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Was I the only one who gave Legion back to Cerberus?


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#126
Aradace

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GnB Epro wrote...

I feel like everyone took Legion as a squadmate, while I gave him to cerberus and left without him.

I felt like he would betray me in the long run. Yes, I understand the different factions of Geth and that he was the true Geth, but I still don't trust it.

And before anyone points it out, YES I trust Cerberus and YES I gave them the collector base. I want the Illusive Man on my side and I would rather Cerberus experiment on Legion and the base to help me out later.


I gave him over to Cerebus on my first playthrough but it was completely by accident lol...Let me explain that one:

I was about to initiate the Reaper IFF mission when my wife came upstairs and wanted me to take my Xboxs downstairs that night because she was particularly tired.  So, I did, albiet by way of a lot of pissing and moaning lol.  Anyway, I start the IFF mission and run through it, and get back to the normandy and when the choice of giving him over to cerberus or keeping him pops up, I look at the TV screen only to find that the brightness is so screwed up that I cant read the text lol.  So, I scrambled around for about 20 minutes trying to find the sodding "original" remote only to remember "Oh yea, it doesnt have one anymore..." and this TV is so old that you cant change the "settings" manually either.  So...Assuming that "keeping" him would be the renegade choice, I picked the bottom option only to find that I get 50k creds and no Legion lol...

Now sure I couldve reloaded at that point but since it was my first play through I wanted to keep it as "real" as possible.  Hence Mordin and Garrus ened up dying on my first time through the Suicide mission.

#127
Tamcia

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What?!

You gave them legion??!?!? Wow...just....wow....

#128
brain_damage

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YES. And you have no heart or soul. Enjoy eating puppies and kicking babies, you....person <_<

#129
Aradace

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I actually plan on doing a run on each of my characters where the only people that survive are my LI and one other person...Not only giving the suicide mission a more "gritty" feel to it but a more "dramatic" end to things. Not like I'll be wanting for squadmates in ME3 seeing as how you'll be getting a whole slough of new squadmates anyway :P

#130
Guest_Guest12345_*

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jeez did you give grunt to cerberus too?

#131
Inverness Moon

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Aradace wrote...

GnB Epro wrote...

I feel like everyone took Legion as a squadmate, while I gave him to cerberus and left without him.

I felt like he would betray me in the long run. Yes, I understand the different factions of Geth and that he was the true Geth, but I still don't trust it.

And before anyone points it out, YES I trust Cerberus and YES I gave them the collector base. I want the Illusive Man on my side and I would rather Cerberus experiment on Legion and the base to help me out later.


I gave him over to Cerebus on my first playthrough but it was completely by accident lol...Let me explain that one:

I was about to initiate the Reaper IFF mission when my wife came upstairs and wanted me to take my Xboxs downstairs that night because she was particularly tired.  So, I did, albiet by way of a lot of pissing and moaning lol.  Anyway, I start the IFF mission and run through it, and get back to the normandy and when the choice of giving him over to cerberus or keeping him pops up, I look at the TV screen only to find that the brightness is so screwed up that I cant read the text lol.  So, I scrambled around for about 20 minutes trying to find the sodding "original" remote only to remember "Oh yea, it doesnt have one anymore..." and this TV is so old that you cant change the "settings" manually either.  So...Assuming that "keeping" him would be the renegade choice, I picked the bottom option only to find that I get 50k creds and no Legion lol...

Now sure I couldve reloaded at that point but since it was my first play through I wanted to keep it as "real" as possible.  Hence Mordin and Garrus ened up dying on my first time through the Suicide mission.

Not reloading because you legitimately picked the wrong choice because you weren't paying attention doesn't seem like you're keeping it "real" to me.

#132
Speakeasy13

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Wait, wait, wait! So you spent ME1 fighting the Geth but didn't spend ME1 fighting Cerberus? Did you even finished playing ME1 at all? Cerberus was as much a main enemy as the Geth...



Btw I killed Thane because he has terminal illness. He says it's some Drell syndrome but I think he may be HIV positive. Well we're not dating and he says he's not gay but you never know...

