140 réponses à ce sujet

[Varenus Luckmann]

What annoys me is that I HAVE to recruit a bunch of people before Horizon launches, and I HAVE to finish Horizon before I can recruit the second bunch of people.

I would've wanted to go and recruit Tali, or Thane, straight away.

[Sullax]

In my opinion this kind-of simulation of urgency was the right step of this game.



In ME1 you could make as much sidequests you wanted and have a good time with the elevators, while Saren was getting nearer and nearer to his destination.



It was like Shepard as Turian Councillor...:



Turian Councillor: "Shepard, you have been idle for too long! You have to find Saren and bring him to justice or he will be ahead of you and be a real threat to the galaxy"



*disconnect*



Joker: "But Commander, don't we have to really stop Saren from getting the Reapers?"



Shepard: "Ah yes, "Reapers"! Set course for Noveria, Joker. I wanna go skiing."

[DigitalMaster37]

tonnactus wrote...

That has nothing to do with a roleplaying game.They throw the player in difficult missions,if they prepared for that or not.(Weapons,abilities)

Hopefully they remove that for Mass Effect 3.

I 100% disagree. Other than a few missions you are given full freedom to choose your own missions and in whatever order. To me it sold the time is running out theme running in the game. If you could slouch your way, it becomes unrealistic, then there goes the immersion.

Why is it whenever people complain, they always forget to weigh the pros and cons of the thing they are complaining about.

You really have to look at why that feature was added other than why you think it frustrated you. It's there to carry on the narative in a believable way.

[inversevideo]

Varenus Luckmann wrote...

What annoys me is that I HAVE to recruit a bunch of people before Horizon launches, and I HAVE to finish Horizon before I can recruit the second bunch of people.

I would've wanted to go and recruit Tali, or Thane, straight away.

I do see where you are coming from. But consider that it would cheapen the 'feel' of the game, if you could know in advance the details of every attack, and be prepared with just the right folks to solve the issue.

This would not happen, in reality right?

We don't know for sure, what will occur to us when we step out our door everyday.

The Collectors are not waiting for us to assemble our team, they are going about their task, of abducting humans, while we are preparing our counter-strike. So along the way, we have to hit back with whatever resources we have available at the time.

Think 'The Battle of the Bulge', or ' The 300'.  If those troops could only have known exactly what they would have faced, they could have been better prepared. But they did not, and they were forced to make do with what they had.

Or as Clint Eastwood  'gunney' would say, "Adapt, Survive, Overcome'.

[Tooneyman]

I agree I like to do things at my own place in games. Not when they tell me to. The BEEzZZ! When it comes down to it. I didn't like being thrown into horizon after I did a side quest that was bull crap. Also the whole IFF was annoying too. They should have giving you more time with the Legion thing. I wanted to use him as a teammate with other quests, but instead ended up only using him for the last mission really and his loyality quest, told boo!

[Madecologist]

Varenus Luckmann wrote...

What annoys me is that I HAVE to recruit a bunch of people before Horizon launches, and I HAVE to finish Horizon before I can recruit the second bunch of people.

I would've wanted to go and recruit Tali, or Thane, straight away.

Tali's Dossier was in the first batch. She was moved to the second batch to make sure people don't just go Garrus/Tali from the start and ignore the ME2 newbies.

[babylonfreak]

Tooneyman wrote...

I agree I like to do things at my own place in games. Not when they tell me to. The BEEzZZ! When it comes down to it. I didn't like being thrown into horizon after I did a side quest that was bull crap. Also the whole IFF was annoying too. They should have giving you more time with the Legion thing. I wanted to use him as a teammate with other quests, but instead ended up only using him for the last mission really and his loyality quest, told boo!

If you have Tali's loyalty quest in your journal you can do both Tali and Legion's loyalty quests before the Collectors ambush you. I like to bring them on their respective tasks because I want to see the Geth and the Quarians view each other in their natural element. They are both "ambassadors" to their people. And the reaction to Legion on the Migrant Fleet is worth it, That said, yes, I wish I had more time with him. I love me some Legion.

Edit That was slightly off-topic. On topic, I liked it. Roleplayin is NOT just about *actions*, sometimes it is about *reactions*. In war there are battles you can plan for, where you can maneuver and get your troops ready and get all your provisions and weapons in place before you launch an attack. Sometimes you are caught with your pants around your ankle. I think Joker said it best: "Oh ****!"

Modifié par babylonfreak, 19 février 2010 - 04:51 .

[Dizzy473]

tonnactus wrote...

If you want urgency in Mass Effect 1,you could just do only the main missions.Problem solved.You could play the first game like you want.Your choice.Not the same in the second game where shepardt is just one dumb puppet,who
is send in one trap after another.
Also,the loyality missions are a contradiction to the urgency.

The difference is game and story.  Yes I could play through all the main missions and nothing else.....still no feeling I had to or else.  The story had no sense of urgency.

