53 réponses à ce sujet

[swk3000]

Whoever came up with the Paragon system for this game needs to be shot. It's basically impossible to get more than a single bar of Paragon without transferring a save from ME1. I just finished Horizon, and it's looking like I'm going to have to restart the entire game because I can't do jack **** for Paragon. I can't get Zaeed's Loyalty, I can't convince anyone to buy up the Quarian Slave on Illium, etc. etc. etc. Without the massive bonus from my ME1 Paragon, I'm basically fscked out of any decent resolution to anything. At this rate, I'm going to hit end-game, and Jack/Miranda and Tali/Legion are going to die because I have no way to settle things peacefully. And since I can't change the gender or name of my imported Shepard, I can't romance Tali, who is the only person I'm even remotely interested in romancing.

I'm a completionist. I want to do all the quests as soon as they become available. But at the rate I'm going, I'd have to wait until I've completed the game before I can even consider entertaining the thought of maybe being able to do all of the Paragon options I want. For me, that's not worth it.

Way to completely ruin the experience, Bioware.

[SelphieSK]

Uuh... There's a passive skill that gives you +100% Paragon/Renegade points.
And I maxed Renegade points while having an initial Paragon bonus, so... You must be doing something wrong here.

Modifié par SelphieSK, 12 février 2010 - 08:31 .

[SmilingMirror]

SelphieSK wrote...

Uuh... There's a passive skill that gives you +100% Paragon/Renegade points.
And I maxed Renegade points while having an initial Paragon bonus, so... You must be doing something wrong here.

This


my bonuses from the last game seemed really insignificant when i imported. I almost wish I had a larger bonus.

Maybe NG+ will make it easier on you.

Modifié par SmilingMirror, 12 février 2010 - 08:35 .

[lockerlocke]

If you're a completionist, you'd have no problem playing the game twice. It's built that way, one for Renegade and one for Paragon.

[swk3000]

Maybe I should mention that I'm doing an Insanity run as a Soldier, so I have to focus on Adrenaline Rush first? And that I'm trying to get as much damage as I can, so I max out Warp Ammo second?



What it's coming out to is that I either focus on Combat and end up not having the points I need to take the Paragon options, so I get fscked out of the options I want that way, or I focus on the Paragon points, but have no way to actually survive long enough to make any use of them. That's beyond stupid.

[swk3000]

SelphieSK wrote...

Uuh... There's a passive skill that gives you +100% Paragon/Renegade points.
And I maxed Renegade points while having an initial Paragon bonus, so... You must be doing something wrong here.

Fine. I'll bite. What am I doing wrong? How can I survive in combat and still have the Paragon points I need to have the Paragon option available at all times? Because I'm obviously too stupid to see it.

[SelphieSK]

swk3000 wrote...

SelphieSK wrote...

Uuh... There's a passive skill that gives you +100% Paragon/Renegade points.
And I maxed Renegade points while having an initial Paragon bonus, so... You must be doing something wrong here.

Fine. I'll bite. What am I doing wrong? How can I survive in combat and still have the Paragon points I need to have the Paragon option available at all times? Because I'm obviously too stupid to see it.

I never said that
So you basically haven't got any points in the passive skill tree?

[GamerttBone]

I did not have a import on my first run. Did not try to answer anything other then with what I felt was right. Had about 75%ish Paragon and 30%ish Renegade.



Was able to get both Tali and Legion loyal but Jack was always a bish to me. Did not even realize it was possible until I cam to the forums (stayed away on purpose until end of my first run).



Have not finished my fulll para or full rene runs yet. Maxed out to Shock Trooper 1st for 100% bonus.



I may be missing some bonuses (like someone mentioned you have to pick the top "paragon" option for the looters before you get the better renegade option)...whatever I have better things to do then try and spend hours playing scenes over and over. It the devs want to make it tricky they are just going to turn off the casual players. DId not play ME1 and not sure if I will get ME3 or Dragon Age yet.



Other people say they have maxed out both but not sure what starting bonuses they had or if they had any at all.