#133
SL22

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Legion is probably the best new character in Mass Effect 2, he also shares a lot of history about the what happened against the quarians and how only five percent of the total geth actually followed Sovereign. You want a massive army to fight the Reapers, not having the geth on your side is going to mess something up.

#134
-M-E-T-A-

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There are plenty of good reasons not to hand Legion over, and evidently no good reason to hand Legion over.

First of all, as a couple of posters have pointed out, you can't hate the Geth simply because of the Heretics.  (It makes about as much sense as hating all Germans because of the ****s.) 

Sympathy for Quarians?  You can love Tali while admitting that Quarians weren't right in the way they treated the Geth.  One poster wrote that you have every right to kill an artificial intelligence you created.  Hmm, it must be the whole artificial thing that makes all the difference, 'cause I'm sure nobody here thinks that you have a right to do whatever you please with anything you create!  (Have kids, anyone?)  And if the artificial thing really does make all the difference, maybe someone would care to explain that.  (And by "explain" I do not mean "repeat.")  Even Tali starts to rethink her prejudice against the Geth (er, ... if you make the right conversational choices in the game).

Can't trust Legion?  Uh, you can't really trust anyone in this game, because anyone might have some ulterior motive which they keep you in the dark about.  Here's the thing, though.  You can trust yourself.  More specifically, you can trust Shep.  Even more specifically, you can trust Shep's ability to handle tough situations.  Think about it.  You put Saren and Sovereign in their place, you've handled tons of Geth, many of which (as another poster rightly pointed out) were probably much more of a handful than Legion--and this should have been obvious at first contact with Legion.  But now you're worried that a single, human-sized Geth is too big of a risk for your bad self?  Interesting.  (Oh, and I THINK that, at this point, you can trust Bioware not to make you pay too dearly for trusting potential team members.  I don't recall having to replay rafts of missions/assignments as a result of some misguided paragon decision.  (Knock on wood.))

Want to get in good with Cerberus?  Hmm, it's one thing to say, "Well, Cerberus has a lot of power, and I'd rather be on the winning team."  And if that's your bottom line, then ... er ... you're ... just the kind of hero the galaxy needs!  (Hope the sarcasm isn't lost on everyone.)  Anyway, it's quite another thing to say that Cerberus is the kind of stand up organization that DESERVES whatever you can do for them.  Surely nobody here seriously thinks that!  And, yeah, I'm familiar with the hey-at-least-they're-a-HUMAN-organization line.  But that's just flat-out discrimination, no two ways about it.  Saying that you should look out for your own kind won't cut it either.  (I'm a lot of kinds.  I'm a male, blue-eyed, brown-haired, heterosexual human being with boatloads of bad habits, so does that mean I should give any preferential treatment toward THAT kind of being?  I hope not.)

There's another thing worth pointing out.  If you pursue a certain conversation line (namely, why's s/he/it wearing your stuff?) deep enough with Legion, it should start to become evident that not all of Legion's decisions are guided by logic alone.  S/he/it exhibits a kind of a-rationality that is almost ... (drum roll) ... human.  The point here is just that Legion certainly appears not only to possess self-awareness (sapience) but also to possess some brute preferences which aren't just products of means-end reasoning.  In short, Legion appears to be significantly more than an artificial intelligence (for better or worse).

Oh yeah, a quick two cents on trusting Cerberus with the big bad Collector base.  This is very different from "trusting" Legion on your ship, because you're in a much better position to handle a bad Legion's nastiness.  What TIM does with the reaper-generating collector tech is in a big way out of your control, simply because you won't be able to keep track of his minions' research.  Besides, even though TIM goes on and on about doing everything he does for the sake of humanity, why would anyone believe that?  Maybe TIM is ultimately just looking out for TIM.  And maybe, at the end of the day, in some weird way, he's actually more like another Saren.  Even if Cerberus is avowedly "Earth-first," that doesn't mean that its leaders and main operatives are.  The bottom line: There's just too much evidence suggesting that this is not a guy you should be granting even more power. 

