467 réponses à ce sujet

[armass]

I can think of a one plothole at least. How did Shepard get that reaper data at the end?

And I think the council or whoever examined/recovered Sovereign is really stupid. The very age of Sovereign would point out geth coudn't have constructed it, it is way older than 300 years. And this can be determined by simple tests.

Modifié par armass, 13 février 2010 - 11:45 .

[kaotician]

Cerbx104 wrote...

ashley williams came out of nowhere on horizon just fine and spoke about shepard highly..  i thought she was in stasis..

Yeah, I saw this (Kaiden for me) and was puzzled too.

[kaotician]

With regards to the bug that Mordus has, I'm guessing that they must have captured one on Horizon, though it's not mentioned at all (at least in my playthrough).



Something that puzzles me though is why you need a biotic shield on the Collector ship when it's established on Horizon that the suit modifications that Mordus has made will protect you from them?

[adam_grif]

kaotician wrote...

Something that puzzles me though is why you need a biotic shield on the Collector ship when it's established on Horizon that the suit modifications that Mordus has made will protect you from them?

They say something to the effect of "... it won't work against swarms of that size". They don't specify any further than that.

[kaotician]

adam_grif wrote...

kaotician wrote...

Something that puzzles me though is why you need a biotic shield on the Collector ship when it's established on Horizon that the suit modifications that Mordus has made will protect you from them?

They say something to the effect of "... it won't work against swarms of that size". They don't specify any further than that.

Oh, do they? Thanks for that.

[t3f3r1]

kaotician wrote...

With regards to the bug that Mordus has, I'm guessing that they must have captured one on Horizon, though it's not mentioned at all (at least in my playthrough).

There is no way they could have because the protection is needed for the prep to ARRIVE at Horizon, and the scene with the bug is shown in the briefing before reaching Horizon. The only place they could've gotten it is Freedom's Progress and even that is never directly addressed.

[Skalman91]

MMkain wrote...

In the opening scene Joker spends a great deal of time unprotected in space. While this isn't a plot whole it does strike me as a glaring error. Infact there are multiple instances in the game where party members have exposed flesh while in inhospitible conditions.

I don't think exposing bare skin to space is as big a plot hole as you might think.

chemistry.about.com/b/2007/08/09/what-really-happens-if-youre-exposed-to-space.htm
wiki.answers.com/Q/What_happens_to_a_human_in_outer_space

Without a suit or oxygen supply a human can be conscious for about 10 seconds in space and survive for almost 2 minutes provided he gets assistance from someone else.

Although the de-pressurization would be a problem, I don't think joker would necessarily die or even get injured in the time it takes him to get from the cockpit to the escape pod, since he has a oxygen supply. 

Modifié par Skalman91, 13 février 2010 - 12:09 .

[JPfanner]

Everything involving the Normandy crash site. 

The Normandy, an advanced prototype ship using secret technology gets destroyed by an unknown enemy; Commander Shepard, hero to the galaxy and humanity's brightest light, is listed as MIA along with 20 crewmembers.

So...it takes two years for the Alliance to get around to looking for the wreckage at all and they NEVER even bothered to search for Shepard, the twenty missing crewmembers, or salvage the secret technology that went into the Normandy.

When the Alliance finally gets around to locating the wreckage after two years, they email the ex-MIA Shepard whom they've decided was dead without bothering to look, to put up a monument and find out what happened to the twenty other MIA people.  That is just insulting, they couldn't even be bothered to even come look for Shepard or twenty other people and now they want you to recover dog tags for them.

Some of those dog tags are in crates too.  Dog tags aren't usually in crates, they tend to be worn by people.  You know, like people injured and stranded on a frozen planet after a crash who take shelter in storage crates waiting for rescue.  Either that or some of the other groups who actually got off their asses to investigate the site stuffed some bodies into the crates.  Which is way more than the Alliance did. 

[Katarian]

Abirn wrote...

Actually the biggest plot hole came in ME1.

Your telling me a specter (and one of the councils favorites) couldn't just walk up to the control panel and activate said relay? The whole conduit had no point to it. Yes Saren used it as a back door for something he literally could have walked up to and nobody would have even said a word about it.

