379 réponses à ce sujet

[corebit]

OP you forgot to substract all the costs (development, marketing, staff) from that $200 million.
You DO know the difference between revenue and actual profit, do you??

Modifié par corebit, 11 février 2010 - 01:09 .

[generalkorrd]

I love how OP says that RTO sucks when he has already said he has never played it. I also love how he speaks for all gamers, and how he seems to know so much about what it takes to run a few hundred million dollar company, probably as he is sitting in his mommys basement, wearing his stormtrooper outfit. Bottom line, do NOT speak for everybody, and stop whining like a little girl. Just because you "read" that RTO is bad ( which it isn't, I actually liked it), dont go spouting it as fact. esp when you have never played it.

Modifié par generalkorrd, 11 février 2010 - 01:17 .

[Sabriana]

Well, I don't like RtO, I didn't buy it, so I never played it (obviously). However, I've viewed a complete walk-through on YouTube. Granted, it only showed me what the individual player chose, but given that it's short DLC, I could see that there wasn't much to it. I don't know exactly what the walkthrough was called, but it was done in 4 parts and played on a console.

I also checked many forums, and reviews and such. There are definitely ways to inform yourself about the product. Just FYI. As for choosing not to purchase, I exercised my right as a consumer. There's no right or wrong about it as far as I believe. Person A buys it and loves it, Person B doesn't buy it, and is happy as well. Neither A nor B are right or wrong.

[generalkorrd]

Sabriana wrote...

Well, I don't like RtO, I didn't buy it, so I never played it (obviously). However, I've viewed a complete walk-through on YouTube. Granted, it only showed me what the individual player chose, but given that it's short DLC, I could see that there wasn't much to it. I don't know exactly what the walkthrough was called, but it was done in 4 parts and played on a console.
I also checked many forums, and reviews and such. There are definitely ways to inform yourself about the product. Just FYI. As for choosing not to purchase, I exercised my right as a consumer. There's no right or wrong about it as far as I believe. Person A buys it and loves it, Person B doesn't buy it, and is happy as well. Neither A nor B are right or wrong.

You are correct, neither is wrong. OP is an idiot by coming on here, and whining about the cost, and content of a dlc he has not played, didnt pay for, and wont pay for ever. Then goes on with all his amazing knowledge of what goes on behind closed doors in EA/Bioware. Then he "shoots" down any contrary opinions by calling them fanbois. Complete idiocy

[Rictras Shard]

I'm wondering when $5 became a huge amount of money.

[Coldcall01]

Yrkoon wrote...

Coldcall01 wrote...

Yrkoon wrote...

Coldcall01 wrote...


Well they got Bioware for a steal at that price, as both DAO and ME2 will gross about the same amount for what EA paid for the whole company a couple years ago. Even if proftibaility is only 50% its still a great deal.

However its no excuse to rip customers on nothing DLC content. EA will make their money back thefold within 10 years and they are more likely to do it sustainably if their customers dont start feeling very cynical towards the group parent.

First off, you're stating your singular opinion as fact.  The last  DLC I bought (RTO)   had *great* content, imo.  Of course, you wouldn't know anything about  RTO's content, since you haven't  actually Played RTO.... as you recently admitted.

Second,  How many times do we have to pound the following point into your head:  WE WERE TOLD EXACTLY WHAT WE WERE  ABOUT TO PURCHASE, then  given a choice as to weather to purchase it or not.  By definition,  we haven't been ripped off.  We were told that   RTO would be about 1 hour long, that it was combat-centric, and that it would cost us exactly 5 dollars.  EVERYTHING we were told was accurate.

And lastly, please, do me a favor. Unless you've suddely become  an industry sales analyst, stop making moronic fiscal predictions  based on "emotion" and "hatred for the evil EA"

I dont need to be a sales analyst to do simple maths. Its very simple just multiply the retail cost with how many units they've sold. Its easy, try it sometime, Use a claculator if you are having issues.

   

Nice try, but as ANYONE here can clearly see from this quote pyramid, you weren't commenting on retail costs and units that have already been sold.  You were making a prediction about FUTURE fiscal success... over a 10 year span, in fact.  And   you did so   without  putting up ANY numbers or figures that can be "crunched" on a calculator  (like, production costs, labor costs, inflation,  how many games they have slated to be released, industry trends etc.)

