50907 réponses à ce sujet

[jlb524]

This picture makes me think of Lizard for some reason.







Evil!Liara?

[jlb524]

yorkj86 wrote...

Scheming Liara is scheming...

That's 'you just called me obsessed how dare you!' Liara.

[tommyt_1994]

jlb524 wrote...

yorkj86 wrote...

Scheming Liara is scheming...

That's 'you just called me obsessed how dare you!' Liara.

Yeah I never fully understood the reasoning behind everyone saying that Liara is obsessed with Shep. Where is all that coming from? The events from Redemption? Oh and speaking of Redemption, I've seen that a lotof Liara fans dislike the comic because ofher OOCness. Why do you guys think she was acting OOC? I've only read it once, but I never really looked deeply into it.

Also: I heard something about caster classes getting an update/new research with LotSB, is there any truth to this?

Modifié par tommyt_1994, 29 août 2010 - 01:57 .

[jlb524]

tommyt_1994 wrote...

Yeah I never fully understood the reasoning behind everyone saying that Liara is obsessed with Shep. Where is all that coming from? The events from Redemption? Oh and speaking of Redemption, I've seen that a lotof Liara fans dislike the comic because ofher OOCness. Why do you guys think she was acting OOC? I've only read it once, but I never really looked deeply into it.

I don't understand why some say Liara is obsessed either.  I didn't know this until recently, but Shepard can tell Liara in ME1 that she is obsessed with her/him.  I thnk Liara's reaction is very telling.  She isn't obsessed with the Commander, but interested, as most are, given that Shepard is thrust into the position as the 'Champion of Humanity'.  A curious and thoughtful person such as Liara would naturally want to find out more about Shepard, but this is hardly an obsession.  She basically tells Shepard that all eyes will be on them, given their position as humanity's first Spectre, and that they should stop being an egotistical, narcissistic jerk-off that thinks everything in the galaxy just revolves around them.  She says this nicer, though.

The 'obsessed' accusations actually started pre-Redemption, but got worse with the release of the comic.  I guess b/c she gave up so much to help the Commander, that some think this was driven by an unhealthy obsession.  I look at it differently.  I've always seen Liara as having great respect for Shepard, in spite of her/him being a complete beyotch, in spite of them not returning romantic feelings.  Liara has respect for what Shepard represents (humanity's champion, the only one that can probably stop the Reapers, etc.) but she also has respect for Shepard the person that exists beyond all of that.  It's not enough for her to just know Shepard the hero...she wants a greater appreciation of the person that exists there and is curious as to what events from their past led them to be in the current position they are in.  She comes to appreciate and understand this person for what they are, even if she doesn't agree with their methods.

So I feel that Liara's mission in Redemption was her way of showing some final respects towards both the figure that is Shepard and the person that lies underneath.  I think what she did was quite honorable, and hate when people trivialize it by calling her 'obsessed' or 'crazy'.  I think they are putting too much emphasis on the romantic aspect.  I wonder if Liara was not a romance option in ME1 and if she didn't show interest in Shepard, if people would feel the same way?

As for OOC-ness in Redemption, it's mainly because Liara's reactions in the comic don't seem very 'thoughful' and mainly impulsive, and we all know that this goes against her ME1 depiction.  I think the reason is just the comic medium had limited this, and Liara was turned into an 'action hero'.  

Modifié par jlb524, 29 août 2010 - 02:12 .

[jtav]

As someone who did call Liara obsessed at one point, it's the "I couldn't let you go" line. It made her seem as if she were pining to an unhealthy degree, especially since I wasn't romancing her. I was also under the erroneous impression that she recovered the body specifically because Cerberus said they could resurrect him/her.

[jlb524]

jtav wrote...

As someone who did call Liara obsessed at one point, it's the "I couldn't let you go" line. It made her seem as if she were pining to an unhealthy degree, especially since I wasn't romancing her. I was also under the erroneous impression that she recovered the body specifically because Cerberus said they could resurrect him/her.

Oh yeah...that line is problematic.  I don't see why that line couldn't be interpreted as merely 'friendly' though. 

It could be that Liara still has very deep but platonic feelings for a Shepard that did not return her feelings in ME1.  I could see a really good friend wanting to do and say the same as Liara did in Redemption and ME2.  Of course, most Liaramancers interpreted it as being deeply romantic, but I don't think this is necessarily the case.  I think that is an example of a line that is free to interpretation. 