That adds an even bigger plot hole. How did no one notice the control panel activated a Mass Relay in the 2000 years before the game. The control needs to be activated from somewhere else in the Citadel, somewhere sealed off from the rest of the station where only the Keepers can go, it's actually stated in the game when talking to Vigil. The hole is why you end up on the Presidium and then go to the Tower, rather then in said control room.

There is a big problem if you go through as a Paragon on ME1 and rescue the Council. They reinstate you as Spectre and then there really is no need to be affiliated with Cerberus. Saren seen to be able to wander around and do whatever he liked without the Council caring, so you could investigate the disappearences as a Spectre. The order of your missions as the start is the biggest problem, If you could visit the Council before Freedom's Progress and they ignore you then joining Cerberus makes more sense then just blindly trusting them until the last decision in the game. It'd also be nice if at least someone tried to stop you when they find out your part of an organisation they consider terrorists, even C-Sec can't be that useless at least a few of the 200k officers must be competent.

[AntiChri5]

JPfanner wrote...

Everything involving the Normandy crash site. 

The Normandy, an advanced prototype ship using secret technology gets destroyed by an unknown enemy; Commander Shepard, hero to the galaxy and humanity's brightest light, is listed as MIA along with 20 crewmembers.

So...it takes two years for the Alliance to get around to looking for the wreckage at all and they NEVER even bothered to search for Shepard, the twenty missing crewmembers, or salvage the secret technology that went into the Normandy.

When the Alliance finally gets around to locating the wreckage after two years, they email the ex-MIA Shepard whom they've decided was dead without bothering to look, to put up a monument and find out what happened to the twenty other MIA people.  That is just insulting, they couldn't even be bothered to even come look for Shepard or twenty other people and now they want you to recover dog tags for them.

Some of those dog tags are in crates too.  Dog tags aren't usually in crates, they tend to be worn by people.  You know, like people injured and stranded on a frozen planet after a crash who take shelter in storage crates waiting for rescue.  Either that or some of the other groups who actually got off their asses to investigate the site stuffed some bodies into the crates.  Which is way more than the Alliance did. 

Oooooh!  

[aaniadyen]

KalReegar wrote...

And how Shepard's body survived reentry of the planet Alchera, when the temperatures of such are enough to completely incinerate a body.

Atmosphere and gravity of Alchera would play a HUGE role in that. If it had no atmosphere (Or even a very weak one) and very low gravity (Hell, on Titan, if you can produce about 6% of your body weight in lift, you can fly). His body, depending on his armor, which, being the most powerful Spectre in the galaxy and having killed Sovereign, would be the best armor available to anyone just about anywhere. I don't think it's all that unrealistic, also, because the planet he got stuck in the gravitational field of was a very snowy one, which would also serve to cushion his fall. He wouldn't be met with hard ground, but soft snow. The impact force with which you hit the ground is dependant on the time it takes you to stop. If it is not instant (hard ground) it is significantly reduced. Though the snow would help...if the gravity of the planet was too great, he'd explode on impact. If the atmosphere was half as powerful as Earths, he'd be burnt to a tiny speck of ash before he hit the ground, no matter what armor he was wearing.

[adam_grif]

aaniadyen wrote...

KalReegar wrote...

And how Shepard's body survived reentry of the planet Alchera, when the temperatures of such are enough to completely incinerate a body.

Atmosphere and gravity of Alchera would play a HUGE role in that. If it had no atmosphere (Or even a very weak one) and very low gravity (Hell, on Titan, if you can produce about 6% of your body weight in lift, you can fly). His body, depending on his armor, which, being the most powerful Spectre in the galaxy and having killed Sovereign, would be the best armor available to anyone just about anywhere. I don't think it's all that unrealistic, also, because the planet he got stuck in the gravitational field of was a very snowy one, which would also serve to cushion his fall. He wouldn't be met with hard ground, but soft snow. The impact force with which you hit the ground is dependant on the time it takes you to stop. If it is not instant (hard ground) it is significantly reduced. Though the snow would help...if the gravity of the planet was too great, he'd explode on impact. If the atmosphere was half as powerful as Earths, he'd be burnt to a tiny speck of ash before he hit the ground, no matter what armor he was wearing.

I liked to kind of assume that his body never crashed to the ground and that it was in orbit when they recovered it.

I have no evidence for this, but I really hope they didn't have his body surviving reentry.