Be a little more honest, next time.

Look im not here to convince fanbois like yourself. I posted my remarks for Bioware,

Then you should have sent Gaider, Priestly and Woo a  Private message or  email, instead of creating a thread  out in the open in the public forums... where anyone with an iota of knowledge   has the right  to   shred  your "remarks"  to ribbons.

Your first point: The games sales of DAO have already reached 3.2 million units, FACT. ME2 is excpected to do just as well.  Just do the maths and you will see my figures are perfectly legit and are probably very conservative.

There's no opinion involved in the game sales numbers, unless someone is lying and those figures came direct from Bioware so if you have a problem with those numbers take it up with Bioware.

No i chose to put my comments here so all the community can read them and make up their own mind. I'm sorrry thats upset you but frankly i could not care less :-)

[Coldcall01]

And for those who are saying that because i have not bought RTO i cannot comment on it, i'll deal with that moronic stance in one post.



There are now plenty of reviews around decribing exactly how short RTO is. I dont need to buy the thing myself to test the length of it. Its just crap value from a pro rata basis compared to original game. Please read, pro rata, and look it up in the dictionary if you dont understand what that means.



But the funneist thing about the comments when one dares to criticise the beloved Bioware is that its no wonder EA keep coming up with these rip schemes when there is an army of thicko consumers who will pay practically anything for another hour of content.



Ya keep it up folks because you'll just encourage EA/Bioware to charge even more. LOL

[Rictras Shard]

Coldcall01 wrote...



No i chose to put my comments here so all the community can read them and make up their own mind. I'm sorrry thats upset you but frankly i could not care less :-)

Those that needed such a thread to make up their minds likely came to a decision in one of the many other threads about this exact same thing. Thanks, though.

[Yrkoon]

LOL
Not me.
I require exactly 1,203 threads about the "apocolyptic travesty of DLC price gouging", before I decide that the DLC's I've already played (and loved) were a waste of my money.
Er... I mean the OP's money.

Modifié par Yrkoon, 11 février 2010 - 02:04 .

[Coldcall01]

Rictras Shard wrote...

Coldcall01 wrote...



No i chose to put my comments here so all the community can read them and make up their own mind. I'm sorrry thats upset you but frankly i could not care less :-)

Those that needed such a thread to make up their minds likely came to a decision in one of the many other threads about this exact same thing. Thanks, though.

Sure there are threads all over RPG forums making similar points to mine so im hardly alone in this view.

However i wanted to add the gross DAO sales figures in terms everyone understands because its clealry apparent they could be a little more generous to their fan base.

Almost all commerce is based on economies of scale. The more you buy the better the value. hence why they offer extra 10% sized choclate bars or extra 20% detergent. Or two for ones etc...

The point is that the DLC strategy is based on the exact opposite principal. The more you buy the more you are paying pro rata. Thats a fact, not an opinion.

[Coldcall01]

Yrkoon wrote...

LOL
Not me.
I require exactly 1,203 threads about the "apocolyptic travesty of DLC price gouging", before I decide that the DLC's I've already played (and loved) were a waste of my money.
Er... I mean the OP's money.

No-one is telling you not to buy them. You obviously love them and their value is somewhat a nebulous concept from your perspective which is fine, but many of us dont feel that way and we are also Bioware customers.

Thats all, live with it.

[Yrkoon]

Coldcall01 wrote...


However i wanted to add the gross DAO sales figures in terms everyone understands because its clealry apparent they could be a little more generous to their fan base.

Aah!  I see.  So basically you're saying that  Because  the 5-years-in-the-making   DA:O (and you still haven't posted actual profit figures yet, but we'll get to that later)  sold   $200 Million, then that means Bioware should generously burn some of those profits by creating high-production  (with Voice acting, marketing, advertising etc) DLCs then   give them away for free.

Before we go any further...  is THIS the gist  of your argument?

[Rictras Shard]

Coldcall01 wrote...


No-one is telling you not to buy them. You obviously love them and their value is somewhat a nebulous concept from your perspective which is fine, but many of us dont feel that way and we are also Bioware customers.

