108 réponses à ce sujet

[Potato Power]

Cerberus is bad, but honestly? Using Reaper Tech to beat the Reapers seems more logical than "The Illusive Man is bad, you can't have this stuff!"
I often find that the Renegade choices in the game make no sense, and end in you just being an ass for the sake of it, but this is one of the only major choices that makes sense, and your teammates act like you're a child molester if you go Renegade. It just makes no sense.
Thoughts?

[Cutlass Jack]

My thought is that keeping that base is about the stupidest decision you could make next to sleeping with Morinth.



The base was a factory for distilling humans into a reaper. If that's the tech we need to win, It amounts to doing the Reaper's job for them.

[Barker673]

Yes.

[Zhijn]

Your handing over a ship that is build to liquify humans!. Eeeww.



And not only that, after you finish the paragon choice TIM shows his true face as to why he wanted it. =P

[Potato Power]

Zhijn wrote...

Your handing over a ship that is build to liquify humans!. Eeeww.

And not only that, after you finish the paragon choice TIM shows his true face as to why he wanted it. =P

Never actually DID the Renegade choice, but I figure it has something to do with using it to make humanity more powerful... Yeah I guess this is more Black/White than I thought.

[DarkNova50]

Somehow, taking a factory that liquifies sentient species and then turns them into behemoth machines hell bent on culling all life, and handing it over to a guy with no scruples whatsoever seems like a really, really bad idea.



Althought it would be amusing to see a massive Reaper in the shape of The Illusive Man.

[MoonstormX19]

I wouldnt call it black and white at all. There is Logic Behind both Keeping it and Destroying it.

The Main Logic behind blowing it to hell is that while it may help us against the reapers, What the Illusive man is willing to use it for after that is FAR from worth it. In his hands he will be willing to destory the reapers and beyond. And I'll be damned if I let my Good Shepard destory the reapers only to have to face down Illusive and a army of whatever the hell he comes up with made from the Lifes of 5 Billion Aliens.

[Khayness]

It's the Anvil of the Void of the future. Only a bit larger.

[KainrycKarr]

Answer me this; what has happened every time someone has tried to study/use Reaper tech and tech that is connected with 'em?

Here's a hint. Ask Saren, Benezia, and the Cerberus team on the Derelict reaper.

Combine that with TIM's whole "CERBERUS IS HUMANITY" line and..

Well come on now.

IF indoctrination was not a threat, then maybe.

IF the person you're handing that kind of technology is NOT one step away from referring to himself as an entity/semi-deity

Then sure. There are merits. But in context? Hell to the nizzaw. It's like asking yourself "Hmm, what if i stuck this fork in the electrical socket..."

Modifié par KainrycKarr, 18 février 2010 - 08:04 .

[Kaiser Shepard]

Did anyone just destroy the base to spite TIM for being responsible for Akuze?

[The Governator]

Cutlass Jack wrote...

My thought is that keeping that base is about the stupidest decision you could make next to sleeping with Morinth.

The base was a factory for distilling humans into a reaper. If that's the tech we need to win, It amounts to doing the Reaper's job for them.

There are a lot of choices that do not seem to fit the alignment they are supposed to support.  For example, I did not think saving the tainted genophage data was wise.  It agrees with the ends justify the means because you cannot make something noble out of something ignoble.  It is taking a short cut which a Paragon Shepard fights hard to avoid.  Sometimes people DO die for nothing, and that is tragic.  Why exacerbate that by propping something that is supposed to be good upon the evil deeds that preceeded it?  It makes no sense to me.  In my view it is, simply, selling out.

Destroying the Collector base is difficult.  Someone wrote a 3 page article explaining plot holes and discussed that in detail suggesting that the false binary choice is insulting at best.  Well, my thinking is that just because you found A (singular) Collector base does not mean you find all of them.  Saving it means they could recapture it, do damage control and start anew without significant setbacks.  It means Shepard sacrificed his/her values (again, shortest path to victory) to secure an advantage against the collectors when it seems clear that if the galaxy could mobilize against the threat it would be capable of stopping these things.  It also means that any number of opportunists who are not of the Collectors could do 'galaxy-knows-what' with that technology.

[Prophetiks]

I went paragon with my first playthrough and made the choice to not destroy it. Frankly very little is known about the Reapers, anything to help give insight into that is helpful. I also think though TIM isn't as nasty as everyone thinks he is....time will tell!

[mangadan]

Hold on though, some renegade Sheps would be all in favour of turning a few hundred billion turians into a state of the art fleet if that was the price of saving the galaxy, particularly if it ensured human dominance in the process. Renshep has never shied away from making big decisions, which are frequently fatal to a lot of non-mission-critical civilians. More to the point, I'm sure that there was technology there worth salvaging other than the people reprocessor.

