278 réponses à ce sujet

[Madecologist]

Gill Kaiser wrote...

...and some of us specifically didn't romance anyone in ME1 because we wanted to romance Tali or Garrus, don't forget us!

You deserve your cookie too! You have my full support. My Shep should have too. They remained loyal to him. I just want that those of us who took the path of "cheat" did not do so lightly or because our Shepard's were weak willed. Okay mine was a little, Verner's foot did not derserve a bullet.

[Kusy]

@Computron2000 :



Yeah, she also told you that Kaidan was lucky, his only kickbacks on L2 are small migrenes. You think they would actualy take a guy who could die anytime or go insane into army.

[Nozybidaj]

Madecologist wrote...

Mystranna Kelteel wrote...

There's absolutely no room for BioWare to turn around and accuse people "cheating" when
1) players aren't given a choice to break up with them.

Well as mentioned, the devs did mention there will be consequences for cheating, using the term cheating. So yes there is room for concern.

However, the part I quoted from you I completely agree with. That was my gripe in ME2. Especially with Liara, she is right there (at least with Kai/Ash you can tell Kelly and Joker it is over with them). I totally would have selected "It's over, we going our own separate ways Liara" dialogue option if it was available. Heck as mentioned, she did not even send a freakin email... nothing. Never mind the breaked embrace and her cold attitude afterwards. It felt like SHE dumped my Shepard.

I swear if she accuses my Shepard of cheating on her in ME3, I hope there is a Renegade interrupt to shoot her. Kidding, but yeah. My Shepard is pissed and hurt by her. Poor Verner's foot had to suffer for it.

There was no point in adding a break up option.  It was already over.  I thought the fact that the previous romance is never acknowledged to have ever taken place was enough of a hint there.

[aeetos21]

It still boggles my mind that people read so much into a two month (at most) relationship.

[Kusy]

aeetos21 wrote...

It still boggles my mind that people read so much into a two month (at most) relationship.

Details.

[SF117]

Gill Kaiser wrote...

...and some of us specifically didn't romance anyone in ME1 because we wanted to romance Tali or Garrus, don't forget us!

I did that as well.  Didn't like Ashley or Liara anyway, so I guess it's all good.

[Madecologist]

Nozybidaj wrote...

There was no point in adding a break up option.  It was already over.  I thought the fact that the previous romance is never acknowledged to have ever taken place was enough of a hint there.

I think you may be right. Kai and Ash's dialogues have a few variations and you get the email later. Liara, no change in dialogue, the only thing we get is the kiss, and her cutting it short and shaking her head. Like I said, Shep was the one getting dumped there.

[Nozybidaj]

Gill Kaiser wrote...
Well, not quite. The game does try to make you feel guilty if you choose another love interest, with the photo on the desk, and the belated conciliatory email (if you romanced Ash/Kaiden).

If a picture on your desk is enough to constitute a continuing romance, that is an extremly loose interpretation. 

All it does is show you that Shepard hadn't forgotten after just waking up.  Remember for him it probably only feels like a couple of days have passed, not two years.

In Ash/Kaidan's case you do get an email as well, though that isn't exactly enough to constitute a romance either.  The LI's themselves though make it clear they have momved on, I don't see how BW could reasonably call it cheating once we get to ME3.

[Nozybidaj]

Madecologist wrote...

Nozybidaj wrote...

There was no point in adding a break up option.  It was already over.  I thought the fact that the previous romance is never acknowledged to have ever taken place was enough of a hint there.

I think you may be right. Kai and Ash's dialogues have a few variations and you get the email later. Liara, no change in dialogue, the only thing we get is the kiss, and her cutting it short and shaking her head. Like I said, Shep was the one getting dumped there.

Exactly.

[Mox Ruuga]

To have Liara accuse you of cheating on her in ME3 is to make her look even more insane than she already did in ME2.

Perhaps they will do that? It'll be the "Big Lipped Alligator Moment" of the ME trilogy.

[Nozybidaj]

Mox Ruuga wrote...

To have Liara accuse you of cheating on her in ME3 is to make her look even more insane than she already did in ME2..

That would be a pretty hard thing to do.

[Kusy]

@Mox Ruuga:



My 100% paragon Shepard would punch her in the face if she does...

(damn, I'm the only one who can't use quotes? This forum DOES nead a maintaince check).