[Lightice_av]

Something that puzzles me though is why you need a biotic shield on the Collector ship when it's established on Horizon that the suit modifications that Mordus has made will protect you from them?

It was explained perfectly clearly: Mordin's invention is not perfect. It masks you from the seeker swarms reasonably well, but when you're in a closed space with thousands of them all around you, no amount of masking will help, since they will hit you even if they don't try.

You people are incidentally forgetting Shepard's mass effect shields when you ponder about his planetfall.

Modifié par Lightice_av, 13 février 2010 - 12:32 .

[theteamfantastic]

The advert kiosks on the Citadel scream your name and your history rather loudly. Yet no-one in the vicinity bats an eye lid.

C-Sec security. You have Cerberus on your uniform, right? So much for staying below the radar. "Is it true, you're working for Cerberus?" How do all these npcs I talk to just so happen to be aware of this?

Further more, the email on my ship. How quickly did these rumours of my being alive go? How do they know to send their e-mails to the new top secret Normandy? What is my e-mail address and how do so many people know it? That doesn't seem very secure! Surely better for cerberus and everyone if we don't behave and walk around as if we're the second alliance navy core.

Remember that ship that was falling into a colony and you had to repower the ship's engines? Well I scanned the planet and the info panel made no mention that this planet had been colonised. There was no colony, it just popped up for the sake of this set pieced mission and then it vanished again.

Also for the IFF cutscene thing. Where was the whole team going in the shuttle? What mission? I looked at my questbook, I had no outstanding missions. I had no reason to leave Joker in charge while I...what? Park my shuttle in deep space for 5 minutes?

Modifié par Ranbir, 13 février 2010 - 12:43 .

[aaniadyen]

adam_grif wrote...

aaniadyen wrote...

KalReegar wrote...

And how Shepard's body survived reentry of the planet Alchera, when the temperatures of such are enough to completely incinerate a body.

Atmosphere and gravity of Alchera would play a HUGE role in that. If it had no atmosphere (Or even a very weak one) and very low gravity (Hell, on Titan, if you can produce about 6% of your body weight in lift, you can fly). His body, depending on his armor, which, being the most powerful Spectre in the galaxy and having killed Sovereign, would be the best armor available to anyone just about anywhere. I don't think it's all that unrealistic, also, because the planet he got stuck in the gravitational field of was a very snowy one, which would also serve to cushion his fall. He wouldn't be met with hard ground, but soft snow. The impact force with which you hit the ground is dependant on the time it takes you to stop. If it is not instant (hard ground) it is significantly reduced. Though the snow would help...if the gravity of the planet was too great, he'd explode on impact. If the atmosphere was half as powerful as Earths, he'd be burnt to a tiny speck of ash before he hit the ground, no matter what armor he was wearing.

I liked to kind of assume that his body never crashed to the ground and that it was in orbit when they recovered it.

I have no evidence for this, but I really hope they didn't have his body surviving reentry.

Well, for a satelite to orbit a planet without descending toward the planet, or ascending away from the planet, it needs to be pulled toward the planet at the exact same velocity it orbits around the circumference of the planet. Essentially, it needs to be traveling so quickly around the planet that the gravity pulls it at a rate which propels it sideways, rather than toward the planet's surface. On Earth, that means for a satellite to remain in orbit indefinately, it needs to be launched with a horizontal velocity of 8000m/s. That would be damn near impossible without some kind of propulsion. Again, depending on the level of orbit (close/far away from the planet's surface) that might even cause more damage due to consistantly moving quickly through the atmosphere. I hate to say it, but in this case, I think it is more realistic that he actually impacted with the planet.

Modifié par aaniadyen, 13 février 2010 - 12:50 .

[adam_grif]

... unless the ship was already in orbit when it crashed, but was in a rapidly decaying orbit. Since his body was recovered long before the events of ME2, it's possible that it was all still in orbit until it eventually crashed on the planet after your body was recovered.

[kaotician]

t3f3r1 wrote...

kaotician wrote...

With regards to the bug that Mordus has, I'm guessing that they must have captured one on Horizon, though it's not mentioned at all (at least in my playthrough).

There is no way they could have because the protection is needed for the prep to ARRIVE at Horizon, and the scene with the bug is shown in the briefing before reaching Horizon. The only place they could've gotten it is Freedom's Progress and even that is never directly addressed.

