167 réponses à ce sujet

[Slygar]

Thomas_R_Roy wrote...

Every modern XBox shooter has some form of aim-assist. People will swear they don't exist or they have them turned off, but most games don't let you. Halo 1,2,3, CoD, Gears of War 1,2, Resident Evil 5, Borderlands, ShadowRun...etc etc etc

We have five systems:

1) Zoom-snap - When you zoom in, the camera moves towards your current target.
2) Bullet magnetism - if you were going to miss by a very small margin, we help you out. (a pretty tiny amount)
3) Friction - when you are over a target, your stick moves slower with slightly more control
4) Adhesion - as you and an enemy turn, it makes it easier to hold the same position
5) Aim-point-preservation - when you pop out of cover, we try to keep your aim point stay where you want it

I wrote most of the systems except #1. They're all tuned pretty low but all together they make a difference and make you able to turn faster and maneuver smoothly.

I'd love to hear specific criticisms of the systems, things I can fix.

Why is there not an option to turn this off?   I don't get it.  You hate to see your hard work wasted?  O.o

[Jayce]

Ok I've been playing this sunday afternoon again and I must say the zoom-snap is by far the most annoying of the lot. It's the no spoilers forum so I'll have to limit what I can say but here's the latest example.



Purgatory. The latter stages; I'm behind cover but there's a merc up on a catwalk who is in a flanking position on my squad mates. I decide to deal with him because I can't move the others due to the dirty great big Ymir whos on the opposite side . The merc ducks back in cover, so I line up a shot on a nearby explosive cannster. I pop up for a scope shot only for the zoom-snap to decide I was trying to aim at the merc (who I can't even hit as he's in cover) and I end up aiming halfway between the Merc and the cannister... by the time I'd realigned the shot the Ymir had torn me a new one and I had to restart the entire section. I was not a happy bunny.



It's less of a problem on Casual, Normal and to a lesser degree, Veteran but on Hardcore and Insanity, the margin for error is tiny and things like that are often fatal. On those seettings, Zoom-snap is a massive hinderance, not a help.

[Warskullx]

 1) Zoom-snap - When you zoom in, the camera moves towards your current target.
2) Bullet magnetism - if you were going to miss by a very small margin, we help you out. (a pretty tiny amount)
3) Friction - when you are over a target, your stick moves slower with slightly more control
4) Adhesion - as you and an enemy turn, it makes it easier to hold the same position
5) Aim-point-preservation - when you pop out of cover, we try to keep your aim point stay where you want it

#1/#5 targets enemies extremely aggressively, way too aggressively.  It makes shooting containers and taking out fragile boxes pretty much impossible on higher difficulties.  Once you pop out and have locked onto an enemy it takes some time to break the auto-aim's lock and shift your aim to the explosive container.  In higher difficulties you will take a lot of damage for this.  I can be over an explosive container with the carnifex and it will move 2-3 reticles to target an enemy.  This becomes a huge problem because you obviously want to shoot explosive containers when enemies are near them.

#3) This makes it difficult to break the auto-aim when it locks onto the wrong target, particularly when targets are moving.  #3 and #4 combine in a really nasty way.  If two targets are close together and one starts moving he can steal your reticle and drag it with him, behind him.  You are locked into a poor shot vs the moving target which will most likely miss.

I would kill for an auto-aim-off mode that stopped guessing at what I wanted to shoot at and let me set up my own shots.  It gets in the way just as much as it helps.  #2 is fine and #3 is alright (but its way too hard and takes way to long to drop a target.)

#4 is just flat out miss mode, the game hijacks your control and keeps you behind the target so you cannot shoot it.  It would be better to just tone done friction vs moving targets so you can keep up with their movements on the console.

#2) Bullet magnetism really sucks with the heavy weapons.  It makes the grenade launch suck.  The grenade launcher ends up flying into cover why you try to use the splash to hit enemies behind cover.  It has a decent AoE, I should be able to shoot it at the floor beside the enemy to blow them up.

For the most part, the auto-aim gets in my way more than it helps me.

Modifié par Warskullx, 14 février 2010 - 08:44 .

[xxSgt_Reed_24xx]

Thomas_R_Roy wrote...

Every modern XBox shooter has some form of aim-assist. People will swear they don't exist or they have them turned off, but most games don't let you. Halo 1,2,3, CoD, Gears of War 1,2, Resident Evil 5, Borderlands, ShadowRun...etc etc etc

We have five systems:

1) Zoom-snap - When you zoom in, the camera moves towards your current target.
2) Bullet magnetism - if you were going to miss by a very small margin, we help you out. (a pretty tiny amount)
3) Friction - when you are over a target, your stick moves slower with slightly more control
4) Adhesion - as you and an enemy turn, it makes it easier to hold the same position
5) Aim-point-preservation - when you pop out of cover, we try to keep your aim point stay where you want it

I wrote most of the systems except #1. They're all tuned pretty low but all together they make a difference and make you able to turn faster and maneuver smoothly.

I'd love to hear specific criticisms of the systems, things I can fix.

The first one is bad.....

I have it constantly screw me up when I'm sniping. Like on the final mission when you are fighting the boss, but other bad guys spawn.... I like to kill them too, but whenever I zoomed in with my sniper it would zoom in to some random spot on the boss instead. Really annoying and I died a couple times b/c of it.

The rest are fine, as I'm pretty sure that the games you mentioned have those systems.... I know for a fact CoD does.

[Aranwen1]

auto aim only bothers me when sniping.... which is a lot since im mainly infiltrator.

[AntiChri5]

The amount of times this has screwed up a perfectly aimed headshot.....especially when a biotic buddy sends someone flying across my sniper scope....

