Posting on a forum is a type of communication. Sprawling, badly formatted, illogical posts that veer away from your point into personal antidotes (I’m sorry you started taking medication after your friend died in Kosovo, but I don’t think it has anything to do with the game) don’t help your case at all.
You’d be better to sit down. Write out what you want, a few reasons as to why this is a good thing, and then engage in dialogue when people come to question/support/criticize your idea.
Roleplayers unite! Or: Why cater to the power-metagamers?
Débuté par
Maria Caliban
, févr. 13 2010 12:13
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#2
Posté 13 février 2010 - 12:17
Loc'n'lol
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Maria Caliban wrote...
Sprawling, badly formatted, illogical posts that veer away from your point into personal antidotes (I’m sorry you started taking medication after your friend died in Kosovo, but I don’t think it has anything to do with the game) don’t help your case at all.
Maria Caliban wrote...
personal antidotes
Maria Caliban wrote...
antidotes
#4
Posté 13 février 2010 - 12:30
soteria
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Maria. The post was really hard to read. But I noticed the "antidotes" too 
I'll just say that even on Nightmare, I did pretty well using a warrior archer built with strength and dexterity, with no mages. You definitely don't have to use stealth or backstab to play a rogue successfully (although why you would want to play a rogue that doesn't stealth, backstab, use poisons, or traps is beyond me). Wouldn't the warrior class fit your character better? They can be archers, too.
I'd suggest that people who have a hard time are struggling not because of their talent choices, but because of their attribute selection and tactics.
#6
Posté 13 février 2010 - 12:38
Maria Caliban
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_Loc_N_lol_ wrote...
Maria Caliban wrote...
Sprawling, badly formatted, illogical posts that veer away from your point into personal antidotes (I’m sorry you started taking medication after your friend died in Kosovo, but I don’t think it has anything to do with the game) don’t help your case at all.Maria Caliban wrote...
personal antidotesMaria Caliban wrote...
antidotes
Naturally, I was informing him that instead of using personal antidotes, he should go to a doctor and get some antibiotics.
Modifié par Maria Caliban, 13 février 2010 - 12:38 .
#7
Guest_distinguetraces_*
Posté 13 février 2010 - 12:43
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That is a really long post.
#8
Posté 13 février 2010 - 12:45
Herr Uhl
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Maria Caliban wrote...
_Loc_N_lol_ wrote...
Maria Caliban wrote...
antidotes
Naturally, I was informing him that instead of using personal antidotes, he should go to a doctor and get some antibiotics.
You can cure poison with antibiotics? Neat!
#9
Posté 13 février 2010 - 12:59
knittzu
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By the time we reached the bottom lines, our hair had gone grey and our eyesight failed. Seriously... edit.
#10
Posté 13 février 2010 - 01:01
Herr Uhl
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If I take a mage that only uses swords (no AW), I would have a hard time too. It's a mage that dislikes using magic and thus a role.
Just because it doesn't fit the system as well as in D&D, it requires metagaming?
Just because it doesn't fit the system as well as in D&D, it requires metagaming?
#11
Posté 13 février 2010 - 01:08
soteria
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I'm a US Marine, who focus on bringing terror to the enemy with extreme aggression balanced with tough training and solid discipline/teamwork. When I play, though... it's a game. I'm not trying to apply my profession to what class I choose. Plus, even if I were, wouldn't a mage be more appropriate? Glyphs = traps, ranged damage is a mage, all the way.
Absolutely, play a rogue for role-playing reasons. Based on your post, though, you're not role-playing a rogue, you're role-playing a warrior. You refuse to use traps and poisons, two of the classic rogue tools. You're not backstabbing or stealthing because you see it as unethical, which are two more classic rogue tools. I'm just guessing you're not doing any stealing either, with little to no cunning and the ethical problem with backstabbing.
So, you're not using the stealing, poisons, or traps skills. That leaves survival, persuasion, combat training, and herbalism--you can max three. You really don't need to max persuasion with a high strength or cunning score. Nothing you have said indicates you need any more skills than persuasion, herbalism, and maybe combat training for RP.
My point is you're choosing a rogue for artificial reasons that have nothing to do with how you're trying to play your character. You're not RPing; you're artificially hampering yourself by clinging to pre-conceived notions about what each class should be. I blame D&D.
I also strongly suspect you're just a troll, but since I'm bored, I really don't care.
Absolutely, play a rogue for role-playing reasons. Based on your post, though, you're not role-playing a rogue, you're role-playing a warrior. You refuse to use traps and poisons, two of the classic rogue tools. You're not backstabbing or stealthing because you see it as unethical, which are two more classic rogue tools. I'm just guessing you're not doing any stealing either, with little to no cunning and the ethical problem with backstabbing.