Yeah, I meant Freedom, got my name's mixed up.

[aaniadyen]

adam_grif wrote...

... unless the ship was already in orbit when it crashed, but was in a rapidly decaying orbit. Since his body was recovered long before the events of ME2, it's possible that it was all still in orbit until it eventually crashed on the planet after your body was recovered.

I'm talking about commander Shepard, not the Normandy. Shepard was spaced, so he'd need to be his own satellite. If you're implying that he was thrown from the ship at the ships orbit speed, well...the cutscene doesn't show it first off. Second...his body wouldn't be able to remain intact after experiencing speeds that great, even if the planet was half as big as Earth. If you've even rode on a tilter-whirl, you know how the momentum pushes you from side to side. Imagine that force multiplied several hundred times over, and imagine being exposed to that indefinately (until Cerberus found you). The body would be a thick paste.

Modifié par aaniadyen, 13 février 2010 - 01:23 .

[adam_grif]

No you silly man, I'm saying that the ship was already in orbit, and thus him getting spaced means he is already going at orbital velocities, since the ship was, and that at some point after his body was recovered, the rest of the ship decayed in it's orbit and crashed to the planet.



Objects in motion stay in motion, and all that. He needn't be ejected from the Normandy at orbital speeds relative to the Normandy, only relative to the planet.

[aaniadyen]

adam_grif wrote...

No you silly man, I'm saying that the ship was already in orbit, and thus him getting spaced means he is already going at orbital velocities, since the ship was, and that at some point after his body was recovered, the rest of the ship decayed in it's orbit and crashed to the planet.

Objects in motion stay in motion, and all that. He needn't be ejected from the Normandy at orbital speeds relative to the Normandy, only relative to the planet.

I'll explain it this way:

if the planet was half as big as Earth, you'd need to travel 4000m/s to maintain altitude.

This translates out to be 400 meters in a tenth of a second.

The
world record for the 200 meter dash is 19.19 seconds. Let's go ahead
and take the librity of assuming that athelete can go twice that at the
same speed. So that would be 38.38 seconds.

Now we're left with
38.38 seconds to go the same distance you'd go in one tenth of a second
required to orbit a planet half the size of the Earth.

400 meters/.1s = 0.248548 mi/.1s

0.248548 mi/.1s = 8947.782 miles per hour.

The human body wouldn't be able to handle that for any ammount of time.

I'm not trying to argue or disagree with you. I'm simply stating that I believe the chances of having some recoverable body to operate on would be better. This depends on whether or not the planet has an atmosphere as well as the planet's size. You can't really tell unless you have more information about it.

Modifié par aaniadyen, 13 février 2010 - 01:40 .

[addiction21]

That there are no waffles in the future. I do not know if that is a plot hole but I do find it very disturbing.

[aaniadyen]

addiction21 wrote...

That there are no waffles in the future. I do not know if that is a plot hole but I do find it very disturbing.

This. With how delicious waffles are divided by how easy they are to make...no way in hell they wouldn't be in Mass Effect while Ramen is.

[GenericPlayer2]

I too disagree with the flimsy breather masks and exposed skin in space or toxic environment (the whole cleavage in space thing is sad). But I think that is just game design, not plot.



Some of the plot holes I didn't like



1. Wilson's motivation still a mystery



2. Cerberus funding explanation is pretty flimsy. In ME1 they go to great lengths to explain how expensive and difficult the Normandy was to build. In some scenes they go as far as saying that they could have gotten a fleet of ships with that price tag, and how the Turians helped with its construction. Now Cerberus comes along and builds a bigger and better Normandy, and has a huge Lazarus project to get someone back from the dead. I can understand that they have wealthy sponsors, but really what we are being shown in ME2 is an organization with the budget of the Alliance Navy. And it was not addressed to my satisfaction. Maybe something in ME3 will clear it up but its a plot hole for me.



3. Collectors as protheans - Shep had all of those images in his head and did not recognize them on first contact?

[adam_grif]

aaniadyen wrote...

adam_grif wrote...

No you silly man, I'm saying that the ship was already in orbit, and thus him getting spaced means he is already going at orbital velocities, since the ship was, and that at some point after his body was recovered, the rest of the ship decayed in it's orbit and crashed to the planet.

