Aller au contenu

Photo

Do you think the Garrus and Tali romances were just fan service?


  • Veuillez vous connecter pour répondre
538 réponses à ce sujet

#201
Zeratul20

Zeratul20
  • Members
  • 699 messages

AdmiralCheez wrote...

mrsph wrote...

LadyJaneGrey wrote...

@mrsph Is Jacob's picture modded?


No. That's his cuddling animation.

Wait, so he takes it off for cuddles?!

*runs off to shove Garrus out the airlock*

Ah, Jacob.  Let's talk.

Jacob: "Ah, "cuddles". We have dismissed that claim."

Speaking of which, I remember that camera angle. It made me wonder if they'd done it on purpose. (Which they probably have.) "Look! Miranda's perfectly shaped rear-end! In a tight spandex! You're not looking at it! LOOK AT IT!"

#202
didymos1120

didymos1120
  • Members
  • 14 580 messages

Zeratul20 wrote...
Speaking of which, I remember that camera angle. It made me wonder if they'd done it on purpose. (Which they probably have.)


Yeah, they spend ages crafting the cinematic dialogues.  Something like that isn't an accident.


"Look! Miranda's perfectly shaped rear-end! In a tight spandex! You're not looking at it! LOOK AT IT!"


Accept it before it destroys you!

Modifié par didymos1120, 21 avril 2011 - 06:19 .


#203
Zeratul20

Zeratul20
  • Members
  • 699 messages
That... Is both hilarious and completely applicable to the way they handled Miranda('s ass).

(Pun intended.)

#204
CroGamer002

CroGamer002
  • Members
  • 20 673 messages
1st this is a necro
2nd answer to OP question. One of the reasons? Yes. Sole or main reason? No.

#205
V-rex

V-rex
  • Members
  • 1 432 messages
It's fan service. Very blatant fan service.
But then, so were all the romances. So was the removal of the elevators, so was a lot of things.

#206
ADLegend21

ADLegend21
  • Members
  • 10 687 messages
Yes. Femshep can go into schok from "ingesting" garrus and Tali can die from Sheps climax. fanservice.

#207
lawp79

lawp79
  • Members
  • 529 messages
In a word yes, I have always believed they were fan service.

#208
wright1978

wright1978
  • Members
  • 8 116 messages
I liked the romances in ME2. Wish they had more varied dialogue after hooking up though.
Fan service possibly but good fan service where they realise that the original game wasn't perfect and they broaden the romance pool with well scripted and believable relationships. My Shep certainly had a certain intellectual attraction to Tali but thats as far as it went as both physically and intellectually in love with Miri. On another playthrough i'll give it a go though.

#209
Merchant2006

Merchant2006
  • Members
  • 2 538 messages

Borschtbeet wrote...

I think they both seemed a bit far fetched.  Tali didn't show any romantic interest in Shepard at all in Mass Effect 1 and all of the sudden she falls in love with him in Mass Effect 2?  So much so that she's willing to risk her life scrogging him?
Also, Turians are probably the least looking humanoid aliens in the galaxy yet he and Shepard agree to scrog?

I have nothing against these romances being included as fan service of course.  I just have trouble taking them seriously.


Yes. People whined and moaned how they couldn't romance G/T so they put them in ME2.

*Slowly looks over at Fan Creations section and cringes*

It's really gone too far now.

#210
lovgreno

lovgreno
  • Members
  • 3 523 messages
^Well you can't make everyone happy.

#211
CulturalGeekGirl

CulturalGeekGirl
  • Members
  • 3 280 messages
I find it slightly amusing that someone with a Miranda's Ass banner is calling the Garrus and Tali romances fanservice, since the cannonical definition of Fanservice is T&A for the purpose of T&A.

Modifié par CulturalGeekGirl, 21 avril 2011 - 10:25 .


#212
Fiery Phoenix

Fiery Phoenix
  • Members
  • 18 968 messages

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...

I find it slightly amusing that someone with a Miranda's Ass banner is calling the Garrus and Tali romances fanservice, since the cannonical definition of Fanservice is T&A for the purpose of T&A.

:lol:

#213
Schattenkeil

Schattenkeil
  • Members
  • 350 messages

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...

I find it slightly amusing that someone with a Miranda's Ass banner is calling the Garrus and Tali romances fanservice, since the cannonical definition of Fanservice is T&A for the purpose of T&A.


B) It's not quite as hilarious as "I support boobs", though. Sounds like an underwear add for female Mass Effect fans to me. N7 bras with carbon fiber plating.

