176 réponses à ce sujet

[Ecael]

He can't be talking to Shepard; he says it even if Shepard is dead.

YOU HAVE SUCCEEDED. WE DON'T NEED TO FIND ANOTHER WAY. CONTINUING CONTROL.

[amat3rasu]

The way I see it, it means more like, "You may have won this time..but now I'm gonna bring out the big guns. And when we do, you will fall"



...something like that. Anyway, Harbinger is a sore loser.

[Ferocious7]

Tyreal42a wrote...
2. The Reaper might have been directly controlling them, but it's still having to use something else's body and unable to act at its full power. If you haven't noticed, they tend to look upon organic beings as servants or puppets. It could have meant the Collector's'weak bodies were inadequate for its controlling needs.

That would be a very poor reason being you never battle the General, not once.  His body did everything the Harbinger commanded, he had control.   The harbinger failed no matter how you slice it.   It's organics vs organics, it's not like shepard is made of titanium and shoots lasers out of his eyes.

[Internet Kraken]

I thought it was irrational anger, meant to show that the Reapers are not the cold, emotionless machines many believe them to be. Rather they are arrogant space squids with emotions just like us.

[Tyreal42a]

Ferocious7 wrote...

Tyreal42a wrote...
2. The Reaper might have been directly controlling them, but it's still having to use something else's body and unable to act at its full power. If you haven't noticed, they tend to look upon organic beings as servants or puppets. It could have meant the Collector's'weak bodies were inadequate for its controlling needs.

That would be a very poor reason being you never battle the General, not once.  His body did everything the Harbinger commanded, he had control.   The harbinger failed no matter how you slice it.   It's organics vs organics, it's not like shepard is made of titanium and shoots lasers out of his eyes.

Not the general, but he controlled about 100 of the collectors trying to kill you. And failed. You have to think his odds of killing you would have improved had he been there to use his own glorious form rather than having to work via squishy, useless collector drones. So yes, their forms failed him.

[Ferocious7]

Tyreal42a wrote...

Ferocious7 wrote...

Tyreal42a wrote...
2. The Reaper might have been directly controlling them, but it's still having to use something else's body and unable to act at its full power. If you haven't noticed, they tend to look upon organic beings as servants or puppets. It could have meant the Collector's'weak bodies were inadequate for its controlling needs.

That would be a very poor reason being you never battle the General, not once.  His body did everything the Harbinger commanded, he had control.   The harbinger failed no matter how you slice it.   It's organics vs organics, it's not like shepard is made of titanium and shoots lasers out of his eyes.

Not the general, but he controlled about 100 of the collectors trying to kill you. And failed. You have to think his odds of killing you would have improved had he been there to use his own glorious form rather than having to work via squishy, useless collector drones. So yes, their forms failed him.

No, he failed choosing them, if he is all knowing and all powerful, he would have known that they aren't powerful enough.  That specific scene doesn't show anyone but the general, and regardless they were fully functional and able to fight... the harbinger absolutely failed there is no doubt about it.  He had control, they weren't unhealthy.. and if they were he shouldn't have chosen them.  That's his fault.   Ultimately one being failed, the Harbinger.  Sugar coat it all you want, Harbinger failed. 

Go watch some youtube clips a few times, the more I watch it the more I realize the Harbinger fails.. so if he is blaming it on someone else, he is a moron... which would make sense being he still continues to underestimate Shepard.

[Volourn]

He's talking to Shepard, the universe, and the General. He's telling you it doesn't matter what you 'accomplished' in ME2 as in the end you will still lose. He's taunting the player, and saying resistance is futile that you cannot win that you are doomed. Blow the base up or not, it don't matter. Victory is his no matter what.

[Jayce]

ruleonecardio wrote...

That along with just about every line of dialogue that Harbinger says is directed at Shepard. I doubt that if you destroy an entire race of beings, re purpose them as controllable slaves, and mind control them to do what you want, that you will even bother to utter a single word to them, lol.