In ME2 avoiding the trigger points and doing side quests instead is simple and if someone is dragged into the "forced " missions unprepared...well maybe next playthrough they do it differently.  Having said that it makes for a hell of a story if you scrape through by the skin of your teeth everytime.

I also said (you may have missed it) having the choice to do the mission now or not doing it straightaway and facing a consequence would have been the ideal. There's your choice, not a dumb puppet anymore.

I can see what you mean by the loyalty missions contradicting the urgency but I honestly didn't feel like that when playing the game.  Maybe it was the script and TIM constantly going on about "build the team, heres more dossiers, build the team" but it felt like time was marching on.  Its just a feeling, not a game mechanic.

[tonnactus]

Well,today i found out that i even couldnt do as many n7 mission as i want.I dont do any loyality quests.I dont even recruit samara yet.But i still had to go to the collector ship.

Yes,great,urgency.

[ElektroDragon]

I'm bring this thread back to the forefront, because YES, it is a COMPLETELY STUPID idea. If I wanted their so called "urgency" I'll play Dead Rising with its idiotic time limit for completing the game. I only had 1/5 Sniper Rifle upgrades for my Infiltrator, and I only got to do 1 loyalty mission. I had just found out where to get more sniper upgrades, when lo and behold, the game forces me into the Collector Ship mission, the Galaxy Map is disabled, and my last manual save is from 2 hours ago. Supposedly the Collector Ship is one of the hardest areas of the game, and I am underprepared. This is absolute garbage, BioWare. This not an RPG anymore. Even Fable is giving us more choices nowadays.

There are no "pros" at all to how they chose to implement this.  For me, the immersion is actually ruined.  I can't think of a single RPG that forces your hand in this way.  Stop defending poor design decisions, guys!  These decisions are part of a misguided approach to expand their audience.  I don't understand how the forced missions, and whole "mission" structure expands the audience.  It just cheapens the experience and alienates the core fanbase.

Mass Effect 1 was perfection on a disc. Mass Effect 2 destroyed most of what was good about the Mass Effect 1, and just added some better production values. But NOT a better story, dialogue, or structure. All these have been downgraded.

Modifié par ElektroDragon, 08 juin 2010 - 07:26 .

[Sereaph502]

Go play a sandbox game like fallout 3 or oblivion if you want to do whatever you want whenever you want without anyone saying otherwise. RPGs have a main story/plot that you are meant to follow, with sidequests on the side for people who want to increase their playtime. An RPG is not a "do whatever you want and we won't ever bother you" type of game. What you're looking for is a sandbox game.

So from what I'm seeing your whole argument/rant is pointless as you aren't even talking about RPGs.


Also holy crap dude, DON'T necropost these threads!  Not everyone reads until the very end to check the date of the last post >_>

Modifié par Sereaph502, 08 juin 2010 - 07:31 .

[ElektroDragon]

I've been playing RPGs since 1987, Seraph, and this is the FIRST RPG that FORCES me to do a certain thing at a certain time without the ability to put it off. Guaranteed freedom is NOT exclusive to sandbox games, your argument is ridiculous. Fallout 3 and Oblivion are closer to a true RPG than Mass Effect 2 is... they are not sandbox games. Sandbox games are games like GTAIV, Red Dead Redemption, Crackdown, and Mercernaries. It's fine to prevent progression in the main story or game until a certain goal/quest is attended to. It's NOT fine to completely block you off from doing anything else until you complete the quest they throw at you without warning. That's not an RPG, that's a Call of Duty style action game, which is something I DO NOT want from BioWare.



As for necroposting, would you rather I start a new thread on the subject? I'd be blasted in 10 seconds by 10 people telling me to search the topics and that a thread already exists. Can't win.



Of course, I shouldn't have expected anything but a BioWare friendly response, as everyone who ever disagrees with BioWare has probably met the wrath of the mods at some point and left this site for others where they can state their opinions more freely.

[Onyx Jaguar]

Oh please, seriously the Mods here do not act in such a way.

[Heimdall]

Way I see it, it only adds to the story. RPG =/= I-do-whatever-the-Hell-I-want It gives you choices but as in reality there are times when you have only one chance that you can't pass up because it may not come around again. It gives appropriate urgency, something I found lacking in ME1 despite supposedly chasing a madman hellbent on the destruction of humanity, and in Dragon Ag where the Blight makes no progress whatsoever no matter how long you run around across the country.

[InvaderErl]

If people aren't complaining that the story lacks urgency by letting us wander around the galaxy while important things are happening they're complaining that the story is too urgent by not letting us wander the entire galaxy while important things are happening.



Additionally, Bioware NEEDED to do a cut off point to make the 2 disc system work efficiently.

[Heimdall]

InvaderErl wrote...

If people aren't complaining that the story lacks urgency by letting us wander around the galaxy while important things are happening they're complaining that the story is too urgent by not letting us wander the entire galaxy while important things are happening.

Additionally, Bioware NEEDED to do a cut off point to make the 2 disc system work efficiently.

Damned if they do damned if they don't