Objects in motion stay in motion, and all that. He needn't be ejected from the Normandy at orbital speeds relative to the Normandy, only relative to the planet.

I'll explain it this way:

if the planet was half as big as Earth, you'd need to travel 4000m/s to maintain altitude.

This translates out to be 400 meters in a tenth of a second.

The
world record for the 200 meter dash is 19.19 seconds. Let's go ahead
and take the librity of assuming that athelete can go twice that at the
same speed. So that would be 38.38 seconds.

Now we're left with
38.38 seconds to go the same distance you'd go in one tenth of a second
required to orbit a planet half the size of the Earth.

400 meters/.1s = 0.248548 mi/.1s

0.248548 mi/.1s = 8947.782 miles per hour.

The human body wouldn't be able to handle that for any ammount of time.

Um.

You realize, don't you, that velocity has no associated stresses and does not have any impact on a human body, right? It's rapid acceleration that is harmful. Simply going at a high velocity, to your body, is like standing still and everybody moving around you.

So long as it is accelerated gently, a human body can go at 0.999999 times the speed of light and will be perfectly fine until it smacks into something at high speed.

If the Normandy was already at orbital speeds around the planet, then the only acceleration Shepard's body took was when he got spaced, which is based on his relative speed to the Normandy. He's clearly not thrown out terribly fast, nothing his body can't handle.

I'm not trying to argue or disagree with you. I'm simply stating that I
believe the chances of having some recoverable body to operate on would
be better. This depends on whether or not the planet has an atmosphere
as well as the planet's size. You can't really tell unless you have
more information about it.

If he landed on the planet at all, there would have been nothing left of the body. And I'm not talking about burning up in the atmosphere, going at speeds associated with spaceflight (orbital speeds are super-slow compared to the speeds that spacecraft travel at), then suddenly decellerating when he hit th surface of the planet means game over for his body and any chances of recovering his brain or any organs at all drop to zero.

[aaniadyen]

adam_grif wrote...

aaniadyen wrote...

adam_grif wrote...

No you silly man, I'm saying that the ship was already in orbit, and thus him getting spaced means he is already going at orbital velocities, since the ship was, and that at some point after his body was recovered, the rest of the ship decayed in it's orbit and crashed to the planet.

Objects in motion stay in motion, and all that. He needn't be ejected from the Normandy at orbital speeds relative to the Normandy, only relative to the planet.

I'll explain it this way:

if the planet was half as big as Earth, you'd need to travel 4000m/s to maintain altitude.

This translates out to be 400 meters in a tenth of a second.

The
world record for the 200 meter dash is 19.19 seconds. Let's go ahead
and take the librity of assuming that athelete can go twice that at the
same speed. So that would be 38.38 seconds.

Now we're left with
38.38 seconds to go the same distance you'd go in one tenth of a second
required to orbit a planet half the size of the Earth.

400 meters/.1s = 0.248548 mi/.1s

0.248548 mi/.1s = 8947.782 miles per hour.

The human body wouldn't be able to handle that for any ammount of time.

Um.

You realize, don't you, that velocity has no associated stresses and does not have any impact on a human body, right? It's rapid acceleration that is harmful. Simply going at a high velocity, to your body, is like standing still and everybody moving around you.

So long as it is accelerated gently, a human body can go at 0.999999 times the speed of light and will be perfectly fine until it smacks into something at high speed.

If the Normandy was already at orbital speeds around the planet, then the only acceleration Shepard's body took was when he got spaced, which is based on his relative speed to the Normandy. He's clearly not thrown out terribly fast, nothing his body can't handle.

I'm not trying to argue or disagree with you. I'm simply stating that I
believe the chances of having some recoverable body to operate on would
be better. This depends on whether or not the planet has an atmosphere
as well as the planet's size. You can't really tell unless you have
more information about it.

If he landed on the planet at all, there would have been nothing left of the body. And I'm not talking about burning up in the atmosphere, going at speeds associated with spaceflight (orbital speeds are super-slow compared to the speeds that spacecraft travel at), then suddenly decellerating when he hit th surface of the planet means game over for his body and any chances of recovering his brain or any organs at all drop to zero.

Yeah, sorry about that. Been up for three days and I was confusing velocity with acceleration speed. I am an idiot -.- I need to stop doing **** like this.

Modifié par aaniadyen, 13 février 2010 - 02:17 .