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[screwoffreg]

Wrex's reunion was more touching than anyone elses. At least he rushes to you and seems excited, throwing every other matter out of the way.



Tali seems unsurprised

Garrus sort of just accepts it, but he is still glad to see Shepard

The Council doesn't seem to care nor does anyone else seem too interested on the Citadel



Hell, Conrad Verner is MORE excited to see Shepard than most anyone else, including Liara. It was nice to see that someone still remembers Shepard and his/hers sacrifices.



It is funny though how no one since the Biblical Jesus and Lazarus has "resurrected" and for some reason people can't seem to be bothered.

[Dinkamus_Littlelog]

WilliamShatner wrote...

The problem with the Reapers is we're 2/3 of the way through the story and I still:

1) Haven't got an idea what their motivation is
2) Think their plans are stupid.

Yeah, it got off to such a good start. In ME1 they were this terrifying, unimaginably ancient and evil race of machines that exterminated the protheans, and we about to do the same to all the current galactic races unless Shepard stopped them. They were a mystery, and a frightening antagonist.

In ME2, they are backseat villains, letting their mooks do all the work - the "work" being making a human smoothie to power their giant terminator cosplay. <_<

Modifié par Dinkamus_Littlelog, 16 avril 2010 - 05:20 .

[vigna]

Les, the fact that I just came up with yet another Liara theory of my own is the troubling thing. the fact that I /we have to come up with any kind of rational for Liara being the way she-- is is disturbing. We should have been shown the reason. Being hinted at or told isn't effective-- if we had been given even that.

[WilliamShatner]

Dinkamus_Littlelog wrote...

WilliamShatner wrote...


BioWare has a history of screwing over characters in sequels.  Dynaheir, one of my favourite Baldur's Gate characters was killed off screen between games.

Yeah, that was a shame, but you have to acknowledge the difference.

The BG1 characters had NO development whatsoever. They had small backstories, characterisation for their audio comments, and then after that they were nothing more than combat aides.

Its a shame that they didnt show equal treatment for all the BG1 part members who didnt remain party members in BGII, but its not quite the same as fully developed, realised and dynamic characters of ME1 becoming a cameo mockery in ME2.

Even Wrex and his "cool cameo" are an absolute pathetic letdown when you realise its just a tweaked version of the Wreav encounter, or vice versa.

The sad thing is that even though the BG character's had limited dialogue and interaction I am more attached to them than any of the new ME2 crew.

[screwoffreg]

Dinkamus_Littlelog wrote...

WilliamShatner wrote...

The problem with the Reapers is we're 2/3 of the way through the story and I still:

1) Haven't got an idea what their motivation is
2) Think their plans are stupid.

Yeah, it got off to such a good start. In ME1 they were this terrifying, unimaginably ancient and evil race of machines that exterminated the protheans, and we about to do the same to all the current galactic races unless Shepard stopped them. They were a mystery, and a frightening antagonist.

In ME2, they are backseat villains, letting their mooks do all the work - the "work" being making a human smoothie to power their giant terminator cosplay. <_<

So far it seems the Reapers are just the "invisible hand" of evolution. 

[Noxis6]

screwoffreg wrote...

Wrex's reunion was more touching than anyone elses. At least he rushes to you and seems excited, throwing every other matter out of the way.

Tali seems unsurprised
Garrus sort of just accepts it, but he is still glad to see Shepard
The Council doesn't seem to care nor does anyone else seem too interested on the Citadel

Hell, Conrad Verner is MORE excited to see Shepard than most anyone else, including Liara. It was nice to see that someone still remembers Shepard and his/hers sacrifices.

It is funny though how no one since the Biblical Jesus and Lazarus has "resurrected" and for some reason people can't seem to be bothered.

Well that one Shopkeeper on the Citadell was quite happy too,I think what bothered me mostly was the fact that some people dont seem to recognize Shepard besides him/her being the most prominent person in the galaxy,while that kind of would staged a problem in Kasumis mission it was still strange

[vigna]

screwoffreg wrote...

Dinkamus_Littlelog wrote...

WilliamShatner wrote...

The problem with the Reapers is we're 2/3 of the way through the story and I still:

1) Haven't got an idea what their motivation is
2) Think their plans are stupid.

Yeah, it got off to such a good start. In ME1 they were this terrifying, unimaginably ancient and evil race of machines that exterminated the protheans, and we about to do the same to all the current galactic races unless Shepard stopped them. They were a mystery, and a frightening antagonist.

In ME2, they are backseat villains, letting their mooks do all the work - the "work" being making a human smoothie to power their giant terminator cosplay. <_<

So far it seems the Reapers are just the "invisible hand" of evolution. 

"Invisible claw"?

[screwoffreg]

It's funny though that Shepard's greatest admirers are the Illusive Man and Conrad Verner. Damn, the Commander needs to make some new friends...

[screwoffreg]

rynluna wrote...

