43796 réponses à ce sujet

[kraidy1117]

fongiel24 wrote...

kraidy1117 wrote...

jtav wrote...

Yes, I did. Both yours and fongiel's.

What do I have in store? A good bit of trouble for Miranda. As always. But I'm hoping it goes easier than writing Shep/Miranda. I'm no good at that.

can't wait. Also it's sad that us fans can write better stuff then what is written by people who are paid to do it. I think Walters should just go back to writing characters.

The fan fiction community can put out some impressive work, but I'd hesitate to call it better than what ME2's writers did. Writing a video game is different from writing fiction because the medium is different. Us fans can use thousands of words to express a character and his or her backstory. ME2's writers have a cap of several hundred words per character, tops, and they don't have the benefit of writing exposition to explain their intentions. Without Walters and Karpyshyn, we have no Miranda to discuss or write stories about.

On another note, I just finished Karpyshyn's first ME novel, Ascension, and I have to be honest. It's... meh . I found the characters too flat. Anderson is too good and Saren is too evil. I never really found myself caring. The overall storyline is good, but I'm starting to understand why Bioware brought Walters in as lead writer for ME2.

Thats not Ascension, your thinking of the first book. Walters is realy good at characters, something Drew is not good at, but Drew is realy good at the overall plot, where Walters is not. I am a little biased for Drew tho since he did do BG2, KOTOR, Jade Empire and Mass Effect story

[TheSixthghoul]

jtav wrote...

That's not a bad idea. I'm about ready to scrap this and go back to writing about Miranda and Thane, but I'll turn this over in my head in the meantime and see if I can flesh it out in an interesting way.

Miranda and Thane? Okay, how the team doesn't even talk to each other and why?

[jtav]

And fanfic writers also have the luxury of being specific. For instance, Shepard in that Miranda/Thane story holds Miranda in open contempt and doesn't nudge her into talking to Oriana. I don't have to account for any players who'd RP him differently. Walters does.

[Collider]

Hindsight is always 20/20. It's very easy for us to criticize other people's work because we didn't actually write it, we spot things that they wouldn't. Whoever wrote (Walters?) the squad mates in ME2 did a fantastic job. And its' very true that video games are a different medium - you need to compact everything, and every word of dialog spoken may have greater weight and importance because you don't have the advantage of the omniscient third person narrative in most books.

[kraidy1117]

Collider wrote...

Hindsight is always 20/20. It's very easy for us to criticize other people's work because we didn't actually write it, we spot things that they wouldn't. Whoever wrote (Walters?) the squad mates in ME2 did a fantastic job. And its' very true that video games are a different medium - you need to compact everything, and every word of dialog spoken may have greater weight and importance because you don't have the advantage of the omniscient third person narrative in most books.

I beleive Walters only did Garrus and wrex, could be wrong tho. I know Legion had a diffrent writer, so does Jack. I think the writer for Jack also did Miri but again I don't know. All I know is that Walters is not a good story teller, hes fantastic at characters, but not story tellnig. Drew is good at story telling, but weak when it ocmes to characters, this can be seen in the ME books. Both books had very strong stories, but a weak cast of characters.Then we look at the comic, strong characters, but lacks a strong story.

[jtav]

Sixth Goul wrote...

jtav wrote...

That's not a bad idea. I'm about ready to scrap this and go back to writing about Miranda and Thane, but I'll turn this over in my head in the meantime and see if I can flesh it out in an interesting way.

Miranda and Thane? Okay, how the team doesn't even talk to each other and why?

I think their personalities would gel nicely and I find them both interesting?

[kraidy1117]

Well I will be gone for half an hour, Chuck is on.

[Garrus is Hot]

Me too I Chuck

[Collider]

kraidy1117 wrote...

Collider wrote...

Hindsight is always 20/20. It's very easy for us to criticize other people's work because we didn't actually write it, we spot things that they wouldn't. Whoever wrote (Walters?) the squad mates in ME2 did a fantastic job. And its' very true that video games are a different medium - you need to compact everything, and every word of dialog spoken may have greater weight and importance because you don't have the advantage of the omniscient third person narrative in most books.

I beleive Walters only did Garrus and wrex, could be wrong tho. I know Legion had a diffrent writer, so does Jack. I think the writer for Jack also did Miri but again I don't know. All I know is that Walters is not a good story teller, hes fantastic at characters, but not story tellnig. Drew is good at story telling, but weak when it ocmes to characters, this can be seen in the ME books. Both books had very strong stories, but a weak cast of characters.Then we look at the comic, strong characters, but lacks a strong story.

It would be grand if they worked in unison.

[kraidy1117]

Collider wrote...

kraidy1117 wrote...

Collider wrote...

Hindsight is always 20/20. It's very easy for us to criticize other people's work because we didn't actually write it, we spot things that they wouldn't. Whoever wrote (Walters?) the squad mates in ME2 did a fantastic job. And its' very true that video games are a different medium - you need to compact everything, and every word of dialog spoken may have greater weight and importance because you don't have the advantage of the omniscient third person narrative in most books.

