335 réponses à ce sujet

[Occams Razor 17]

These are the steps to ensure that everyone survives.  It is possible to have everyone survive without following all of these steps, but this is the simplest, surest way to do so. (If anyone has proof that any of this is wrong, please say so and I will edit this post) 

Here is the way to make sure everyone survives:

• Get all Loyalties.
• Get all Combat Ship Upgrades (Shields, Armor, Cannon)
• Go directly to Omega 4 Relay after abduction. (Make sure Legion's loyalty mission is the first thing you do after IFF mission)
• Tech: Tali, Legion, or Kasumi (Must be loyal)
• Leader: Miranda, Garrus, and/or Jacob (Must be loyal)
• Biotics: Samara/Morinth, or Jack (Must be loyal)
• Hold the Line: Grunt, Garrus, and Zaeed (Leave these squadmates behind during the boss fight, and don't give them escort duty)
• Escort/Boss Fight:  Anyone squishy who you wouldn't want on the Line (Mordin, Tali, etc) (Must be loyal)

It's not possible to have anyone die if you follow those guidelines, and it is possible to get away with unloyal people on the line if you do follow them closely. 

If you want to know the exact priority order for character deaths during each segment, (as well as how to get the No One Left Behind achievement with 3 loyals by recruiting the bare minimum number of squadmates), read this impressive guide written by Ecael and Pacifien; The Ultimate Guide for the Omega-4 Relay Mission.

If you're interested in manipulating the system to cause certain characters to die, read Ecael's "The Worst Possible Playthrough for Import in ME3" thread.

Here is the original OP that explains why characters can die off camera during the boss fight and Hold the Line.

Dusty Everman's Post

Dusty Everman wrote...

Mordin's death is not a glitch or bug.  I believe that when people are surprised with Mordin's death, it's during the "Hold the Line" time where you leave crew behind as you and two squad mates move onward.   Tech had their moment in the sun with the tunnel infiltration.  A biotic is key for the protective bubble.  The Hold the Line sequence is time for your soldier types to do their best.

Basically you want your best DEFENDERS to hold the line.  Don't think about offensive solo strikers.  Think about the guys that can dig down and hold a position with moxie.  You want them to hold the line.

Under the hood, each character has a "hole the line" score, which gets a bonus  if the character is loyal.  Characters like Mordin, Jack and Tali are squishy and not exoeruenced with bunkering down and holding out for an extended period of time.  Characters like Grunt and Zaeed are tanks who thrive on this type of work.  The score is tallied for all the team members that are holding the line, and the number of survivors are calculated.  If people are to die, the non-loyals squishies go first through the list to the loyal tanks.  Alas, I think Mordin is at the head of the death list.  Some characters can't survive without help even if they are loyal.  Others can survive even if not loyal.   

Here are some examples for the group holding the line:
Loyal Mordin by himself:  He can't hold the line by himself.  He dies.
Non-loyal Grunt by himself: Grunt lives.  He hunkers down and gets the job done, and doesn't have to worry about helping any one else.
Loyal Mordin and non-Loyal Grunt:   Grunt dies, but Mordin lives.  Grunt is able to hold the line but goofs up helping Mordin... he was just too aggressive without his right of passage.
Loyal Mordin and Loyal Grunt: They both live.

Note it is possible to get non-loyal henchmen to survive through the end game with the proper group holding the line.

So what is a good strategy?  Send back a loyal squishy with the crew, like Mordin or Tali.   Leave your defensive bad asses to hold the line (hmmm, Garrus defended a base all by himself to an extended period of time....)  and take your loyal offensive favorites with you to the end.

As for saving Kelly and the crew, you just need to make sure you go through the Omega-4 relay right after the crew is taken, and make sure you send a loyal squad mate back as an escort.

Hope this helps people out; and thanks, Dusty, for this info!

Modifié par Occams Razor 17, 23 juin 2010 - 06:59 .

[Occams Razor 17]

Bump? I wish this answer was easy for people to find, since the question comes up so much.

[Frotality]

well now i really dont understand why my unloyal jack survived that part....maybe doing the mission but losing it from the choice afterwards is different than not doing it.

[Gill Kaiser]

On my first playthrough I kind of assumed it would be something like this. Might I ask what data this is based on though?

[HelterSkelter89]

i just figured this was common sense lawl.

[Lew717]

I thought they told you Mordin is as good a soldier as an scientist

Anyway I took legion and tali to boss and no one died lol

[binaryemperor]

I figured this too, that was why I always sent Mordin back to the ship. It just seemed logical. As we all know how well salarians....



HOLD THE LINE!

[aznsoisauce]

I wouldn't call it common sense considering Mordin protected the clinic on Omega. Then again, he had those mechs...



Regardless, this is good to know. Either way, though, I always bring Mordin with me to the end-boss for his Incinerate.

[Canned Bullets]

Well, I took Thane and Grunt with me, and left the rest behind with Tali in the vents and Mordin going back with the survivors.

[HelterSkelter89]

every time i took tali and mordin because i figured they weren't the type to "hold the line". every time i had noone die. pretty common sense to figure a tech with few offensive abilities and low health isn't going to be the soldier type needed to hold a position.



i found out one thing though. legion will die if unloyal in the boss fight but not if he holds the line, hope that helps someone.