Thats all, live with it.

You can't get much more inexpensive than $5. The impression I get from threads such as these is that the OPs think they should be getting the DLC for free. That would be nice, but if such a thing happened, further games from the company would be of a much lesser quality, or the company would go out of business.

Myself, I don't mind paying for things I enjoy, as it helps to ensure that the people I give money to will make more things I enjoy.

[Yrkoon]

Coldcall01 wrote...

No-one is telling you not to buy them.

No?


  And here I thought you were warning us about the  inevidable Music-industry-like DOOM that we're going to see if we continue to  "waste our  fanboi money" on any crap with the Bioware label on it.

Glad to see that your stance is really:   I urge you to please do what you want!

Modifié par Yrkoon, 11 février 2010 - 02:18 .

[generalkorrd]

Yrkoon wrote...

Coldcall01 wrote...


However i wanted to add the gross DAO sales figures in terms everyone understands because its clealry apparent they could be a little more generous to their fan base.

Aah!  I see.  So basically you're saying that  Because  the 5-years-in-the-making   DA:O (and you still haven't posted actual profit figures yet, but we'll get to that later)  sold   $200 Million, then that means Bioware should generously burn some of those profits by creating high-production  (with Voice acting, marketing, advertising etc) DLCs then   give them away for free.

Before we go any further...  is THIS the gist  of your argument?

Yes, he wants it for free, because mean old EA isnt going to listen to his poormouthing. Face it OP things change, and the industry isnt what it was 10 years ago. You go on and on about piracy in your first post, why do you think the companies are charging for everything now? Because they KNOW it will get pirated, so they are making up the loss before it happens. Do you honestly think these loser pirates will look at DAO and say" hey wow look, free dlc, lets not pirate this one okay guys?" If you do you are dumber than you let on

[hardvice]

If you actually read the article you linked to, you'll see that the alleged $10 charge for used games is really just about including free DLC (The Stone Prisoner in DA:O and the Cerberus Network in ME2--both of which were actually $15, but hey, that's the least of that article's problems).
So yes, the idea is to either give people an incentive to buy the game new or give the company a chance to make some money from people who buy it used, but to call it a $10 charge to transfer ownership is extremely disingenuous, as it's entirely optional.

Modifié par hardvice, 11 février 2010 - 02:28 .

[Gebut]

God forbid Bioware/EA wants to make some profit, cause thats like super bad. They are the devil I tell ya =)

[RetrOldSchool]

As far as I understand and like hardvice said, the $10 is for Shale and Cerberus network. It comes as a free DLC for new buyers while those who buy used games will have to pay for it.



You can view that in 2 ways: Either as a give-back to the fans who buy the game new while people who wait and buy it used don't get that privilege. Or you can view it as a way to punish the buyers who buy the game used.



To me it's clearly no1. It's the same that those who buy the CE version gets extra free DLC. Before the CE buyers would get extra content in form of physical items, so the extra DLC can be viewed as extra bonus. I don't think anyone would view it like they are "punishing" buyer who buy the regular edition.



Thus, buying the game used and having to pay for the extra content that new buyers will get is not some kind of scheme to me.

[MarshmellowDonuts]

Well, I've been sitting on the sidelines being amused by this post. I think the DLC's are value when I think about what else I spend my $ on. Bring your kid or go to StarBucks/Dunkin Donuts and you'll blow through that $ and have nothing to show for it before leaving the parking lot. Or after working a 12-16 hour day it is so nice to pay for a DLC and have some fresh content and enemies to kill and be taken away for a bit. Maybe I'm old, when I think of how much entertainment I get from them compared to what else I have to spend money on, they have extreme entertainment/price ratio.

[Jace Surana]

I, personally, don't see anything wrong with what they charged.



I paid, got the content, and enjoyed the little sidequest immensely. So I got what I paid for, and more. As long as people like the content, it's a good purchase. So what's the problem?

[Eurypterid]

I'm just going to add my two cents here as well as clear up a couple misconceptions.



Firstly, civil to each other. We can disagree without resorting to name calling, sarcasm, and insults. So let's drop the fanbois/troll comments etc.