[Badpie]

Mystranna Kelteel wrote...

I doubt anything will crop up at all. BioWare handled the LI carry-over very, very poorly.

There's absolutely no room for BioWare to turn around and accuse people "cheating" when
1) players aren't given a choice to break up with them
2) the romance isn't even brought up at all (with Liara, who doesn't even send an email...)
3) they all talk about the relationship in the past tense (except Liara, who doesn't talk about it at all)

So, to summarize, don't worry. BioWare has no room to create "cheating" drama in ME3. It wouldn't make any sense.

QFT.

I still didn't go for anyone else because when push comes to shove, even though they're not really together, my Shep loves Ash and knows (or at least suspects) that she still loves him too.

I don't like that Bioware started calling it "cheating" though.  I feel that's inaccurate.

IF Bioware decides to make this some sort of thing that carries over (WHICH THEY SHOULD) then I hope they don't do the whole "cheating" thing.  I can see there being some consequence to moving on and how it affects your relationships going forward with both your old and new LIs, but I hope they stay away from the angry, jilted former lover slant.  They're all adults.  They can all act like it.

[JPfanner]

Uh, I'm not sure how you can blame the character of Liara for a fundamental screw-up by the writers and anyone else involved who thought that whole interaction was good enough to ship out the door.



You aren't given the option to bring up the relationship at all. It isn't mentioned by anyone in the game. Those are failures by the developers, not the character. Liara only says what she's allowed to say, you can only ask about what you're allowed to ask about. What she says and what you're permitted to ask about constitutes a total failure on the part of Bioware.



You can stay with her despite the developer screwup on every level with her interaction, or you can chose to experience content they actually got around to putting in the game and didn't screw up so badly. But in any case, busting out your tiniest violin and "justifying" pursuing content by how cold she was to is just pretty absurd. The screwed up way that whole scene is now she says the same things to everyone and they can say the same things back to her regardless of whether you had her as a LI, a friend, or didn't even import from ME 1.

[Nozybidaj]

/shrug If the devs wanted to imply a continuing romance they easily could have done so. They didn't. Hence no cheating.



You can certainly choose to remain single throughout ME2, no one says you have to take a romance, but come ME3 I don't see how they would be able to rationalize calling Shep romancing someone in ME2 cheating.

[Unit-Alpha]

Remember they are continuing the Liara LI thread in ME3 ( or so an interview said).

[Madecologist]

JPfanner wrote...

Uh, I'm not sure how you can blame the character of Liara for a fundamental screw-up by the writers and anyone else involved who thought that whole interaction was good enough to ship out the door.

You aren't given the option to bring up the relationship at all. It isn't mentioned by anyone in the game. Those are failures by the developers, not the character. Liara only says what she's allowed to say, you can only ask about what you're allowed to ask about. What she says and what you're permitted to ask about constitutes a total failure on the part of Bioware.

You can stay with her despite the developer screwup on every level with her interaction, or you can chose to experience content they actually got around to putting in the game and didn't screw up so badly. But in any case, busting out your tiniest violin and "justifying" pursuing content by how cold she was to is just pretty absurd. The screwed up way that whole scene is now she says the same things to everyone and they can say the same things back to her regardless of whether you had her as a LI, a friend, or didn't even import from ME 1.

Keep in mind, "the busting out of the tiniest violin" is not as absurd when you read transcripts of the writers mentioning "cheating" and "haunt" repeatedly. Also stating any such concern as such is actually offensive. A well dressed insult is still and insult. Our response to the game is just as valid as yours, no matter how much you disagree with it.

To use your terminology, Liara's failing is screw up on the designers side, so there is nothing wrong with us in persueing of ME2 content. But what is there stopping them from continuing the tradition and pulling something on us in ME3 involving Liara.

I do agree, Liara was poorly handled. No break up option, no dialogue changes, no Kelly/Joker asking you about it (not even an email). Doesn't change the fact of what writers say during interviews or what may happen in ME3. So please refrain from accusing us with the violin arguement. Our gripes are just as valid as yours, in the context it was given to us.

[Tamahome560]

Yeah I don't see how they can call this cheating when it is obvious that ME1 Li's have moved on or don't acknowladge the relationship ... I hope Bioware does not screw this up in ME3, old love interests was the only thing I hated about ME2.