"I support Miranda's ass" simply raises the though of him bending over behind Miranda's desk for her to sit on. Everyone needs a stool, I guess.

Modifié par Schattenkeil, 21 avril 2011 - 10:54 .


#214
lovgreno

lovgreno
  • Members
  • 3 523 messages
By calling someone who likes something you don't like fanboys/girls you can get a false sense of superiority over them. You feel like you are among those few who are smart enough to like the "right" things. When things you don't like are included in the next game in the series you can blame it on those fanboys/girls who forces BioWare to "dumb down" the game. Because it is always most important that your opinions and wishes are fullfilled.

BioWare however have a more practical way of doing things: Listen to the consumers and try to give as many of them as possible what they want. Wich is fine by me, I don't expect to get what I want all the time.

#215
Zulu_DFA

Zulu_DFA
  • Members
  • 8 217 messages

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...

I find it slightly amusing that someone with a Miranda's Ass banner is calling the Garrus and Tali romances fanservice, since the cannonical definition of Fanservice is T&A for the purpose of T&A.

T&A in ME2 is a whole another matter, aka "squad armor & inventory".

But as far as the story and characters go, Miranda, as a "Cerberus cheerleader", fits perfectly in the story, while Garrus and Tali are there primarily for out-of-game reasons.

#216
CulturalGeekGirl

CulturalGeekGirl
  • Members
  • 3 280 messages

Zulu_DFA wrote...

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...

I find it slightly amusing that someone with a Miranda's Ass banner is calling the Garrus and Tali romances fanservice, since the cannonical definition of Fanservice is T&A for the purpose of T&A.

T&A in ME2 is a whole another matter, aka "squad armor & inventory".

But as far as the story and characters go, Miranda, as a "Cerberus cheerleader", fits perfectly in the story, while Garrus and Tali are there primarily for out-of-game reasons.


Yes, but we're not talking about Miranda's character. We're talking about her butt.

The term "fanservice" became popular on Usenet in the mid 90s, mostly in regards to anime fandom. In an episode where characters (often plot important characters, sometimes not) were inexplicably naked (or in bikinis, or in skin-tight jumpsuits), the Usenet people would point that out as "fanservice."

The term became more widespread in the late 90s, when the anime Evangelion became popular. The original Japanese promos would point out when an episode was going to contain gratuitousness by actually using the term "fanservice" or "saabisu." The VO would say something like "next episode: more fanservice," referring to a popular, plot-vital character showing her panties, or wearing a revealing outfit. The character's relevance to the plot doesn't determine whether or not a thing is fanservice, rather any visceral titilation is fanservice.

Later, this definition was expanded to include geek references, inexplicable giant robots, and basically anything that pandered to the audience.  Still, those who first used the phrase were primarily talking about scantily clad ladies.

This has been your internet history lesson! 

#217
Zulu_DFA

Zulu_DFA
  • Members
  • 8 217 messages

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...

Zulu_DFA wrote...

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...

I find it slightly amusing that someone with a Miranda's Ass banner is calling the Garrus and Tali romances fanservice, since the cannonical definition of Fanservice is T&A for the purpose of T&A.

T&A in ME2 is a whole another matter, aka "squad armor & inventory".

But as far as the story and characters go, Miranda, as a "Cerberus cheerleader", fits perfectly in the story, while Garrus and Tali are there primarily for out-of-game reasons.


Yes, but we're not talking about Miranda's character. We're talking about her butt.

The term "fanservice" became popular on Usenet in the mid 90s, mostly in regards to anime fandom. In an episode where characters (often plot important characters, sometimes not) were inexplicably naked (or in bikinis, or in skin-tight jumpsuits), the Usenet people would point that out as "fanservice."

The term became more widespread in the late 90s, when the anime Evangelion became popular. The original Japanese promos would point out when an episode was going to contain gratuitousness by actually using the term "fanservice" or "saabisu." The VO would say something like "next episode: more fanservice," referring to a popular, plot-vital character showing her panties, or wearing a revealing outfit. The character's relevance to the plot doesn't determine whether or not a thing is fanservice, rather any visceral titilation is fanservice.

Later, this definition was expanded to include geek references, inexplicable giant robots, and basically anything that pandered to the audience.  Still, those who first used the phrase were primarily talking about scantily clad ladies.

This has been your internet history lesson! 


So how does Miranda's butt cancel the fact that Garrus and Tali made it to the ME2 squad for no other reason, than to please people who, in the ME universe, have way over a hundred years since been dead?

