901 réponses à ce sujet

[BlastedLands]

Velvetmeds wrote...

wth...what's with the uproar over the DLC items? who cares? i can't believe people bought DLC because of items, seriously? i bought them because i wanted to go to new places and do more quests, items are just a bonus that most of the time i don't even use cause there are better.

well, of course. but it feels weird that they just vanish, doesn't it?  they're in customs or what?

[Vanderbilt_Grad]

I can guess at some of the technical, developmental, & financial reasons some of the decisions regarding Awakenings were made … but overall I think that some huge mistakes are being made.



I think that the single largest is the lack of romances. Lets face it, DA:O attracted a huge audience, and a sizeable amount of it either focused on the romances as a primary story element, one of the main reasons they actually bothered playing the game, or as an important sub-element, something that added greatly to the game. Many players think about “their” Warden in terms of his or her story, and, for better or worse, the Romance was a huge part of that. By not continuing romances or allowing for new ones Bioware is ensuring that Awakening will have a much smaller market share.



I understand, the romances are probably some of the most cost intensive parts of the game when it comes to development. They are hard and time consuming to write. They are usually very complex code wise (witness how the romances are some of the buggiest parts of the main game … there is a reason for this). They also my require more expense when it comes to voice acting. Finally … what was one of the biggest things that DA:O took a PR hit on? The same sex romances. By excluding romances the PR department has much less work dealing with fallout after a release.



What’s done is done as far as Awakenings given where we are up against the release date, but IMHO Bioware needs to learn form DA:O and make DANG sure that they have romances built into any add-ons for DA2. There was talk of “poisoning the well” with downloadable content. Well the same thing holds true with the romances. Those gamers who are playing DA:O for the Romance as much or more than the main storyline need to be considered. If you exclude them in major content like they are far less likely to be there when DA2 hits the shelves.



Second the DLC items not porting over is a poor business move. People are already upset about the DLC for many reasons … not porting items over gives the nay-sayers MAJOR new ammunition and will be a factor in whether or not folks buy it now and in the future. You have two factors here from the consumer side. The folks who want value for their money don’t want items that just last for a small portion of the game. Then there are the gamers who are really attached to various DLC items for one reason or another. For one it might be the way it looks, for another it might be the stats which they really value. Either way these are customers & taking away items takes away from their game experience and makes them less likely to buy DLC or even DA focused games in the future.



From a dev standpoint, a lot of the work on the DLC and Awakenings had to be going on at the same time & had to be done by different teams. I can see how the Awakenings team would find it nearly impossible to try to test and balance DLC items Awakening and still meet a release date. I get that.



What I hope Bioware does in the future is to either more tightly integrate DLC and add-on development OR give us the option to import items or not. Frankly I don’t care if the game is “balanced” when it comes to DLC items. I just like extra options both for looks and ability. Let the customer decide on the balance they want.

[Walina]

Velvetmeds wrote...

wth...what's with the uproar over the DLC items? who cares? i can't believe people bought DLC because of items, seriously? i bought them because i wanted to go to new places and do more quests, items are just a bonus that most of the time i don't even use cause there are better.

*sigh* you're a really good customer who doesn't care about money.

You PAID for those contents so yeah they should've be carried over into the expansion, that's money!
Bioware sold their collector bowes thank to those DLC contianing items and they just realeased a new DLC.
Sorry but I think it would be unfair to make pay you just for a new map if there weren't any new items to get!
So, yeah people do look for new items in DLCS they paid and it's normal to want those items stay with player in the futur.

Modifié par Walina, 13 février 2010 - 06:48 .

[SirOccam]

I have to admit I was getting a little freaked out reading the 5 pages of this thread, but Mr. Gaider's post put to rest a lot of my concerns.

No DLC content: I'm not bothered too much by this. I'll be sorry to see Starfang go, but overall I didn't pay that much attention to gear anyway; for me it was all about the story. Comparing stats on items isn't that entertaining IMO. I even let Alistair leave to become king wearing Cailan's armor and shield and Duncan's sword...it just seemed right that he should have them. The only item I really want to keep is Morrigan's ring. Everything else is replaceable.

