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[FenrisDeSolar]

sagequeen wrote...

At the end of ME2, I trust completely: Liara, Garrus, Tali, Miranda
I'm trust with some reservation: Kaidan (only because I have no idea what BW has in store for him, Joker, Kasumi, Anderson, Samara, Bailey
I'm neutral on: Thane, EDI, the Council, the Alliance, Jacob
I'm very leery of: Legion, Zaeed
I don't trust at all: TIM, Udina

Why do you hold reservation toward Joker? O_O I can understand the rest, but what did Joker do?

[sagefic]

I can't explain it, exactly. I trust Joker in many ways, but...I guess he went over to Cerberus rather easily. And his reaction if Shep dies at the end is just...weird. His writing is off there. I dunno. I adore Joker, and I trust him to do his job, but I keep feeling like he'd sell out much more easily than the others. Miri, once on Shep's side, I don't see her turning back again. Joker, I could see him being bought. No offense, and perhaps others will disagree. But this is a KAidan thread. And with Kaidan, I'd put him in the totally trust except that I don't know what he's up to.

[FenrisDeSolar]

Huh. I suppose you have a point. :/ But can't we put that down to bad writing instead? I mean, the Joker I know from ME1 was a loyal friend, to Shep AND Kaidan.



But yes, Kaidan. xD

[Reverie]

sagequeen wrote...

I can't explain it, exactly. I trust Joker in many ways, but...I guess he went over to Cerberus rather easily. And his reaction if Shep dies at the end is just...weird. His writing is off there. I dunno. I adore Joker, and I trust him to do his job, but I keep feeling like he'd sell out much more easily than the others. Miri, once on Shep's side, I don't see her turning back again. Joker, I could see him being bought. No offense, and perhaps others will disagree. But this is a KAidan thread. And with Kaidan, I'd put him in the totally trust except that I don't know what he's up to.

That's pretty much how I feel about Joker. I'm a little hesitant about completely trusting him. Of courses my brother thinks I'm crazy (he plays the game too) But I stand by it.

[Geirahod]

I really want that they do a dlc for Kaidan/Ash ...I hate that part when your FemShep encountered Kaidan on Horizon...It must be some way to get rid off cerberus, TIM and all that crap...and solve the possible troubles between your Shep and Kaidan/Ash.



And for the love of the goddess, I can't stand cerberus anymore...my FemShep do everything to ****** off the illusive man (yea, everytime that I play the "suicide mission" I destroy the collector's base ).

[FenrisDeSolar]

It never struck me that people might not love Joker as much as I do. I'm stunned.



But again, back to Kaidan. Do you think he'd ever betray Shepard?

[Reverie]

I don't hate Joker. Just a bit leery about him.



Onto Kaidan. I don't think he would ever betray Shepard. Even with what went on that mess of Horizon, I just can't see him turning on her like that.

[jillyfae]

Reverie wrote...

sagequeen wrote...

I can't explain it, exactly. I trust Joker in many ways, but...I guess he went over to Cerberus rather easily. And his reaction if Shep dies at the end is just...weird. His writing is off there. I dunno. I adore Joker, and I trust him to do his job, but I keep feeling like he'd sell out much more easily than the others. Miri, once on Shep's side, I don't see her turning back again. Joker, I could see him being bought. No offense, and perhaps others will disagree. But this is a KAidan thread. And with Kaidan, I'd put him in the totally trust except that I don't know what he's up to.

That's pretty much how I feel about Joker. I'm a little hesitant about completely trusting him. Of courses my brother thinks I'm crazy (he plays the game too) But I stand by it.

Ok, I love Joker to itty-bitty pieces, as anyone who's read anything I ever wrote has probably noticed, but I completely agree with being leery of his motives in ME2.  Joining Cerberus cause they can resurrect a dead body and will let you fly?  Crazy.  In the story in my head, there is definitely more going on with that choice than they tell you about in the game.  (For Chakwas too.)  

[FenrisDeSolar]

I always thought Joker joining Cerberus was down to his guilt over Shepard's death. I think he felt compelled to be there, should he/she ever wake up. Chakwas probably just stalks Joker because she's the only constance in her life.



I'm worried about the whole Kaidan/Ashley thing. I keep wondering if it's possible that one we see them again, they won't take Shepard back. O_O The silence from Bioware just kills me a little. >_<

[sagefic]

chakwas, i think the reasons are given and they are sound. joker's...not as much.



Kaidan betray Shepard? Never in a million years. He's just got too much integrity. However, Shepard getting painted into a corner by Cerberus and unable to communicate what happened to her to Kaidan and him stabbing her in the heart because he misunderstood her and stood by his principles? I could totally see that happening...



Oh, wait. It DID. grrr....