 It is known that the developers look to the forums to see what their fans want to see more or less of.  There is proof in that they did away with the whole elevator scenes and adding Tali/Garrus as a romance for instance.  I've read so many posts of players who cheated on Liara because of how she comes off on Illium.  I guess it worries me that Bioware sees that their evil plan of making the ME2 romances seem more appealing worked and because of this they aren't going to pay extra special attention to all the loyal ME1 love interest players.

Again, this is all my opinion and I felt I needed to throw my two cents into the mix.  I'm also extremely tired so I hope this didn't come out in a jumbled mess. 

Yeah, I think Bioware realizes by now their plan worked too well.  They will need to do some major rehab on Liara's plot or else I think most people are just as likely to blow her off in ME 3.  Especially those who never played the first game!  Their only interaction with Liara is her acting cold and like a young Emperor Palpatine, without any context of who she was in ME 1.  More than that, I doubt most of those same players read the comic anyway...

[jlb524]

ME1 was awesome, because it involved a bunch of 'regular' or 'average' (some say, 'boring') people banding together to beat the odds and save the galaxy. Ashley and Kaidan were just your typical Alliance soldiers, Liara was just a scientist (unlike Mordin, she doesn't have some super kewl badass and 'sexy' past as a member of the STG or didn't work on the genophage...she just studied Protheans), Garrus was just another cop back then (now he's 'Batman'!), Wrex was just your typical Krogan merc, and Tali was just a typical quarian on her pilgrimage, though her father is influential on the fleet.



I think the idea of a bunch of average Joes and Janes coming together and taking down a huge threat to be an awesome one.



ME2 is filled with SUPER 'SEXY' BADASSES WHO ARE SO KEWL OMG THEY ARE SOOO INTERESTING!!!!!!

[Eddie-Hawke]

Except for maybe that one line, "Two years..? I've been gone that long?", even Shepard seemed pretty cool with the whole dying thing. Among other things, I wish they had openly played up the 'It was two years for you and a few weeks for me' aspect; it could have been used to explain a few things.

[vigna]

Eddie-Hawke wrote...

Except for maybe that one line, "Two years..? I've been gone that long?", even Shepard seemed pretty cool with the whole dying thing. Among other things, I wish they had openly played up the 'It was two years for you and a few weeks for me' aspect; it could have been used to explain a few things.

Not to be an uber-nerd, but they could have played up the "man out of time" Captain America style story, but didn't. I mean technology doubles every year or two now. In the future it might double every few months. The universe could be a completely different place in two years...or atleast the ME corner of it.

[Noxis6]

jlb524 wrote...

ME1 was awesome, because it involved a bunch of 'regular' or 'average' (some say, 'boring') people banding together to beat the odds and save the galaxy. Ashley and Kaidan were just your typical Alliance soldiers, Liara was just a scientist (unlike Mordin, she doesn't have some super kewl badass and 'sexy' past as a member of the STG or didn't work on the genophage...she just studied Protheans), Garrus was just another cop back then (now he's 'Batman'!), Wrex was just your typical Krogan merc, and Tali was just a typical quarian on her pilgrimage, though her father is influential on the fleet.

I think the idea of a bunch of average Joes and Janes coming together and taking down a huge threat to be an awesome one.

ME2 is filled with SUPER 'SEXY' BADASSES WHO ARE SO KEWL OMG THEY ARE SOOO INTERESTING!!!!!!

Well in terms of Wrex I would say he was the Krogan version of Zaeed when it comes to expirience but I agree on the fact that it was nice to have "average" people saving the galaxy,I also never understood the reasoning behind recruiting most of the ME2 squad I never had the feeling the last mission was so super critical that it could only be done by the best of the best in the entire galaxy
Actually I would bet Liara could have done the biotic field too with sucess

[WilliamShatner]

screwoffreg wrote...

It's funny though that Shepard's greatest admirers are the Illusive Man and Conrad Verner. Damn, the Commander needs to make some new friends...

No wonder ME2 allows Shepard to get drunk.

[screwoffreg]

WilliamShatner wrote...

screwoffreg wrote...

It's funny though that Shepard's greatest admirers are the Illusive Man and Conrad Verner. Damn, the Commander needs to make some new friends...

No wonder ME2 allows Shepard to get drunk.

Well, Kelly helps as well.  She's the only person in the entire game who asks Shepard how she feels.  Also she flirts all the time so its a self-esteem boost when the world turns against you...

[WilliamShatner]

jlb524 wrote...

ME1 was awesome, because it involved a bunch of 'regular' or 'average' (some say, 'boring') people banding together to beat the odds and save the galaxy. Ashley and Kaidan were just your typical Alliance soldiers, Liara was just a scientist (unlike Mordin, she doesn't have some super kewl badass and 'sexy' past as a member of the STG or didn't work on the genophage...she just studied Protheans), Garrus was just another cop back then (now he's 'Batman'!), Wrex was just your typical Krogan merc, and Tali was just a typical quarian on her pilgrimage, though her father is influential on the fleet.

I think the idea of a bunch of average Joes and Janes coming together and taking down a huge threat to be an awesome one.