[swk3000]

As I said: I'm doing an Insanity run. I'm rather more interested in staying alive, but I'm royally pissed (as you can probably tell) that staying alive is costing me the conversation options I would like to take. I hate having to choose one or the other. I should be able to do both.

[flem1]

Waah! A RPG makes me choose between character builds!

[SmilingMirror]

swk3000 wrote...

SelphieSK wrote...

Uuh... There's a passive skill that gives you +100% Paragon/Renegade points.
And I maxed Renegade points while having an initial Paragon bonus, so... You must be doing something wrong here.

Fine. I'll bite. What am I doing wrong? How can I survive in combat and still have the Paragon points I need to have the Paragon option available at all times? Because I'm obviously too stupid to see it.

lmao, both are about equally fine in combat, its just that the "aggressive" mindset of a raider or commando doesn't leave room for as much negotiation.

Why are you playing your first game on insanity anyways?

I think the real reason your complaining is you thought the game was an easy way to gain achievements or something like ME1. Guess what? things improve and this is NOT ME1.

Modifié par SmilingMirror, 12 février 2010 - 08:54 .

[Divine Flame]

How bout. Since you know at what points the arguments will occur you go and respec prior to doing the 2nd one and max out your passive skill. As an example: Complete Miranda's loyalty quest. Respec to max your passive skill and go do Jack's loyalty. You then get the fight cutscene and you'll have the most paragon/renegade you can get at that point. See what happens. That's what i plan to do for mine. Jack's loyalty mission is cake anyways in terms of amounts of ppl you fight.

[swk3000]

SmilingMirror wrote...

swk3000 wrote...

SelphieSK wrote...

Uuh... There's a passive skill that gives you +100% Paragon/Renegade points.
And I maxed Renegade points while having an initial Paragon bonus, so... You must be doing something wrong here.

Fine. I'll bite. What am I doing wrong? How can I survive in combat and still have the Paragon points I need to have the Paragon option available at all times? Because I'm obviously too stupid to see it.

lmao, both are about equally fine in combat, its just that the "aggressive" mindset of a raider or commando doesn't leave room for as much negotiation.

Why are you playing your first game on insanity anyways?

I think the real reason your complaining is you thought the game was an easy way to gain achievements or something like ME1. Guess what? things improve and this is NOT ME1.

I'm not. This is my second run. However, as I said before: I'm a completionist. The fact that I've already done it on my first run through doesn't change my desire to do it all. In fact, it's a matter of pride: I want to complete not just the story on Insanity, but the entire game, including all of the side-missions.

[SelphieSK]

swk3000 wrote...

As I said: I'm doing an Insanity run. I'm rather more interested in staying alive, but I'm royally pissed (as you can probably tell) that staying alive is costing me the conversation options I would like to take. I hate having to choose one or the other. I should be able to do both.

Well I suppose the only solution is to research Retrain Powers and put a few points in the passive skill tree... That's the only way to boost your points. You'll have to neglect another skill for a few levels though...

[SmilingMirror]

You could try wearing the Death Mask or starting a new game +

that way you'll have that 70% straight from the start.

you could also try what SelphieSK suggested, retrain your powers.


also, try to be either as paragon or renegade as you can, don't go inbetween if you want to have a complete master playthrough.

Modifié par SmilingMirror, 12 février 2010 - 09:02 .

[brgillespie]

How about playing through on Normal and saving the Insanity run for after you cruise through the story?

[swk3000]

I don't like the Death Mask. Not to mention I don't actually have access to the thing yet.



I don't like the idea of a New Game+ for an Insanity run. Things are already hard enough without making my enemies massively powerful on top of it.



I'll probably end up doing what Selphie suggested, but I'm still going to have to redo the end of the Horizon mission. That's going to be a **** and a half.



Anyway, I apologize for all the anger. Horizon was a ****, and then I got hit with this, so I'm not exactly in a patient mood at the moment. Thanks for the help.

[swk3000]

brgillespie wrote...

How about playing through on Normal and saving the Insanity run for after you cruise through the story?

