets off during cutscenes and conversations.

[Skilled Seeker]

Just to clarify the DLC suits are Blood Dragon (you get this by having the code from Dragon Age), Inferno and Terminus (pre order offers), Collecter (Collecter's edition) and now the Cerberus suit with the Network Card. They are all extremely badass and well designed but they all have helmets.

[Wintermist]

77boy84 wrote...

This is not a big issue.

Correction: Not a big issue for you.

77boy84 wrote...

This is bioware giving us an awesome game, and awesome bonus armor, and you're being a **** about it.

Actually, that's not what this problem is about. You think that because people are having an issue with something in the game they automatically hate the whole game? EDIT: We wouldn't even bother if we didn't actually like the game.

The helmet issue, as I see it, is about immersion. Something an RPG is all about. And I don't think the main issue is with the DLC armor, but with the actual N7 armor that is the default armor.

The helmet is already detached on the N7 armor, and what people, me included, was hoping for was that it would be taken off as the character you play enter situations where it completely ruins immersion. Those situations may be few, but it's enough that just one of those situations fail to damage your immersion.

Now if you don't have a problem with that, I don't think you've got anything to say here, correct? Though BioWare has now said their piece about it and further discussion could be viewed as rebellion, it's still how we feel about it.

Modifié par Wintermist, 10 février 2010 - 01:16 .

[stillnotking]

77boy84 wrote...
This is not a big issue.
There are like two or three times when the game actually requires no helmet to be on to make sense.

Not sure what you mean by "make sense".  Personally I don't think it makes a lot of sense for Shepard to be wearing a helmet with faceplate while he talks to every NPC in the game.  It's really aggravating to me, and obviously to a lot of other people.  I wear the +10% headshot visor as a workaround; I'd rather gimp my character than have to put up with it.

ArcanistLibram wrote...

It wouldn't be anywhere near as annoying if Dragon Age didn't toggle helmets off during cutscenes and conversations.

This.  It's not like we're asking for cutting-edge technical sophistication.  It boggles my mind that they couldn't include a simple helmet toggle for conversation.  I really hope they fix this with a patch.

[tsd16]

tmp7704 wrote...

DarthReavus wrote...

But definitely not a return to the old toggle system where you could magically pull a big helmet out of your arse.

I liked the old toggle way precisely because you didn't have to run all way to ship locker just to switch between seeing your face in cutscenes on say, Citadel where no one really wears a helmet and having your helmet on in firefights where it looked better to have it. It's purely an appearance thing, and being able to toggle it is no more immersion breaking than Shepard able to magically get drunk through their helmet glass.

That was the part about the helmets being on I thought was ludicrous.  After beating the game I was strolling around in the inferno armo, said hey lets have a drink, and I saw him drink through the glass on the helmet!  FAIL.

[Stofsk]

It's a shame that the developers don't take this criticism onboard. I don't know how you could fix it, but it is a shame. It's a valid complaint. I don't let it bother me though, because I go with the N7 armour with headshot visor (at least I can kiss someone or drink green alcohol).



Mind you, I have a hard time coming to terms with walking around in full battle armour carrying 5 weapons on my back in civilian areas, and everyone being blase about it ("Lol he's a Spectre I guess he can shoot anyone he wants whenever he wants."). I think that ruins immersion as well. It would be nice if you actually had to wear civvies in such places. (this is a problem with both games IMO)

[Sgt.Roadkill]

yeah drinkgin through the helemt / kising through thelemt was anothe rhting that iritaed the ****** out of me......



i fall directly in the 2 camps of i wish that A) the helemts woudl be removed during points in the ganme where it woudl make sense and i wish i could jsut decide nto to wear the helmet while wearing inferno armoru and similar.

[Ninja Ataris]

I think the simplest solution would be to just make the helmets toggleable in the locker, like on the N7 armor. Removing it for certain cutscenes and all would stretch the immersion a bit, at least for me.

[Stofsk]

People keep referencing the Dragon Age solution of having the helmet you wear magically disappear whenever you're in a dialogue cutscene. That's not a solution either, for immersion's sake. I kinda get what the developers mean when they say this is all intentional, because for immersion's sake you'd need to actually carry that helmet somewhere, rather than have it completely disappear, then reappear after a cutscene.



I remember in ME1 at the end when you're in the elevator heading up to the council chambers to kill Saren, and he cuts the power to the elevator. Shep says 'Suit up! We're going outside!' First of all, you're already suited up, but that's just a writing issue. Secondly, the helmet isn't visible anywhere on your character model (unless you play Shep with the helmet on all the time).



For that reason alone, I actually wouldn't want a helmet toggle. I would rather you wear it full time like a real soldier would on the battlefield, or take it off for cutscenes and hold it in your arms. Because while it's silly to go to the bar in the Citadel and drink through a helmet, it's also silly to toggle it 'off' and 'on' whenever you want, with your helmet in your magical bag of holding that's also invisible.



