107 réponses à ce sujet

[Cuddlezarro]

ejoslin wrote...

Cuddlezarro wrote...

iv lost the fight before and iv never got such a cutscene just a game overscreen

and the whole ambush was a glorified suicide attempt thats why he took the job in the first place because he honestly didnt expect to win

Hahaha, more than didn't expect to win, set himself up to lose.  Anyone who starts an ambush with, "Help, we're being attacked! Please, come save us!" really is not trying to use the element of surprise.  The only thing that does surprise me about that whole thing is he found people dumb enough to think that would work.

like you said in the zev fan topic you know theres something wrong when you find something obvious >_>

[ejoslin]

But I love to repeat the obvious in every relevant thread. Heh, if it's obvious to me, the queen of clueless, I'm always surprised when it's not obvious to others.

[Addai]

Helios969 wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

We're not talking about a romance with Zevran. I find the character as interesting on a friend run-through.

Whatever... to each his own. I do think Skadi's criticism is not directed at you, rather at the OP. I mean, look at the thread title for Andraste's sake. You can at least articulate something. I do think you are missing out in terms of taking advantage of rogue abilities, judging by what you've posted. It's probably my favorite class. I'm running a sword and shield character a.t.m. and I find it hard not to be impatient with how tedious and ineffective it is, being more used to DW rogue.

I'm not missing out on rogue abilities.  That's why Leliana is always in my party.  I'll admit I usually do not play rogues, I'm actually do so for the first time in this game with my current playthrough.  A Dwarven female rogue from Dust Town.  The thing is, because of my tactics (or lack of) I just play my character as if she were a warrior.  Probably, mostly, defeats the purpose.

I tend to play my rogues war-like, too.  I don't use traps or the like, very often.  I do like to be able to disarm my own traps and to use stealth to scout and set up an ambush.   I was simply going from the fact that you said Zevran is the most useless party member and you scoffed at the idea of rogues beating your party.   If you only use a rogue to open locks and disarm traps, I could see why you would think that, because his default set-up is a dex-based rogue rather than cunning-based.  However, with some paralyze runes, adding Lethality, Momentum and Coup de Grace to his assassin abilities, pouring points into dexterity and cunning- he's the deadliest fighter in your party.  I guess you'll have to trust us if you don't want to test it out yourself.  My last PC was a cunning rogue and between the two of them, fights were like child's play.  Unless you run a two-mage party, there's no reason not to take two rogues.  All a warrior is good for, really, is pulling threat, and that does help make your rogues even deadlier (when enemies swarm the tank, their backs are turned, making it easier to get backstabs for added damage).

YMMV.

Edit:  There are pages-long threads in the Build forum on how to set up rogues.  I'm just giving some things off the top of my head that work well.

Modifié par Addai67, 14 février 2010 - 08:32 .

[Addai]

Helios969 wrote...

It just occurred to me (sorry if I'm a bit slow,) but if you desecrate the Ashes, how do you save the Arl?

You get to take a pinch before you do so.

It just occurred to me that if Wynne and Leliana were true Andrastians, they would believe in the power of the ashes whether there was dragon's blood on them or not.  After all, Leli kvetsches at you if you give the Redcliffe knights chantry amulets, saying that it has to be faith that saves people.

Heh, once you know Leliana's story, it's possible to see the chilling clues that were along the way.  I just went through the Tower and when you come across Cullen in the magical cage, she says "he's been tortured, and denied food and water- I can tell."  She's speaking from experience, her own as a prisoner no doubt but also because she tortured marks, too.

I don't hate Leliana, nor am I weirded out by the fact that she prefers women, though it is frustrating that you can give completely innocuous replies in dialogues and next thing you know companions are talking about you being in a romance with her.  She's also a good fighter and the fact that she wants to change is a good thing.  The puzzling thing is that people accept her willingness to change at face value, but aren't willing to do the same for Zevran.  It's a credit to the writers and to Leliana that her sweet, seductive air is so very convincing that we spend forum time trying to point out the other side.  That girl is a damn good bard.  :happy:

I also am finding it harder to befriend Zevran with my male PC.   I figure my females to be more sympathetic, and the elves especially given their affinity.  Meanwhile, my male PC is smitten with Morrigan and took her magical ring despite some misgiving.  That is bound to be trouble, and deep down he knows it.  So I can understand that sexual dynamic can come into play, even if it's not outright weirdness over Zevran being bisexual.

