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[jlb524]

To clarify the earlier misunderstanding, the 'fairweather fan' comment was not directed at those that really didn't like Liara's character in ME1, but came to appreciate her in ME2 and furthermore in LotSB. It wasn't directed at those that played ME2 first, and didn't have the proper chance to appreciate Liara's character until playing either ME1 or LotSB. It wasn't directed at people who decided that an ME2 LI fit them better and moved on to Tali/Thane/Miranda/Jacob/Jack/Garrus.



It was directed at fans that did play ME1 and were like, 'OMG, I love Liara, she's awesome!' and enjoyed her romance then. Some of these people then decided that Liara was crap in ME2, or a 'nutso, cold-hearted biatch' because she wasn't willing to drop everything and jump back into bed with Shepard in ME2. However, now that she is in LotSB, now they are like 'Liara is great, OMG!' all over again. That is the definition of a 'fairweather fan'. If things are good, they want to be with Liara. If things are bad, they don't. I'm not sure how that got misconstrued into an insult against those that didn't appreciate her character until later.



The same will probably happen with Ashley and Kaidan...lots of fans deride these characters b/c they were 'unreasonable' and 'mean' to their Shepards, and didn't take the time to understand their motivations. This is fine, if you plan to stick it out with the new ME2 LI. However, I know those fanbases will also be populated with 'fairweather fans' once Ashley and Kaidan go back to being 'nice' to Shepard and so forth.

[Nodarius]

tmk wrote...

Nodarius wrote...

tmk wrote...
He didn't seem to even stop and try to think of some other way to do it. Ironically, as much as it was overkill, it didn't actually kill neither Liara nor Sekat.

There were no time to stop and think lest Liara gets the data from Sekat and runs away with it

You realize that planting bombs all over three floors is probably going to take longer than finding whoever you're trying to kill and just shooting him (which, again, is what happened in the end anyways)? TSB had a whole platoon of mercs in there already. It almost seems like the explosion was there just to slightly up the chances.

Not necessarily, if a person to be disposed of is good at hiding (especially in familiar surroundings) or even, -- which, given the nature of the business, might be quite possible, -- has a hiding place ready.

[GuardianAngel470]

I'm curious to know why the SB didn't pack up camp and relocate in the time it took the Normandy to get there. He should have had intel to suggest that Vasir was dead, and he definitely should have inferred that Shepard and Liara had what they were after.



To me, the SB seems like a much more cautious character than that.

[Nodarius]

GuardianAngel470 wrote...

I'm curious to know why the SB didn't pack up camp and relocate in the time it took the Normandy to get there. He should have had intel to suggest that Vasir was dead, and he definitely should have inferred that Shepard and Liara had what they were after.

To me, the SB seems like a much more cautious character than that.

Well, arrival of the Normandy was merely an interruption, as the SB put it, and his operations were too crucial... etc. All in all, overconfidence, as usual

[jlb524]

GuardianAngel470 wrote...

I'm curious to know why the SB didn't pack up camp and relocate in the time it took the Normandy to get there. He should have had intel to suggest that Vasir was dead, and he definitely should have inferred that Shepard and Liara had what they were after.

To me, the SB seems like a much more cautious character than that.

He really didn't have that much time.

[GuardianAngel470]

jlb524 wrote...

GuardianAngel470 wrote...

I'm curious to know why the SB didn't pack up camp and relocate in the time it took the Normandy to get there. He should have had intel to suggest that Vasir was dead, and he definitely should have inferred that Shepard and Liara had what they were after.

To me, the SB seems like a much more cautious character than that.

He really didn't have that much time.

Overconfidence kinda makes sense, but the time one doesn't. The ship isn't docked, it's already in flight. If all he had to do was know Shepard was coming then he could just plot a course out of the system.

But as I think about it, Liara does say there were no encryptions on the terminal, so maybe the SB was just stupid and didn't think it was at all possible to for anyone to stop him.

