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[heretica]

TeenZombie wrote...


And we need more Kaidan in here!

For some reason this is one of my fav close shots. *drools*

[jillyfae]

NICKjnp wrote...

I'm doing a Sheploo ME1 playthrough this weekend... and I can't decide if I'm going to save Kaidan or Ashley (it is going to be a no romance playthrough).

I only saved Ashley twice.  But you are asking this question in the Kaidan thread, so I think you can guess what most people will suggest.    Poor Chief Williams.

[Ulathar]

@sagequeen...I agree on the trials. I loved the one in NWN2 and KotOR (Manaan). Really cool stuff and I'm hoping for one in ME3, too.

[syllogi]

Systemlord Baal wrote...

@sagequeen...I agree on the trials. I loved the one in NWN2 and KotOR (Manaan). Really cool stuff and I'm hoping for one in ME3, too.

Yeah, the trial in NWN 2 was my favorite part of the game, and cemented my love for Sand...sob!  He really should have been a romance option.  I fully believe Obsidian hates romances, and hates making romances for female players even more.

If Shepard is put on trial by the Alliance in ME3, it would be kind of awesome.  We could finally see Arcturus Station (and Admiral Hackett!  We must see Admiral Hackett!), we would have a chance to finally put to rest the argument about whether Shepard was still part of the Alliance after becoming a Spectre (I say of course she was, otherwise it would make no sense for her to worry about fraternization, or try to impress the Admiral who comes to inspect the Normandy, or for Hackett to keep reminding her she's Alliance when giving her missions...).  And hopefully we would have Kaidan or Ashley on our side, because even if they're not happy about Shepard working with Cerberus, I don't think they would stand by and watch the Alliance hang her out to dry.

And Nick, I personally always save Kaidan, but I'm obviously biased.  I love Ashley for being so well written and interesting, but I don't feel guilty for sending her with the Salarians and going back to the bomb site.  It's the logical course of action to me, personally (and I can secretly blame Kirrahe for getting his entire squad back to the Normandy, but not her).

[Chignon]

I started another ME1 playthrough (to see what I all missed on my last one - still discovering new things!) and there are quite a few moments where I feel a bit sad or nostalgic when I have Ash/Kaidan in my squad and think of what is to come for them after ME1 and up until the end of ME2.

Ash, Kaidan and Shepard admiring the view on the Citadel and the locker scene with Kaidan's "Everything will be fine, Shepard." are one of those.



Do you have any such moments? And if so, which one and why?

[Ulathar]

@TZ....Well, we'd probably need someone to speak for us who is still part of the Alliance. Since Shepard is in question, he/she wouldn't be allowed to defend himself/herself. With Anderson sort of out of the picture after Retribution, that would leave Udina (uh....no), Hacket (maybe) and the VS to help us out......I like this already

[jlb524]

Just dropping by to support Kaidan, Kaidan DLC, Kaidan in ME3, all of the above!

Chignon wrote...

Ash, Kaidan and Shepard admiring the view on the Citadel and the locker scene with Kaidan's "Everything will be fine, Shepard." are one of those.

Do you have any such moments? And if so, which one and why?

Yes, the scene with Kaidan, Ash, and Shepard on the Citadel was wonderful.  ME2 missed out on having moments such as these.  ME2 did have areas that you could click on and the squad mates would make a comment, but it wasn't as cinematic or as fun as that scene in ME1.

The entire end-game section, including Ilos, is one of those moments.  I really love that level, and I felt as if the whole ending to ME1 was quite epic.  

[Shenzi]

Chignon wrote...

I started another ME1 playthrough (to see what I all missed on my last one - still discovering new things!) and there are quite a few moments where I feel a bit sad or nostalgic when I have Ash/Kaidan in my squad and think of what is to come for them after ME1 and up until the end of ME2.
Ash, Kaidan and Shepard admiring the view on the Citadel and the locker scene with Kaidan's "Everything will be fine, Shepard." are one of those.

Do you have any such moments? And if so, which one and why?

TBH I don't think that way just because I've spent so much time working on my own fic, that my A/U version has become my ME2 storyline when thinking about my own canon character.
 
Occasionally when playing ME1 I'll look at Kaidan and think "Sorry about the trip to the pod that's headed your way, but I promise Kate will rescue you before you get turned into a smoothie," but that's as far as it goes. When I play ME1 I just enjoy being able to have  both my boys (Kaidan and Garrus) in my group.

[Sialater]

I don't know if I have an absolute favorite scene. The love scene is possibly the best written...

Can't wait to get to it with my replay of Avery.  Speaking of... I'm getting a ton of new reviews for aPoV despite not having updated in a couple weeks.  So... if someone's recommending it somewhere, THANKS!

Modifié par Sialater, 14 septembre 2010 - 03:22 .

[Shenzi]

Sialater wrote...

I don't know if I have an absolute favorite scene. The love scene is possibly the best written...

Can't wait to get to it with my replay of Avery.  Speaking of... I'm getting a ton of new reviews for aPoV despite not having updated in a couple weeks.  So... if someone's recommending it somewhere, THANKS!

So when will we get a new chapter of aPoV? 

(you just had to know I couldn't resist asking that question.)

[Sialater]

LOL, Meg's holding up the works at the moment, but aPoV is definitely on the schedule.