Modifié par Addai67, 14 février 2010 - 08:48 .

[FierachEredasSoulchiou]

Leliana IS a good bard.



Up until where she's trying to confess that she loves you. =D

[Nonvita]

Addai67 wrote...

Helios969 wrote...

It just occurred to me (sorry if I'm a bit slow,) but if you desecrate the Ashes, how do you save the Arl?

You get to take a pinch before you do so.

It just occurred to me that if Wynne and Leliana were true Andrastians, they would believe in the power of the ashes whether there was dragon's blood on them or not.  After all, Leli kvetsches at you if you give the Redcliffe knights chantry amulets, saying that it has to be faith that saves people.

Heh, once you know Leliana's story, it's possible to see the chilling clues that were along the way.  I just went through the Tower and when you come across Cullen in the magical cage, she says "he's been tortured, and denied food and water- I can tell."  She's speaking from experience, her own as a prisoner no doubt but also because she tortured marks, too.

I don't hate Leliana, nor am I weirded out by the fact that she prefers women, though it is frustrating that you can give completely innocuous replies in dialogues and next thing you know companions are talking about you being in a romance with her.  She's also a good fighter and the fact that she wants to change is a good thing.  The puzzling thing is that people accept her willingness to change at face value, but aren't willing to do the same for Zevran.  It's a credit to the writers and to Leliana that her sweet, seductive air is so very convincing that we spend forum time trying to point out the other side.  That girl is a damn good bard.  :happy:

Isn't there a way that Leliana won't turn against you if she's hardened and you have enough coercion? I've never tried it, but do you know how it works?

I remember her commenting about Cullen and thinking it was really creepy. Zevran's talk about enjoying "the kill" is creepy too, granted, but even the first time I heard it I thought, "This guy is really trying hard to convince himself of this." I mean, we know how young he was sold to the Crows, and we know that he resisted his training for quite awhile and even tried to escape. I think only when he realized that he couldn't escape that he had to find a way to come to terms with his lot in life. But his detailed description of how he enjoys it just sounds like he spent way too much time thinking about it as he tried to find some semblance of meaning in his existence.

I also am finding it harder to befriend Zevran with my male PC.   I figure my females to be more sympathetic, and the elves especially given their affinity.  Meanwhile, my male PC is smitten with Morrigan and took her magical ring despite some misgiving.  That is bound to be trouble, and deep down he knows it.  So I can understand that sexual dynamic can come into play, even if it's not outright weirdness over Zevran being bisexual.

Interestingly, my male friend said he found it easier to befriend Zevran as a male than as a female. He said Zevran flirts less with male characters and so is easier to get along with as a friend. Funny how so many guys act like he pushes his "gayness" all over them...

[natetodamax]

He's bisexual.



I wish he would have survived that fight like he survives when you first meet. I wanted him to be alive when I finish him off.

[Emerald Melios]

Addai67 wrote...
Leliana also wasn't a slave.  She grew up with advantages, and choices.  She speaks pretty casually about using torture and how seduction is usually preferable because it works better.  (Would put a new spin on things if I heard that as a male PC romancing her...)  Zevran also is trying to start a new life, he is just at a different point of that transition than Leliana.  Both of them contemplate returning to it.  Leliana even tells Zevran that they have a lot in common, and she rather warmly welcomes him into your party.  Taking any one of these characters at face value is a mistake, IMO.  There's much more going on with all of them.  Personally I find the cold-bloodedness that you discover in Leliana even creepier for the fact that she has lied about it and puts up a sweet, goody-two-shoes exterior.  Zevran, OTOH, is ruthlessly honest.

Strange, I found that aspect of Leliana to be titillating.

" Dying while in the company of a lovely seductress... tell me that isn't
a good death.
" - Leliana

But really, a great deal of  mine (and others') preference for Leliana over Zevran is that she joins earlier and on much better terms.