It can't be directed at Shepard for the simple reason Harbinger doesn't say it until after Shepard and the Normandy have got the heck out of dodge, just before the collector base detonates.

The only things on screen are the Holo of Harbinger and the Collector General and as its Harbinger speaking....

Modifié par Jayce F, 15 février 2010 - 06:49 .

[Ferocious7]

Jayce F wrote...

ruleonecardio wrote...

That along with just about every line of dialogue that Harbinger says is directed at Shepard. I doubt that if you destroy an entire race of beings, re purpose them as controllable slaves, and mind control them to do what you want, that you will even bother to utter a single word to them, lol.

It can't be directed at Shepard for the simple reason Harbinger doesn't say it until after Shepard and the Normandy have got the heck out of dodge, just before the collector base detonates.

The only things on screen are the Holo of Harbinger and the Collector General and as its Harbinger speaking....

Yeah.... I think he's speaking to the General and the Collector's... however, if he is... he's a hypocrite and can't accept his own controlling-flaws.  LOL

Imagine being a race car driver, and then telling the car it failed to win the race.   Well, if it wasn't fast enough, good enough, etc... and then why drive that car?   Not to mention, if you are the one controlling the car, you are ultimately responsible unless there's some mechanical issues.. which there were not for the Collector's.

I can't wait to shut the Harbinger up.... his/her/their/its fate is sealed, it's only a matter of time.   =)   Let them fly all the way over to Shep's side of the galaxy only to get owned.   It's like someone driving over to your house and only to get beat up by you.  LOL

Modifié par Ferocious7, 15 février 2010 - 06:56 .

[sergio71785]

That's what EA would have said to Bioware if ME2 wasn't successful.

[Sir Ulrich Von Lichenstien]

The first part of the speech before that line IS directed at Shepherd, whereas I believe that part is directed at the Collectors.

The first part is...

"Human, you have changed nothing, your species has the attention of those infinitly your greater, that which you know as reapers are your salvation through destruction."

Harbinger doesn't say the "You have failed..." bit until the camera is well and truly on the Collector General just as he is about to get fried.. so it is definitly aimed at the Collectors.

So yeah, Harbinger is being a bit of an idiot seeing as he was the mastermind behind this plan.

Modifié par Sir Ulrich Von Lichenstien, 15 février 2010 - 07:02 .

[newcomplex]

Guys your opinion is completely illogical. Shepherd, at the time of the dialogue, clearly cannot see the Collector general, or anything else except his immediate surrounding. He/She is only able to hear the collectors disembodied voice. The only assumption shep could make is that the Collector General is addressing him. Since this game is a ****ing role playing game, the only way your theory could be true is if you were to roleplay the collector general (who isn't even sentient, according to Mordin) From sheps perspective, the collector general is acknowledging him. This game is designed completely around sheps perspective, except a short sequence involving joker. Since this is fiction, the only logical conclusion one can draw is that harbringer is addressing you, the player, through shepherd.


Then theirs the matter of RIGHT BEFORE the piece of dialogue, the Harbringer specifically says "human".    Then theirs the fact that talking to collectors is like talking to a gun.    

Modifié par newcomplex, 15 février 2010 - 07:00 .

[Ferocious7]

sergio71785 wrote...

That's what EA would have said to Bioware if ME2 wasn't successful.

I think EA is lucky to have Bioware... however, they both benefit because EA has deep pockets if it's a project they believe in... and you'd be a fool not to put your money backing Bioware games, let alone Mass Effect 2.

[Tyreal42a]

Ferocious7 wrote...

Tyreal42a wrote...

Ferocious7 wrote...

Tyreal42a wrote...
2. The Reaper might have been directly controlling them, but it's still having to use something else's body and unable to act at its full power. If you haven't noticed, they tend to look upon organic beings as servants or puppets. It could have meant the Collector's'weak bodies were inadequate for its controlling needs.

That would be a very poor reason being you never battle the General, not once.  His body did everything the Harbinger commanded, he had control.   The harbinger failed no matter how you slice it.   It's organics vs organics, it's not like shepard is made of titanium and shoots lasers out of his eyes.