What I think isn't debatable is that Liara does care for Shepard the person on some level, given all the steps she took to get to know Shepard on a personal level, more than just the 'Galactic Savior/First Human Spectre'.  Shepard touched her and changed her life....it would be difficult to let this person go, I think.  Even if Liara has given up on hopes of romance.  

I think that Liara is the squad mate that most respects Shepard as the person, and not just as the [i]symbol[/i[ and what the represent.  She wanted to know what shaped them into the person they are now.  I'm sure some will argue with me though :)

[jlb524]

yorkj86 wrote...

People call Liara obsessed for several reasons.

First, they consider how quickly she takes to Shepard in ME1.  People who choose not to romance Liara in ME1 know how easy it is to get in to the romance arc with her, even if it's done by accident.

I always found this to be ridiculous.  That's B.S.  I can understand accidently romancing Ash or Kaidan, but Liara?

Liara:  I'm interested in you, do you feel the same?

Shepard's options

1)  Yes!!!!!!
2)  I just want to be friends.
3) Hell no!!!!!

Could they make it more obvious?

yorkj86 wrote...

Second, they look at how dedicated she is to obtaining Shepard's body.  They question her motivations.  They might think that her motivations border on obsession.  After all, she's the only one of the ME1 teammates who cared about Shepard after his
death.

Well...they couldn't really use any one else there.  Three of the ME1 squad mates could be dead, and they were  planning on using Tali and Garrus in ME2. 

Plus, I think being the only one to care about Shepard and her/his death is a good thing.  People should like and appreciate her for this and not call her 'crazy' or 'obsessed'.   Again, I wonder if she wasn't an ME1 romance option if most would feel this way?

Modifié par jlb524, 29 août 2010 - 02:41 .

[jlb524]

yorkj86 wrote...

I also think that they see a disconnection between how the asari typically act, and how Liara acts. She's acting un-asari-like in doing all of this, and then, at the end of Redemption, voices her thoughts about the human obsession with resurrection. They think that her obsession is what's causing her to act like this.

How do you think she is acting 'un-asari like' to them?  I know the asari take a 'philosophical approach' to their unions, but Redemption assumes a Liara that did not meld with Shepard...no union.

[jlb524]

yorkj86 wrote...

EDIT: What's with everyone changing their avatars?

It's just me...out of boredom.

I understand what you said.   Perhaps Liara just felt it wasn't Shepard's time?

[Nerdage]

Liara's efforts to "save" Shepard could simply stem from Shepard saving her from the geth on Therum, whereas most of the other companions are just people you meet who want to help with your mission, Liara most likely feels indebted to Shepard for saving her, feelings which could've mutated into guilt after Shepard dies. She's relatively young/'immature' during ME1 after all, I doubt she could cope with sudden loss as well as older Asari (though she didn't seem to go through as much trouble to try and redeem Benezia, perhaps that contributed to her desire to save Shep? Maybe she blamed Benezia's death on her own inaction?).

Which could also explain why she's going to such trouble to rescue Feron, his being captured during Shepard's 'rescue' probably just shifted alot of her feelings of debt/guilt to him.

While you do also save Ashley on Eden Prime, she's more used to such situations being a soldier, and her religious beliefs probably allowed her to rationalize Shepard's death as a good thing.

That's the best reason I can think of for her saving a non-romance - or even openly hostile - Shepard, anyway.

Edit: added a bit.

Modifié par nerdage, 29 août 2010 - 03:23 .

[jlb524]

That's a good point, nerdage. Liara is still a Maiden after all. She's 'restless' and a 'go getter' and is probably unlike most elder asari in that they would take a more accepting philosophical approach to death. Liara has also not experienced much death herself, until the events of ME1 where she loses both Benezia and Shepard, her friend and/or lover.



She's a Maiden....they want to go out and do things...experience the galaxy. It's not odd that she would be doing what she is doing now then, IMO.

[Cyricsservant101]

jlb524 wrote... I always found this to be ridiculous.  That's B.S.  I can understand accidently romancing Ash or Kaidan, but Liara?

Liara:  I'm interested in you, do you feel the same?

Shepard's options

1)  Yes!!!!!!
2)  I just want to be friends.
3) Hell no!!!!!

Could they make it more obvious?

It's fairly obvious how to initiate a romance with Liara, and unlike the others she can't stealth-romance you. The thing to keep in mind though is how unhealthy her and Shep's relationship can be, and how persistent Liara is after you express interest in her.

