50907 réponses à ce sujet

[Dinkamus_Littlelog]

LesEnfantsTerribles wrote...

Dink, the Shadow Broker has existed since long before humanity made first contact, IIRC.

And how do you know whatever entity TIM could be hasnt existed long before humanity made first contact?

I covered this in my "TIM waking up and saying, 'I know, today Ill attempt to dictate the future course of humanity and build a super-sekrit terrorist organisation' is stupid".

Seriously, if TIM is an ordinary "pro-human" human, Ill be pissed. It just seems tacky, stupid and forced, and far too mundane.

What exactly do we know about TIM? Hes the head of cerberus, and has weird eyes. Thats about it really. Everything else could be a facade and all just deception.

Modifié par Dinkamus_Littlelog, 25 avril 2010 - 09:26 .

[jlb524]

justinnstuff wrote...

If I can get a volunteer I'll definitely do it! I'm thinking of just PM'ing J and seeing if she'd like to give it a shot. I know she can customize the camera in ME1 for PC. She already did to get those pics in the first place.

I can do this...what will you need?

[Dinkamus_Littlelog]

LesEnfantsTerribles wrote...

I know, I was just trying to make the point that the Shadow Broker, who has been a major player in galactic politics for centuries, has existed for alot longer than humanity even being a part of the galactic community, and so it kind of debunks the notion that TIM is the Shadow Broker.

Unless you're trying to say that TIM isn't exactly human, and that was the point you're trying to make?

Thats entirely the point LET.

Are you really okay with Cerberus simply being founded for a "pro-human" agenda? I think it sucks. Id much rather there be something far more sinister going on, and TIM is manipulating humanity rather than advancing it.

Until we get some concrete info on TIM, I dont think its any safer assuming hes an ordinary man who one day up and decided to follow a ridiculously extra ordinary agenda and managed to pull it off.

[II Goonah II]

LesEnfantsTerribles wrote...

I know, I was just trying to make the point that the Shadow Broker, who has been a major player in galactic politics for centuries, has existed for alot longer than humanity even being a part of the galactic community, and so it kind of debunks the notion that TIM is the Shadow Broker.

Unless you're trying to say that TIM isn't exactly human, and that was the point you're trying to make?

That pretty much means that the Shadow Broker is either a very close-nit group of individuals or it is a rouge AI.

[screwoffreg]

LesEnfantsTerribles wrote...

I don't particularly like the idea of Liara getting captured and Shepard having to save her, though. I appreciate that you see it as a legitimate way that they could play out Liara's current character arc, but I think Liara is way too strong, competant and intelligent to warrant another "rescue" mission. I don't want her to be perceived as just another damsel in distress. She's too much of a strong character for that.

No offense, screw. :-) It's just it's something that I don't want to see them doing. Liara saving Shepard again. on the other hand. I'd like that.

The Reapers could care less about Liara beyond her purpose to Shepard, to be honest.

No, my point was Liara would be given the chance to have her vengeance and Shepard would come along, out of love or to pay a debt.  

What have the Reapers always wanted since Sovereign fell?  Even during the battles with Harbringer, what did he say to his troops?  Leave Shepard alive, kill the rest.

It would be the most bitter irony that the very one who saved Shepard from the Collectors would be the same one who delivered her into the hands of the Reapers themselves.

Imagine the end of the expansion being a scene as the squad watches helplessly as a Batarian ship, or worse, a Reaper rises into the sky containing the now captured Shepard.  Harbringer would probably taunt Liara before the end, thanking her for the part she played.

It would make sense really, to begin ME 3 as a "restart" again.  Almost a Jon Irenicus situation, where Shepard wakes to find herself tortured and experimented on by servants of the Reapers for reasons only they know.

A Shepard filled with their technology, as Paul Grayson's example teaches us, would be a powerful weapon.  Shepard would hear their voice, perhaps even be influenced by them.  Imagine the Renegade decisions she could make.  Turning the Geth and Quarians conflict into a war.  Marginalizing the Council.  Worse, if the Alliance is already infiltrated by the Reapers, as a subtle hint in the Kasumi DLC suggests, the final decision may be one that humanity takes alone to embrace its ascension, with Shepard as their messiah.

A bitter turn, but one that has not been done before.

[Noxis6]

screwoffreg wrote...

LesEnfantsTerribles wrote...

I don't particularly like the idea of Liara getting captured and Shepard having to save her, though. I appreciate that you see it as a legitimate way that they could play out Liara's current character arc, but I think Liara is way too strong, competant and intelligent to warrant another "rescue" mission. I don't want her to be perceived as just another damsel in distress. She's too much of a strong character for that.

No offense, screw. :-) It's just it's something that I don't want to see them doing. Liara saving Shepard again. on the other hand. I'd like that.

The Reapers could care less about Liara beyond her purpose to Shepard, to be honest.

No, my point was Liara would be given the chance to have her vengeance and Shepard would come along, out of love or to pay a debt.  

What have the Reapers always wanted since Sovereign fell?  Even during the battles with Harbringer, what did he say to his troops?  Leave Shepard alive, kill the rest.

It would be the most bitter irony that the very one who saved Shepard from the Collectors would be the same one who delivered her into the hands of the Reapers themselves.

Imagine the end of the expansion being a scene as the squad watches helplessly as a Batarian ship, or worse, a Reaper rises into the sky containing the now captured Shepard.  Harbringer would probably taunt Liara before the end, thanking her for the part she played.

It would make sense really, to begin ME 3 as a "restart" again.  Almost a Jon Irenicus situation, where Shepard wakes to find herself tortured and experimented on by servants of the Reapers for reasons only they know.