So, you're not using the stealing, poisons, or traps skills. That leaves survival, persuasion, combat training, and herbalism--you can max three. You really don't need to max persuasion with a high strength or cunning score. Nothing you have said indicates you need any more skills than persuasion, herbalism, and maybe combat training for RP.
My point is you're choosing a rogue for artificial reasons that have nothing to do with how you're trying to play your character. You're not RPing; you're artificially hampering yourself by clinging to pre-conceived notions about what each class should be. I blame D&D.
I also strongly suspect you're just a troll, but since I'm bored, I really don't care.
Modifié par soteria, 13 février 2010 - 01:09 .
#12
Posté 13 février 2010 - 01:10
Sloth Of Doom
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So, what you wanted to say was "Roleplaying is fun, and people who want t roleplay shouldn't be penalized because they don't play the most powerful builds"
Instead, you made a terribly formatted 2422 word meandering post about beheadings, drugs, landmines and Baldur's Gate.
Instead, you made a terribly formatted 2422 word meandering post about beheadings, drugs, landmines and Baldur's Gate.
#13
Posté 13 février 2010 - 01:13
DomiiMai
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To be honest.. I didn't even read 1/4 of it. Lost interest rather quickly.
#14
Posté 13 février 2010 - 01:14
Sarielle
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I don't necessarily see why needing the game to list your character as "rogue" is necessary to RP a rogue. If you want the lockpicking and such then, of course that makes sense, but otherwise, rogue is a lifestyle, imo, and you get access to the exact same DW talents (which do have some CC in there), taunt/disengage to "control the battlefield", and the exact same archery talents. I'm also not sure why you're having problems if you're stacking strength then dex then con, as that's a great way to build an offensive melee character.
My offer to help you set up your tactics to make it easier to use a less-than-balanced group still stands. And of course, there's always changing difficulty to easy. You can do this in the middle of the game. If you're feeling it's "necessary" to bring a mage on normal, then lower the slider. Nothing wrong with that.
I do feel like you're taking this whole thing far, far too much to heart. If you tell us more what you're trying to do, with fewer emotional anecdotal interjections as Maria said -- IE, I'm playing a DW rogue with archery, no traps/poisons (which is what I got out of that overall) -- then perhaps we can help you more with how you approach a battle to make it more effective, sans mage.
At some point I started feeling like you were more using the stage to give us your life story than actually ask for any sort of constructive help playing your RP character effectively.
EDIT: Ugh. I think Soteria largely beat me to the punch while I answered the phone.
Uh, except I'm a lowly journalist, rather than a Marine. My character fights the darkspawn by exposing how they're misusing their funds.
...kidding, kidding.
My offer to help you set up your tactics to make it easier to use a less-than-balanced group still stands. And of course, there's always changing difficulty to easy. You can do this in the middle of the game. If you're feeling it's "necessary" to bring a mage on normal, then lower the slider. Nothing wrong with that.
I do feel like you're taking this whole thing far, far too much to heart. If you tell us more what you're trying to do, with fewer emotional anecdotal interjections as Maria said -- IE, I'm playing a DW rogue with archery, no traps/poisons (which is what I got out of that overall) -- then perhaps we can help you more with how you approach a battle to make it more effective, sans mage.
At some point I started feeling like you were more using the stage to give us your life story than actually ask for any sort of constructive help playing your RP character effectively.
EDIT: Ugh. I think Soteria largely beat me to the punch while I answered the phone.
Uh, except I'm a lowly journalist, rather than a Marine. My character fights the darkspawn by exposing how they're misusing their funds....kidding, kidding.
Modifié par Sarielle, 13 février 2010 - 01:17 .
#15
Posté 13 février 2010 - 01:18
sami jo
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Edit: Typed too slowly.
I read your post in the other thread, and much as in this one, people were reacting more to your tone than to your problem.