My ideal solution would probably be controversial - wear civilian clothing in civilian areas. A lot of the missions on the Citadel (for example) are non-combat anyway, so you don't really need to wear your battle armour and walking arsenal. When you do go on a combat mission, it's usually to a specific location so it would make sense to be armed and armoured. But if all you're doing is walking around a mall, walking into shops and talking to people... it's a bit silly to be ready for battle.



And it's not like they don't already do this in the game - Samara's loyalty quest is a perfect example. I just wish they'd extended that to other parts of the game.

[AM50]

I don't mind. Its annoying but not a huge issue. I love my custom armor and colors. It would be cool to be able to use the individual components from the DLC armors but its not a huge deal. At least I don't think so. I wish they had more visors and things like that. That would be cool. I love using the visor now.

[Wintermist]

They should just have made an animation of Shepard taking his helmet off to kiss Liara, and put his helmet on the bar counter as he drank his drink, and there we go. No problem anymore.

[uv23]

Don't speak for everyone. I, personally, do not want a helmet toggle. If I decide to go out into the field fully armored, I'm not going to take off my helmet every time I speak to someone. Especially in a combat zone. That's just ridiculous.

[implodinggoat]

Honestly, a helmet toggle would be nice; but if Bioware isn't planning on adding it then its best to focus our requests elsewhere. I suggest we encourage the Bioware programmers to focus more effort on creating new armor pieces that can be used with the armor customization system. In the long term new armor pieces with distinct appearances would be greatly appreciated. In the short term just quickly making some armor pieces that use existing models; but have different (and hopefully more powerful) stats would be nice. For example I really like the look of the strength boost pads shoulder armor; but as a gun focused soldier I can't rationalize choosing their 25% boost to melee damage over the 3% boost to weapon damage the stock N7 shoulder pads give me.

[WoodWizzard87]

I want all the benefits of the helmet, but i don't want the ****ing thing on my head when i'm talking to people and going through cinematic parts of the game. Its just much better to see the face of your hero than look at a helmet with a visor on it.



It took me all that time customizing my Sheppards' facial features, Yet i have to penalize myself to just see his face during dialogue and such? What a bunch of ****!!

[Shipwr3K]

lol

[Darth_Trethon]

Wintermist wrote...

Nite77 wrote...

Darth_Trethon wrote...
. Nobody whined when you couldn't change armors in ME1 so get over yourself, wipe off your tears and move the hell on.

...wat.

Ssshhhhh, don't wake the delusional.

OK poor choice of words.....you could "change" armors but not customize them....still I shouldn't have to clarify the intent should be obvious.

[durasteel]

scyphozoa wrote...
you do realize that you're making demands and complaints about bonus armor. N7 is the stand alone product you bought. You're complaining about the bonus armors BDA, Terminus, Collector or Cebrerus. They are bonus. N7 armor allows for helmet to go unworn.

Look, I'm not trying to jump on the helmet toggle bandwaggon here, but your just plain wrong.  The Terminus, Collector's, and Inferno armor are what's called "bargained for consideration."  If you, the consumer, have done your part (ie purchased the CE or pre-ordered the game) then you are entitled to that in-game item as a contractual right.  It is not in any way, shape, or form a "freebie."

An argument might be made that there is an implied warranty that the DLC armor is fit for a particular purpose.  Since Mass Effect 2 is marketed as a role-playing game, that purpose is arguably role playing.  If it is not possible for a reasonable consumer to role play the character with a persistent helmet, then there might be a problem.

Another issue is that the helmets in Mass Effect 1 were toggled.  This game is unequivocally marketed as a sequel to ME1, so it is very reasonable to expect that functionality present in the first game will not be inexplicably stripped from the sequel, absent notice of such before purchase.

Now, I'm not suggesting that the helmets are a big deal, but the suggestion that no one has the perogative to complain because these are "bonus" items is simply preposterous.

Armor in ME2 comes in two varieties: modular and set.  The N7 is obviously the modular armor, while every other costume is a set, including each of the costumes worn by your squadmates.  You might notice that your squadmates do not have their helmets on at all times, despite the fact that they have an armor "set."  Another thing you might notice is that the game has settings to override your helmet choice, even on the N7 armor.  Not only does the game toggle your helmet on for missions in hostile atmospheres, if you have a helmet substitute (eg a visor) equiped, it will override that selection and put Shepard in the respirator helm for these encounters (such as your time spent on the Flotilla.)  All of this suggests to me that the one and only reason that the helmets of the DLC armor are fixed in place at all times is because they were, quite simply, half-assed in their implementation.  The art department did a great job on the design, but when they were coded in to the game someone made the decision to do it fast rather than to do it right.  It's a shame.  It's not a big deal, but it is also not a good sign.

[durasteel]

uv23 wrote...

Don't speak for everyone. I, personally, do not want a helmet toggle. If I decide to go out into the field fully armored, I'm not going to take off my helmet every time I speak to someone. Especially in a combat zone. That's just ridiculous.

Which is why you should be enthusiastic about a helmet toggle.  You could set yours to "on" and go dance at the nightclubs with your face fully protected.  Another player can head-butt a krogan while bare-headed.  Everyone's happy.

[cronshaw8]

uv23 wrote...

