102 réponses à ce sujet

[dynas2001]

I wondered why the barrier skills seemed so useless

[mundus66]

Im not sure, but as far as i can tell Geth shield boost is for Legion only. Barrier and Geth shield gets effected by tech/biotic cooldown reduce and the duration increase, as well as class specific talents which reduce cooldown or increase duration. Fortification has 1 boost afaik from the soldiers unique class ability, but doesn't that affect the other 2 as well?

[sinosleep]

Even if GSB boost doesn't apply, the tech upgrade still do as does the + 10% damage from the 7%% version. That's enough to differentiate it. GSB is better for techies, Barrier is better for biotics, fortification appears to be worthless for all.

[davidshooter]

Hmmm,



Hard to believe the devs haven't seen this yet.



Bumping before this goes to page 2

[_Dannok1234]

Still nothing new.. (bump)

[NihilisticN]

For great justice

[GCreature]

Damn, the cryo question was answered, but this wasn't?

[Coughee Brotha]

Nice thread. I have been confused about barrier too

[RamsenC]

I have a feeling fortification is working as intended just because otherwise it would be close to as good as tech armor. None of the other loyalty powers measure up to class specific powers. I would use fortification in a second if it actually lasted the entire duration.

Modifié par RamsenC, 17 février 2010 - 03:20 .

[sinosleep]

RamsenC wrote...

I have a feeling fortification is working as intended just because otherwise it would be close to as good as tech armor. None of the other loyalty powers measure up to class specific powers. I would use fortification in a second if it actually lasted the entire duration.

Problem with that is that fortification essentially functions the same as barrier except with no obvious bonuses like the biotic cool down bonuses that apply to barrier.

[D.Shepard]

I was just wondering what defensive bonus power is more efficient. I was thinking about Geth Shield Boost and Fortification for my Soldier Shepard. Currently I'm using Geth Shield Boost (evolved to Improved Geth Shield Boost) and it saved my character few times on Insanity. GSB offers a weapon damage bonus but if we select the version that only a shields' boost is it as efficient as Fortification?

[sinosleep]

Yup, all three are IDENTICAL when it comes to the actual shield boost. It's the cool down bonuses that GSB and Barrier get that it doesn't appear fortification gets. And at the end of the day I think they are all kinda pointless on insanity any way. I should post the vid with the vorchas. It's ridiculous how quickly they can make a 12 second cooldown entirely pointless.

Modifié par sinosleep, 17 février 2010 - 10:25 .

[Anew614]

I miss the protection skills from mass effect 1, they were very usefull, abit over powered BUT atleast they were usefull.



I dont understand why devs didnt balance them instead they made them very underpowered in other words Useless.

[Sarevok Anchev]

I think all 3 Defenses are meant to be this way, or Tech-Armor (as a Major-Power for Sentinels) wouldnt be working with the "till Overloaded"-Limit.



Its even a Shame, that you cant have Health/Armor/Shields like your enemys

Health/Tech-Armor/Shields

Health/Fortitude(Armor)

Health/Shields(")

Health/Barrier(")



so you would be able to choose Defenses, that are more resistant to the Weapons your Enemys are using.

[swk3000]

I'm not sure I see the issue everyone's worried about. After watching the video, I'd say that you've proven, not that there's any glitch, but that Fortification is simply inferior to both Geth Shield Boost and Barrier. It seems to me that Fortification provides the same Shield Boost as both GSB and Barrier, but that once your shields are gone, then the Boost is gone. GSB and Barrier, on the other hand, both seem to last out the entire duration of the power.



Frankly, all the video suggests to me is that Fortification is inferior to Barrier and GSB because it's Shield Bonus only lasts until the first time your Shields are depleted. After that, you lose the bonus, and have to deal with the cooldown time.



Then again, I may be missing something everyone else is seeing.

[sinosleep]

Um, yeah, you are missing something. They ALL behave the same way as fortification did in that video. All three of them last for the duration of the ability in the tutorial, and all three of them are done as soon as you lose shields any where else. In that regard they are ALL equally gimped. Where fortification appears gimped in comparison to GSB and barrier is that fortification appears to not get a bonus from anything whereas GSB gets boosts from tech and barrier gets boosts from biotics.

[Kronner]

sinosleep wrote...

Um, yeah, you are missing something. They ALL behave the same way as fortification did in that video. All three of them last for the duration of the ability in the tutorial, and all three of them are done as soon as you lose shields any where else. In that regard they are ALL equally gimped. Where fortification appears gimped in comparison to GSB and barrier is that fortification appears to not get a bonus from anything whereas GSB gets boosts from tech and barrier gets boosts from biotics.

Thats all true and sounds nice and dandy. But my allow me this question:

Why does it matter? Why does Shredder Ammo sucks compared with Tungsten Ammo and yet it is still available as a bonus talent. This is SP game, abilities do not have to be comparable not to mention equally effective.

[davidshooter]

The gameplay is behaving in two mutually exclusive ways at different points in the game. They both can't be working as intended. The question is, which is one is working correctly. People want to know the answer. It isn't complicated.

This is not the same as shredder ammo sucking.

Shredder ammo doing twice the damage on one level than another would be an accurate comparison - the game doesn't have that problem though.

Modifié par davidshooter, 17 février 2010 - 01:59 .