[jlb524]

GuardianAngel470 wrote...

Overconfidence kinda makes sense, but the time one doesn't. The ship isn't docked, it's already in flight. If all he had to do was know Shepard was coming then he could just plot a course out of the system.

But as I think about it, Liara does say there were no encryptions on the terminal, so maybe the SB was just stupid and didn't think it was at all possible to for anyone to stop him.

It seems as if he wanted Shepard to come and bring her valuable squadmates so he could sell them/use them.  He figured he could handle it and win out in the end.

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

jlb524 wrote...

GuardianAngel470 wrote...

Overconfidence kinda makes sense, but the time one doesn't. The ship isn't docked, it's already in flight. If all he had to do was know Shepard was coming then he could just plot a course out of the system.

But as I think about it, Liara does say there were no encryptions on the terminal, so maybe the SB was just stupid and didn't think it was at all possible to for anyone to stop him.

It seems as if he wanted Shepard to come and bring her valuable squadmates so he could sell them/use them.  He figured he could handle it and win out in the end.

Could Tali or Jacob be that much worth? Jacob is nothing more than a mere grunt and Tali could possibly be a traitor, so she wouldn't be alot ransom money worth.

[Nodarius]

jlb524 wrote...

GuardianAngel470 wrote...

Overconfidence kinda makes sense, but the time one doesn't. The ship isn't docked, it's already in flight. If all he had to do was know Shepard was coming then he could just plot a course out of the system.

But as I think about it, Liara does say there were no encryptions on the terminal, so maybe the SB was just stupid and didn't think it was at all possible to for anyone to stop him.

It seems as if he wanted Shepard to come and bring her valuable squadmates so he could sell them/use them.  He figured he could handle it and win out in the end.

Most likely, yes. "Thank you for bringing me [insert companion's name], Dr T'Soni..."

Modifié par Nodarius, 22 octobre 2010 - 09:11 .

[Nodarius]

Lizardviking wrote...

jlb524 wrote...

GuardianAngel470 wrote...

Overconfidence kinda makes sense, but the time one doesn't. The ship isn't docked, it's already in flight. If all he had to do was know Shepard was coming then he could just plot a course out of the system.

But as I think about it, Liara does say there were no encryptions on the terminal, so maybe the SB was just stupid and didn't think it was at all possible to for anyone to stop him.

It seems as if he wanted Shepard to come and bring her valuable squadmates so he could sell them/use them.  He figured he could handle it and win out in the end.

Could Tali or Jacob be that much worth? Jacob is nothing more than a mere grunt and Tali could possibly be a traitor, so she wouldn't be alot ransom money worth.

May be not, but what choice did the SB have? It wasn't that he could be picky at that stage

[jlb524]

Lizardviking wrote...

Could Tali or Jacob be that much worth? Jacob is nothing more than a mere grunt and Tali could possibly be a traitor, so she wouldn't be alot ransom money worth.

Well, it seems as if Jacob's capture would cripple Cerberus, and Tali is the daughter of a powerful, well loved Admiral (though deceased) and the Shadow Broker could use that as leverage.

[Nodarius]

jlb524 wrote...

Lizardviking wrote...

Could Tali or Jacob be that much worth? Jacob is nothing more than a mere grunt and Tali could possibly be a traitor, so she wouldn't be alot ransom money worth.

Well, it seems as if Jacob's capture would cripple Cerberus, and Tali is the daughter of a powerful, well loved Admiral (though deceased) and the Shadow Broker could use that as leverage.

Or as a source of information -- the migrant Fleet is considered a closed society, to some extent

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

jlb524 wrote...

Lizardviking wrote...

Could Tali or Jacob be that much worth? Jacob is nothing more than a mere grunt and Tali could possibly be a traitor, so she wouldn't be alot ransom money worth.

Well, it seems as if Jacob's capture would cripple Cerberus, and Tali is the daughter of a powerful, well loved Admiral (though deceased) and the Shadow Broker could use that as leverage.