Don't speak for everyone. I, personally, do not want a helmet toggle. If I decide to go out into the field fully armored, I'm not going to take off my helmet every time I speak to someone. Especially in a combat zone. That's just ridiculous.

I think people are irriatated because if you go somewhere like illium you would like to talk to npcs w/ your helmet off and then put your helmet back on for say Thane's recruitment mission w/out having to go back to the ship.
Maybe part of BioWare's problem is that they gave the helmets stats perhaps that makes the toggle option a little more complicated? (i'm no game developer)

Modifié par cronshaw8, 10 février 2010 - 04:51 .

[WoodWizzard87]

durasteel wrote...

scyphozoa wrote...
you do realize that you're making demands and complaints about bonus armor. N7 is the stand alone product you bought. You're complaining about the bonus armors BDA, Terminus, Collector or Cebrerus. They are bonus. N7 armor allows for helmet to go unworn.

Look, I'm not trying to jump on the helmet toggle bandwaggon here, but your just plain wrong.  The Terminus, Collector's, and Inferno armor are what's called "bargained for consideration."  If you, the consumer, have done your part (ie purchased the CE or pre-ordered the game) then you are entitled to that in-game item as a contractual right.  It is not in any way, shape, or form a "freebie."

An argument might be made that there is an implied warranty that the DLC armor is fit for a particular purpose.  Since Mass Effect 2 is marketed as a role-playing game, that purpose is arguably role playing.  If it is not possible for a reasonable consumer to role play the character with a persistent helmet, then there might be a problem.

Another issue is that the helmets in Mass Effect 1 were toggled.  This game is unequivocally marketed as a sequel to ME1, so it is very reasonable to expect that functionality present in the first game will not be inexplicably stripped from the sequel, absent notice of such before purchase.

Now, I'm not suggesting that the helmets are a big deal, but the suggestion that no one has the perogative to complain because these are "bonus" items is simply preposterous.

Armor in ME2 comes in two varieties: modular and set.  The N7 is obviously the modular armor, while every other costume is a set, including each of the costumes worn by your squadmates.  You might notice that your squadmates do not have their helmets on at all times, despite the fact that they have an armor "set."  Another thing you might notice is that the game has settings to override your helmet choice, even on the N7 armor.  Not only does the game toggle your helmet on for missions in hostile atmospheres, if you have a helmet substitute (eg a visor) equiped, it will override that selection and put Shepard in the respirator helm for these encounters (such as your time spent on the Flotilla.)  All of this suggests to me that the one and only reason that the helmets of the DLC armor are fixed in place at all times is because they were, quite simply, half-assed in their implementation.  The art department did a great job on the design, but when they were coded in to the game someone made the decision to do it fast rather than to do it right.  It's a shame.  It's not a big deal, but it is also not a good sign.

Its not a big deal, but it is a pain sometimes.  I like watching the emotions on the character faces, even though they were haxx sometimes.  It makes them more human to see expressions. 

I kind of compare it to going on a date with a gorgeous gal and she wears a big pair of sunglasses the whole time.  Kind of frustrating when you cant see the emotion from her smile and eyes and such, kinda get it?

[Plazeor]

There are numerous ways to please both sides of the argument. The response of we designed it this way is valid. Just like my response of I am not buying the Collectors Edition of Mass Effect 3 as a result is valid. If this was such a great addition to the game, why did they not announce it earlier? At least then I could have decided before the fact and not feel mislead.

[WoodWizzard87]

Heartlocker wrote...

stofsk wrote...

People keep referencing the Dragon Age solution of having the helmet you wear magically disappear whenever you're in a dialogue cutscene. That's not a solution either, for immersion's sake. I kinda get what the developers mean when they say this is all intentional, because for immersion's sake you'd need to actually carry that helmet somewhere, rather than have it completely disappear, then reappear after a cutscene.

I remember in ME1 at the end when you're in the elevator heading up to the council chambers to kill Saren, and he cuts the power to the elevator. Shep says 'Suit up! We're going outside!' First of all, you're already suited up, but that's just a writing issue. Secondly, the helmet isn't visible anywhere on your character model (unless you play Shep with the helmet on all the time).

For that reason alone, I actually wouldn't want a helmet toggle. I would rather you wear it full time like a real soldier would on the battlefield, or take it off for cutscenes and hold it in your arms. Because while it's silly to go to the bar in the Citadel and drink through a helmet, it's also silly to toggle it 'off' and 'on' whenever you want, with your helmet in your magical bag of holding that's also invisible.

My ideal solution would probably be controversial - wear civilian clothing in civilian areas. A lot of the missions on the Citadel (for example) are non-combat anyway, so you don't really need to wear your battle armour and walking arsenal. When you do go on a combat mission, it's usually to a specific location so it would make sense to be armed and armoured. But if all you're doing is walking around a mall, walking into shops and talking to people... it's a bit silly to be ready for battle.

And it's not like they don't already do this in the game - Samara's loyalty quest is a perfect example. I just wish they'd extended that to other parts of the game.

This, you really nailed it perfectly. 

Plus everytime you hit a load screen before battle, you pick out your weapons a squadmates anyways.