1118 réponses à ce sujet

[RPGlover732]

my entire brain is saying " bioware screwed your main PC over, dont buy it!"

but my gut says "bioware rules, they wouldnt leave US people out to dry like this"

[KnightofPhoenix]

RPGlover732 wrote...

my entire brain is saying " bioware screwed your main PC over, dont buy it!"
but my gut says "bioware rules, they wouldnt leave US people out to dry like this"

*insert silly cliche here*
"And what does your heart tell you Glover?"

[RPGlover732]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

RPGlover732 wrote...

my entire brain is saying " bioware screwed your main PC over, dont buy it!"
but my gut says "bioware rules, they wouldnt leave US people out to dry like this"

*insert silly cliche here*
"And what does your heart tell you Glover?"

 
that i need to stop playing video games and talking on forums and start working out or it will give up on me... oh well i still got 4 more playthroughs to do

[MalikCaligulaBey]

Has bioware actually come out and said that it is impossible to import a save from a character who made the ultimate sacrifice and start as the Orlesian? Or, are people just succumbing to mass hysteria or something? I understand the concern, I'd be pretty pissed too if they wouldn't let you keep your decisions as a dead character who wishes to play as the Orlesian but this doesn't seem like something bioware would do, particularly because it should be very easy to just import those decisions. o_0

[Korvayer]

Fernando Melo wrote...

Can you import the world 'state', but start new in Awakening as the Orlesian Cmdr?  No.  The world 'state' only exists and lives on as part of your character's choices - most of the reactivity to events and choices in Origins would simply not make sense if it wasn't 'you' that did it.

-- Korvayer. Bursting bubbles since 2009.

Modifié par Korvayer, 18 février 2010 - 06:57 .

[Shady314]

Feraele wrote...

Hostetler wrote...

okie doke - my 2 cents worth - no one is putting a gun to your head to purchase this expansion - if you cannot get your mind around what they are doing for the "ultimate sacrifice" ending do not buy it - honestly - I am as story driven as most of you folks are. whole reason I loved FF VIII, and love BG series. but sometimes things are not as easy as folks would like to think.  I am positive Bioware did it this way because that was the only way to make it work at this point in time.  My dead GW's are gonna stay that way .. dead - I will not import them into the expansion.  I am pretty sure most of you that have dead wardens also have other endings with different chars, so in the end you are gonna purchase this just to see what can be done with the other chars you made.

Sorry I am bound into my pre-order...I can't cancel it, I can't refuse it thats the site rules where I pre-ordered

.    I pre-ordered prior to knowing about this latest development that was announced maybe 4 days ago.

So I have to carry through.   That doesn't mean I can't voice whats wrong with that picture.   Does it?

Which site is this? That's not really allowed most places (in the US anyways). Just contact them and demand a refund. They'll cave quickly. At worst you can inform the credit card company you are being refused a refund for an item you have not even received and get a chargeback.

[Shady314]

I would have thought the answer was plain from reading the thread. Although, admittedly, a significant number of errant posts have obscured matters.

It's not plain at all. It seems the devs said SOMETHING but that this was interpreted to mean something that was not necessarily what they actually said. Can you supply a quote?

The bold section is really an incorrect characterisation of the situation. What people want, I think, is coherent story progression and continuity.

And they believe the means to achieve this is by continuing their dead warden's story through the new Orlesian character.... So what I said and what you bolded was completely accurate.

I am not sure why it is "silly", especially given that you have already acknowledged that it is "desirable". And as to why people are "mad" (I am not mad, simply bemused, as I suspect others are), well the source of this debate has been explained over and over again in this thread and in one or two other threads. Basically it stems from the general claim made very early on by Bioware that decisions made in the first game would be reflected in the expansion and the subsequent dismay when it was indicated that in the case of a US ending this would only be accomplished by bringing a dead character back to life.

So because I want something it can't be silly? I find it silly because the arguments are spurious.
Take for example your claim this is all about "story cohesion and continuity."
I think a character being dead and ending the story makes for pretty fantastic story cohesion and continuity. Dead=THE END

It seems silly to me because I think what I am really reading is a resistance to Bioware creating canon specifically the Dark Ritual. Maybe not but that's the way many of these so called arguments come off.

[Behindyounow]

Ok, its fine with me that people are able to carry on playing as their dead character.



But, why cant we play as the Orlesian with the dead characters choices? I dont want the canon storyline forced on me.

[spottyblanket]

People already did..why do you think the Devs announced that if we didn't mind our dead wardens walking around again..neither did they. 

Thats fine said before I don't begrudge someone playing THEIR GAME THAT WAY.

I just think we should have been given a cohesive carry over..with a short explanatory blurb ...to the new Orlesian warden.  Would have been enough to cover the plot hole and go on to play the Orlesian..without any further ado.

If thats the case, why not just start the game as an Orlesian Grey warden?  No need to carry data over.

There wouldn't be a plot hole, after all many grey wardens come and go and die.

[Feraele]

spottyblanket wrote...

People already did..why do you think the Devs announced that if we didn't mind our dead wardens walking around again..neither did they. 