To be clear, I played through with a dual wielding rogue my first playthrough without using traps, stealth or poison. I died a few times. Some battles were difficult, but none took close to an hour. I don't know what difficulty level you have the game set to, but the opponents scale with your character's level, not by area or quest, in specific ways based on the difficulty you select. You CAN talk your way out, by intimidation or persuasion, of many confrontations. Dark spawn don't generally respond to such things, so I can't fathom using it there; but it is entirely possible to play through using multiple different builds. The easiest is certainly a heavy damage/AOE mage, but I have played through large chunks of the game with a flock of other builds successfully. Some builds simply will not work well. If you don't wish to travel with a healer, you need to bump the constitution of your party early and invest in potions. That would be where a character with high skill in potions would come in handy. Tactics do matter and that includes building your characters and NPC's in ways that will work well together. This is complementary to the role playing element. These characters are essentially in a combat company. When they learn new skills (level up) that would compliment their companions. In a war, sometimes one must work with less savory individuals (clearly your view of Morrigan). It isn't even possible to play with a party of four mages, there are only two mage NPCs so if your PC is a mage that would make three. I have never played with more than two, and I only did two in the Circle quest when my mage PC had to take Wynne. If you favor builds that are less effective in combat, you will need to be more careful about your party composition, make very careful use of tactics, and plan on having to replay some battles repeatedly. If your archer had skill points in the archery skills, several of those abilities should have been able to be activated to do away with the drake much faster. Save frequently in multiple slots. You cannot reasonably expect that a character could win a war, for that is what this is, with no combat skills whatsoever. One cannot reason with the archdemon and ask her nicely to stop eating people.
To be having as much difficulty as you seem to be, there likely is a problem with your character builds (skills that don't work well together, heavy armor on the weakest character drawing all the baddies, etc), a problem with your party composition (characters with skill sets that do not complement, not pausing to manage frequently enough), a problem with your tactics set up or a combination of those things. I say this not to be insulting but because I have successfully played through with the types of builds you claim to favor without the sorts of problems you are having. I, and others here, are happy to offer suggestions as to how to fix those problems. If you don't want suggestions, then just say that you are venting and stop screaching at people for genuinely trying to help you resolve your problem. We all got that you are frustrated.
I read your post in the other thread, and much as in this one, people were reacting more to your tone than to your problem.
To be clear, I played through with a dual wielding rogue my first playthrough without using traps, stealth or poison. I died a few times. Some battles were difficult, but none took close to an hour. I don't know what difficulty level you have the game set to, but the opponents scale with your character's level, not by area or quest, in specific ways based on the difficulty you select. You CAN talk your way out, by intimidation or persuasion, of many confrontations. Dark spawn don't generally respond to such things, so I can't fathom using it there; but it is entirely possible to play through using multiple different builds. The easiest is certainly a heavy damage/AOE mage, but I have played through large chunks of the game with a flock of other builds successfully. Some builds simply will not work well. If you don't wish to travel with a healer, you need to bump the constitution of your party early and invest in potions. That would be where a character with high skill in potions would come in handy. Tactics do matter and that includes building your characters and NPC's in ways that will work well together. This is complementary to the role playing element. These characters are essentially in a combat company. When they learn new skills (level up) that would compliment their companions. In a war, sometimes one must work with less savory individuals (clearly your view of Morrigan). It isn't even possible to play with a party of four mages, there are only two mage NPCs so if your PC is a mage that would make three. I have never played with more than two, and I only did two in the Circle quest when my mage PC had to take Wynne. If you favor builds that are less effective in combat, you will need to be more careful about your party composition, make very careful use of tactics, and plan on having to replay some battles repeatedly. If your archer had skill points in the archery skills, several of those abilities should have been able to be activated to do away with the drake much faster. Save frequently in multiple slots. You cannot reasonably expect that a character could win a war, for that is what this is, with no combat skills whatsoever. One cannot reason with the archdemon and ask her nicely to stop eating people.
To be having as much difficulty as you seem to be, there likely is a problem with your character builds (skills that don't work well together, heavy armor on the weakest character drawing all the baddies, etc), a problem with your party composition (characters with skill sets that do not complement, not pausing to manage frequently enough), a problem with your tactics set up or a combination of those things. I say this not to be insulting but because I have successfully played through with the types of builds you claim to favor without the sorts of problems you are having. I, and others here, are happy to offer suggestions as to how to fix those problems. If you don't want suggestions, then just say that you are venting and stop screaching at people for genuinely trying to help you resolve your problem. We all got that you are frustrated.
Modifié par sami jo, 13 février 2010 - 01:24 .
#16
Posté 13 février 2010 - 01:20
Sloth Of Doom
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Sarielle wrote...
EDIT: Ugh. I think Soteria largely beat me to the punch while I answered the phone.
...kidding, kidding.
Hrm, was that your article about how almost 40% of darkspawn funding is going directly to corpse arrangement and heads on sticks instead of useful things such as better weapons?
#17
Posté 13 février 2010 - 01:23
MishenNikara
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If you want crazy, non ideal customization, and super depth, and this doesn't cut it for you, then make some friends and break out the pen and paper and d&d handbooks.