I beleive Walters only did Garrus and wrex, could be wrong tho. I know Legion had a diffrent writer, so does Jack. I think the writer for Jack also did Miri but again I don't know. All I know is that Walters is not a good story teller, hes fantastic at characters, but not story tellnig. Drew is good at story telling, but weak when it ocmes to characters, this can be seen in the ME books. Both books had very strong stories, but a weak cast of characters.Then we look at the comic, strong characters, but lacks a strong story.

It would be grand if they worked in unison.

Thats why I am realy hoping that Drew writes the main story for ME3, and Walters leads the character writers. If ME3 isl ike that ,then ME3 will be very strong. However Drew is doing the story for Biwoares MMO

[TheSixthghoul]

I was just thinking why couldn't you kill Wilson? The moment I heard his voice when talking to Jacob I knew he was the traitor. It was made so predictable how he shoot himself, how he said their where mech's after him with no mech's around so obvious that you should have been able to kill him.

[Collider]

Sixth Goul wrote...

I was just thinking why couldn't you kill Wilson? The moment I heard his voice when talking to Jacob I knew he was the traitor. It was made so predictable how he shoot himself, how he said their where mech's after him with no mech's around so obvious that you should have been able to kill him.

Because Miranda needs to kill him. It's part of her femme fatal image. It was basically how they introduced her character. Very calculating. 

[TheSixthghoul]

Collider wrote...

Sixth Goul wrote...

I was just thinking why couldn't you kill Wilson? The moment I heard his voice when talking to Jacob I knew he was the traitor. It was made so predictable how he shoot himself, how he said their where mech's after him with no mech's around so obvious that you should have been able to kill him.

Because Miranda needs to kill him. It's part of her femme fatal image. It was basically how they introduced her character. Very calculating. 

But, it makes Shepard look like Jacob and thats just wrong on ever level.

[jtav]

Of course, the femme fatale aspect gets severely watered down once you leave Freedom's Progress. Pity.

[kraidy1117]

jtav wrote...

Of course, the femme fatale aspect gets severely watered down once you leave Freedom's Progress. Pity.

This. Miri is still a well-written character, but she is a very water down femme fatale.

[jtav]

Sixth Goul wrote...

But, it makes Shepard look like Jacob and thats just wrong on ever level.

You really don't like Jacob, do you? I like him as long as I'm playing MaleShep and I like Miranda/Jacob in a way, though he'd need some serious development for it to actually work long term.

[fongiel24]

jtav wrote...

Of course, the femme fatale aspect gets severely watered down once you leave Freedom's Progress. Pity.

I don't even think she's displays her femme fatale side at all during ME2. She's just a very competent field operative who happens to kill people occasionally as a part of the job. When I think of a femme fatal, I think of a figure like Mata Hari, a woman who uses her charms to kill as much as her weapons. In ME2, Miranda is a straight shooter (no pun intended). She has a mission and she just does it. When she interacts with Shepard, she tells him exactly what's on her mind. I can see Miranda having been more of a femme fatale in other missions in her career, but I don't get that impression in ME2.

[fongiel24]

jtav wrote...

Sixth Goul wrote...

But, it makes Shepard look like Jacob and thats just wrong on ever level.

You really don't like Jacob, do you? I like him as long as I'm playing MaleShep and I like Miranda/Jacob in a way, though he'd need some serious development for it to actually work long term.

Probably the wrong thread to ask this in, but this got me thinking and I'll give it a shot anyways.

I'm trying to add additional perspectives to something I'm working on right now but I need some help. Disregarding Bioware's lacklustre character work in ME2, who is Jacob? What makes him tick? He's clearly idealistic, but where does he draw the lines in his relationship with Cerberus?

[Collider]

Seems I've been been using femme fatale in correctly here, though it was just a general term for an able killer who was a woman. So what I meant to say really, that Miranda was to be portrayed as very methodical and calculating.

[Markinator_123]

Miranda is a classic anti-hero.

[jtav]

Don't forget ruthless and morally ambiguous. I really thought there'd be some question as to her loyalty to you. I also expected the fact that she worked for Very Bad People to be brought up even more. She's a member of a terrorist organization.

[TheSixthghoul]

jtav wrote...

Sixth Goul wrote...

But, it makes Shepard look like Jacob and thats just wrong on ever level.

You really don't like Jacob, do you? I like him as long as I'm playing MaleShep and I like Miranda/Jacob in a way, though he'd need some serious development for it to actually work long term.

I don't hate him, he's a decent sidekick at least. I haven't killed him of in a playthrougth if that count's. I treat him way better then I do Jack or Alistair example social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/47/index/2376091. He's the me 2 version of Alistair that renegades have to deal with for a time. To put in another way he doesn't fit mt Shepard's ideal's of  a useful teammate, he's cannon fodder who think's he's Shepards equal that what I don't like about him.

[kraidy1117]

I don't like Jacob.......... I like Miri.

[jtav]

Markinator_123 wrote...

Miranda is a classic anti-hero.

And I like her that way. I like the side she displays with Oriana and during her romance, but I want her to keep that edge she has.

[Markinator_123]

jtav wrote...

Don't forget ruthless and morally ambiguous. I really thought there'd be some question as to her loyalty to you. I also expected the fact that she worked for Very Bad People to be brought up even more. She's a member of a terrorist organization.

How about we make this all easier? Everything goes into gray in Mass Effect. Even my Shepard isn't a saint and everybody on the team has their own moral ambiguity.