The Insanity run requires me to start the game on Insane difficulty, then keep it there for the entirety of the game. Otherwise, it's not an Insanity run.

[We Tigers]

I'm pretty sure I had two paragon bars and almost one renegade bar by Horizon.  You get paragon/renegade points for almost every bit of dialogue.  I finished the game with full paragon and a little under half renegade.

[swk3000]

Any idea how you managed that?

[coinop25]

swk3000 wrote...

brgillespie wrote...

How about playing through on Normal and saving the Insanity run for after you cruise through the story?

The Insanity run requires me to start the game on Insane difficulty, then keep it there for the entirety of the game. Otherwise, it's not an Insanity run.

Right ... the suggestion was that not do an insanity run yet. Focus on dialog playing Normal, Veteran, or Hardcore, and do Insanity run later once you have a leveled character ready to import for New Game +.

I don't see how this is any different from Mass Effect 1, by the way. Same deal, you either put puts into Charm/Intimidate, or you put points into combat skills. I always opt for points toward dialog on my first playthrough, and then play higher difficulty on another character later. Also, by the time I've beaten it once or twice, I am good enough that I can still survive the hardest difficulty levels even though I wait to put points into combat skills...

Another possibility you may want to consider: Go do as many light- or non-combat missions as possible early in the game, like the N7 missions (when you hear "Anomaly Detected" while exploring planets) and the Normandy Crash Site DLC so you level up quickly outside of combat. That way you can put some points into passive skills before you do the "real" stuff.

[gr00grams]

If you want to max Paragon/Renegade, without any fancy tricks, two simple things;



1. Do everything. By that, I mean all available side stuff before major plot stuff.

2. Always, regardless of what you want to say, choose the high left option if present, if not, choose the high right.



For renegade, choose the low left options, if none present, choose low right.



This will ensure you have enough points for every conversation option. It's quite simple to do without starting with any import.

[Peer of the Empire]

To get Zaeed's Paragon loyalty you have to be Paragon all the way through the mission.  Or at least for 1 of the 2 early prompts you get with the word "mission" in them while he's busy blowing up the base.   Shep talking about sticking to the mission and stuff like that.  Maybe both; I've selected them as a pair when I have.  Then, later you get the option to lecture him into loyalty.

I was a Renegade and I accomplished this 1st time.  Hardy-har.  Course, on replays I tended to choose different responses which is how I discovered this in the first place.

Modifié par Peer of the Empire, 12 février 2010 - 10:43 .

[mayatola]

I played a soldier on insanity which happened to be my first character playing insanity on ME2, and just my second time ever playing the game.  I had no trouble maxing Combat Mastery first with just level 1 Adrenaline Rush.  I don't see what the big deal is.

gr00grams wrote...
For renegade, choose the low left options, if none present, choose low right.

Oh, and I would advise against this.  As a renegade, you have to be a little more mindful than that.  For instance, when you get to the looters during Mordin's recruitment on Omega, you have to pick the up-left options of "I don't like looters." and the next up-left option before you are given the chance to intimidate and earn renegade points.  Also, if you do stuff like blow off Conrad instead of helping him, you may gain a few renegade points, but not as much as if you accepted the quest and intimidated the merchant.

Being a renegade doesn't mean just blowing off everyone when you get the chance (such as choosing down-right options whenever you are presented with them, because many of them involve flat out declining a quest).  It means getting the job done your own way, whatever the cost, through intimidation or whatever.

[FredegarKadere]

I found Paragon to be extremely easy to achieve. Renegade has been a pain for me. As Mayatola mentions, the bottom right isn't always the answer to get high renegade while paragon is always the top right.

The assignments/missions are also built up so that you can rarely successfully talk/intimidate your way out of every conversation with blue or red. My guess is that they do this to encourage replay by making secondary runs unique by having the player switch up the order they do the missions. Example) You have three recruitment quests that you can do, all three involve a blue/red test at some point. The first quest you try won't have blue/red unlocked, but if you played smart the second and third quest will have either blue/red unlocked. So next time you play through the game you do the 'first' quest last to see what you missed out on with the blue/red check.