Not the general, but he controlled about 100 of the collectors trying to kill you. And failed. You have to think his odds of killing you would have improved had he been there to use his own glorious form rather than having to work via squishy, useless collector drones. So yes, their forms failed him.

No, he failed choosing them, if he is all knowing and all powerful, he would have known that they aren't powerful enough.  That specific scene doesn't show anyone but the general, and regardless they were fully functional and able to fight... the harbinger absolutely failed there is no doubt about it.  He had control, they weren't unhealthy.. and if they were he shouldn't have chosen them.  That's his fault.   Ultimately one being failed, the Harbinger.  Sugar coat it all you want, Harbinger failed. 

Go watch some youtube clips a few times, the more I watch it the more I realize the Harbinger fails.. so if he is blaming it on someone else, he is a moron... which would make sense being he still continues to underestimate Shepard.

Knows a lot and is powerful. I don't think it's ever mentioned they're 'All powerful,' though. They're arrogant enough, but I don't recall them outright making claim to that. Harbinger definitely failed, but so did the collectors. Every action that fails doesn't have to be the responsibility of one being. The collectors were modified and enslaved, but they still definitely seemed to have some awareness and action. It's possible there was only so much he could do with their base organic forms. That's still them failing him, even if a good portion of the failure was his own.  If he is claiming to be a god, of course he's not going to admit his own part of the problem, he's going to blame it on his minions, no matter how accurate it may be. Like a good villian should.

And he could easily have been referring to all the collector race in general while just talking to him. Heck, he does it with humanity through shepard often enough. Anyway, it just reinforces that particular conversation was definitely not for Shepard, to me.

[Ferocious7]

He's probably talking to Oprah... I think she had Harbinger on because he made a large donation to charity.

[newcomplex]

Tyreal42a wrote...

Ferocious7 wrote...

Tyreal42a wrote...

Ferocious7 wrote...

Tyreal42a wrote...
2. The Reaper might have been directly controlling them, but it's still having to use something else's body and unable to act at its full power. If you haven't noticed, they tend to look upon organic beings as servants or puppets. It could have meant the Collector's'weak bodies were inadequate for its controlling needs.

That would be a very poor reason being you never battle the General, not once.  His body did everything the Harbinger commanded, he had control.   The harbinger failed no matter how you slice it.   It's organics vs organics, it's not like shepard is made of titanium and shoots lasers out of his eyes.

Not the general, but he controlled about 100 of the collectors trying to kill you. And failed. You have to think his odds of killing you would have improved had he been there to use his own glorious form rather than having to work via squishy, useless collector drones. So yes, their forms failed him.

No, he failed choosing them, if he is all knowing and all powerful, he would have known that they aren't powerful enough.  That specific scene doesn't show anyone but the general, and regardless they were fully functional and able to fight... the harbinger absolutely failed there is no doubt about it.  He had control, they weren't unhealthy.. and if they were he shouldn't have chosen them.  That's his fault.   Ultimately one being failed, the Harbinger.  Sugar coat it all you want, Harbinger failed. 

Go watch some youtube clips a few times, the more I watch it the more I realize the Harbinger fails.. so if he is blaming it on someone else, he is a moron... which would make sense being he still continues to underestimate Shepard.

Knows a lot and is powerful. I don't think it's ever mentioned they're 'All powerful,' though. They're arrogant enough, but I don't recall them outright making claim to that. Harbinger definitely failed, but so did the collectors. Every action that fails doesn't have to be the responsibility of one being. The collectors were modified and enslaved, but they still definitely seemed to have some awareness and action. It's possible there was only so much he could do with their base organic forms. That's still them failing him, even if a good portion of the failure was his own.  If he is claiming to be a god, of course he's not going to admit his own part of the problem, he's going to blame it on his minions, no matter how accurate it may be. Like a good villian should.