#218
Leonia

Leonia
  • Members
  • 9 496 messages
It makes good sense to keep some of the old squad in ME2, it also makes sense that Shepard would feel close enough to those characters to pursue a romance with them (everyone from the ME1 is romanceable except poor Wrex). I'm not saying Miranda (and her *ahem* assets) aren't as important as a character or as a LI, but to simply say "That's fanservice and it shouldn't be in the game!" isn't very helpful either. A lot of things are fanservice, as this thread has shown, to take out any of them would hurt some portion of the fanbase. May as well not rock the boat and keep the fanservice items there, especially the ones that make sense (returning squad-mates from ME1 with LI potential). Not all of the fanservice is sensical (I'm a straight woman, I'm not attracted to Miranda's ass, sorry) but who said all of the fanservice had to make a lot of sense?

#219
Zeratul20

Zeratul20
  • Members
  • 699 messages

Zulu_DFA wrote...

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...

Zulu_DFA wrote...

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...

I find it slightly amusing that someone with a Miranda's Ass banner is calling the Garrus and Tali romances fanservice, since the cannonical definition of Fanservice is T&A for the purpose of T&A.

T&A in ME2 is a whole another matter, aka "squad armor & inventory".

But as far as the story and characters go, Miranda, as a "Cerberus cheerleader", fits perfectly in the story, while Garrus and Tali are there primarily for out-of-game reasons.


Yes, but we're not talking about Miranda's character. We're talking about her butt.

The term "fanservice" became popular on Usenet in the mid 90s, mostly in regards to anime fandom. In an episode where characters (often plot important characters, sometimes not) were inexplicably naked (or in bikinis, or in skin-tight jumpsuits), the Usenet people would point that out as "fanservice."

The term became more widespread in the late 90s, when the anime Evangelion became popular. The original Japanese promos would point out when an episode was going to contain gratuitousness by actually using the term "fanservice" or "saabisu." The VO would say something like "next episode: more fanservice," referring to a popular, plot-vital character showing her panties, or wearing a revealing outfit. The character's relevance to the plot doesn't determine whether or not a thing is fanservice, rather any visceral titilation is fanservice.

Later, this definition was expanded to include geek references, inexplicable giant robots, and basically anything that pandered to the audience.  Still, those who first used the phrase were primarily talking about scantily clad ladies.

This has been your internet history lesson! 


So how does Miranda's butt cancel the fact that Garrus and Tali made it to the ME2 squad for no other reason, than to please people who, in the ME universe, have way over a hundred years since been dead?

It doesn't. I think she just tried to point out that it's odd for someone who supports one (somewhat more blatant) kind of fanservice to simultanuously denounce the other "fanservice" characters.

#220
vader da slayer

vader da slayer
  • Members
  • 479 messages
looking at it from what goes on in the stories of ME1/2 the Garrus romance looks like pure fan service while the Tali romance does have some believability to it (even though its probably straight up fan service as well).

Modifié par vader da slayer, 21 avril 2011 - 11:21 .


#221
CulturalGeekGirl

CulturalGeekGirl
  • Members
  • 3 280 messages

Zulu_DFA wrote...

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...

Zulu_DFA wrote...

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...

I find it slightly amusing that someone with a Miranda's Ass banner is calling the Garrus and Tali romances fanservice, since the cannonical definition of Fanservice is T&A for the purpose of T&A.

T&A in ME2 is a whole another matter, aka "squad armor & inventory".

But as far as the story and characters go, Miranda, as a "Cerberus cheerleader", fits perfectly in the story, while Garrus and Tali are there primarily for out-of-game reasons.


Yes, but we're not talking about Miranda's character. We're talking about her butt.

The term "fanservice" became popular on Usenet in the mid 90s, mostly in regards to anime fandom. In an episode where characters (often plot important characters, sometimes not) were inexplicably naked (or in bikinis, or in skin-tight jumpsuits), the Usenet people would point that out as "fanservice."

The term became more widespread in the late 90s, when the anime Evangelion became popular. The original Japanese promos would point out when an episode was going to contain gratuitousness by actually using the term "fanservice" or "saabisu." The VO would say something like "next episode: more fanservice," referring to a popular, plot-vital character showing her panties, or wearing a revealing outfit. The character's relevance to the plot doesn't determine whether or not a thing is fanservice, rather any visceral titilation is fanservice.

Later, this definition was expanded to include geek references, inexplicable giant robots, and basically anything that pandered to the audience.  Still, those who first used the phrase were primarily talking about scantily clad ladies.

This has been your internet history lesson! 


So how does Miranda's butt cancel the fact that Garrus and Tali made it to the ME2 squad for no other reason, than to please people who, in the ME universe, have way over a hundred years since been dead?