Modifié par -M-E-T-A-, 16 février 2010 - 03:23 .


#135
Taritu

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Wow. This thread may be full of more stupid than any other thread I've seen here. Remarkable.

#136
Vaenier

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OP is a bad person, giving the poor helpless Geth to the mean Cerberus scientists. How would you like it if the Geth have your body to the Heretic scientists?

#137
MICHELLE7

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:blink:Why would anyone give Legion to Cerberus? That's just crazy.

#138
Tyfreaky

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Just from a tactical standpoint, giving away Legion is a bad idea. You get 50k for giving him to Cerberus. That is about the price of one upgrade if you have a discount.

Legion is considered one of the top NPCs for insanity difficulty combined with the fact that any chances you have of getting the Geth to help the galaxy, or even come to peaceful terms with the Quarians is now gone.



You also lose a potential source of information and you guarentee that you will have to fight the Geth, ALL THE GETH, as well as the Reapers in ME3.



While some of that requires for shadowing,. even the things that don't require it add up to more than 50k work of credits and possible productive research from Cerberus.


#139
Bron Avery

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Did it on my third play through. All that money. so nice, so yet useless.

Modifié par Bron Avery, 16 février 2010 - 03:39 .


#140
Basher of Glory

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Did nobody notice TIM's line during the discussion if I had over the collector base or if I blow it up? He said:

"...this would give us power over the reapers AND BEYOND!"



This "AND BEYOND" did it. What exactly did TIM mean? You can guess...

If any of all my paragon actions then this was the greatest: To blow up the facility! In retrospect at this point, I was, too, very satisfied with my descision NOT to hand over Legion.

#141
LOLandStuff

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Legion is too cool to give away, especially to Cerberus. They might have rebuilt Shepard but come on, you must be slow not to figure out they didn't want something in return.

I played as paragon and Cerberus was funding me and nothing more. I waited the entire game to ditch TIM and when I did, I was so proud of myself :)

And for 50K creds? That's sad. The money at the end was useless, I had enough to buy all the upgrades from the stores and still had some left.

#142
GnB Epro

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Guaritor wrote...

GnB Epro wrote...

Mikazukinoyaiba2 wrote...

GnB Epro wrote...
I felt like he would betray me in the long run. 

But you kept a psychopathic biotic, a justicar, an assassin on your team?

ok



No the psychopath I intentionaly killed. If I could have gotten rid of her sooner I would. Justicar and Assassin, yes I kept them because they were never my enemy...like the geth were.


Dunno if its been discussed yet... but would you kill every japanese, german, and italian person you saw just because they were your enemies once?

Going more into the ME universe, what about Turians? They killed tons of humans in the first contact war...



I thought someone would bring this up. To that I answer, no...no I would not. I have no compassion for the geth because they are non-sapient, and to me they seem relatively mindless (yes, I understand the hive mind). Humans, Turians, Quarians, etc are all sapiet and that gives me some relateable measure of intelligence, oversation, and emotion.

#143
GnB Epro

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Gill Kaiser wrote...

OP clearly has chronic poor judgement.


and you provide no reason for this statement...?

Thanks for playing then.

#144
Missouri Tigers

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I wish I had.  Legion is one of the worst characters I've ever encountered.  He's a wierd robot that I thoroughly enjoyed killing in Mass Effect and he has been tracking me down after stealing my armor.  His lines suck, I don't like his powers, and ever since my first playthrough I've always given him to Cerberus.

#145
GnB Epro

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FlashedMyDrive wrote...

Mikazukinoyaiba2 wrote...

FlashedMyDrive wrote...
I'm totally find with playing a game without breaking immersion and enjoy roleplaying, but there is a level at which it should stop.


If I didn't metagame in any way, I wouldn't have joined Cerberus.

I wouldn't have hired Zaeed, Miranda, Jack, Grunt, Morinth, Legion, or Thane.
I wouldn't have gone through the Omega-4 relay, because it's dangerous.
I wouldn't have trusted EDI.


There is a logical point in which you have to think, "This is a game, this is how it's supposed to happen."

