280 réponses à ce sujet

[tmp7704]

MsKlaussen wrote...

I think maybe what I'm referring to is not the lack of stereotypical feminine qualities, it is the abundance of blatantly male qualities, where the movement and mannerisms are concerned.

That would make sense. I think this is actually something i like about female Shepard, that between these mannerisms and the VA's performance she's not the typical take on a heroine where the gender differences are put in focus. It's hard to put in words but, she's type of character who if put say, in Gotham City wouldn't be a Catwoman or some another Harlequin, but rather unabashed mirror image of Batman himself, and she'd easily give him run for his money while still conveying more emotions where suitable. It's that certain (and possibly uninteded) disregard for gender which makes the resulting character more interesting than her male counterpart who basically is a walking gender stereotype, and as such winds up feeling more flat and "boring" on par with Jacob who suffers the same flaw.

[Leyt22]

JLFL wrote...

I honestly think it comes down to personal prefrence. I think both have great voice acting and fit in just right. However if were speaking in terms of canon of the story i'm guessing bioware intended Shepard to be male considering every single piece of boxart, demonstration videos, trailers, strategy guide, has male Shepard on the cover.

I agree.

Though I couldn't stand trying to play the game as a female. Something wasn't right.

[AntiChri5]

tmp7704 wrote...

MsKlaussen wrote...

I think maybe what I'm referring to is not the lack of stereotypical feminine qualities, it is the abundance of blatantly male qualities, where the movement and mannerisms are concerned.

That would make sense. I think this is actually something i like about female Shepard, that between these mannerisms and the VA's performance she's not the typical take on a heroine where the gender differences are put in focus. It's hard to put in words but, she's type of character who if put say, in Gotham City wouldn't be a Catwoman or some another Harlequin, but rather unabashed mirror image of Batman himself, and she'd easily give him run for his money while still conveying more emotions where suitable. It's that certain (and possibly uninteded) disregard for gender which makes the resulting character more interesting than her male counterpart who basically is a walking gender stereotype, and as such winds up feeling more flat and "boring" on par with Jacob who suffers the same flaw.

What he said.

[DaeJi]

Leyt22 wrote...

Though I couldn't stand trying to play the game as a female. Something wasn't right.

Voice acting too good?

I'm kidding, I'm kidding.

[AntiChri5]

Luc0s wrote...

SarEnyaDor wrote...

Okay so girls really enjoy being able to actually play a female who isn't just TnA, and some guys like to play females because of the butt-watching aspect, and some guys think that playing a chick is weird and shouldn't be allowed? Is that what the thread is really about?

Because every so often OP comes back to make his point that male Shep is really the only one he thinks makes sense, so either he is afraid no one will remember he likes male Shep better, or his real point is that he dislikes us being able to have the choice of playing femShep ... because if you just like male Shep better wouldn't you just play male Shep and not make a thread about how much you don't think femShep makes any sense?

I, for one, am glad that at least one game company likes to take my tainted female money and continues to make games I can identify with.

You clearly missed the whole point of this thread. You act personally attacked, as if I'm a sexist bastard who disrespects females, now that's just insane. I never made such claims and please don't puth words in my mouth I never said. I would never say BioWare shouldn't have given the option to play as a female character in Mass Effect, I only said that it doesn't work for me the way they implemented the female-option in their game right now. it feels misplaced, as if they simply swapped the male Shepards character model for a female one and asked Jennifer Hale to redo all Mark Meer's lines. To me, female Shepard walks, talks and acts like a male person a little to much.

I'd love to see a more distinguished female counterpart of Commander Shepard, but maybe I ask to much from BioWare.

Your problem is that there isnt enough differentiation between male and female shep. I actually love this, gender is not a big deal.

[tmp7704]

Luc0s wrote...

Stereotypes is what makes a character good though. Sounds weird but it is. A cliche character is bad, a flat character is bad, but a stereotypical character can be really good. In order to relate with a specific character, the character needs to be somewhat predictable. If the character is totally unpredictiable, it's unlikely anyone will get attached to him/her, because we can't relate to someone who's actions we can't predict. Trust me, it's true.

I'd disagree with that -- for character to be predictable they simply need to be consistent, to stick with what's defined as character's traits. But these traits don't by any means need to be stereotypical. When you talk of stereotypes, these are just lazy man's way to avoid having to come up with such traits at all, as that's what the stereotypes are -- certain combinations of personal traits people are already familiar with. This doesn't make the character good, just easy to make.

The cliche characters, the flat characters -- these are result of such (over)reliance on the stereotypes. Because our familiarity with them can easily cause the resulting character to be boring, as without a twist or some shake up what you have is just a "been there done that" kind of character.

