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[Chignon]

Collider wrote...

I appreciate though, that you still get to be friends with Garrus, Thane & Tali without romancing them. It's true that often there's not enough dialog, but it's a lot better than not being friends at all, as was the case with Jack. I also would have liked friendship dialog with Kaidan - Ashley definitely had more in the friendship department than Kaidan did, for non-romance Shepards.

True. Thane has great friendship dialogue. I really liked talking with him.

Concerning Kaidan's friendship content - I've never not romanced him with my female Shepards and I've never played the game through with MShep so I can't really say.


Edited for top-of-the-page-Kaidan:

Modifié par Chignon, 01 septembre 2010 - 04:36 .

[DragonRose]

Speaking of the friendship thing, contrasting other Bioware games, I like how you can become friends with other love interests without actually romancing them. Like, if you romance someone other than Alistair and you get his approval high enough, he'll tell you that you're his best friend and that he'd do anything for you. It'd kind of be nice to have something like that in ME for love interests.

[sagefic]

i agree dragon. i didn't like alistair as an LI (sorry, i know some folks did, but i was still pining for kaidan), but i loved that if you were careful enough, you could avoid a romance and be his buddy. it was too bad they didn't do that with kaidan, ash, etc.

edit: a kaidan - miss him being there:

Modifié par sagequeen, 01 septembre 2010 - 05:12 .

[syllogi]

Sialater wrote...

Chignon wrote...

Jade, that was something that bugged me, too.
You can't "get friendly" without being more or less railroaded into a romance or you get barely any dialogue at all - the friendship you could have with Ash in ME1 is such a glaring contrast to that, I think.
Also, I've seen that if you romance Garrus, or Tali for that matter, they don't even make any reference to Kaidan or Ash if you've been involved with them. I just found it a bit strange, especially since you could take Garrus to Horizon.

And I agree, Chakwas could have been a great choice; she told you about that little episode with Jenkins and Kaidan if you get her that bottle of brandy and I would have loved more of that.

The problem is also in ME1.  You can't be friends with Kaidan if you aren't a femshep and romancing him.  BW left out a lot of the friendship dialogue in both games, IMHO.

Yeah.  It's why I totally understand why someone who has never been interested in romancing Kaidan would think he's boring (not WHINY, just boring), since from their perspective, all he has to talk about is a morality tale about his youth.  They do get glimpses of his personality, and a few more laid back comments, but not much, especially if they're not predisposed to want to get to know some human male party member who isn't XTREEM. 

I hope they take this into account when writing Kaidan for ME3 (and oh gosh I hope he's got more than three lines), and I *really* hope they factor in the feedback for the ME2 romances...whatever they decided to do with Jacob was just wrong for most FemShep players.  The other two male LIs had far more going for them, and yet they were less "explicit".  That should tell the writers something.

[Collider]

^ I can't say anything about Jacob's romance, because my one FemShep romanced Garrus and the other stayed far, far away and pined for Kaidan. The only thing I know is, "The PRIIIIIZE," meme going around. Is Jacob's romance dialogue that bad?

I've done all of the romances in Mass Effect. Jacob's romance actually has some good parts in it. However, the bad parts overshadow them. His romance scene is basically completely bad dialog wise, as well. IMO.

[Sialater]

Brodyaha wrote...

^ I can't say anything about Jacob's romance, because my one FemShep romanced Garrus and the other stayed far, far away and pined for Kaidan. The only thing I know is, "The PRIIIIIZE," meme going around. Is Jacob's romance dialogue that bad?

I hope they put in tons of character development for Ash and Kaid in ME3 (or shift some of the story over to DLC). I've been leaving little hints in my posts and comments for BioWare to read.

Yes.  The dialogue is that bad.  Not to mention how FemShep talks to him, period.  She sounds like a drunken cheerleader on prom night.  I romanced him once, for science, and that's all I'll ever do unless ME3 redeems both him and FemShep.


ETA:  Collider is correct.  There is one conversation where he asks how Shep is doing.  He's the only one to do that.  BUT, if you try to get him to open up to you, he tells you to go talk to Garrus and the romance is over.

Modifié par Sialater, 01 septembre 2010 - 05:23 .

[Collider]

Sialater wrote...

Brodyaha wrote...

^ I can't say anything about Jacob's romance, because my one FemShep romanced Garrus and the other stayed far, far away and pined for Kaidan. The only thing I know is, "The PRIIIIIZE," meme going around. Is Jacob's romance dialogue that bad?

I hope they put in tons of character development for Ash and Kaid in ME3 (or shift some of the story over to DLC). I've been leaving little hints in my posts and comments for BioWare to read.

Yes.  The dialogue is that bad.  Not to mention how FemShep talks to him, period.  She sounds like a drunken cheerleader on prom night.  I romanced him once, for science, and that's all I'll ever do unless ME3 redeems both him and FemShep.

It'll be interesting to see where Bioware takes the Jacob romance in ME3, especially considering all of the criticisms.

[Sialater]

It can only improve, Collider.


Same goes for post-Horizon Kaidan and Shep.

Modifié par Sialater, 01 septembre 2010 - 05:27 .

[Collider]

Brodyaha wrote...