Thats fine said before I don't begrudge someone playing THEIR GAME THAT WAY.

I just think we should have been given a cohesive carry over..with a short explanatory blurb ...to the new Orlesian warden.  Would have been enough to cover the plot hole and go on to play the Orlesian..without any further ado.

If thats the case, why not just start the game as an Orlesian Grey warden?  No need to carry data over.

There wouldn't be a plot hole, after all many grey wardens come and go and die.

Do I have to explain this all over again..we are told nothing is carried over from the dead warden.

Ultimate sacrifice has no history...nothing.   Think Ferret mentioned that a couple days ago.......even though we were told a month ago that our choices would have some sort of effect or meaning in Awakening.

Ultimate sacrifice also has no meaning..does not exist..if we import the dead warden...because that means you have to play that dead warden ..instead of importing dead warden, and getting say a small indication from Ohgren or whomever...that ...that warden died killing the Archdemon and saving Ferelden.

Wouldn't it make sense to have some small history carried over..in the form of a conversation to inform the New Warden what happened to the old one.

The way they have it set up now...there is no connection whatsoever between the old warden and the new one.

And NO we are not advocating...import dead warden..and whoop suddenly the Orlesian is somehow taken over by the dead warden.  I keep seeing people say that..and its a total misinterpretation.

Dead warden remains dead..but is given credit for killing the archdemon and saving Ferelden...as per the cutscene that exists with that information.

The cutscene plays as this:   the king or queen is standing over your dead body on the bier,  he or she states that you will be entombed honourably along with the other four grey wardens that died the same way..killing the previous archdemons.

  They are all buried at Weisshaupt.     The monarch also states that a large statue will be erected in honour of the self-sacrifice of this Grey warden...at the entrance of the New Keep in Amaranthine.

This is the plot hole I am talking about.

Why is it okay with the Dev team to miraculously revive a dead warden and get rid of the Ultimate Sacrifice tag....and say oh you didn't really die?  If you didn't really die..then you didn't really kill the Archdemon and save Ferelden either.

Your friends didnt' really have a funeral for you...and you weren't entombed at Weisshaupt.   No honorable recognition for what you did........instead you are forgotten.   No statue at the new keep.

We still don't have a choice if we decide to let the dead warden remain dead...because not one piece of information is carried forward to inform the Orlesian Grey Warden..about what happened to the former Ferelden grey warden....again Ultimate Sacrifice is denied..by not being included in any information going forward.

That constititutes a plot hole.   And..makes the Ultimate Sacrifice ending an absolute farce.

And frankly...I think I have repeated all this about 20 times so far..sometimes to the same people..over and over.

Maybe its time for some reading and understanding..instead? 

[spottyblanket]

I get the plot holes and everything. I meant more, the option is given to carry over your old character. Yes without equipment and such (which I feel is more reason to complain, though I kinda like starting out with nothing tbh). But if bioware has given ALL players option to carry over their character, then they cannot turn round and say except for the US ones. Because people would complain. Because bringing back from the dead is a major plotline in the game, I imagine it will affect the game if you bring over the dead warden somewhere along the line--we don't know everything yet. Until you play the game yourself, you can't make all the assumptions. Play it first.

[Dave of Canada]

Oh I see how it'll go.



If you sacrifice yourself, you get +2 approval with Alistair and Wynne but if you sleep with Morrigan to perserve yourself you'll get +4 approval with Loghain and Oghren.

[darrenr22]

Shady314 wrote...

It's not plain at all. It seems the devs said SOMETHING but that this was interpreted to mean something that was not necessarily what they actually said. Can you supply a quote?

It is not plain to you. That much is obvious. I do not think there is any real need for me to go searching for a quote since the issue is grounded in the initial intimation that decisions in the first game would be reflected in the expansion, an intimation which I think everyone is already aware of. It is enough for the purposes of this debate that that initial intimation did not say "except for a significant caveat with regard to ultimate sacrifice endings". And even then this debate would still have merit since what this is really all about is what Bioware should do, and what a significant number of players would like them to do, given that they are already committed to have some kind of decision-reflection in the expansion.

You are still preoccupied with whether the option under discussion here was promised or whether Bioware are obligated to implement this option. But as I have already explained, more than once in this thread, it is not particularly relevant whether this specific option was promised or whether Bioware are obligated.

And they believe the means to achieve this is by continuing their dead warden's story through the new Orlesian character.... So what I said and what you bolded was completely accurate.

Any situation can fall under more than one description. Your characterisation did not appropriately reflect the nature of the issue under discussion given the concerns upon which this discussion is based.

So because I want something it can't be silly? I find it silly because the arguments are spurious.

You appear to be confused about the difference between "desirable" and "desired". I stated it was desirable. A rational person cannot agree, as you did in your previous post, that something is "desirable" and then disparage it as "silly" on pain of contradiction.

It seems silly to me because I think what I am really reading is a resistance to Bioware creating canon specifically the Dark Ritual. Maybe not but that's the way many of these so called arguments come off.