Stil don't Jacob being that much worth again. But the point with Tali having intel on the fleet seems valid enough.

[Nodarius]

Lizardviking wrote...

jlb524 wrote...

Lizardviking wrote...

Could Tali or Jacob be that much worth? Jacob is nothing more than a mere grunt and Tali could possibly be a traitor, so she wouldn't be alot ransom money worth.

Well, it seems as if Jacob's capture would cripple Cerberus, and Tali is the daughter of a powerful, well loved Admiral (though deceased) and the Shadow Broker could use that as leverage.

Stil don't Jacob being that much worth again. But the point with Tali having intel on the fleet seems valid enough.

Agree on Jacob, but still, better than not having him

[GuardianAngel470]

jlb524 wrote...

GuardianAngel470 wrote...

Overconfidence kinda makes sense, but the time one doesn't. The ship isn't docked, it's already in flight. If all he had to do was know Shepard was coming then he could just plot a course out of the system.

But as I think about it, Liara does say there were no encryptions on the terminal, so maybe the SB was just stupid and didn't think it was at all possible to for anyone to stop him.

It seems as if he wanted Shepard to come and bring her valuable squadmates so he could sell them/use them.  He figured he could handle it and win out in the end.

Well, he was wrong. I wouldn't even have needed Liara to bring down the sky on him, I had him within a single sniper shot of death already.

He miscalculated.

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

GuardianAngel470 wrote...

jlb524 wrote...

GuardianAngel470 wrote...

Overconfidence kinda makes sense, but the time one doesn't. The ship isn't docked, it's already in flight. If all he had to do was know Shepard was coming then he could just plot a course out of the system.

But as I think about it, Liara does say there were no encryptions on the terminal, so maybe the SB was just stupid and didn't think it was at all possible to for anyone to stop him.

It seems as if he wanted Shepard to come and bring her valuable squadmates so he could sell them/use them.  He figured he could handle it and win out in the end.

Well, he was wrong. I wouldn't even have needed Liara to bring down the sky on him, I had him within a single sniper shot of death already.

He miscalculated.

Widow shot I assume?

Good choice, I also just shot jim at point-blank range with it.

Modifié par Lizardviking, 22 octobre 2010 - 09:51 .

[GuardianAngel470]

Lizardviking wrote...

GuardianAngel470 wrote...

jlb524 wrote...

GuardianAngel470 wrote...

Overconfidence kinda makes sense, but the time one doesn't. The ship isn't docked, it's already in flight. If all he had to do was know Shepard was coming then he could just plot a course out of the system.

But as I think about it, Liara does say there were no encryptions on the terminal, so maybe the SB was just stupid and didn't think it was at all possible to for anyone to stop him.

It seems as if he wanted Shepard to come and bring her valuable squadmates so he could sell them/use them.  He figured he could handle it and win out in the end.

Well, he was wrong. I wouldn't even have needed Liara to bring down the sky on him, I had him within a single sniper shot of death already.

He miscalculated.

Widow shot I assume?

Good choice, I also just shot jim at point-blank range with it.

As Infiltrator it was useful. I could bend an incinerate past his shield, which would make him reel back, and then cloak and take a shot at his exposed face.

And yes, the Widow. For snipers there is only one superior long range weapon and that is the cannon on the Mako.

Maybe that's why I liked the mako and others didn't, I'd just drive the thing to high ground and snipe from there.

But anyway, back on topic. I can't remember, did Liara have a dossier on the SB base?

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

GuardianAngel470 wrote...
But anyway, back on topic. I can't remember, did Liara have a dossier on the SB base?

No she didn't. Neither did Ash/Kaidan, which was disapointing. Perhaps she chose to destroy the intel regarding herself or hide it?