Now, to clear up the misconceptions:



1) the charge to used game buyers has been pointed out by Hardvice: it's not a charge to anyone that buys a used game. It's a charge to get extra content if you buy the game used. There's a vast difference there from what the article implies.



2)

Spitz6860 wrote...



supply and demand, as long as people keep buying them they'll keep making them until it's not profitable. let's face it, being nice doesn't send food to your mouth, it's a grim world, but that's the way it is. although i have to say the fact we can only load saves with DLC content while connected to internet is pretty distasteful. so after you get a DLC pack you have to log on your EA account in order to load that save file, they are pretty much penalizing people who bought the DLCs

This is completely untrue. For both DA:O and ME2, when you've authenticated your DLC once, you can play off-line (either a new game or loading previous saves) as much as you want. I've tested this. It works. If you're having problems doing this, then you're either not logged into the game with the account you used to activate the DLC or you're having some other issue that needs looking into.



Now for my two cents: the bottom line on DLC is, in fact, if you don't feel it's value for the money then don't buy it. I know people that have issues with the concept and pricing don't like to hear this, but it's the same here as with any other product. If you don't think it's worth the cost, don't buy it. If enough people feel the same way, then the pricing will change or the concept itself will be abandoned. By all means, voice your opinion on it though, as feedback to the company is a valuable tool to determine what direction to go in for the future. Someone mentioned snake oil as an example, which I feel is a great one. Think about it: how's the snake oil market today? Not that good. Why? Because people figured out it wasn't good value for their money and stopped buying it. They chose not to buy, and the market dried up.



Having said that, please let's try to refrain from insinuating that those who feel the DLC is worth buying are somehow intellectually inferior or just fanbois who will blindly throw away their money just because the product has the BioWare logo on it. That's not only insulting, but it does nothing to strengthen your argument.



Is the cost to length ratio much larger for the DLC than for the game itself? You bet. But it would be at 1 dollar, considering the size of DA:O. Value is an individual perception, and comparing the cost of the DLC to the cost of the base game, while tempting to do, is not really a solid platform on which to base the argument of value. One thing that's not being considered is that perhaps the cost of the base game is LOWER than it should be, given the extent of it and the amount of content within. So perhaps the DLC is of a reasonable cost for what it is, while we're being given a great bargain price on the game? Just a thought.



Pirates: the argument that people will turn to piracy because they don't feel the DLC is worth the cost is a non-starter, IMO. I don't even understand the reasoning that people use to justify this. You don't think something is worth the money, so you steal it? Where's the logic there? That just smacks of entitlement. If you want to use the product, then pay for it. If you don't think it's worth the cost, then don't buy - but why would you steal something that's not worth it. The vast majority of people that would do this are likely going to steal it anyway (and probably would steal the base game as well).



Blast. I have to go.



Anyway, once again, be excellent to each other.

[Sylixe]

Stompi wrote...

The DLC idea was born when MMOs became popular. It's a similiar concept, developers are trying to make some extra money, while working on the next game. I don't have a problem with DLC, as long as I can choose what to buy.
DAO really doesn't feel like an unfinished game, I would bet that most games don't even cost half the developing efforts but are sold at the same price.

To a degree it did but it really came to the front when the "Free to Play" models started showing real financial returns.  Now all the MMO's are trying to pile on the micro transactions along with a monthly fee.  It was only natural the stand alone titles that don't have monthly fees would go in a similar direction. 

I personally don't have an issue with this as it's purely YOUR choice now to add more or less to your game.  In a way it's probably the best we could ask for with RPG titles.  That way you don't buy a huge expensive expansion and not get what you wanted.  My fear though in this is that titles will now be released with less content in order to suck more money from the consumer.  DAO has plenty of content for the price you pay.  I am really curious to see what the avergae play time is on the expansion. 

[errant_knight]

People need to start adding to previously existing threads for some of these things. We really don't need individual new threads everytime someone wants to say the game is too hard/easy, DLC is too expensive, or a character/item suxorz. Perhaps these should be merged by the moderators into one thead for each catagory of complaint.

[KentGoldings]

May the $5 is a bit steep. But, money for extra content seems like a fair trade in my book.