A Shepard filled with their technology, as Paul Grayson's example teaches us, would be a powerful weapon.  Shepard would hear their voice, perhaps even be influenced by them.  Imagine the Renegade decisions she could make.  Turning the Geth and Quarians conflict into a war.  Marginalizing the Council.  Worse, if the Alliance is already infiltrated by the Reapers, as a subtle hint in the Kasumi DLC suggests, the final decision may be one that humanity takes alone to embrace its ascension, with Shepard as their messiah.

A bitter turn, but one that has not been done before.

Well for the start something on the Leviathan of Dis,I dont think hes a fully working reaper anymore to me it seems hes just a "corpse" so yes he may still send his indoctrination signal but he cannot direct it anymore or do something with it since his "soul" is gone so the only thing the reapers would get out of it are more Husks
And beyond that there seems to be no real physical reaper presence in the galaxy after Sovereigns defeat

On Shepard being filled with reaper tech I might add that it could already be the case,as for Grayson how usefull or powerful he is remains to be seen chances are he spins completely out of control

[Erinlana]

Cartims wrote...

Dinkamus_Littlelog wrote...

LesEnfantsTerribles wrote...

Dink, the Shadow Broker has existed since long before humanity made first contact, IIRC.

And how do you know whatever entity TIM could be hasnt existed long before humanity made first contact?

I covered this in my "TIM waking up and saying, 'I know, today Ill attempt to dictate the future course of humanity and build a super-sekrit terrorist organisation' is stupid".

Seriously, if TIM is an ordinary "pro-human" human, Ill be pissed. It just seems tacky, stupid and forced, and far too mundane.

What exactly do we know about TIM? Hes the head of cerberus, and has weird eyes. Thats about it really. Everything else could be a facade and all just deception.

He also smokes and drinks....sounds pretty human.

His eye's look Husk-like , i am suspicious .

[Dinkamus_Littlelog]

LesEnfantsTerribles wrote...

I think it may just be a consequence of the retconning of Cerberus into a powerful, influential, wealthy and huge organisation, when in ME1 they were nothing more than a rogue, splinter terrorist group. Consequently, we're questioning just where the hell TIM came from and what motivated him to one day decide to create Cerberus and "advance humanity to their rightful place in the galaxy", as he puts it.

As it's shown in Redemption with how Liara is suddenly fully aware of everything about Cerberus, suddenly they're a major player in the galaxy, and a major faction fighting for control. Cerberus have been retconned.

And that retcon would only be made worse by having it simply lead to "Theyre a powerful pro-human group.... thats all."

What kind of role can they occupy in ME3 with just that? I already found their role in ME2 pathetically forced as the rest of the galaxy mysteriously (ham fisted railroading) no longer gives a crap about the reapers, and the ONLY ones Shepard can turn to are cerberus.

[Sunnie]

screwoffreg wrote...

LesEnfantsTerribles wrote...

I don't particularly like the idea of Liara getting captured and Shepard having to save her, though. I appreciate that you see it as a legitimate way that they could play out Liara's current character arc, but I think Liara is way too strong, competant and intelligent to warrant another "rescue" mission. I don't want her to be perceived as just another damsel in distress. She's too much of a strong character for that.

No offense, screw. :-) It's just it's something that I don't want to see them doing. Liara saving Shepard again. on the other hand. I'd like that.

The Reapers could care less about Liara beyond her purpose to Shepard, to be honest.

No, my point was Liara would be given the chance to have her vengeance and Shepard would come along, out of love or to pay a debt.  

What have the Reapers always wanted since Sovereign fell?  Even during the battles with Harbringer, what did he say to his troops?  Leave Shepard alive, kill the rest.

It would be the most bitter irony that the very one who saved Shepard from the Collectors would be the same one who delivered her into the hands of the Reapers themselves.

Imagine the end of the expansion being a scene as the squad watches helplessly as a Batarian ship, or worse, a Reaper rises into the sky containing the now captured Shepard.  Harbringer would probably taunt Liara before the end, thanking her for the part she played.

It would make sense really, to begin ME 3 as a "restart" again.  Almost a Jon Irenicus situation, where Shepard wakes to find herself tortured and experimented on by servants of the Reapers for reasons only they know.

A Shepard filled with their technology, as Paul Grayson's example teaches us, would be a powerful weapon.  Shepard would hear their voice, perhaps even be influenced by them.  Imagine the Renegade decisions she could make.  Turning the Geth and Quarians conflict into a war.  Marginalizing the Council.  Worse, if the Alliance is already infiltrated by the Reapers, as a subtle hint in the Kasumi DLC suggests, the final decision may be one that humanity takes alone to embrace its ascension, with Shepard as their messiah.

A bitter turn, but one that has not been done before.

Honestly, I do not want to play that game, and if ME3 turns out to be "that" game, I will be ending my trilogy at part 2.

[Noxis6]

Sunnie22 wrote...
Honestly, I do not want to play that game, and if ME3 turns out to be "that" game, I will be ending my trilogy at part 2.

Well its not very likely that we will see something like that,simply because its save to assume Bioware will want to keep this franchise going after Shepards story is over

[bjdbwea]

Dinkamus_Littlelog wrote...

Are you really okay with Cerberus simply being founded for a "pro-human" agenda? I think it sucks. Id much rather there be something far more sinister going on, and TIM is manipulating humanity rather than advancing it.

It is likely that they will grant your wish one way or another, and it's probably for the best. However, as long as the actual writing is proper, you don't always need hidden motives. Simple characters and plots can work as well. They may even be the better choice, especially if you don't really have the time or talent for the better stuff. ME 2 tried to pull off some sinister and "dark" stuff and twists, but in my opinion the writing failed almost completely. Faceless enemies, an idiotic "explanation" for their reasons, and a laughable end boss. A "normal" villain would have been preferable to this.

Modifié par bjdbwea, 25 avril 2010 - 09:59 .