Ohgren as the returning companion: oh well. As I've stated elsewhere, I didn't like him, and don't like Dwarves in general, but on the other hand I don't have to (and probably won't) use him. I mentally prepared myself for no Morrigan and no Leliana, and it looks like it was just in time.

No romances: this I don't mind so much since my character is 100% head-over-heels for Morrigan, and as I said before, I was prepared for the possibility that she might not be back. I can wait for DA2, and I think it'll be worth the wait. What I DO want is a chance for my character to talk about it, or other characters to mention it, etc. I want it to feel like it was real and not just some variable that got set to point to Morrigan at some point. When I see Alistair I hope I can have a nice bro talk with him; he and my PC were pretty good friends, at least up until I let Loghain live.

Wade and Herren returning: YAY...on one condition. Cam Clarke had better come back as Herren! I'd know that voice anywhere, so I will know if someone just tries to do an impression of him! While we're on the topic of voices, it would be pretty cool to have Jim Cummings back too...I know he did the scholar/librarian dude in the human noble origin. When I heard him berate that kid, I thought "Tigge--I mean Jim Cummings!"

A few disappointments in the FAQ (no Leliana probably first among them), but overall I'm still really excited about this game, and I have every confidence that it's going to turn out great.

Modifié par SirOccam, 13 février 2010 - 06:45 .

[ArcanistLibram]

Velvetmeds wrote...

wth...what's with the uproar over the DLC items? who cares? i can't believe people bought DLC because of items, seriously? i bought them because i wanted to go to new places and do more quests, items are just a bonus that most of the time i don't even use cause there are better.

Nobody in their right mind would buy DLC for the items. However, my main character usually ends up with nothing but DLC equipment by the time I'm up to the Archdemon. Why the hell shouldn't it carry over to the expansion and what am I going to get to wear instead? 

[darrenr22]

I am confident that most of those posting in this thread saying they are cancelling their preorder and won't buy Awakening will definitely buy Awakening when it is released.



And I am confident Awakening will be awesome.

[WilliamShatner]

Vanderbilt_Grad wrote...

I can guess at some of the technical, developmental, & financial reasons some of the decisions regarding Awakenings were made … but overall I think that some huge mistakes are being made.

If this game were made by an Indie dveloper working on their first IP I'd sympathise.

This is BioWare, one of the world's biggest RPG developers, now owned by EA one of the world's biggest game publishers.

Lack of development time or finances doesn't wash with me I'm afraid.

[JasonPogo]

"Wouldn't the length of the expansion preclude the development of romances? Unless we are talking a short fling, the getting to know the other stage, the getting interested stage, the flirting and love stages, would be so compressed that it would feel awkward and unrealistic, I think.



I'm all for the romances in Bio's games, and enjoy them thoroughly, but I like them to be done gradually and stretched over a big chunk of the game. Romances in the expansion (unless they were a continuation) wouldn't fit that mold."

That is from a post by Modderater Kevin Lynch.


I don't know if Kevin knows anything we don't but if that post is true then there are many things to be consernd about.  Why are we paying almost full price for something so short they can't see you falling in love with someone...

[Walina]

For anyone who didn't read the FAQ in detail : you CAN import your DEAD warden and play it !! xD (Great, why did I have to do that damn ritual again??)

Modifié par Walina, 13 février 2010 - 07:00 .

[Cuddlezarro]

ArcanistLibram wrote...

Velvetmeds wrote...

wth...what's with the uproar over the DLC items? who cares? i can't believe people bought DLC because of items, seriously? i bought them because i wanted to go to new places and do more quests, items are just a bonus that most of the time i don't even use cause there are better.

Nobody in their right mind would buy DLC for the items. However, my main character usually ends up with nothing but DLC equipment by the time I'm up to the Archdemon. Why the hell shouldn't it carry over to the expansion and what am I going to get to wear instead? 

^THIS

my wardens are pretty much decked out completely in DLC items

it makes no sence for the warden commander of ferelden to NOT have freaking warden commander armor

[Silensfurtim]

DLC items play a role in character builds.



For example, a melee rogue's only best helmet is the Helm of Honnleath. For warriors, most of us end up using Blood Dragon Armor or Warden Commanders Armor.



What do they want us to wear in Awakening? Our freaking underwear? Did our Warden got poor before Awakening and decided to sell his equipment that helped kill the Archdemon?