ME2 is filled with SUPER 'SEXY' BADASSES WHO ARE SO KEWL OMG THEY ARE SOOO INTERESTING!!!!!!

The Kasumi DLC just adds new levels of unrealism.  She runs up pipes and jumps like Spider-Man, and she's not even a biotic, just a supposedly normal human.

Clearly the SCIENCE fiction part of Mass Effect was left behind.

[Noxis6]

Well actually Jacob asks too if you romance him but I wouldnt want to do that just for one line,its kind of disapointing that Garrus or Tali have nothing to say about it

[rvayda141]

One thing i don't get is the notion that the larger focus on shooter based gameplay is them trying to get more people who play shooters into the game. If you think of halo and gears of war as the typical shooter games, then by those standards ME2 is still way too complicated for people who just play twitch games and want to kill people on the internet. While the dialogue and RPG elements in comparison to the first game obviously got severely cut down, theres still enough of it that it doesnt seem to me like it would hold the attention of the average FPS player, especially if they didnt play the first game.
Obviously the largest issue with the first game was the lackluster combat mechanics, so Bioware focused on fixing that to the detriment of the rest of what made the game good.
Another thing i dont get is why shepard's death is being debated as an important plot device. Yea it was a convenient excuse to clear the slate and start shepard fresh in terms of class/skills and whatnot, but him being gone for two years seems to be the focal point for nearly everything in the game. They couldnt really pass that time with shepard alive, because no matter what others told him to do, shepard wasnt gonna sit on his ass and wait for the reapers. He wakes up after two years to find everyone pretty much said he was a raving lunatic and didnt know what he was talking about. The only reason i can see him working for cerberus is because they are the only entity that believes his claims of the reapers that can actually help him and are trying to take steps in order to stop them. Shepard's absence also obviously shapes the characters from ME1, most notably of course, Liara.
Despite this, i do agree that some of the characters are overly nonchalant about shepard's miraculous return from the dead, and cerberus pretty much tells him walk it off broski, we got **** to do, and thats what he does because its what he has to do. The biggest flaw i found with the plot device of shepard's death was how the rest of his team from ME1 were content to carry on with their lives when they had first hand knowledge of the reapers coming.

Modifié par rvayda141, 16 avril 2010 - 05:41 .

[Ulathar]

LesEnfantsTerribles wrote...
Again, this goes back to my previous point. The whole "Shepard dying" thing was solely for gameplay purposes, and has no story reason at all, whatsoever. The fact that it is all but ignored after 30 minutes is pathetic, and how Shepard doesn't even seem bothered that everyone and everything else has moved on or changed after 2 years is ridiculous.

Shepard is such a poorly written character in ME2 it's unbelieveable. The Liara reunion is testament to this. Your lover pulls away from a kiss and sadly shakes her head, something clearly bothering her, and you don't say anything or inquire about her wellbeing and just sit down?!

This...so THIS!
90% of the fans can write Shepard in a better way than BW has in ME2 <_<

I wonder how it came to that....

"let's mention his death 2 or 3 times in the beginning and then let's move on"
"yeah, that's for the best. tis a shooter anyways so no one will pay attention to something like that.
"ha you're right. Since we're dumbing the game down we don't have to pay attention to the characters actually being in-character and no one will care about plot-holes anyways."
"But don't you think the RPG crowd will raise hell about that?"
"Yeah...maybe, but there are more ppl buying shooter than there are RPG-players so we still get tons of money"
"Ah I see...well then, carry on..."

is this plausible?

[screwoffreg]

Noxis6 wrote...

Well actually Jacob asks too if you romance him but I wouldnt want to do that just for one line,its kind of disapointing that Garrus or Tali have nothing to say about it

Well, its interesting that Bioware admitted that the game tracks if Kelly comes up to your room. Obviously it doesn't negate any romances, as the picture of the ME 1 LI stays up.  It will be interesting to see if there is a reaction in ME 3.

"So, I heard you had this red head up..."

Or even better if Kelly becomes an Isabella from DA and decides the more the merrier in this little relationship

[jlb524]

Noxis6 wrote...

Actually I would bet Liara could have done the biotic field too with sucess

I think so too...she would have done a better job than Jacob or Mirana.

[JaylaClark]

Eddie-Hawke wrote...

Except for maybe that one line, "Two years..? I've been gone that long?", even Shepard seemed pretty cool with the whole dying thing. Among other things, I wish they had openly played up the 'It was two years for you and a few weeks for me' aspect; it could have been used to explain a few things.

I said that earlier, actually.  People keep acting like it's logical for Shepard to just accept the fact that 'Liara has moved on' and 'it's been two years, right?'... when it hasn't.  Hell, Shepard gets blown to hell -- rather literally, if the last pages of the comic are any indicator; don't read it on a full stomach (for multiple reasons) if you have an active imagination -- and then, a blip of Miranda standing over her, then she's up, new scars in place (though the old scars are healed) and she's all "Wow, that must've been a bad week".  Then she hears 'two years' twice, can react to it twice, and then she's on the job.  The hell?

And LES IS BACK!