48 réponses à ce sujet

[AviramG]

I've battled and destroyed whole armies of darkspawn, abominations, zombies, demons, golems, dwarves, dragons too.

But the most deadly fighters in the DA universe are 3 bands of denerim thugs, apparently..

[prmsntrcrps]

Well it seems like the grunt mobs in the ending are lvl 1 at least if that satisfies your needs. It did make me feel kind of dirty though, using a single blizzard instead of entire armies to crush them all.

[Malecite00]

I KNOW, **** super aggrivating but necessary I guess. The first playthrough as a mage that was the pivotal moment that FORCED me to reset and rebuild my char. The second time I wiped them no prob but man its tough.

[AviramG]

Yeah, I'm in my first playthrough still and I took mage wanting to be arcane warrior. oh, and on Hard difficulty, and I'm taking the weakest party possible because their interaction and storylines have been hyped a lot (alistair, morrigan, leilana)..



I've run through the circle with sten, wynne and alistair and basically breezed through it. what an awsomely powerful party that is..

[Dom Queron]

AviramG wrote...

I've battled and destroyed whole armies of darkspawn, abominations, zombies, demons, golems, dwarves, dragons too.

But the most deadly fighters in the DA universe are 3 bands of denerim thugs, apparently..

Your topic header is wrong, because those 3 bands of thugs are not scaling down, which is your problem

[dimman87]

Yes its completly tragic.. and NO its not nessecary.. this is an RPG, in an rpg the most important element is the character and story line. It makes no sense that your hero - a legendary Grey Warden gets beat up by a band of thugs.. I'm at that spot as well and I've had to load like 20 times. THUGS SHOULD NEVER BE HARD - not even in hard difficulty.. this is an extreme failure. I have no problems with certain boss fights being near impossible and you have to plan your tactics a lot for but I dont want to feel like a lvl 20 WoW Mage trying to kill a lvl 29 Hyena in the barrens. Come on, im casting a ****ing fireball at a band of thugs and I barely scratch them... now I have to wait for a bloody cooldown while getting killed in 5 seconds by their archers.

[Tesslyn]

Usually bioware are pretty good at throwing easily despatched idiots at you to make you feel powerful,heh

[Vaeliorin]

dimman87 wrote...
THUGS SHOULD NEVER BE HARD

Every fight should be hard.  If they're easy, roll over speed bumps, then all they are is a waste of time.

[AviramG]

I have no problem with hard fights, just with ... well, things that are stupid, and it's just stupid

A band of hardened mercenaries, an army of darkspawn, ok... but a band of street thugs all with 16 skills in archery with every shot being scattershot and critical shot? sorry, that's just retarded.



The street thug fight SHOULD be the one where you just go into the street and wipe the floor with them, logically. also it's fun to have a couple of fights where you absolutely dominate just to get a sense of your power.



never liked level scaling, or specifically how bioware tend to apply it, but i suppose its a necessary evil

[T3RMIN8T0R X]

agreed. I also think wolves are far too powerful. I have never played an RPG where wolves were not a beginner level nuissance more than anything else. And, I can hit one 6-7 times with a level 7 rogue using an enchanted long sword and he's still alive. Conversely, I can be bitten 5 times by the damn thing while wearing armor and be killed. And that's on normal difficulty.

[PromisedPain]

The fights on denerim were crazy... i mean, like 20 thugs with crossbows? Using scatteringshots. No good.

I'm playing on normal, guess i'll be trying hard/nightmare next run. I'm not really dying that much.

Modifié par Rivalshow, 07 novembre 2009 - 11:57 .

[Kemor]

True, the dark alleys fights at level 10-12 were insane. If hitting the tank, archers are not much of a problem but to get them to hit the tank is a totally different story...

[AviramG]

I guess what we learn from this is to do denerim first.. :>

[Sheylan]

AviramG wrote...

Yeah, I'm in my first playthrough still and I took mage wanting to be arcane warrior. oh, and on Hard difficulty, and I'm taking the weakest party possible because their interaction and storylines have been hyped a lot (alistair, morrigan, leilana)..

I've run through the circle with sten, wynne and alistair and basically breezed through it. what an awsomely powerful party that is..

That is actualy a realy powerfull party, just focus on healing/control spells for Morrigan (make her a spirit healer at 14)
And make Leliana an archer, Alistair sword+shield warrior and your main a DPS.