[Swmystery]

While I would love Liara to be available for the squad in ME3 (along with everyone else who's still alive from ME1/2), I unfortunatly doubt it will happen now. If this has already been highlighted by someone else, I apologise (haven't had time to read the whole thread). After you've cleared the Lair of the Shadow Broker DLC and Liara is up in your cabin, she makes a rather revealing (I think) comment about what the developers plan for her in the final game.



It's something along the lines of "You're going to leave again, when the Reapers finally arrive...you'll dive into the fray. So I need to know you're coming back." There's a pretty heavy indication there that Liara thinks she's not going to be fighting alongside Shepard when the invasion hits- and by extension, the developers dropping a hint that she won't be usable in ME3, but rather will support you from the sidelines as the Shadow Broker.



Obviously, this doesn't prove she won't be included by any means (her recuitment mission might involve resucing her from the Broker's base when it's attacked, for example), and I've no doubt she'll play a fairly big role in ME3 whether she's in the squad or not.I just wanted to get a feel for how likely other fans thought it would be that she would be playable.

[Nodarius]

Lizardviking wrote...

GuardianAngel470 wrote...
But anyway, back on topic. I can't remember, did Liara have a dossier on the SB base?

No she didn't. Neither did Ash/Kaidan, which was disapointing. Perhaps she chose to destroy the intel regarding herself or hide it?

Or, rather, writers didn't  want to reveal (or simply hadn't decided yet) what they are going to do with them, in a manner of speaking

[Nodarius]

Swmystery wrote...

While I would love Liara to be available for the squad in ME3 (along with everyone else who's still alive from ME1/2), I unfortunatly doubt it will happen now. If this has already been highlighted by someone else, I apologise (haven't had time to read the whole thread). After you've cleared the Lair of the Shadow Broker DLC and Liara is up in your cabin, she makes a rather revealing (I think) comment about what the developers plan for her in the final game.

It's something along the lines of "You're going to leave again, when the Reapers finally arrive...you'll dive into the fray. So I need to know you're coming back." There's a pretty heavy indication there that Liara thinks she's not going to be fighting alongside Shepard when the invasion hits- and by extension, the developers dropping a hint that she won't be usable in ME3, but rather will support you from the sidelines as the Shadow Broker.

Obviously, this doesn't prove she won't be included by any means (her recuitment mission might involve resucing her from the Broker's base when it's attacked, for example), and I've no doubt she'll play a fairly big role in ME3 whether she's in the squad or not.I just wanted to get a feel for how likely other fans thought it would be that she would be playable.

Well, it could also be a red herring for all we know. Or could be just nothing especially meaningful in that respect. Which means, in fact, that we still haven't got a clue

[Sable Phoenix]

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

Swmystery wrote...

While I would love Liara to be available for the squad in ME3 (along with everyone else who's still alive from ME1/2), I unfortunatly doubt it will happen now. If this has already been highlighted by someone else, I apologise (haven't had time to read the whole thread). After you've cleared the Lair of the Shadow Broker DLC and Liara is up in your cabin, she makes a rather revealing (I think) comment about what the developers plan for her in the final game.

It's something along the lines of "You're going to leave again, when the Reapers finally arrive...you'll dive into the fray. So I need to know you're coming back." There's a pretty heavy indication there that Liara thinks she's not going to be fighting alongside Shepard when the invasion hits- and by extension, the developers dropping a hint that she won't be usable in ME3, but rather will support you from the sidelines as the Shadow Broker.

Obviously, this doesn't prove she won't be included by any means (her recuitment mission might involve resucing her from the Broker's base when it's attacked, for example), and I've no doubt she'll play a fairly big role in ME3 whether she's in the squad or not.I just wanted to get a feel for how likely other fans thought it would be that she would be playable.

There's sadly a good chance that Liara will be "restricted" to be our new TIM, but I wouldn't rule out her being a squadmate just yet. She could atleast be a squadmate for the finale battle.

[Nodarius]

Sable Phoenix wrote...

Well done!

[bjdbwea]

Sable Phoenix wrote...

But still beautiful.