And he could easily have been referring to all the collector race in general while just talking to him. Heck, he does it with humanity through shepard often enough. Anyway, it just reinforces that particular conversation was definitely not for Shepard, to me.

First of all, he can easily mean that this little victory will matter little in the grand scheme of things.

The only the conversation makes sense from your perspective is if you accept his monologue as soliloquy despite the fact that the previous and subsequent lines both directly address shepherd.    If you do not accept it as soliloquy, the fact that he is addressing the Collector general is completely illogical as shepherd cannot possible know that the Camera is panning to the collector general as he is saying this (to ensure "releasing control" makes more sense and is more dramatic).    

If you do accept it as soliloquy, why the **** is their soliloquy sandwhiched between two monologues directly addressed towards the main character?   That means your asserting that biowares dialogue writers have the profficiency of a sixth grader.    


"You have failed" is telling shepherd that his actions ultimately mean nothing in halting arrival of the reapers.    

Modifié par newcomplex, 15 février 2010 - 07:09 .

[Ferocious7]

Tyreal42a wrote...

Ferocious7 wrote...

Tyreal42a wrote...

Ferocious7 wrote...

Tyreal42a wrote...
2. The Reaper might have been directly controlling them, but it's still having to use something else's body and unable to act at its full power. If you haven't noticed, they tend to look upon organic beings as servants or puppets. It could have meant the Collector's'weak bodies were inadequate for its controlling needs.

That would be a very poor reason being you never battle the General, not once.  His body did everything the Harbinger commanded, he had control.   The harbinger failed no matter how you slice it.   It's organics vs organics, it's not like shepard is made of titanium and shoots lasers out of his eyes.

Not the general, but he controlled about 100 of the collectors trying to kill you. And failed. You have to think his odds of killing you would have improved had he been there to use his own glorious form rather than having to work via squishy, useless collector drones. So yes, their forms failed him.

No, he failed choosing them, if he is all knowing and all powerful, he would have known that they aren't powerful enough.  That specific scene doesn't show anyone but the general, and regardless they were fully functional and able to fight... the harbinger absolutely failed there is no doubt about it.  He had control, they weren't unhealthy.. and if they were he shouldn't have chosen them.  That's his fault.   Ultimately one being failed, the Harbinger.  Sugar coat it all you want, Harbinger failed. 

Go watch some youtube clips a few times, the more I watch it the more I realize the Harbinger fails.. so if he is blaming it on someone else, he is a moron... which would make sense being he still continues to underestimate Shepard.

Knows a lot and is powerful. I don't think it's ever mentioned they're 'All powerful,' though. They're arrogant enough, but I don't recall them outright making claim to that. Harbinger definitely failed, but so did the collectors. Every action that fails doesn't have to be the responsibility of one being. The collectors were modified and enslaved, but they still definitely seemed to have some awareness and action. It's possible there was only so much he could do with their base organic forms. That's still them failing him, even if a good portion of the failure was his own.  If he is claiming to be a god, of course he's not going to admit his own part of the problem, he's going to blame it on his minions, no matter how accurate it may be. Like a good villian should.

And he could easily have been referring to all the collector race in general while just talking to him. Heck, he does it with humanity through shepard often enough. Anyway, it just reinforces that particular conversation was definitely not for Shepard, to me.

Actually, it's in the game.   Play it a few times.   The entire time, the Harbinger is telling you that you can not win, that he is assuming control and will stop you.  Apparently he is so sure of it and underestimates you because who gets owned?  Harbinger.  He throws everything at his disposal at you and fails.   The collector's didn't fail, they are mindless according to the game.   He controls their every move.  They weren't breaking their bones when they took steps, the issue was his control vs my control over Shep.. Harbinger lost.   hah.

Seriously, I pretty much agree with the fact that in that particular scene he was talking to Harbinger, however I wouldn't definitely say so because the devs can say anything they want and it make sense being that part is open to debate depending on your perspective... the "human" part is obviously talking to Shepard.   Some people seem to be mixing those scenes together, hence some of the confusion.

