I stun 3 enemies and run over to them and just punch them to death in between slams
Biotics + Higher Difficulty = Bad Design Problems. BioWare Please Read and Comment.
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Guest_XxTaLoNxX_*
, févr. 11 2010 02:18
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#101
Posté 12 février 2010 - 03:13
javierabegazo
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Btw, I don't use slam for it's damage, which on Insanity is next to nothing, I use it for it's amazingly awesome 8 second stun and 2 second recharge I stun 3 enemies and run over to them and just punch them to death in between slams
I stun 3 enemies and run over to them and just punch them to death in between slams
Retour en haut
#102
Posté 12 février 2010 - 03:16
Ahglock
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Benny922 wrote...
Slam is pretty sweet. I could see it being pretty useful for an adept. I'm not quite sure how people are annoyed that biotics suck on insanity. They suck just as much as tech.
I like slam alot since it is the only biotic bonus talent that feels
biotic to me, the rest feel like magic that doesn't fit the lore.
As for the rest of your post.
I think the adept just highlights it more since every one of his abilities except for warp is either severely limited(singularity) or does close to nothing(everything else) The engineer has more abilities that work in every situation. But yes, tech gets hit by this as well.
And the complaint isn't so much that they suck but the loss of versatility in your power usage makes the class less fun. You get stuck in a rut of a certain set of tactics, whcih generally boil down to warp, or the squad does most of the work. There is a little bit of variablility past that but this is the basics. Other classes don't really get pigeonholed into a couple repetative tactics as much as the adept as the difficulty increases.
Furthermore while you can make use of pull, throw, and shockwave all you really need is singualrity and warp. Sure there are times when you have singualrity up and you need pull as an additioanl CC, or maybe someone is near a cliff and throw works wonders. But the added utility is perceived rightly or wrongly to not be large enough to really matter, which means you not only get pigeonholed in tactics but in abilities. Personally I have found that it is mostly true for pure effectiveness, but varying up the powers makes it more fun even if it doesn't really help much.
And wow, this thread is getting nasty.
#103
Posté 12 février 2010 - 05:11
Roxlimn
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Ahglock:
Actually, for a variety of missions, you can work without either Singularity or Warp. Warp Explosion is fantastic, but it's not the ONLY thing that works. That's nearly as lazy as previous players complaining that Warp Spam is the only thing that works. Not so. Pull and Throw are good enough that they can be your bread and butter powers if you choose to do so on Hardcore. The main thrust is the extremely low cooldowns.
Warp and Warp Explosion are great for doing damage, no doubt about that. If you're planning not to use them, you have to compensate for damage dealing by getting a good gun and putting good ammo on it - take a squaddie with good ammo skills, or get a bonus power as one yourself. This also helps with stripping defenses using your weapons. You'll need a good aim.
Once you got that down pat, use squaddie abilities and gunfire to take out defenses, then Throw and Pull to lock them out of firing and to get them out of cover. It's very busy work because you're constantly firing off powers and using guns, but it works.
Flash_in_the_Flesh:
Actually, I've found extreme difficulties in games to rarely be consistent with lore. This is true in Dragon Age as well. Magic is supposed to be feared and your character is supposed to be a powerful warrior, but on higher difficulties, it's a little less true.
Jack actually works really well with a Sentinel on Hardcore. This is because the Sentinel lacks Pull and Singularity, rendering her incapable of deploying Warp Explosion by herself. Jack and Jacob both have Pull, but only Jack has cooldown reductions for it.
On higher difficulty levels in other games, magic is similarly strapped. In classic D&D play in 1st edition, Mages are supposed to be uber-badasses but on higher levels, the saving throw structure meant that every Warrior and his kid resisted darn well every spell with impunity. In 3rd ed, the situation is greatly better, but Spell Resistance and other defenses often worked at cross-purposes to the lore past level 10.
Increasing gameplay difficulty in a game like this is not easy. Jack is supposed to be able to take down 3 YMIR Mechs by herself, using no guns. If she could really do that on Insanity, then it's ceases to be a level with any degree of difficulty, no? Squad powers and efficacy are scaled back on the higher difficulty levels as part and parcel of the difficulty scaling. They lean on you more, regardless of what the lore says about how powerful they are.
Actually, for a variety of missions, you can work without either Singularity or Warp. Warp Explosion is fantastic, but it's not the ONLY thing that works. That's nearly as lazy as previous players complaining that Warp Spam is the only thing that works. Not so. Pull and Throw are good enough that they can be your bread and butter powers if you choose to do so on Hardcore. The main thrust is the extremely low cooldowns.
Warp and Warp Explosion are great for doing damage, no doubt about that. If you're planning not to use them, you have to compensate for damage dealing by getting a good gun and putting good ammo on it - take a squaddie with good ammo skills, or get a bonus power as one yourself. This also helps with stripping defenses using your weapons. You'll need a good aim.
Once you got that down pat, use squaddie abilities and gunfire to take out defenses, then Throw and Pull to lock them out of firing and to get them out of cover. It's very busy work because you're constantly firing off powers and using guns, but it works.
Flash_in_the_Flesh:
Actually, I've found extreme difficulties in games to rarely be consistent with lore. This is true in Dragon Age as well. Magic is supposed to be feared and your character is supposed to be a powerful warrior, but on higher difficulties, it's a little less true.
Jack actually works really well with a Sentinel on Hardcore. This is because the Sentinel lacks Pull and Singularity, rendering her incapable of deploying Warp Explosion by herself. Jack and Jacob both have Pull, but only Jack has cooldown reductions for it.
On higher difficulty levels in other games, magic is similarly strapped. In classic D&D play in 1st edition, Mages are supposed to be uber-badasses but on higher levels, the saving throw structure meant that every Warrior and his kid resisted darn well every spell with impunity. In 3rd ed, the situation is greatly better, but Spell Resistance and other defenses often worked at cross-purposes to the lore past level 10.
