212 réponses à ce sujet

[Mass_Casualty]

Thanks, in part, to EAs purchasing of the rights to the ME series, the original RPG heavy interface with an action-based combat system was thrown away.  ME2 plays much more like a straightforward action-shooter with a slight bit of RPG flavoring in the "Squad Powers" screen and somewhat customizable armor.

Dialogue is really the only RPG element that was maintained from the 1st game.  There is basically no exploration, no combat-kill based XP system, and a (comparitively) primitive talent system (called "powers" in ME2).  IMO, if you took the graphics from the 2nd game (and the Shield/Barrier/Armor rock paper scissors system) and ported it into the1st game, you'd have the perfect game.

As it stands, the removal of the awesome talent system from ME1 (that gave a TON of leeway for detailed tailoring of your characters progression) makes the game MUCH LESS replayable.  I completed ME1 nine times... that's NINE TIMES.  I've completed ME2 3 times and probably won't revisit it for at least a year.

Having only 3 "powers" for my squadmates is a huge loss from ME1.  In fact, I returned to play another run through of ME1 after completing the sequel because I missed it so!

Are there any other fans of ME1 that feel the game lost it's RPG mystique that was so easy to love in the first game?

[TheConfidenceMan]

Before the Bioware Defense Force floods the thread with their usual drivel and spam, yes, there are a lot of other fans that are displeased with the direction ME2 has taken.

[EternalWolfe]

TheConfidenceMan wrote...

Before the Bioware Defense Force floods the thread with their usual drivel and spam, yes, there are a lot of other fans that are displeased with the direction ME2 has taken.

And there are a lot of them who enjoyed the game.  And then there's even people like me who liked both games enough to admit they both have their flaws and neither as perfect.

Edit: As for the OP:

Exploration: running around a dead planet with horrible terrain isn't what I'd call 'exploration'.  Everything but minerals were already marked on the map anyways, and there wasn't anything left to find.  I would enjoy more open and explorable spaces in ME2, providing it doesn't lose uniqueness and become a chore that ME1 did.  I'm waiting to see what missions appear with the Hammerhead DLC.

XP for killing: Not every RPG has kill for xp system.  Some only give you xp at the end of a session.  I prefer the former, but the latter doesnt'  make a difference to me
Talent System: Hmm, i won't argue this one.  You could max out about the same in both games, but you can only effect powers(and only X number of points at a time) in ME2.  I liked having choices between boosting my powers or instead increasing my shields through electronics.  ME3 should have more skills, espically for teammates, IMO.  They cut off a little too much here.

Modifié par EternalWolfe, 11 février 2010 - 02:04 .

[AlbertoAquilani]

If you look up, there's a whole thread dedicated to what fans want in ME 3. Try using your eyes once in a while.

http://social.biowar...03/index/887957

Modifié par AlbertoAquilani, 11 février 2010 - 01:59 .

[birdland 1115]

I like the changes as a whole but I would still like to see more customization. I still contend that ME3 should meet somewhere between ME1 and ME2. More customization and choices for leveling up that ME2 but more focused game play and streamlined inventory than ME.

[Tikkidew]

I agree and disagree with you Mass_Casualty. I'm a huge fan of both games. In one sense I do miss all the RPG elements, but then again I love the streamlined and fast paced tempo of the new game. They cut a lot of the fat from ME1 .. maybe too much.



If there were no Dragon Age and all of it's wonderful community made mods to get my RPG fix, I would be all over this topic with ferocity. Since both games came out at pretty much the same time I can't be mad at Bioware for doing what they did with ME2.



P.S. I'm pretty sure EA has nothing to do with designing Bioware games.

[banshee768]

Funny. I just returned to ME1 to get a female soldier for ME2 and I hate it. I've completed the first 2 main missions and can't bring myself to continue. Unfortunately that means I won't be able to play ME2 either, because the default decisions suck. Lose-lose situation.

[BLY78NOR]

yay another one of these thread, you're so original and special



I love RPGs to i love getting stuck on a pebble in the road and having to grind for 47 hours to up my jump peeble skill enough to get past it, that's smart gaming and not lame in any way

.

I hope they spend the next 2-3 years making ME2 less intuitive. I also hope they add lighsabers, elves, a dungeon master to make sure you do the proper amount of grind before it lets you go back to playing the game and they replace combat with random turn based dice rolls.

[Sidac]

EternalWolfe wrote...

 they both have their flaws and neither as perfect.

yup.

and to the OP...you realize that EA owned Bioware BEFORE ME1 right?

Modifié par Sidac, 11 février 2010 - 02:20 .

[Paperghost]

they removed:



* overly large hubworlds stuffed with fetchquests and endless slogging from point A to B

* tons of dead space

* frankly terrible "exploration" / mako missions

* mako padding inserted into the main plot levels

* one of the worst inventory systems I've ever seen

* the pointlessness of an inventory system where everyone just uses spectre weapons and one type of armour

* a bunch of other minor issues that dragged the original title down somewhat.



what's left in ME2 is pretty much ME1 but without many of the screwups listed above. ME2 is what ME1 should have been, without all the mostly redundant rpg trappings that should never have found their way into the mix. Honestly, I think some people would be happier if bioware just released KOTOR every two years. Just draw the number 3 onto the front of your ME1 box, because the things you want are never coming back - thank goodness.