It doesn't.

All romances in ME are fanservice. I never said they weren't. I just found it amusing that someone whose banner reflects the classic definition of fanservice would feel the need to call out an instance of the more modern, less central definition.

Miranda's whole appearance is fanservice. Renegade Shepard's badass lines are fanservice. Recurring characters are fanservice. Seth Green is fanservice. Lair of the Shadow Broker is fanservice. Punching al'Jilani is fanservice. Paragon kiss interrupt is fanservice.

(But back in 1994, when the term was invented, only Miranda's butt, Jack's chest, and possibly Jacob's Abs would have been considered fanservice. While I appreciate that the term has expanded since then, as someone who heard the term back when it applied exclusively to T&A, the irony is delicious.)

Modifié par CulturalGeekGirl, 21 avril 2011 - 11:23 .


#222
Zeratul20

Zeratul20
  • Members
  • 699 messages
Woohoo, I got it right.

#223
Zulu_DFA

Zulu_DFA
  • Members
  • 8 217 messages

Zeratul20 wrote...

It doesn't. I think she just tried to point out that it's odd for someone who supports one (somewhat more blatant) kind of fanservice to simultanuously denounce the other "fanservice" characters.

What is more blatant: a character brought back solely for the sake fan service, or a character that fits well in the story, and happens to carry an element of fan service?

Miranda's butt wouldn't be a problem at all if it did not encroach upon the inventory / squad armor / immersion in combat / vacuum / toxic atmosphere situations.

Tali and Garrus, on the other hand, took away time and money from other, more relevant characters' development, carried serious discontinuity issues regarding certain story elements in ME1, and were the most dull characters on the Normandy, unless romanced.

#224
AdmiralCheez

AdmiralCheez
  • Members
  • 12 990 messages
Impression I'm getting from this thread:

I would never consider romancing Garrus or Tali and did not forsee Bioware taking their character development in that direction = ZOMG IT'S ALL JUST FANSERVICE THE STUPID FANS BROKE ME2!!!

Anyway, "fanservice" is simply giving the fans either something they want to see (Talimance) or something the writers presume they want to see (nearly everything about Miranda). It is often divorced from the main plot and doesn't necessarily denote cheap sexual content.

As many others have stated, all romantic subplots are technically fanservice. So, too, are any cases of T&A (the cheap kind) AND any other content that was requested by the fans (the often good kind, as it shows that the writers are paying attention to the fanbase).

Neither Garrus nor Tali paraded their sexy bits around, and as both romances are entirely optional, they do not force either character to develop in that direction. If you feel that a Garrus/Talimance cheapens that character, simply hit the "do not want" button and it is never brought up at all. Yes, Tali still admits that she trusts you with her life and has developed a bit of a crush on you, but considering your heroics in ME1 and all you've done on her behalf in ME2, this is not unforseeable. Liara and Kadian (if you play FemShep) both kind of crushed on you in ME1, anyway, and so does Thane in ME2 if you're simply nice to him (I heard that "siha" line, pal).

Bottom line: Fussing about the inclusion of entirely optional content just because you do not plan on taking advantage of it is a bit immature. Likewise, b*tching because the writers took a certain plotline or character in a direction you did not like does not mean that they have "broken" that aspect of the story.

I am not a huge fan of Tali and did not imagine her becoming an LI, but the inclusion of a romantic subplot with her in ME2 didn't bother me or make her character seem cheaper/derailed. As someone who pays close attention to writing and character development in any medium and tends to have a stick up my butt about it, I feel comfortable saying, yeah, it was fanservice, but not badfanservice. If there had been abundant Tali buttshots and close-ups of her boobs, then I would have raged pretty hard, but hey, the closet Tali comes to being objectified in-game is when Ken references the snugness of her envirosuit. I'd say that's no worse than the creepy neck-stroke that Saren's assassin gave her in ME1.

Here's a couple fun questions for you all: Would you have preferred that no characters from ME1 made a return? Would you rather have Bioware never include anything suggested by fans?

#225
Zulu_DFA

Zulu_DFA
  • Members
  • 8 217 messages

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...

Miranda's whole appearance is fanservice. Renegade Shepard's badass lines are fanservice. Recurring characters are fanservice. Seth Green is fanservice. Lair of the Shadow Broker is fanservice. Punching al'Jilani is fanservice. Paragon kiss interrupt is fanservice.

And all of it is bad, and detracted from ME2, making it super-cheesy. Except for Seth Green, who isn't exactly fan service, but a comic relief.