[Chief Savage Man]

My Shepard has left Liara to her new life and moved on. To Tali. (who I wish was an LI in the first one)

[Nozybidaj]

Tamahome560 wrote...

Yeah I don't see how they can call this cheating when it is obvious that ME1 Li's have moved on or don't acknowladge the relationship ... I hope Bioware does not screw this up in ME3, old love interests was the only thing I hated about ME2.

Agreed their inclusion was rather pointless with the way they were implemented.  More of a fanservice thing like seeing Shiala or Gianna or Conrad again.

[JPfanner]

Nozybidaj wrote...

/shrug If the devs wanted to imply a continuing romance they easily could have done so. They didn't. Hence no cheating.

You can certainly choose to remain single throughout ME2, no one says you have to take a romance, but come ME3 I don't see how they would be able to rationalize calling Shep romancing someone in ME2 cheating.

And I agree with that.  In order for it to be considered cheating you would have to had a chance to express how you felt about the relationship.  And you aren't given that chance.  You stand there mindlessy and get chewed out by Ashley/Kaiden and then get an email; or you sit there and do some hacking quests for Liara.  At least you can talk to Kelly about what you currently feel about Ashley/Kaiden, but even that shouldn't count because Kelly isn't in the relationship and it isn't any of her damn business.

Even if Bioware didn't want to include the ME 1 characters as squadmates, or make them available as pez dispenser instant sex clickies, there is absolutely no excuse for the total lack of dialog about the relationship.  And that isn't Ashley, Kaiden, or Liara's fault.  That is Biowares fault.  They can't railroad you and limit your options to freaking zero, then crow about how you "faltered" when the only thing faltering is their ability to deliver on appropriate content.

The way things are now you can either choose to experience the content you paid $60 for based on what was delievered, or you can decide not to based on what they should have delivered and your own personal feelings on what your Shepard would do.

[Madecologist]

Nozybidaj wrote...

Agreed their inclusion was rather pointless with the way they were implemented.  More of a fanservice thing like seeing Shiala or Gianna or Conrad again.

Agreed. Sadly, in the case of Liara, I felt those 3 were better done. I know this is something on the level of the game design. But my in game choices will be made based on what is given to me and not on what should have been given. Which is sad because it does ruin the character (unless it was their intention, maybe they wanted Liara to be just like that).

[screwoffreg]

If Liara had at least said something that indicated she felt something for me other than "hey, hack these computers for me!!!" it would be different. Even Ashley used "loved" in the past tense. Liara's dialogue with "friend" Shepard is almost exactly the same as if you romanced her, minus the awkward kiss. There was no indication she even saw you as a romance anymore, especially after she turns away from you.



My solution? Nuke.From.Orbit.

[Nozybidaj]

JPfanner wrote...

Nozybidaj wrote...

/shrug If the devs wanted to imply a continuing romance they easily could have done so. They didn't. Hence no cheating.

You can certainly choose to remain single throughout ME2, no one says you have to take a romance, but come ME3 I don't see how they would be able to rationalize calling Shep romancing someone in ME2 cheating.

And I agree with that.  In order for it to be considered cheating you would have to had a chance to express how you felt about the relationship.  And you aren't given that chance.  You stand there mindlessy and get chewed out by Ashley/Kaiden and then get an email; or you sit there and do some hacking quests for Liara.  At least you can talk to Kelly about what you currently feel about Ashley/Kaiden, but even that shouldn't count because Kelly isn't in the relationship and it isn't any of her damn business.

Even if Bioware didn't want to include the ME 1 characters as squadmates, or make them available as pez dispenser instant sex clickies, there is absolutely no excuse for the total lack of dialog about the relationship.  And that isn't Ashley, Kaiden, or Liara's fault.  That is Biowares fault.  They can't railroad you and limit your options to freaking zero, then crow about how you "faltered" when the only thing faltering is their ability to deliver on appropriate content.

The way things are now you can either choose to experience the content you paid $60 for based on what was delievered, or you can decide not to based on what they should have delivered and your own personal feelings on what your Shepard would do.

I don't disagree with a thing you said.  The only point I was trying to make is that there is no reasonable explanation that BW could use come ME3 for considering it "cheating".

[Nozybidaj]

Madecologist wrote...

Which is sad because it does ruin the character (unless it was their intention, maybe they wanted Liara to be just like that).

I would guess the answer would be "working as intended".