[Klosetmonkey]

eh just sleep the archers while you dish out the melee dudes one at a time. I had no trouble with the back alley fights!

[RKahn]

My party is Shale/Dog/Zevran and my main is a Spirit Healer/Shape shifter.



I died my first time on those street thugs. And then I found clever uses of the environment and pulling. There is ALWAYS a corner of some sort, and those corners allow you to bunch up the ranged guys nicely. Then Shale taunts and my main drops walking bomb on one target and virulent walking bomb on another. Kill those 2 and the rest are gone. (along with Zevran due to 100% friendly fire, but that's what Kits are for!)

[cyvaris]

Wolves are the evil incarnate. They are the only enemies I cannot defeat no matter how many times I fight them(luckily they seem to not re-spawn when I reload from my camp). It's kinda funny how the enemies scale. Really I can wipe the floor with anything but punks, bandits, and wolves. Also as an added point enemy mages are incredibly hard to kill. I finally figured out a strategy that works, if they do not know you are there bow snipe them, if they do rush them with your rogue/tank.

[AviramG]

mages you need to do a crushing prison spell (or whatever its called) on, as soon as you see them. kills them all. My arcane warrior does that at the start of each fight where there are mages.



there is a surprisingly large amount of non-circle mages running around.

The impression the lore tries to give is that mages are tightly controlled by the chantry and the templars are brutally effective and so on and so forth but I've met and killed like over a hundred mages so far

[TheWabbit]

This is why KOTOR and NWN are far superior. The game mechanics and storyline worked much better. This game is interesting and the characters are deep but the game detracts from them because you are not a hero like Aragorn, Legolas or Drizzt Do'Urden (of DnD fame) but just some schmuck who needs to grind it out to get through the levels.



Bioware should have hired the guys who made Mount & Blade for the combat mechanics.

[intrepidemise]

RPGs are supposed to be about character DEVELOPMENT. You sink time in, learn more of the story, and grow in power. Sure, boss fights should need good tactics and good preparation, but every single fight being difficult isn't fun, it's ANNOYING. It's gotten to the point where I DREAD leveling up because I know every other enemy I encounter will also level up, making leveling virtually pointless. Why would I want to do it? To get new armor or weapons that will do the same relative damage to my enemies? Level scaling was BS in Oblivion and it's BS in every other RPG I've played. The mod community should NOT have to come out with a level-scaling mod in order for this game to be enjoyable past level 7 or so.

[Serenity84]

There is a limit to level scaling.



At the end you have no trouble with ogres unless maybe you're fighting two lieutenants at once. While the one in the Tower of Ishal is a huge challenge. Normal darkspawn at the end are level 10 and can be killed in one hit

[Onlyasandwich]

Pulling, stuns, and bombs. These solve most problems when used strategically, mage or no.



Bombs are absurd in this game. Every element is on a different cooldown. Goodbye wolves, goodbye grouped up archers in just a few seconds. Boom fwoosh zap.

[Dex1701]

If they didn't level scale the enemies the player would be forced to approach the various areas of the game in a set order, and then everyone would whine about not having freedom to do things in the order they want to, and you'd need a walkthrough or a lot of trial-and-error to even figure out what that order was.

There would be a lot of trying things out, realizing you're not strong enough, and planning to come back later.  This is fun to a point, but not if you have to approach the entire game that way.  Honestly, I think people would hate that more than the level scaling.

I don't think the scaling in DA:O is too bad. It would be nice to see some encounters tethered to some kind of random range to add some variety, though.  If you want to see an example of truly idiotic level scaling look no further than vanilla Oblivion.

I just did the first two of the "back alley" fights at level 12 with Allistair, Leliana, and Wynne. They were challenging, but not that awful. My main character is a mage with the entire fire branch of the Primal tree and the entire force field branch of the Spirit tree.

Between those spells and some healing support from Wynne I was able to dispatch those thugs pretty handily on Hard...only reloading once across both of the battles. It takes some planning (the stuns from the archers are really annoying), but you can think your way through it.

Modifié par Dex1701, 02 décembre 2009 - 12:47 .

[Seeker341]

The strange thing about the Denerim thugs is that later on you'll find most encounters to be much easier than those. So even if they do scale, they seem to be rated higher than other encounters which lore-wise would seem to be far more powerful.

[thinker029]

What I'm hearing is this darkspawn-slaughtering hero-type isn't smart enough to take cover when there are a dozen archers trying to pepper him