If you Roleplay at the level, where you willingly disregard the fact that a character is a squadmember just because  you don't want to break immersion, that is willful ignorance and it takes it a tad too far.


I disagree, a lot of the things you said you "wouldn't" do I actually would do, even when I was RPing. Especially because I'm presented my choices and is shackled by Bioware at some points. I would have kept Zaaed, I would have kept every member of the team because they are useful, and yes I would have gone through the Omega-4 relay because that is my Shepard's mission.


You completely missed my point.

My point is that, unless you don't know that Mas Effect 2 is a game and you have no shred of common sense, you should be able to understand that none of the recruitable characters will betray you in some sort of game sabotaging way.


I'm not saying that his choice was dumb, I'm saying that the basis was dumb. If he wanted to "pretend" that his Shepard didn't trust Legion as some sort of personal story device, fine.

But if he trully believed that Legion was going to betray him, he just lacks common sense. Bioware wouldn't make a recruitable, just to sabotage your game.

Metagaming or not, it's common sense.





As a person, a human being, a role player, an ignorant naive child, WHATEVER you have decided I am, I stand by my claims.


YES, I knew before playing the game that Legion was a squadmate and I knew I COULD take him IF I thought it was a good idea. I had ABSOLUTELY NO IDEA how Legion would behave in the collector base, if he would help or hamper my mission in anyway. This is NOT an ignorant assumption, as up until getting Legion, we have been told that the Geth are humanities' enemy. I chose not to trust him. That's it.

I understand that Bioware wouldn't create a character to give me perpetual game overs, but Legion's presence stood a chance at perhaps endangering another squad member or the mission itself. Turns out it doesn't. So you can call me wrong...or too immersive...or whatever you like, but the fact of the matter is I made a decision that seemed logical at the time. In retrospect, I still stand by my decision because what Legion will do in ME3 is unknown. He could act as a homing beacon for the reapers or something. I don't know. Until then, you can be right.

#146
Kerilus

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@-M-E-T-A-: You either love Legion very much, or you hate Cerberus/TIM very much.

#147
GnB Epro

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Speakeasy13 wrote...

Wait, wait, wait! So you spent ME1 fighting the Geth but didn't spend ME1 fighting Cerberus? Did you even finished playing ME1 at all? Cerberus was as much a main enemy as the Geth...

Btw I killed Thane because he has terminal illness. He says it's some Drell syndrome but I think he may be HIV positive. Well we're not dating and he says he's not gay but you never know...



Cerberus was NOT the main enemy of ME1. Any DEV will tell you that. You can go the whole game without hearing about Cerberus, so much as you refrain from sidequests.

#148
Internet Kraken

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GnB Epro wrote...

Guaritor wrote...

GnB Epro wrote...

Mikazukinoyaiba2 wrote...

GnB Epro wrote...
I felt like he would betray me in the long run. 

But you kept a psychopathic biotic, a justicar, an assassin on your team?

ok



No the psychopath I intentionaly killed. If I could have gotten rid of her sooner I would. Justicar and Assassin, yes I kept them because they were never my enemy...like the geth were.


Dunno if its been discussed yet... but would you kill every japanese, german, and italian person you saw just because they were your enemies once?

Going more into the ME universe, what about Turians? They killed tons of humans in the first contact war...



I thought someone would bring this up. To that I answer, no...no I would not. I have no compassion for the geth because they are non-sapient, and to me they seem relatively mindless (yes, I understand the hive mind). Humans, Turians, Quarians, etc are all sapiet and that gives me some relateable measure of intelligence, oversation, and emotion.


But Legion is sapient. According to its dialogue and the codex, the Geth are sapient.

#149
eternalnightmare13

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I plan on doing so with my pure Renegade.  I enjoyed having him as a squad mate and findingout more about the Geth with my other character.  I don't see the point of doing everything the same in other play throughs.

#150
vigna

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How could you give him away after seeing those awesome head flanges-- every time he is questioning or postulating they do that flip floppy thing?....those things are awesome...they are as or more emotional as any body language from a npc in the game--just by watching them they tell you oodles about his character.