[TripLight]

I'll still be buying it too. At least Mr. Gaider (Thank you by the way for clearing that up, it's greatly appreciated.) said that the romances will be given a nod, so I can live with that.

DLC items, while it does suck, I think its safe to assume in Awakenings we will be getting new armor and weapons, and I look forward to seeing what they came up with. I didn't buy the DLC for the items, I bought it for the stories, and Shale:lol:.

All in all, after I get back from my Caribbean Cruise, I will be playing Awakenings in my pajamas and beer in hand. I look forward to it.

[Silensfurtim]

HAHA.



YOU CAN IMPORT A DEAD WARDEN YET YOU CANT IMPORT DLC/PROMO ITEMS.



thats pathetic.

[Silensfurtim]

yeah i bought DAO for the stories too...





but i still paid for the frigging DLC items.

[Walina]

David Gaider wrote...

Just regarding those asking about the romances, by "not continue" it just means you don't have a chance to actively continue the relationship during the course of this adventure. It does not mean that you mysteriously broke up or that the romance is not recognized to exist. I would have liked to have cameos by everyone, but that simply wasn't possible. As it is, you may find some treats awaiting you -- recognizing past decisions can be done in small ways, as well as large (and this applies to things outside of romances, as well).

You should really have a talk to the people who give interview or write the website, so people won't get upset easely if they read more detailed replies like you wrote :innocent:

[Velvetmeds]

fine, to each his own. i'll never understand players interest in loot/items/etc, as it's always what i care less about in a RPG, and it annoys me to see people insisting on this.



*glad ME2 threw loot and inventory out the window.*

[Marik333]

Walina wrote...

For anyone who didn't read the FAQ in detail : you CAN import your DEAD warden and play it !! xD (Great, why did I have to do that damn ritual again??)

As a Lorophile, I detest that idea. If my character died in a sort of "holy ritual" that sacrificed his entire being just to spare the world from the Blight, I want that to count for SOMETHING. Saying, "Oh, yeah, by the way... um... that whole Archdemon mutual-soul-destruction bit? Just a joke that the Wardens play on all new recruits. Haha, you've just been Theda-punked, bizzznitch" is a bit of a sting.

I'll get over it, of course. I just detest rewriting entire meaningful sections of the lore without actually altering the game around it, and publicly specifying that the whole thing's been retconned (making the Dark Ritual pointless, as far as personal survival goes).

[Abriael_CG]

As much as I have profund respect for Bioware, I'm strongly feeling that they are cutting corners again with Awakening as they did with Mass Effect 2 (this time in order to release an expansion too early compared to the original game's release).

The inability to import DLC armor like Warden Commander's and Calian's is absolutely inexcusable. There's simply no reason to prevent that if not just cutting the corner of having to program that particular items into the awakening importing database. Actually I dread they're doing that in order to sell more Awakening DLCs offering loot. I'd be severely disappointed if that was to happen.
In any case, there's really no excuse.

I can deal with the inability of continue romances from origins, sometimes developers feel that a fresh start is necessary for a character, and I can accept that,  but again, the complete absence of romance from the expansion is something that will reduce my enjoyment of it by about the 50%. Romance is a very important factor in Bioware games, and one of the very reasons that sets them apart from the rest of RPGs and western games that normally don't place so much attention on the story.
The lack of romance simply cuts off a quite sizeable part of the Bioware's target, that's made by people that enjoy romance as part of a good story.

I'd even be willing to pay extra for a DLC including romanceable companions (or romance for the existing ones) as much as I'd detest the idea of them excluding it in order to use it to get more revenue later.

Unfortunately, I'm afraid it's too late to change this before the release of the expansion, but I hope that Bioware will learn their lesson from the general reaction to this news.
Cutting corners is... bad.
And cutting corners on some of the most prominent elements that your fans appreciate is worse.

I'm sorry Bioware, again, with all due respect, this is a major screwup.

Modifié par Abriael_CG, 13 février 2010 - 07:15 .