But if you take control of someones entire purpose and you are talking all of this smack the entire time, saying Shepard is gonna fail, you are taking control, blah blah blah.... and you can't pull it off, sorry but the blame is on you.  The harbinger talked the talk, but when it came down to it... he got owned and fled like a wimp.

Harbinger took control of what... hundreds?  Yeah about that on Insanity and still couldn't pull it off.   Not to mention all the others he has brainwashed, so technically thousands.   He/she/it/they whatever Harbinger is, failed.

[WoodWizzard87]

Lightice_av wrote...

You're being too literal. "You have failed" is directed towards the player (ergo Shepard). It's dramatic Irony wherein the audience sees something that the characters may not.

Watch it again and pay attention to the Collector General. Then tell me it's directed at Shepard - or the player for that matter.

Harbinger does the entire speech, while still mind controlling the General, so i have no idea how hes talking to him.  Its still a rant at the audience/player to bring about an emotional response.  Harbinger doesnt release control of the body until a few seconds before the explosion.  He looks up at the hologram at the end and sends the program that mind controls back to the reaper.  Its really not that hard to figure out.

[NoUserNameHere]

Well, for one he could be talking to both Shep and the Collector General.



Two, the CG may have some degree of autonomy, so it would be somewhat possible for him to be at fault for part of the operation.

[newcomplex]

NoUserNameHere wrote...

Well, for one he could be talking to both Shep and the Collector General.

Two, the CG may have some degree of autonomy, so it would be somewhat possible for him to be at fault for part of the operation.

Mordin clearly states that the Collectors brains have been reduced to the level of a neural remote control transponder.   

Ferocious7 wrote...
Harbinger took control of what...
hundreds?  Yeah about that on Insanity and still couldn't pull it off.  
Not to mention all the others he has brainwashed, so technically
thousands.   He/she/it/they whatever Harbinger is, failed.

Did
you not see the hundreds of reapers, several magnitudes harder to kill
then sovereign (who didn't have any sheilds) coming at the end of ME2?

Thats
NOT what I call failing.    Among them is Harbringer, healthy as
ever.    He hasn't failed, merely been delayed.

Modifié par newcomplex, 15 février 2010 - 07:15 .

[Ferocious7]

newcomplex wrote...

Tyreal42a wrote...

Ferocious7 wrote...

Tyreal42a wrote...

Ferocious7 wrote...

Tyreal42a wrote...
2. The Reaper might have been directly controlling them, but it's still having to use something else's body and unable to act at its full power. If you haven't noticed, they tend to look upon organic beings as servants or puppets. It could have meant the Collector's'weak bodies were inadequate for its controlling needs.

That would be a very poor reason being you never battle the General, not once.  His body did everything the Harbinger commanded, he had control.   The harbinger failed no matter how you slice it.   It's organics vs organics, it's not like shepard is made of titanium and shoots lasers out of his eyes.

Not the general, but he controlled about 100 of the collectors trying to kill you. And failed. You have to think his odds of killing you would have improved had he been there to use his own glorious form rather than having to work via squishy, useless collector drones. So yes, their forms failed him.

No, he failed choosing them, if he is all knowing and all powerful, he would have known that they aren't powerful enough.  That specific scene doesn't show anyone but the general, and regardless they were fully functional and able to fight... the harbinger absolutely failed there is no doubt about it.  He had control, they weren't unhealthy.. and if they were he shouldn't have chosen them.  That's his fault.   Ultimately one being failed, the Harbinger.  Sugar coat it all you want, Harbinger failed. 

Go watch some youtube clips a few times, the more I watch it the more I realize the Harbinger fails.. so if he is blaming it on someone else, he is a moron... which would make sense being he still continues to underestimate Shepard.