[sinosleep]

Kronner wrote...
Thats all true and sounds nice and dandy. But my allow me this question:

Why does it matter? Why does Shredder Ammo sucks compared with Tungsten Ammo and yet it is still available as a bonus talent. This is SP game, abilities do not have to be comparable not to mention equally effective.

One, that's a weak excuse, and two it's not remotely near the same thing. While you might get people saying that + damage to health is worthless, it's still + damage to health. It's doing SOMETHING, fortification on the other hand does NOTHING differently from barrier or GSB and is in fact clearly inferior because it doesn't benefit from something that GSB and barrier do benefit from. That's why it matters. If fortification also received some kind of boost from upgrades then it'd be fine, it would just be a duplicate and it wouldn't really bother me. Fact is though, it's not a duplicate since it gets no boosts from upgrades. It adds nothing new, AND it's gimped. That's worse than being a duplicate. 

Every other bonus ability serves a purpose or provides some feature (including shredder ammo), fortification doesn't. 

Modifié par sinosleep, 17 février 2010 - 02:04 .

[GCreature]

I think it was mentioned that Tech Armour was acting the same way in the tutorial? Perhaps TA doesn't deactivate when you lose all your shields as some sort of learning curve, a little bit of EZ mode in the tutorial. If that's the case maybe TA and the 3 bonus powers share that part of coding, it was probably easier to just copy the ability and just remove the explosion and change the graphics.

[sinosleep]

The difference between tech armor and the shield talents though is that at least when tech armor goes down it explodes providing damage and a knock down effect. Even if you lose it early and you are near enemies you got SOMETHING for your 10 point investment. The shield talents on the other hand get cut down in absolutely no time at all, so you just spent your 12 second cool down on something that was useful for about 1. As they currently work, on insanity at least, the shield talents are entirely pointless.

[Anew614]

Can a Dev help us out here.

[Kronner]

sinosleep wrote...

Kronner wrote...
Thats all true and sounds nice and dandy. But my allow me this question:

Why does it matter? Why does Shredder Ammo sucks compared with Tungsten Ammo and yet it is still available as a bonus talent. This is SP game, abilities do not have to be comparable not to mention equally effective.

One, that's a weak excuse, and two it's not remotely near the same thing. While you might get people saying that + damage to health is worthless, it's still + damage to health. It's doing SOMETHING, fortification on the other hand does NOTHING differently from barrier or GSB and is in fact clearly inferior because it doesn't benefit from something that GSB and barrier do benefit from. That's why it matters. If fortification also received some kind of boost from upgrades then it'd be fine, it would just be a duplicate and it wouldn't really bother me. Fact is though, it's not a duplicate since it gets no boosts from upgrades. It adds nothing new, AND it's gimped. That's worse than being a duplicate. 

Every other bonus ability serves a purpose or provides some feature (including shredder ammo), fortification doesn't. 

Fortification SHOULD be better (than barrier and shield)  against some type of attacks and worse against others.
I did not bother to test, but since barrier is in biotic, shield in tech and fortification in combat category, it makes sense.
Also, I do not really understand your logic.
Lets say Shredder Ammo is inferior to AP Ammo and that is fine with you because it is still different (more bonus to health damage), right?
Now lets assume Fortification is inferior to both Shield and Barrier = that is a problem you say.
But each of them boosts different stuff /armor/shield/barrier = it IS different.

[GCreature]

sinosleep wrote...

The difference between tech armor and the shield talents though is that at least when tech armor goes down it explodes providing damage and a knock down effect. Even if you lose it early and you are near enemies you got SOMETHING for your 10 point investment. The shield talents on the other hand get cut down in absolutely no time at all, so you just spent your 12 second cool down on something that was useful for about 1. As they currently work, on insanity at least, the shield talents are entirely pointless.

That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying TA could be the cause of the 'glitch'. The 3 bonus powers might be affected because they share some part of the code.

I wasn't commenting on the usefulness/uselessness of the bonus powers.

Modifié par GCreature, 17 février 2010 - 02:12 .

[swk3000]

sinosleep wrote...

Um, yeah, you are missing something. They ALL behave the same way as fortification did in that video. All three of them last for the duration of the ability in the tutorial, and all three of them are done as soon as you lose shields any where else. In that regard they are ALL equally gimped. Where fortification appears gimped in comparison to GSB and barrier is that fortification appears to not get a bonus from anything whereas GSB gets boosts from tech and barrier gets boosts from biotics.

Looked at the video again, and while it does get the point across, it does so in a roundabout way. I actually stopped watching after the Barrier test.

To be completely honest, I'd redo the video. While I appreciate the work it takes to produce a video, a video that's properly put together would get your point across much more clearly. I'd run it like this:

1. Geth Shield Boost in Tutorial
2. Geth Shield Boost on Freedom's Progress
3. Fortification in Tutorial
4. Fortification on Freedom's Progress
5. Barrier in Tutorial
6. Barrier on Freedom's Progress

The biggest problem with your video is you don't test the same skill twice in a row. If you'd tested GSB in the Tutorial, and then immediately tested GSB on Freedom's Progress, then I'd have seen what you were talking about right away, instead of assuming that it's simply a problem with Fortification.

Anyway, I realize I'm coming across as rather rude, especially considering what it must have taken to get the different saves to points where you could test them, and I apologize. However, I feel that if you're going to present video evidence, doing it right would make your case that much stronger, and that much easier to pick up on.