[max_ai]

@OP:



Clearly she was reciting text, since mShep and femShep have almost identical dialogue (which is BAD). But IMHO she did to the best of her abilities (in most parts).

In movies and cartoons it's a bit different, actors are given more freedom with text. I'm not entirely sure why Bioware choose this type of production, but I still hope it'll change in ME3. Yes, it's a downside, and yes much of the text was written for mShep. I can easily acknowledge that, but Jennifer did a nice job with it.

Let's put it this way: Mark had a head start (95% of the WHOLE game was designed with him in mind), but in many parts he lost the race.



Considering all this, yeah, I can understand where you come from, and indeed in most cases it's easier to identify with the character the game was designed for.

[noobeffect]

Luc0s wrote...
Stereotypes is what makes a character good though.

Incorrect. No character needs to be supported by a stereotype and framed by stereotypes.

Luc0s wrote...
I have to admit, I haven't played ME2 with my
femshep character just yet, only ME1. I think I'm gonna give my femshep a
try after I've beaten ME2 on Insanity with my maleshep vanguard.

Luc0s wrote...
I have to admit, I haven't played ME2 with my femshep character just yet, only ME1.

Luc0s wrote...
I haven't played ME2 with my femshep character just yet, only ME1.

Luc0s wrote...
I haven't played ME2 with my femshep character just yet

Luc0s wrote...
haven't played ME2 with my femshep character

Luc0s wrote...
Trust me, I have no idea what I'm talking about.

Sounds more appropriate.

Modifié par noobeffect, 16 février 2010 - 02:54 .

[Kolaris8472]

#1 - I liked Hale's voice work a lot more than Meer's. She makes Shephard feel like Shephard and not just the PC

#2 - Headbutting the Krogan on Tuchanka was 10x as awesome

#3 - I felt good punching in al-Jilani's face

#4 - Beating up the Turian's in Afterlife's VIP room was far more satisfying

#5 - Pretty much any intimidate option feels better to me with the subtext of a female being underestimated

#6 - Its a lot easier getting along with all your squadmates as a Female, less whining that I'm spending too much time with Miranda/Jack etc...



I'm in the opposite boat as the OP. I had about a 50/50 split in terms of m/f playthroughs in ME1, but I'm finding it really hard to play as a Maleshep in ME2.

[DaeJi]

I play a female Shepard a lot; her actions and dialog seem fine to me. She tough and has seen a lot and doesn't fit into the cliqued "badass female" roles that other heroines fall into. That's a huge plus.

[Kolaris8472]

It sounds like a serious point to me. What specific moments were you thinking Femshep came off as a weak character if you don't have any specific moments, just stereotypes and Maleshep playthrough experience?

[Acero Azul]

My first character is always a male shepard with the default face because i can't seem to like any of the custom faces even if i try to make a good one. The female shepard is easier to make a good looking character which is a fun part of the game so i tend to make more female characters after that initial playthrough.

[tmp7704]

Kolaris8472 wrote...

#2 - Headbutting the Krogan on Tuchanka was 10x as awesome

I'm soo looking forward to this one, saving it for my ruthless earthborn vanguard Shepard as it's something just up her alley.

Only wish she still had that wide scar across the nose i gave her in ME1, damn Cerberus and their plastic surgery machines

[Shanra]

I'm going to say this is really a matter of preference.



I played my first playthrough on each game as a female paragon. I liked it a lot. I will say overall, I prefer the female. There is a bit more emotion there, and as an emotional person, I can coincide with it.



I've played both games as a male renegade Shep. I like it too. The male Shep sounds just like I would expect a male in his position would. He acknowledges emotions, but is not all touchy-feely about it.



That being said, there are some lines I think are absolutely much better on a male Shep, even though I prefer the FemShep.



I honestly think they are just about right.

[AntiChri5]

Luc0s wrote...

AntiChri5 wrote...

Your problem is that there isnt enough differentiation between male and female shep. I actually love this, gender is not a big deal.

Exactly. I think gender DOES matter, especially in a story-driven game like Mass Effect. Small details can make or break a character and gender is a little more than just a "small" detail.

To me, female Shepard just doesn't cut it, unless BioWare would have made her more a femme-fatale type of character, with her own unique dialogues and behavior. Right now, female Shepard's dialogue and behavior is just copy-paste from male Shepard.