My renshep decided that TIM's idea was just too impractical and risky to be worth following through. But then he has a tendency to choke at the climactic moment. All that tough guy stuff is just bluster.

Modifié par mangadan, 18 février 2010 - 08:17 .

[TerribleTruth]

Hummanity is about to start a war with thousands of species enslaving, dreadnought sized space squids, and you throw away your chance to learn something about them to give you an edge?
Lawful stupid.

Modifié par TerribleTruth, 18 février 2010 - 08:22 .

[UnAffectedFiddle]

I guess it came down to this for me.



Your about to fight a species that has successfully ended all advanced life in this part of the universe for god knows how long. They have technology where one ship could have destroyed most of the fleet if it had not panicked and raced into the Citadel and let its guard down to control Saren. They have been studying genetic material for millions of years and have had very small if any major setbacks. These are true end of the world times.



Who cares if Cerberus has poor intentions AFTER the Reaper threat. So far they have been pretty good trying to bring every species up to speed for a united front (not always in the nicest way, but still).



More importantly, to lose this fight on principles, while "nice" does mean the extinction of every single space capable race in the Milky Way. Its nice that your pride may endanger billions and billions and billions of lives. But every animal would fight tooth and nail against extinction and this is what we are facing.



If Cerberus use it for nefarious means after, well least we can be happy there is an after.

[Abirn]

Cutlass Jack wrote...

My thought is that keeping that base is about the stupidest decision you could make next to sleeping with Morinth.

The base was a factory for distilling humans into a reaper. If that's the tech we need to win, It amounts to doing the Reaper's job for them.

The situation is whats called a "win at all costs" scenario.  It doesn't matter how many humans would have to be made into dna soup, the survival of humanity as a whole is preferable to extinction.

[Gavinthelocust]

You would have thought that Miranda may have a problem with destroying the thing but she is all happy about betraying her boss and organization.

[UnAffectedFiddle]

Also, the Thannix Cannon is based off Reaper tech. Did anyone not buy the upgrade because of it? The relay technology is Reaper made...and so on.

[generic username]

Remember the whole "advancing along the paths we desire by using our technology" talk Sovereign gave you?

Yeah.

[Frotality]

for all the eendless logic and reasoning you can apply to one choice or the other, shepard either wont "comprimise who i am":sick: or instead of considering the vast potential and thousands of uses of the base, you are forced to hand it over to one power hungry terrorist organization.

they really couldnt hand us a neutral choice like ME1? the middle ground between "epic sacrifice for great council saving justice" and  "let the motherf**kers burn"? was it so hard to get meer and hale to say "i'll keep the base, but not for you."? did your contract with them run out just before you got around to recording the neutral option? whats going on here?!

[UnAffectedFiddle]

The thing is you can always destroy the base later. Its kinda hard to say during the invasion



"Gee, we cant penetrate their shields...kinda wish we had better technology".



Though I can understand the worry, look how Mordin describes giving Nuclear technology to a race unprepared for it i.e. Krogan. It is better to earn knowledge than simply be handed it on a silver platter.



Still, the impact on the third game of keeping it is simply staggeringly monumental to pass up. It will be fun to walk the linee between becoming like the Reapers or using technology wisely.

[Skyblade012]

There is a reason you get both Paragon and Renegade points no matter which decision you make.

[Jeremy Winston]

Abirn wrote...

Cutlass Jack wrote...

My thought is that keeping that base is about the stupidest decision you could make next to sleeping with Morinth.

The base was a factory for distilling humans into a reaper. If that's the tech we need to win, It amounts to doing the Reaper's job for them.

The situation is whats called a "win at all costs" scenario.  It doesn't matter how many humans would have to be made into dna soup, the survival of humanity as a whole is preferable to extinction.

Actually, from a true paragon point of view, extinction is preferable to compromising principles.  This is why so many good stories exist about fallen heros who fell exactly because they fell into the trap of thinking that they had to "win at all costs."

[Br0th3rGr1mm]

If it has Reaper tech, it has the possiblity of indoctrination associated with it.



While I agree that the absolute black and white associated with your choice is kind of naive (as is the reaction of EVERYONE in the crew), using the Reaper tech is simply asking for trouble.

[Beechwell]

Frotality wrote...
they really couldnt hand us a neutral choice like ME1? the middle ground between "epic sacrifice for great council saving justice" and  "let the motherf**kers burn"? was it so hard to get meer and hale to say "i'll keep the base, but not for you."?

I honestly doubt Shepard has much say in who gets the station. The only way to it is through the Omega 4 relay and the only one possessing the key to that is EDI, a Cerberus AI. My guess is that if you tell EDI to forward the IFF to the Alliance or Council, you'd get an "I'm sorry, Shepard. But I'm afraid I can't do that."