[flem1]

Excellent repost, OP.

And note:  just like Bio telegraphs that Thane and Samara, though badasses, won't do well as fire team leaders (they both say they've spent all their time working *alone*), Mordin's dialogue about Kirrahe telegraphs his weakness here.

aznsoisauce wrote...

Either way, though, I always bring Mordin with me to the end-boss for his Incinerate.

Exactly.

[Canned Bullets]

HelterSkelter89 wrote...

every time i took tali and mordin because i figured they weren't the type to "hold the line". every time i had noone die. pretty common sense to figure a tech with few offensive abilities and low health isn't going to be the soldier type needed to hold a position.

i found out one thing though. legion will die if unloyal in the boss fight but not if he holds the line, hope that helps someone.

Yeah same with Miranda even though she wasn't loyal.

[Balek-Vriege]

Just guessing but here's my guestimation of who is what:



Primary Defenders: Garrus, Grunt, Zaeed

Secondary Defenders: Jacob and Miranda (Both were able to survive on Station)

Offensive: Thane, Samara, Legion, Jack

Neither: Tali and Mordin

[Empiro]

Also just to be clear: you don't need all 8 of your party members to be loyal in order to have everyone survive and also save the entire crew. In fact, someone did it with just 4 loyal characters (and according to a Bioware person, that's the minimum).

In my game, Legion was not loyal, but I still got everyone to survive on my second try (on my first try, Mordin ate a rocket).

Modifié par Empiro, 11 février 2010 - 06:16 .

[IndomitusRex]

Weird, I've always taken Garrus and Grunt to the final fight, two of the best defenders, and the only time I've lost someone was when I didn't send Mordin to escort the crew back.

[binaryemperor]

Balek-Vriege wrote...

Just guessing but here's my guestimation of who is what:

Primary Defenders: Garrus, Grunt, Zaeed
Secondary Defenders: Jacob and Miranda (Both were able to survive on Station)
Offensive: Thane, Samara, Legion, Jack
Neither: Tali and Mordin

I had Miranda the only one to die in the line hold. I'd imagine she's somewhat squishy. if she died before unloyal Zaeed.

Modifié par binaryemperor, 11 février 2010 - 06:19 .

[Alamar2078]

binaryemperor wrote...

I figured this too, that was why I always sent Mordin back to the ship. It just seemed logical. As we all know how well salarians....

HOLD THE LINE!

I always liked sending Thane back with the crew so he could lead them around trouble.  Also it's too much fun to get Mordin to "hold the line" everything considered

[Shadow-Novus]

I dunno, I still vote for it being a bug. I've tried numerous combinations and Mordin always bites it unless I either take him with me or send him back with the crew.

[FFTARoxorz05]

Is there a wiki with these values? Somehow Zaeed, cofounder of a galaxy-wide organization, isn't a good leader and Legion isn't a good tech.  I don't really miss Zaeed, but Legion was cool.

On topic, I'm pretty sure I let Mordin hold the line and he didn't bite it.  He was loyal with a health upgrade though.

Modifié par FFTARoxorz05, 11 février 2010 - 06:33 .

[Cutlass Jack]

FFTARoxorz05 wrote...

Is there a wiki with these values? Somehow Zaeed, cofounder of a galaxy-wide organization, isn't a good leader and Legion isn't a good tech.  I don't really miss Zaeed, but Legion was cool.

Zaeed was held down by 6 of his own people and shot in the head. Not the sign of a good leader. Also if you listen to his tales, they often involve him being the only one who survived. Not the kind of guy you want to trust to keep your team alive.

Legion should have been just fine as your tech though. He's right at the top with Tali. If he died its probably because you picked a poor fireteam leader.

[StowyMcStowstow]

The leaders and members of whatever teams go where ever is important. I managed to figure that out on my third playthrough.



Remember, you gotta Hold The Line, because love isn't always on time.

[BobbyTheI]

StowyMcStowstow wrote...

Remember, you gotta Hold The Line, because love isn't always on time.

You, my friend, win the obscure reference trophy of the evening.  Congratulations.  

[Occams Razor 17]

flem1 wrote...

Excellent repost, OP.

And note:  just like Bio telegraphs that Thane and Samara, though badasses, won't do well as fire team leaders (they both say they've spent all their time working *alone*), Mordin's dialogue about Kirrahe telegraphs his weakness here.

aznsoisauce wrote...

Either way, though, I always bring Mordin with me to the end-boss for his Incinerate.

Exactly.

Thanks.  What was in Mordin's dialogue about Kirrahe that telegraphs it?  I don't remember what he says.

[Dark Specie]

Occams Razor 17 wrote...
Thanks.  What was in Mordin's dialogue about Kirrahe that telegraphs it?  I don't remember what he says.

I think it was basically that Kirrahe is big on speeches and teamwork - he himself on the other hand, is more of a lonewolf.

[xdaimyox]

Rubbish. I've left Mordin on the line THREE DAMNED TIMES now and he's never died. In fact, nobody has.