[jeffindenver]

banshee768 wrote...

Funny. I just returned to ME1 to get a female soldier for ME2 and I hate it. I've completed the first 2 main missions and can't bring myself to continue. Unfortunately that means I won't be able to play ME2 either, because the default decisions suck. Lose-lose situation.

I had the same problem until I grabbed the saved game editor from www.masseffectsaves.com
You can choose all of your ME 1 decisions not to mention add a playthrough's worth of minerals to avoid the tedium of scanning.

[BLY78NOR]

Sidac wrote...

EternalWolfe wrote...

 they both have their flaws and neither as perfect.

yup.

and to the OP...you realize that EA owned Bioware BEFORE ME1 right?

ME1 was published by Michrosoft on the 360 then EA aquired Bioware and published the PC version 6 months later

[FlintlockJazz]

TheConfidenceMan wrote...

Before the Bioware Defense Force floods the thread with their usual drivel and spam, yes, there are a lot of other fans that are displeased with the direction ME2 has taken.

So if we disagree that ME2 is any less of an RPG than ME1 and that in actual fact we consider ME2 a better RPG we are automatically labelled fanboys?  Opinion noted.

End of line.

Modifié par FlintlockJazz, 11 février 2010 - 04:16 .

[obie191970]

BLY78NOR wrote...

Sidac wrote...

EternalWolfe wrote...

 they both have their flaws and neither as perfect.

yup.

and to the OP...you realize that EA owned Bioware BEFORE ME1 right?

ME1 was published by Michrosoft on the 360 then EA aquired Bioware and published the PC version 6 months later

Either way, EA has no Design Direction over Bioware.  They certainly influence DLC matters, but thinking they dictate any of the design is ignorant and naive.

I just went back and did a 20 hour speed run through ME1 to import a new character and still loved playing it - Even getting 14 Frictionleess Materials each level I cleared:P.  Anyway, as others have said - Both games have their flaws, yet I love them both.  They tried correcting all the issues with ME1 and created a whole new list in the process.  Hopefully ME3 will incorporate the great aspects of both games.

[Matshelge]

Mass_Casualty wrote...

Thanks, in part, to EAs purchasing of the rights to the ME series, ....

I gave up around here.

Do you work at EA? Have you seen any internal notices going around BioWare from EA telling them how they should make games? Do you know how internal studios work at EA? I'd like to know, as I think BioWare has been allowed to make the games they want without EA bothering them.

Infact, the whole idea that EA has some sort of insider developer that they ship around studios to "fix" games so they match up to the "EA profile" (whatever that is), is so absurd, when you think about how much freedom is given to each company when it comes to the marketing. Clearly there is no overreaching hand here.

[Grand_Commander13]

Yeah, seriously: if you think Mass Effect was ever a strong RPG then I just can't help you. Incredibly weak character customization (it didn't help that even the classES played largely similarly), terrible inventory customization (they had the SPACE to give us customization but gave us same-old-upgrade items), almost no consequences for any of the choices we were asked to make (not in ME1, and not in ME2 either as it turned out), and no meaningful side quests at all.

[obie191970]

Crawling_Chaos wrote...

You imbeciles are looking back with some THICK rose tints there.

ME1 had GARBAGE RPG elements. In case you don't remember, when that game came out the true-RPG lovers pointed out how it's just a watered down shooter bogged with sub-par convoluted RPG mechanics. With ME2, they aren't pretending to be something they're not. It's an more pure ARPG, with the nasty pseudo-RPG fat cut away.

Now people are talking about returning to that garbage? Don't make me vomit.

This shouldn't surprise you - It happens with every series.  People have very short memories.  Morrowind people complained about walking everywhere, Oblivion people complained about fast travel.  With CoD4, all people ****ed about was lack of host migration, now with MW2 people only **** about host migration.

[Darkmoone1]

All ME2 did was lose all the unnecesary weight ME1 had.

[YakoHako]

I was going to be a jackass and say "THERE SHOULD BE NO COMBAT IN MASS EFFECT 3" but then I thought about it and also saw the word "exploration" on there somewhere and thought that would be cool as hell if it was more like Star Trek with lots of exploring and diplomacy instead of killing everything

[TheConfidenceMan]

What it lost was all the depth Mass Effect had. It lost the sense of progression, it lost the sense of specialization, lost the sense of exploration. They may not have been implemented well enough in the first game, but they were there at least and now they're not. Simple as that.

[newcomplex]

Honestly, their are so many things Bioware could improve on, adding a roman numeral behind the 15 weapons you get is not one of them.

[wrdnshprd]

FlintlockJazz wrote...

TheConfidenceMan wrote...

Before the Bioware Defense Force floods the thread with their usual drivel and spam, yes, there are a lot of other fans that are displeased with the direction ME2 has taken.

So if we disagree that ME2 is any less of an RPG than ME1 and that in actual fact we consider ME2 a better RPG we are automatically labelled fanboys?  Opinion noted.

End of line.

this thread excluded, there are a lot of other threads out there that expressed similar viewpoints and those OPs got hammered left and right with insults and 'GTFO' remarks.  at least here, it seems people are willing to discuss their views without doing that.