Well, watched the Jacob romance on YouTube.
It sounds less like a romance and more like a simple booty call. Both from the dialogue and their tone of voice (especially FemShep's).
My opinion, anyway.
Definitely preferred Kaidan's.

Having played all of the romances in both games, I have to say that Kaidan's was one of the best.

[sagefic]

i got into one jacob convo and was like...whoa! whoa! what's happening? no! that line of dialog was worse than the first one. what???



and then i reloaded and walked through the tech lab ever after. this is why mordin thought my shep was in love with him. which i almost could be, because he sang to me.

[Chignon]

Who knows, he could serenade your Shep in ME3, Brodyaha. (;

[Aslanasadi]

sagequeen wrote...

i got into one jacob convo and was like...whoa! whoa! what's happening? no! that line of dialog was worse than the first one. what???

and then i reloaded and walked through the tech lab ever after. this is why mordin thought my shep was in love with him. which i almost could be, because he sang to me.

I did exactly the same thing...after I had the dialogue with Jacob...
reloaded and walked through the tech lab ever after...and btw I really like Mordin
I created a male Shepard in ME1 and I'm curious about the differences in the dialogues with Kaidan... and Jacob later....

[oyukichan]

Aslanasadi wrote...

sagequeen wrote...

i got into one jacob convo and was like...whoa! whoa! what's happening? no! that line of dialog was worse than the first one. what???

and then i reloaded and walked through the tech lab ever after. this is why mordin thought my shep was in love with him. which i almost could be, because he sang to me.

I did exactly the same thing...after I had the dialogue with Jacob...
reloaded and walked through the tech lab ever after...and btw I really like Mordin
I created a male Shepard in ME1 and I'm curious about the differences in the dialogues with Kaidan... and Jacob later....

I am just now discovering the differences in conversation with mShep and Kaidan (I could not bring myself to play mShep for the longest time!) and I really enjoy it.  I don't understand how people can come away from mShep's conversations with Kaidan thinking he was a wuss and that there is no way to be friends with him.

I get that talking with him is not the same as talking to Liara (who you can be a total jerk to and she will still love you), but I like that he has an actual personality.  Does anyone know how it works with Ashley?  I've never tried being a jerk to her.  Will she clam up and become strictly business with both mShep and femShep?

edit: For the curious, my Sheps were never intentionally mean to Kaidan (in fact, I have never been able to bring myself to renegade my crew even with renegade Shep).  I just noticed that after the Noveria mission, when my femShep asked his opinion on the mission and he talked about thinking that saving the Rachni Queen was not a good idea, the relationship dialogue was no longer available and he was cold to her forever after.

Modifié par AurinShepard, 01 septembre 2010 - 07:07 .

[FireEye]

...

[Nik_Li]

AurinShepard wrote...

my Sheps were never intentionally mean to Kaidan (in fact, I have never been able to bring myself to renegade my crew even with renegade Shep).  I just noticed that after the Noveria mission, when my femShep asked his opinion on the mission and he talked about thinking that saving the Rachni Queen was not a good idea, the relationship dialogue was no longer available and he was cold to her forever after.

That's odd, I saved the queen too and that didn't stop the romance. I thought he'd object only if he had been renegaded (is that a word?  ) So he'll object if you're renegade and save the queen, but not if you're a paragon and save the queen?

I have seen a renegade Kaidan on YouTube and it seems incongruous to hear fair-minded Kaidan spouting anti-alien sentiment. I haven't been able to bring myself to renegade him yet... it's far easier to harden Alistair IMO as Al hardly changes at all.

Modifié par Nik_Li, 01 septembre 2010 - 09:32 .

[fortunesque]

The only thing that will stop the romance besides telling him to buzz off/you want Liara only is disagreeing with him about aliens after the second or third mission. If you want to renegade him then you don't pass the charm/intimidate check and still disagree with him, the relationship will be cut off.

[FireEye]

Nik_Li wrote...

That's odd, I saved the queen too and that didn't stop the romance. I thought he'd object only if he had been renegaded (is that a word?  ) So he'll object if you're renegade and save the queen, but not if you're a paragon and save the queen?

I have seen a renegade Kaidan on YouTube and it seems incongruous to hear fair-minded Kaidan spouting anti-alien sentiment. I haven't been able to bring myself to renegade him yet... it's far easier to harden Alistair IMO as Al hardly changes at all.

I thought that he objected whether or not you saved the Queen - roughly, he doesn't question your having to make a decision, he just didn't think it was up to a human strike force to decide something they didn't have the experience to be involved in.

But I honestly don't know. 

[Daewan]

My Renegade femShep saved the Queen and Kaidan didn't complain. He did yell at her for shooting colonists, though, and I almost lost the romance there. I wonder if it's an order thing, rather than a specific location?

Being a jerk to Ashley is really funny, both as a male and a female. She snarks back a lot.

[Daewan]

Uh... why can't I see my post?
Dammit!  Nobody saw that.

Modifié par Daewan, 01 septembre 2010 - 09:53 .

[Bananagirl]

Argh, this thread moves too quickly! I'll never be able to keep up once school starts again!

I am, however, loving these pics...



Anyway, I just started up a renegade Shep and could not bring myself to be cruel to any of the crew members....I'm bad at being bad. And I tried to renegade Kaidan, but as far as I could tell, nothing changed. Are you supposed to do something specific?