[Velvetmeds]

if you import a dead warden, he didn't die. the expansion changes the ending you got, and you didn't actually die in ultimate sacrifice, even if "you did". this means that you just don't suddenly appear after supposedly being dead; it just changes the ending you watched on the game and you didn't die after killing the archdemon.



of course, there's still need for some plot to justify this. very easy to explain if in your game you ever did it with morrigan, but not so easy if you never did.

[Arbiter Libera]

Marik333 wrote...

As a Lorophile, I detest that idea. If my character died in a sort of "holy ritual" that sacrificed his entire being just to spare the world from the Blight, I want that to count for SOMETHING. Saying, "Oh, yeah, by the way... um... that whole Archdemon mutual-soul-destruction bit? Just a joke that the Wardens play on all new recruits. Haha, you've just been Theda-punked, bizzznitch" is a bit of a sting.

Pretty much. If my character died, he should remain dead and I should start with the new Orlesian Warden or whoever, but decisions of my former character should still apply. Just because my new PC is around now it doesn't that events before his time didn't happen... overall, it's the problem with brining dead character back and cheapening his death. Dunno why BioWare decided on that, it takes away all the weight from that particular DA:O ending.

Much dissapointed in that regard.

[Finiffa]

Abriael_CG wrote...

As much as I have profund respect for Bioware, I'm strongly feeling that they are cutting corners again with Awakening as they did with Mass Effect 2 (this time in order to release an expansion too early compared to the original game's release).

The inability to import DLC armor like Warden Commander's and Calian's is absolutely inexcusable. There's simply no reason to prevent that if not just cutting the corner of having to program that particular items into the awakening importing database. Actually I dread they're doing that in order to sell more Awakening DLCs offering loot. I'd be severely disappointed if that was to happen.
In any case, there's really no excuse.

I can deal with the inability of continue romances from origins, sometimes developers feel that a fresh start is necessary for a character, and I can accept that,  but again, the complete absence of romance from the expansion is something that will reduce my enjoyment of it by about the 50%. Romance is a very important factor in Bioware games, and one of the very reasons that sets them apart from the rest of RPGs and western games that normally don't place so much attention on the story.
The lack of romance simply cuts off a quite sizeable part of the Bioware's target, that's made by people that enjoy romance as part of a good story.

I'd even be willing to pay extra for a DLC including romanceable companions (or romance for the existing ones) as much as I'd detest the idea of them excluding it in order to use it to get more revenue later.

Unfortunately, I'm afraid it's too late to change this before the release of the expansion, but I hope that Bioware will learn their lesson from the general reaction to this news.
Cutting corners is... bad.
And cutting corners on some of the most prominent elements that your fans appreciate is worse.

This ^^.  Im a big DAO fan but atm I'm feeling very sad

[SinYang]

Abriael_CG Wrote: 
I can deal with the inability of continue romances from origins, sometimes developers feel that a fresh start is necessary for a character, and I can accept that

You havent read the posts on this thread or Davids.. look carefully. Theres more too life than this one "expansion", romances arent being ignored. (Wonders how some people managed to complete Origins & understand it)

Bioware has "always" said there isnt the budget to add romance to an expansion pack.

Modifié par SinYang, 13 février 2010 - 07:34 .

[Giant ambush beetle]

I am also a big Bioware and DAO fan but I have to agree with Abriael_CG's post in every single point. 

Modifié par The Woldan , 13 février 2010 - 07:22 .

[RafielSyntos]

Gracknug wrote...

I really do hope they change it so DLC items can be carried over aswell :/ . Having a shiny armor to start Awakening with was one of the reasons i bought RTO to begin with.

and also for those human nobles who married Anora and became King make sense to start out with shiny armor.  I am also sad that Bioware isn't going let us keep the DLC items we paid for them right... so i think we should transfer them over to our character but oh well im still buying the expansion anyways :innocent:

Modifié par RafielSyntos, 13 février 2010 - 07:25 .

[Valkeyr]

I actually like the fact there are no new romances. More focus put into the story and general companion dialogue would make the expansion more enjoyable for me.





That said, no dog cameo confirmed yet? It seems like it won't show up in awakening, did it die?





Also, I'm importing my dead dwarvern beserker warden on my 2nd awakening playthrough. He survived through pure dwarvern stubborness and the high alcohol content in his blood affected the ritual. That or dog killed the archdemon and died.