If you want to be able to get through the game without blowing a ton of poultices and ideal set ups then get good. Stop whining that you don't have the skill required and then blame Bioware for your lack of ability.
If you want to be able to get through the game without blowing a ton of poultices and ideal set ups then get good. Stop whining that you don't have the skill required and then blame Bioware for your lack of ability.
#18
Posté 13 février 2010 - 01:27
Sarielle
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Sloth Of Doom wrote...
Sarielle wrote...
EDIT: Ugh. I think Soteria largely beat me to the punch while I answered the phone.
...kidding, kidding.
Hrm, was that your article about how almost 40% of darkspawn funding is going directly to corpse arrangement and heads on sticks instead of useful things such as better weapons?
Yes. There was also significant overspending on materials used to deface statues.
#19
Posté 13 février 2010 - 01:29
MishenNikara
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Sarielle wrote...
Sloth Of Doom wrote...
Sarielle wrote...
EDIT: Ugh. I think Soteria largely beat me to the punch while I answered the phone.
...kidding, kidding.
Hrm, was that your article about how almost 40% of darkspawn funding is going directly to corpse arrangement and heads on sticks instead of useful things such as better weapons?
Yes. There was also significant overspending on materials used to deface statues.
Hey they voted for Random Darkspawn 238957907290865, its the voters fault that this has occured!
#20
Posté 13 février 2010 - 01:37
soteria
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EDIT: Ugh. I think Soteria largely beat me to the punch while I answered the phone. Uh, except I'm a lowly journalist, rather than a Marine. My character fights the darkspawn by exposing how they're misusing their funds.
...kidding, kidding.
Well, the pen/keyboard IS mightier than the sword/rifle...
#21
Posté 13 février 2010 - 01:41
Darkemorrow
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What difficulty are you playing on? You shouldn't have to min/max an optimal build to play on Easy. That's why they have Easy mode. You can choose whatever skills, attributes, and talents you want for role-playing purposes and still do just fine. Hell, the game practically plays itself on Easy.
If you are trying to play on Hard or Nightmare and are complaining that your build doesn't cut it then you need to change your difficulty level. If role-playing and story are all that you care about then it shouldn't matter.
If you are already playing on Easy and are having this much trouble... well then I simply don't know what to tell you other than that you need a bit more practice, or that you need to try harder (read: try AT ALL. Seriously, its EASY MODE). You definitely do not need to be a "power-gamer" to play this game, but you do need half a brain.
If you are trying to play on Hard or Nightmare and are complaining that your build doesn't cut it then you need to change your difficulty level. If role-playing and story are all that you care about then it shouldn't matter.
If you are already playing on Easy and are having this much trouble... well then I simply don't know what to tell you other than that you need a bit more practice, or that you need to try harder (read: try AT ALL. Seriously, its EASY MODE). You definitely do not need to be a "power-gamer" to play this game, but you do need half a brain.
#22
Posté 13 février 2010 - 01:41
MishenNikara
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soteria wrote...
EDIT: Ugh. I think Soteria largely beat me to the punch while I answered the phone. Uh, except I'm a lowly journalist, rather than a Marine. My character fights the darkspawn by exposing how they're misusing their funds.
...kidding, kidding.
Well, the pen/keyboard IS mightier than the sword/rifle...
The guy who came up with that apparently hasn't been stabbed/shot.
#23
Posté 13 février 2010 - 01:43
Herr Uhl
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MishenNikara wrote...
soteria wrote...
Well, the pen/keyboard IS mightier than the sword/rifle...
The guy who came up with that apparently hasn't been stabbed/shot.
You ever been stabbed by a pen? It hurts.
#24
Posté 13 février 2010 - 01:45
Sarielle
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Herr Uhl wrote...
MishenNikara wrote...
soteria wrote...
Well, the pen/keyboard IS mightier than the sword/rifle...
The guy who came up with that apparently hasn't been stabbed/shot.
You ever been stabbed by a pen? It hurts.
No, but it looked really effing brutal in the Bourne....uh, one of those movies.
#25
Posté 13 février 2010 - 01:49
soteria
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Sarielle wrote...
Herr Uhl wrote...
MishenNikara wrote...
soteria wrote...
Well, the pen/keyboard IS mightier than the sword/rifle...
The guy who came up with that apparently hasn't been stabbed/shot.
You ever been stabbed by a pen? It hurts.
No, but it looked really effing brutal in the Bourne....uh, one of those movies.
This one time, I stabbed myself with a pencil on accident, and it got infected. My hand got all swollen and there was a red line travelling up my arm and everything. Watch out for the writing utensils... they'll get ya. They'll get ya.