[yuncas]

two things that bothered me

- 4 point reticle on the sniper rifle. the transition from 3rd person view to zoom crosshairs view does not match up. while using all other weapons there is no difference between the point of aim when simply holding the gun and when looking down the sights.



-the sniper rifle following an enemy is terribly frustrating, especially when an enemy closes to within melee range.

[SymbolicGamer]

Thomas_R_Roy wrote...

Every modern XBox shooter has some form of aim-assist. People will swear they don't exist or they have them turned off, but most games don't let you. Halo 1,2,3, CoD, Gears of War 1,2, Resident Evil 5, Borderlands, ShadowRun...etc etc etc

We have five systems:

1) Zoom-snap - When you zoom in, the camera moves towards your current target.
2) Bullet magnetism - if you were going to miss by a very small margin, we help you out. (a pretty tiny amount)
3) Friction - when you are over a target, your stick moves slower with slightly more control
4) Adhesion - as you and an enemy turn, it makes it easier to hold the same position
5) Aim-point-preservation - when you pop out of cover, we try to keep your aim point stay where you want it

I wrote most of the systems except #1. They're all tuned pretty low but all together they make a difference and make you able to turn faster and maneuver smoothly.

I'd love to hear specific criticisms of the systems, things I can fix.

The four bolded sometimes seem counter intuitive.

Like I'll try to sweep across a moving enemy after popping out of cover, but the enemy moves faster than the reticle can move.

[thisshistsux]

I had alot of trouble with this feature playing as an infiltrator. It also seemed like I would line up a shot then zoom in and it wouldn't zoom to the right spot, felt broken. And PC elitist GTFO!!!!

[yuncas]

thisshistsux wrote...

I had alot of trouble with this feature playing as an infiltrator. It also seemed like I would line up a shot then zoom in and it wouldn't zoom to the right spot, felt broken.

this is a concise description of the problem I was trying to describe with my half-ass post.

[ScroguBlitzen]

Thomas or some other Bioware rep want to come back in this thread and tell us all how we are making things up and there really is no problem at all?

[AliasGrey]

Game plays as well as, or in some cases better then most 3rd person shooter on the 360, Just my opiniom. dont see what all this aggro is about.

[Soruyao]

If a feature helps you 95% of the time and gets in the way 5% of the time, that feature is still a good feature. There is a net gain.

[LoweGear]

Soruyao wrote...
As for mouse/keyboard being better for shooters, I wonder.  I can understand missing the extra buttons a keyboard has access to, but if using a mouse makes aiming easier, wouldn't using a controller take more skill?   Wouldn't having extra ease in aiming be exactly the same as using aim assist?   In games where you can turn it off, wouldn't the superior gamer be the one who won using a controller?

Indeed, children would prefer a setup that is easier over a setup that takes more skill, would they not?

Using a mouse is easier yes, but don't mistake ease of use for ease of gameplay. Using the mouse to aim manually means that your targetting skill is ultimately up to you, with no "snap" assistance when trying to track moving targets. This means that if you do miss, it's ultimately a resut of your skill with the mouse and not a fault of the system. For example even with mouse and keyboard I still miss targets if I don't aim right (particularly if you're trying to shoot a moving target by leading the shot), and have to use the Adrenaline Rush/Sniper Scope time dilation + Tactical cloak when trying to shoot someone with a sniper rifle - as I imagine most of us who play Soldier or Infiltrator do.

Hence, why PC FPS games rarely have auto-aim: because auto-aim would make the game far too easy if they had installed it.

[ScroguBlitzen]

Broken 5% of the time is broken. We are just asking for the option to turn off aim assist, just like ME1 provided.

If you haven't played Insanity with an Infiltrator or a Sniper centric Soldier on the XBox360 then you have no clue what we are talking about... GTFO of this thread. (or keep responding with ignorance and boost the threads popularity.)

[androshalforc]

ScroguBlitzen wrote...

Thomas or some other Bioware rep
want to come back in this thread and tell us all how we are making
things up and there really is no problem at all?

this seems a bit harsh particularly when they have already asked us for specifics so they can look into the problems

Thomas_R_Roy wrote...

Every modern XBox shooter has some form of aim-assist. People will swear they don't exist or they have them turned off, but most games don't let you. Halo 1,2,3, CoD, Gears of War 1,2, Resident Evil 5, Borderlands, ShadowRun...etc etc etc

We have five systems:

1) Zoom-snap - When you zoom in, the camera moves towards your current target.
2) Bullet magnetism - if you were going to miss by a very small margin, we help you out. (a pretty tiny amount)
3) Friction - when you are over a target, your stick moves slower with slightly more control
4) Adhesion - as you and an enemy turn, it makes it easier to hold the same position
5) Aim-point-preservation - when you pop out of cover, we try to keep your aim point stay where you want it

I wrote most of the systems except #1. They're all tuned pretty low but all together they make a difference and make you able to turn faster and maneuver smoothly.

I'd love to hear specific criticisms of the systems, things I can fix.

although id love to hear an update

[Schneidend]

The specific criticism I can think of is fights where there are multiple enemies and lots of explosive containers. If a vorcha is standing right next to an explosive container, I want to shoot that container and not the vorcha. Unfortunately, the target assist systems will snap my zooming crosshairs to that vorcha instead of the box I was pointing at whilst in cover. As somebody else mentioned, the second or two it takes to drag your cursor away from that vorcha can spell death on Insanity.

[IggyD]

When i use adrenaline rush and I zoom in with the sniper rifle, the game occasionally takes control away from me and tracks the empty air next to my target. Oh, and i can't turn "aim assist"  off?

Oh. Goodie.