Increasing gameplay difficulty in a game like this is not easy. Jack is supposed to be able to take down 3 YMIR Mechs by herself, using no guns. If she could really do that on Insanity, then it's ceases to be a level with any degree of difficulty, no? Squad powers and efficacy are scaled back on the higher difficulty levels as part and parcel of the difficulty scaling. They lean on you more, regardless of what the lore says about how powerful they are.
#104
Posté 12 février 2010 - 07:14
Soruyao
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I have come to the conclusion after exhaustive testing that a shotgun adept is indeed not a good idea against collectors. (At least with the DLC shotgun. Maybe the others would be better?)
I thought that people might want to know about these findings.
After all these topics arguing how weak throw and lift are, I can say that this is a case of something genuinely being a really terrible idea. In fact, the only way I was able to clear the infamous scions on lifts section was when I finally reverted to my old strategies and spammed lift and throw to knock all the collectors off the discs before they could harbingerize.
The jury's still out on shockwave though. We'll see if I can make more use out of it than shotguns.
Lol
I thought that people might want to know about these findings.
After all these topics arguing how weak throw and lift are, I can say that this is a case of something genuinely being a really terrible idea. In fact, the only way I was able to clear the infamous scions on lifts section was when I finally reverted to my old strategies and spammed lift and throw to knock all the collectors off the discs before they could harbingerize.
The jury's still out on shockwave though. We'll see if I can make more use out of it than shotguns.
Lol
#105
Posté 12 février 2010 - 07:28
gr00grams
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After all these topics arguing how weak throw and lift are, I can say that this is a case of something genuinely being a really terrible idea. In fact, the only way I was able to clear the infamous scions on lifts section was when I finally reverted to my old strategies and spammed lift and throw to knock all the collectors off the discs before they could harbingerize.
An easy way to deal with them is bring more biotics.
Trap the one collector that does 'harbingerize' with singularity so he's useless.
Then use warps, reaves (Samara), boolats (with warp ammo from Jack), Pulls/Thows, etc to take out the other collectors while maintaining the singularity on the harbinger.
That method garuantees only one harbinger ever spawns, and the one that does is effectively useless.
Modifié par gr00grams, 12 février 2010 - 07:29 .
#106
Posté 12 février 2010 - 07:38
Hulk Hsieh
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There's an awesome thread in the build forum named "Adepting Through Insanity Adept Guide".
Seems a lot of fun to play with an Adept.
Seems a lot of fun to play with an Adept.
#107
Guest_XxTaLoNxX_*
Posté 12 février 2010 - 07:55
Guest_XxTaLoNxX_*
Guest_XxTaLoNxX_*
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Wow, you know insulting people and saying that they lack intelligence when the number 1 most important rule in this thread was stated in the first post just shows ignorance (please, you know you are better than that). DO NOT FLAME! We are all adults and we can all make valid points without delving into childish arguments and name calling.
Also to the people who believe that all the points in my first post are "my opinions" you clearly and calmly need to reread the first post. I stated (and now repeat) that I am just organizing the arguments in the other thread as cleanly as I can and that if I do have an opinion I will clearly state that the claim is my opinion.
Some of those original points are NOT my opinion. Also I have played an Adept through Insanity and I find myself constantly spamming Warp Explosion or just dropping the shields/barrier/armor and then taking a second to shoot the enemy instead of waiting for a cooldown timer. IN MY OPINION, that is not fun, to make the only effective strategy WE/Warp spam.
Another fix I propose is that in future DLC without having to go back and rework classes just continue with the skill trees, we already choose between two versions of a power, so that if we can add levels to that version of the skill we can make ALL the skills equally effective and fun.
Also, I disagree that Shockwave is bad. I use it after a cover-to-cover smg flurry and backup (squad) AoE Overload/Fireblast/Reave to throw multiple enemies into the air and then AoE Throw, so that if the Shockwave/Throw combo doesn't hurl enemies off the "map" then the remaining enemies are most likely dead from damage. Also FYI you can Reave/Warp... try it, you'll like it.
Also to the people who believe that all the points in my first post are "my opinions" you clearly and calmly need to reread the first post. I stated (and now repeat) that I am just organizing the arguments in the other thread as cleanly as I can and that if I do have an opinion I will clearly state that the claim is my opinion.
Some of those original points are NOT my opinion. Also I have played an Adept through Insanity and I find myself constantly spamming Warp Explosion or just dropping the shields/barrier/armor and then taking a second to shoot the enemy instead of waiting for a cooldown timer. IN MY OPINION, that is not fun, to make the only effective strategy WE/Warp spam.
Another fix I propose is that in future DLC without having to go back and rework classes just continue with the skill trees, we already choose between two versions of a power, so that if we can add levels to that version of the skill we can make ALL the skills equally effective and fun.
Also, I disagree that Shockwave is bad. I use it after a cover-to-cover smg flurry and backup (squad) AoE Overload/Fireblast/Reave to throw multiple enemies into the air and then AoE Throw, so that if the Shockwave/Throw combo doesn't hurl enemies off the "map" then the remaining enemies are most likely dead from damage. Also FYI you can Reave/Warp... try it, you'll like it.
Modifié par XxTaLoNxX, 12 février 2010 - 07:56 .
#108
Posté 13 février 2010 - 04:38
Benny922
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Just finished on insane as a vanguard. Was pretty easy. Maybe the people who are having trouble aren't exploring enough? I think I may have done almost all of the quests and got my shield and health upgraded all the way. Pretty hard to die after that. Shockwave also did a great job clearing out husks and collectors. Oh ya anybody know why there's 1015 gamerscore?