I do not think the issue of canon has much to do with this debate. Personally I have no problem at all with Bioware creating a canon for Dragon Age. Bioware have already said they are implementing a form of decision-reflection in the expansion; this debate is about the exact nature and extent of that implementation. Not about canon.

[RPGlover732]

I really want Bioware to come out and just tell us everything. we have clues, but i want Bioware to so on this forum or a big upset forum about the US what is going on for sure without a doubt

[Alexor Destroyer of Worlds]

I don't care much. The only people who lose in this are the ones stupid enough to kill their character.



No offense meant.

[Dave of Canada]

Alexor Destroyer of Worlds wrote...

I don't care much. The only people who lose in this are the ones stupid enough to kill their character.

No offense meant.

Yes, we're stupid because we prefer one ending over the other one. Riiight.

[habitat 67]

Alexor Destroyer of Worlds wrote...

I don't care much. The only people who lose in this are the ones stupid enough to kill their character.

No offense meant.

You are right though. 

[Reaverwind]

Alexor Destroyer of Worlds wrote...

I don't care much. The only people who lose in this are the ones stupid enough to kill their character.

No offense meant.

Hmmm, really? Perhaps the one whose intelligence should be called into question is the entity not collecting my cold, hard cash, after making it rather clear that story is no longer paramount in their new "mission-focused" expansion?

[SwordsmanofShadow]

www.giantbomb.com/news/dragon-age-origins-awakening-hands-on/1876/

From the Press Release thread; in one of the articles it said importing a dead Warden leads to a retcon style switch. Meaning your history got a little rewrite. Glad to know what ending to choose now.

Modifié par SwordsmanofShadow, 19 février 2010 - 05:14 .

[Lord_Darkmoon]

Why is there no official word on this?

[Arbiter Libera]

Indeed. Glad I'm not the only one who has noticed that devs have conveniently avoided this subject.

[RurouniSaiya-jin]

Lord_Darkmoon wrote...

Why is there no official word on this?

On what? Why you can't use your dead warden's decisions with a new character? Flip back a few pages in the thread and you'll see they covered this a month ago.

[Feraele]

spottyblanket wrote...

I get the plot holes and everything. I meant more, the option is given to carry over your old character. Yes without equipment and such (which I feel is more reason to complain, though I kinda like starting out with nothing tbh). But if bioware has given ALL players option to carry over their character, then they cannot turn round and say except for the US ones. Because people would complain. Because bringing back from the dead is a major plotline in the game, I imagine it will affect the game if you bring over the dead warden somewhere along the line--we don't know everything yet. Until you play the game yourself, you can't make all the assumptions. Play it first.

What? I have put in almost a thousand hours playing this game..STILL don't have all the achievements..all story endings..YET.    Twelve characters..9 were deleted and I started over due to bugs and glitches, but kept all achievement history.

Did you read the official explanation?  

Fernando Melo wrote...

Can you import the world 'state', but start new in Awakening as the Orlesian Cmdr?  No.  The world 'state' only exists and lives on as part of your character's choices - most of the reactivity to events and choices in Origins would simply not make sense if it wasn't 'you' that did it.

What they haven't considered at all ..is its NOT necessary to import the whole world state in order to give a nod to your dead and sacrificed warden.

Story wise all it should necessitate is:   "Someone (Ohgren?)" talks to the new grey warden, states something..about the former grey warden dying to save Ferelden..by killing the Archdemon.

In the lead up to the whole kill the Archdemon thing...aren't we given to understand that it is EACH warden's duty to do that...that is the main purpose why we do the taint.    That if we are in the vicinity one of us has to attempt to bring the Archdemon down..and destroy him utterly.

If we don't do that..Ferelden falls...pretty much.

So again, bringing the warden back to life...kind of smashes that idea......UNLESS they did the Dark Ritual, but in that case there would be no death, no funeral involved...

So they are willing to give "some" players an easy out.    Why is that more important, than a small conversation that gives the Ferelden Grey Warden some credit for doing his/her job?

Modifié par Feraele, 19 février 2010 - 01:28 .

[wowpwnslol]

Stop whining. Bioware cannot make a game with 1000 options for every player. Maybe they don't recognize the ending where you threw away your character like a tool as canon? That's within their right if they want to develop Awakening story that involved Morrigan's involvement to keep your character alive.This place is getting worse than WoW forums. Every second topic is QQ about DLC items and others are just plain nerd raging. How about suggestions that will fix many of DA's flawed combat and balanced mechanics?

Modifié par wowpwnslol, 19 février 2010 - 01:27 .

[Feraele]

wowpwnslol wrote...

Stop whining. Bioware cannot make a game with 1000 options for every player. Maybe they don't recognize the ending where you threw away your character like a tool as canon? That's within their right if they want to develop Awakening story that involved Morrigan's involvement to keep your character alive.This place is getting worse than WoW forums. Every second topic is QQ about DLC items and others are just plain nerd raging. How about suggestions that will fix many of DA's flawed combat and balanced mechanics?

I think perhaps you need to look up the definition of "whining'.....really.. a dictionary is your friend.   Reading comprehension is also your friend.