Except that a marine commander is not and never will be a "femme fatale" regardless of gender. Femshep is a soldier, the best soldier humanity has to offer (unless you play as manshep, in which case she doesnt exist) the standard femme fatal attributes would just feel odd. There are some differences in peoples reactions too you but not much, and anyway, why would a Turian react differently to a female or male human? It would make no difference to them.

[Tisiphne]

tmp7704 wrote...

MsKlaussen wrote...

I think maybe what I'm referring to is not the lack of stereotypical feminine qualities, it is the abundance of blatantly male qualities, where the movement and mannerisms are concerned.

That would make sense. I think this is actually something i like about female Shepard, that between these mannerisms and the VA's performance she's not the typical take on a heroine where the gender differences are put in focus. It's hard to put in words but, she's type of character who if put say, in Gotham City wouldn't be a Catwoman or some another Harlequin, but rather unabashed mirror image of Batman himself, and she'd easily give him run for his money while still conveying more emotions where suitable. It's that certain (and possibly uninteded) disregard for gender which makes the resulting character more interesting than her male counterpart who basically is a walking gender stereotype, and as such winds up feeling more flat and "boring" on par with Jacob who suffers the same flaw.

I agree almost entirely, but the sitting and walking animations, particuarly in ME1, are not correct. One doesn't have to walk like she is wearing 6 inch heels to walk like a female. Women, due to anatomy, walk with the legs closer together. I'm certain that was entirely a cost saving thing - creating two entirely different animation sets for FMVs would have been double the work and money.

Modifié par Tisiphne, 16 février 2010 - 03:24 .

[shinyspace]

It's certainly all a matter of opinion. I for one am so happy that BW gives us the option.



I'm a girl and always play as a female if able. I much prefer the voice acting of Jennifer Hale. For me Shepard as a female is more interesting. That said, I have one custom male shep and I do have fun seeing the game from the male perspective.

[DaeJi]

Luc0s wrote...

I'm basing my opinion on ME2 and small parts of what I've seen from ME2. This topic could have been placed in the Mass Effect 1 forum, sure, but does it really matter?

A few examples from both ME1 and what I've seen from ME2 where I think femshep doesn't fit:

ME1 - the spectre speech when Anderson hands over the Normandy to you. I loved Mark Meer's typical commando speech, either way, paragon or renegade, it doesn't matter, his speech was awesome. Femshep sounded more like my old gymnastic teacher explaning how we are screwed if we didn't get a C+ for gymnastics at high-school...

ME1 - While escording Liara out of the digside, the krogan merch encounter, renegade option "I don't have time for this, charge!". Again, maleShep nailed it, femShep just didn't make it sound believable.

ME1 - Preaching Hanar on the Citadel, renegade dialogue "because it's a big stupid jellyfish". MaleShep's sarcastic voice was hilarious, it made me laugh, femShep's version didn't do anything for me.

ME2 - Archangle mission, renegade encounter with the Blue Suns mechanist (forgot his name), "you're working to hard". I loved the sarcastic voice of Mark Meer on that one, missed that when I saw the femShep version.

ME1 - Most of the Conrad dialogues (especially the gun-in-his-face part) felt awkward and less convincing with femShep.

ME2 - Old council offers you spectre reinstatement, renegade dialogue, "take that offer and cram it up your ass". Femshep just didn't make it sound believable.


Okay, paragon femshep pretty much works, but for me, the renegade **** additude just doesn't cut it. the maleshep bastard renegade is way better and way more convincing.

Need more?

It's a personal thing. In each of those examples I far preferred Hale to Meer. Hell, it was hearing her do the Normandy speech that made me want to be a femShep instead of a male Shepard. There are some renegade lines that he does do better, but for the most part she blows him out of the water for me.

[MutantSpleen]

FemShep is what I play but I did try to start a game in ME1 with default "John Shepard"..yech I couldn't even get off Eden Prime. Subsequently though I listened to a lot of MaleShep scenes on YouTube and I just cringe. To me he sounds so flat, wooden and uninspired and he misses subtle nuances in his delivery. I'd say he slightly improved in ME2 but just slightly and only in some scenes. (I have not seen all scenes with him though, but most of the big ones)



I also think Hale as female Shepard delivers an outstanding Renegade because she can put those nuances in her voice that add an edge of viciousness or sarcasm that I just don't hear from MaleShep and her Paragon can sound so warm and motherly. Sorry the two are night and day different for me, I could never play a Maleshep.



I do agree that her walk could be slightly better but should not be too feminine since she is a soldier, and both male and female Shepard have that annoying limp when walking in ME2.

[InvaderErl]

I think this is a case of people seeing what they WANT to see. On Both sides.

Modifié par InvaderErl, 16 février 2010 - 03:41 .