Knows a lot and is powerful. I don't think it's ever mentioned they're 'All powerful,' though. They're arrogant enough, but I don't recall them outright making claim to that. Harbinger definitely failed, but so did the collectors. Every action that fails doesn't have to be the responsibility of one being. The collectors were modified and enslaved, but they still definitely seemed to have some awareness and action. It's possible there was only so much he could do with their base organic forms. That's still them failing him, even if a good portion of the failure was his own.  If he is claiming to be a god, of course he's not going to admit his own part of the problem, he's going to blame it on his minions, no matter how accurate it may be. Like a good villian should.

And he could easily have been referring to all the collector race in general while just talking to him. Heck, he does it with humanity through shepard often enough. Anyway, it just reinforces that particular conversation was definitely not for Shepard, to me.

First of all, he can easily mean that this little victory will matter little in the grand scheme of things.

The only the conversation makes sense from your perspective is if you accept his monologue as narration, despite the fact that the previous and subsequent lines both directly address shepherd.    If you do not accept it as narration, the fact that he is addressing the Collector general is completely illogical as shepherd cannot possible know that the Camera is panning to the collector general as he is saying this (to ensure "releasing control" makes more sense and is more dramatic).    

If you do accept it as narration, why the **** is their narration sandwhiched between too monologues directly addressed towards the main character?

This is why I say there is no absolute answer as to who he was talking to in that exact instance.  I can see all of your (plural) arguments from the valid viewpoints.   It makes sense a number of ways for any of the reasons listed here in this thread.  However, unless a developer comes in, it's left up to speculation.

The more I watched it, the more it seemed as if talking to the General made the most sense.. the way it seemed that he wasn't just an indoctrinated mindless freak, that he still had a mind and just gained control of it back at that last split second... would actually be pretty damn deep.  Just talking to shepard would be same ol same ol.    Talking to the actual player of the game, would be outright corny.  So hopefully, to add depth to the story... he's talking to the General or even Collector's as a whole with his "eye" so to speak on the General... because then there could be some back-story to that other than what we've already gotten.  More story = more Mass Effect 2 = More of a good thing.   

I say we all take a vote, I vote he was talking to Oprah.   He donated money to one of her charities and that was his air-time.   lol


I'd honestly like him to tell Jack or Grunt they fail.... and hear their rebuttals.  Harbinger would get verbally abused.

[Sir Ulrich Von Lichenstien]

WoodWizzard87 wrote...

Lightice_av wrote...

You're being too literal. "You have failed" is directed towards the player (ergo Shepard). It's dramatic Irony wherein the audience sees something that the characters may not.

Watch it again and pay attention to the Collector General. Then tell me it's directed at Shepard - or the player for that matter.

Harbinger does the entire speech, while still mind controlling the General, so i have no idea how hes talking to him.  Its still a rant at the audience/player to bring about an emotional response.  Harbinger doesnt release control of the body until a few seconds before the explosion.  He looks up at the hologram at the end and sends the program that mind controls back to the reaper.  Its really not that hard to figure out.

No he doesn't, he was mind controlling the General just the same way he was the normal Collectors.

By the time he says the "You have failed" line Shepherd is either lying dead somewhere on the base or flying off away from the blast zone.

Why would he be speaking to shepherd if shepherd is dead?

Shep dies video Move to 3.22 for the "you have failed" part.

Shep is dead by this point so he can't be talking to Shep

[newcomplex]

Ferocious7 wrote...

newcomplex wrote...

Tyreal42a wrote...

Ferocious7 wrote...

Tyreal42a wrote...

Ferocious7 wrote...

Tyreal42a wrote...
2. The Reaper might have been directly controlling them, but it's still having to use something else's body and unable to act at its full power. If you haven't noticed, they tend to look upon organic beings as servants or puppets. It could have meant the Collector's'weak bodies were inadequate for its controlling needs.

That would be a very poor reason being you never battle the General, not once.  His body did everything the Harbinger commanded, he had control.   The harbinger failed no matter how you slice it.   It's organics vs organics, it's not like shepard is made of titanium and shoots lasers out of his eyes.

Not the general, but he controlled about 100 of the collectors trying to kill you. And failed. You have to think his odds of killing you would have improved had he been there to use his own glorious form rather than having to work via squishy, useless collector drones. So yes, their forms failed him.