You can be incredibly rude to her and she'll still express interest in you... and if you say something like "I'm interested in you and Ashley, want a three-way?" BAM! You're stuck in a permanent romance with Liara. Feel free to renegade her for the rest of the game, but she'll only beg you not to "push her away" before lunging at your face like a succubus. And when she visits your personal quarters for a 5-minute romp before heading out to save the universe, it takes no less than four firm denials to get her to go away.

It also doesn't help that whenever you try to talk with Liara about her people's "culture" all she wants to talk about is mating.

Personally, I'm glad Liara underwent a change. I have nothing against Liara the niave, 100+ year old virgin, closet-nymphomaniac, but she was a bit too one-dimensional for me prior her transformation.

yorkj86 wrote...

Plus, I think being the only one to care about Shepard and her/his death is a good thing.  People should like and appreciate her for this and not call her 'crazy' or 'obsessed'.   Again, I wonder if she wasn't an ME1 romance option if most would feel this way?

I liked it too. It's a display of unconditional love... which does border on obsession. I mean, Shepard's a corpse at this point. I'm sure the other crew members mourned his death too (*points to Garrus' self-destructive behavior*), but it's true that only Liara was interested in safe-guarding Shepard's remains.

Modifié par Cyricsservant101, 29 août 2010 - 09:35 .

[Marcin K]

hey all

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

Cyricsservant101 wrote...


I liked it too. It's a display of unconditional love... which does border on obsession. I mean, Shepard's a corpse at this point. I'm sure the other crew members mourned his death too (*points to Garrus' self-destructive behavior*), but it's true that only Liara was interested in safe-guarding Shepard's remains.

To be fair. The other 4 squadmates at this point had other duties to attend to.

Wrex was on Tuchanka durings the events of the SR-1 destruction, and he proberly didn't have the time to go out looking for a corpse.

Garrus was at the citidal during the SR-1 destruction, doing one out three things depending on your choice in ME1. He proberly became even more frustated and angry when the news of Shepard's death arrived. Ultimativly deciding to move to Omega and become Archangel.

Tali was on the Normandy. But once the Alliance picked up the survivors, they presumebly dropped Tali off at the Citidal. Once that hapend, Tali just went back to her people. Which is quite understandable.

Ash/Kaidan are soldiers. I could imagine that they were given new duties to attend to.

Liara was at this point completely alone. All her friends had moved on for reasons mentioned above, her mother was dead. She could  perhaps return to Thessia and live in the mansion her mother owned. But I have a feeling that she spends a few weeks on the Citidal. Only to recieve a message that Shepard's body had be found.

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

jlb524 wrote...

This picture makes me think of Lizard for some reason.



Evil!Liara?

I <3 Evil!Liara.

She's so evil!

....

And cute!

[Nerevar-as]

jtav wrote...

As someone who did call Liara obsessed at one point, it's the "I couldn't let you go" line. It made her seem as if she were pining to an unhealthy degree, especially since I wasn't romancing her. I was also under the erroneous impression that she recovered the body specifically because Cerberus said they could resurrect him/her.

I got that idea too until the much maligned line from Redemption 4. Up to that moment, she was starting to feel a bit too close to Anakin Skywalker obssesive-wise, and see how that ended for the character. Especially as Shepard was already dead. That line meant at least she wouldn´t be willing to cross all the lines just in a really small hope. And then some people "cheat" on her because she ignored them. Yeah.<_<

Try her image shooting Saren for Evil Liara. She is scary being that OOC.

[V-rex]

Hey, another friendly bump from the Ashley thread.
Liara is awesome, the comic demonstrated as such and it'll be great to see her in action against the Shadow Broker.

EDIT:



Girls of Mass Effect 1 for the win!

Modifié par V-rex, 29 août 2010 - 02:21 .

[V-rex]

Eek, double post.

Modifié par V-rex, 29 août 2010 - 02:22 .

[Lord Zeuss]

Lizardviking wrote...

jlb524 wrote...

This picture makes me think of Lizard for some reason.



Evil!Liara?

I <3 Evil!Liara.

She's so evil!

....

And cute!

She doesn't get angry nearly enough.:happy:

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

Lord Zeuss wrote...

Lizardviking wrote...

jlb524 wrote...

This picture makes me think of Lizard for some reason.


Evil!Liara?

I <3 Evil!Liara.

She's so evil!

....

And cute!

She doesn't get angry nearly enough.:happy:

Not angry enough?



Evil!Liara believes that you should reconsider your statement again, before she flays you with her mind.

[Lord Zeuss]

Lizardviking wrote...

Not angry enough?



Evil!Liara believes that you should reconsider your statement again, before she flays you with her mind.

That's better.