[FenrisDeSolar]

Lol, Sage. I hope he doesn't but I have my moments of despair, when I feel like we'll never see him again. >_< Last time I made a playthrough I paid my brother £20 to do Horizon for me. ¬_¬

Modifié par FenrisDeSolar, 10 septembre 2010 - 06:53 .

[FireEye]

sagequeen wrote...

chakwas, i think the reasons are given and they are sound. joker's...not as much.

Kaidan betray Shepard? Never in a million years. He's just got too much integrity. However, Shepard getting painted into a corner by Cerberus and unable to communicate what happened to her to Kaidan and him stabbing her in the heart because he misunderstood her and stood by his principles? I could totally see that happening...

Oh, wait. It DID. grrr....

I believe that Kaidan could (potentially) betray Shepard.  Just because, at this point, why couldn't he? 

[FenrisDeSolar]

Don't say that FireEye, it makes me all queasy. >_<



He can't! He musn't! HE LOVED US! >_<

[fortunesque]

Here's the simplified reason why I don't quite trust Kaidan as of right now:



He's chosen between his morals and the woman he loves; his morals won out. Therefore, if Shepard chooses the immoral path, he won't follow her and will do what he feels is right. If we get forced into choosing the 'immoral' path again, I think Shep could lose him for good.

[Collider]

Like Fort says, if Shepard does something that runs counter to Kaidan's morals, Kaidan isn't going to be happy.

[FenrisDeSolar]

Damn. You're right, Fort. :/



Well, I hope that blowing up the base will be your OFFICIAL resignation from Cerberus. I do not want to work with them any more. Get me back with the Alliance. All the cool dudes are Alliance!

[Chignon]

I don't see Kaidan as being able to 'betray' Shepard. But if he is forced to choose between her and duty ... As he said on Horizon, he's an Alliance soldier.

If Shepard isn't able to finally and once and for all cut ties with Cerberus in the near future, I can't see whatever they had going anywhere.

[fortunesque]

Yeah, I'd prefer not to work with a psychotic group of terrorists that are bent on establishing a dominant racial utopia.

[FenrisDeSolar]

Well, sh*t. ¬_¬



If that happens, I might have to break up with Bioware. I don't want to. We've been in love for so long.

[FireEye]

FenrisDeSolar wrote...

Well, I hope that blowing up the base will be your OFFICIAL resignation from Cerberus. I do not want to work with them any more. Get me back with the Alliance. All the cool dudes are Alliance!

The LotSB is supposed to be post-suicide mission, yet starts with a Cerberus letter, doesn't it?  Doesn't bode well.  It seems that even if we quit, we're still playing nice.  <_<







...

[JaerWolfe]

fortunesque wrote...



Here's the simplified reason why I don't quite trust Kaidan as of right now:



He's chosen between his morals and the woman he loves; his morals won out. Therefore, if Shepard chooses the immoral path, he won't follow her and will do what he feels is right. If we get forced into choosing the 'immoral' path again, I think Shep could lose him for good.

Ironically enough, I was thinking of how to phrase why I believe Kaidan would 'betray' Shepard and you posted this. It pretty much sums it up for me why a 'betrayal' would happen, although I wouldn't call it that. Betrayal implies stabbing someone in the back and that I don't see Kaidan doing. A major difference in goals/methods, yes, and I think it would be a relationship breaker.

One of the things I have always adored about Kaidan's character is that he questions Shepard and doesn't follow her blindly. Ironically, the fact he doesn't follow blindly on Horizon is used against him by those who don't like him.

The trust built up in ME1 has been badly damaged by both parties and is why I would like any kind of resolution to be a slow building of that trust once more or a complete breaking of it.

[Chignon]

I hope they won't.

It was bad enough to have no choice whatsoever in regards to working with Cerberus in ME2 in the first place. If Bioware continues to force us - I don't even want to think about it and the consequences for Shep and Kaidan's relationship.

[fortunesque]

Everything starts with a Cerberus letter. I hate having them forced on me. I'm not a Natzi (yeah, they censor this word). I hate Cerberus and everything they stand for.

[Jenova65]

Well Big Brother UK ends tonight after 11 series!

I have missed you all and will be back on form after tonight :-) That is, if you still love me, I still love Kaidan...............

[FenrisDeSolar]

I don't hate EVERYTHING Cerberus stand for. They're trying to advance the human race. I respect that. But the Alliance is trying to do the same thing. Thing is, the Alliance is not a bunch of d*ckheads who think that humans are above everyone else.



Cerberus sponsor the Terra Firma party. I wanted to throw up when I met the Terra Firma protesters in ME1.



I think I confused people, and myself, when I said "betray." I don't think Kaidan would ever stab Shepard in the back, but I'm scared he might step away from her/him because of what Fort said earlier.