No, he failed choosing them, if he is all knowing and all powerful, he would have known that they aren't powerful enough.  That specific scene doesn't show anyone but the general, and regardless they were fully functional and able to fight... the harbinger absolutely failed there is no doubt about it.  He had control, they weren't unhealthy.. and if they were he shouldn't have chosen them.  That's his fault.   Ultimately one being failed, the Harbinger.  Sugar coat it all you want, Harbinger failed. 

Go watch some youtube clips a few times, the more I watch it the more I realize the Harbinger fails.. so if he is blaming it on someone else, he is a moron... which would make sense being he still continues to underestimate Shepard.

Knows a lot and is powerful. I don't think it's ever mentioned they're 'All powerful,' though. They're arrogant enough, but I don't recall them outright making claim to that. Harbinger definitely failed, but so did the collectors. Every action that fails doesn't have to be the responsibility of one being. The collectors were modified and enslaved, but they still definitely seemed to have some awareness and action. It's possible there was only so much he could do with their base organic forms. That's still them failing him, even if a good portion of the failure was his own.  If he is claiming to be a god, of course he's not going to admit his own part of the problem, he's going to blame it on his minions, no matter how accurate it may be. Like a good villian should.

And he could easily have been referring to all the collector race in general while just talking to him. Heck, he does it with humanity through shepard often enough. Anyway, it just reinforces that particular conversation was definitely not for Shepard, to me.

First of all, he can easily mean that this little victory will matter little in the grand scheme of things.

The only the conversation makes sense from your perspective is if you accept his monologue as narration, despite the fact that the previous and subsequent lines both directly address shepherd.    If you do not accept it as narration, the fact that he is addressing the Collector general is completely illogical as shepherd cannot possible know that the Camera is panning to the collector general as he is saying this (to ensure "releasing control" makes more sense and is more dramatic).    

If you do accept it as narration, why the **** is their narration sandwhiched between too monologues directly addressed towards the main character?

This is why I say there is no absolute answer as to who he was talking to in that exact instance.  I can see all of your (plural) arguments from the valid viewpoints.   It makes sense a number of ways for any of the reasons listed here in this thread.  However, unless a developer comes in, it's left up to speculation.

The more I watched it, the more it seemed as if talking to the General made the most sense.. the way it seemed that he wasn't just an indoctrinated mindless freak, that he still had a mind and just gained control of it back at that last split second... would actually be pretty damn deep.  Just talking to shepard would be same ol same ol.    Talking to the actual player of the game, would be outright corny.  So hopefully, to add depth to the story... he's talking to the General or even Collector's as a whole with his "eye" so to speak on the General... because then there could be some back-story to that other than what we've already gotten.  More story = more Mass Effect 2 = More of a good thing.   

I say we all take a vote, I vote he was talking to Oprah.   He donated money to one of her charities and that was his air-time.   lol


I'd honestly like him to tell Jack or Grunt they fail.... and hear their rebuttals.  Harbinger would get verbally abused.

Were not argueing whether or not the collectors failing is valid or not.      Harbringer is not talking to the Collector general because grammatically, it makes absolutely no sense.   

Modifié par newcomplex, 15 février 2010 - 07:21 .

[Tyreal42a]

NoUserNameHere wrote...

Two, the CG may have some degree of autonomy, so it would be somewhat possible for him to be at fault for part of the operation.

This. And personally, I still think the other collectors weren't completely lacking some control as well. Otherwise, why wouldn't they just use the Geth or other machines? They were an experiment to Harbinger, and they failed him. Of course, he failed too, possibly the lion's share of it, but they were a failure to him as well.

Anyway, this blame game is kinda silly and offtopic. The purpose was to establish WHY he would be saying 'You have failed!' to the collector general/collectors in general.

[Draconis6666]

it makes even less sense for him to be talking to someone whos not even there anymore and then in the same line of dialogue inform the collector general he is releasing control.