[Daewan]

TeenZombie wrote...

Systemlord Baal wrote...

@sagequeen...I agree on the trials. I loved the one in NWN2 and KotOR (Manaan). Really cool stuff and I'm hoping for one in ME3, too.

Yeah, the trial in NWN 2 was my favorite part of the game, and cemented my love for Sand...sob!  He really should have been a romance option.  I fully believe Obsidian hates romances, and hates making romances for female players even more.

Some quotes from Chris Avellone, lead writer for KOTOR 2, on romance:

I wish I believed in romance more than Bioware. I just can't write it
unless one of the pair gets impaled on a pike, set on fire, or betrays
the other and then impales them on a pike or sets them on fire.
Generally, I prefer unrequited, melancholy, quiet suffering whenever
possible, which really doesn't go over well with a lot of the
role-players out there.

AVC: I read that you don’t like romances in games. Over the '00s,
the romances with companions have gotten more and more elaborate. And
BioWare’s Dragon Age: Origins has even been compared to a “love
sim”: some players focus all their attention on the romance options and
barely notice the main plot.
CA: I’ve got to be honest, I absolutely don’t like designing
romances. I think that you get a lot more drama and impact from failed
romances, or unrequited relationships that occur in games. I think that
creates more player tension. I’ve had debates with forum members where, I
guess I would agree that romances can still work, as long as the
consummation happens near the end. I just follow the soap opera
methodology, that once a relationship is consummated, you are now in
danger of boring the player. Because it’s consummated, that problem is
solved, and in a dramatic situation that’s not necessarily what you want
to happen. It just seemed like more tension could be had when there’s
something flawed there, or there’s a disconnect, and you might be able
to get more of an emotional impact when those things aren’t consummated,
but you know why.
So that’s kind of like the approach that I take. Now, that said, I’m
kind of hypocritical in that when I’m playing Mass Effect, Mass
Effect 2, I do want that consummation. I want to figure out what
makes Jack [in [i]Mass Effect 2[/i]] go this way or that away. So I
guess I have two sides warring there. But from a design perspective, I
feel like keeping the drama going is more important.

[Sialater]

Ugh. I hate stories like that.

[fortunesque]

I hate it too. Everyone loves a happy ending, dammit :/

[Sialater]

Shades of Babylon 5. *weeps bitterly over Marcus and Ivanova*

Anyway... I'm glad he's not writing the Shenko romance.


And I've made a request on the KAAS if anyone has time to look at it. social.bioware.com/group/1137/discussion/10859/899874/#post_899874

Modifié par Sialater, 14 septembre 2010 - 04:58 .

[FireEye]

I don't like endings. 



... well, maybe this one, I guess...

[Collider]

Manaan was beautiful.



As for KOTOR II. The "romances" were so subtle and off-screen that I prefer they hadn't included it at all. It's a little frustrating when Atton is obviously into your exile but you can't express interest in him too.

[Daewan]

I would have preferred something like this:


updated to be relevant to the discussion

Modifié par Daewan, 14 septembre 2010 - 05:26 .

[Sialater]

Nah... Disciple was FAR too annoying.



And now... back to our regularly scheduled Kaidan...

[syllogi]

Collider wrote...

Manaan was beautiful.

As for KOTOR II. The "romances" were so subtle and off-screen that I prefer they hadn't included it at all. It's a little frustrating when Atton is obviously into your exile but you can't express interest in him too.

Seriously!  I loved Atton, but was so frustrated by not being able to do anything about it.  Even the cut content, where he could die in a fight with Sion if he was in love with the Exile, would have been better than what we got.

I choose to believe that my Exile and Atton went off together after the end of the game, Kreia be damned.

But other than Atton, my only video game love has been Kaidan, and they're very different.  I'm very glad Kaidan doesn't have a tortured past like that, though.

[Collider]

What's funny too is that for ManShep, he turns into a girl in the romance scene. In the scene between Ash and FemShep nothing changes.

I assume they never got around to animating any M/M love scenes.
Virmire...Kaidan is a lot more useful to Shepard's mission. Ashley's just a soldier. A spirited one at that. But Shepard can really get people who shoot things anywhere - they are a dime a dozen.

Kaidan's an L2 biotic (not to mention with the even more rare circumstance of not having as bad of headaches as the other L2s) with a very well decorated leadership history. He also has technical skills. You can't really replace him. He also obviously gets along better with aliens. If Shepard dies in battle, Kaidan would easily be the best choice to replace Shepard against Saren.

Modifié par Collider, 14 septembre 2010 - 05:26 .

[FenrisDeSolar]

fortunesque wrote...

I hate it too. Everyone loves a happy ending, dammit :/

Would you guys think less of me if I disagreed with this...?

I was so pissed off when no one died on my first suicide mission. Killed the drama... So, I intentionally made a playthrough where I treated everyone like sh*te and made sure they all died. >:/

I'm not completely against happiness, but when things end with an "all was well" or "happily ever after" I just wanna shoot something to ruin the mood. >

[Sialater]

FenrisDeSolar wrote...

fortunesque wrote...

I hate it too. Everyone loves a happy ending, dammit :/

Would you guys think less of me if I disagreed with this...?

I was so pissed off when no one died on my first suicide mission. Killed the drama... So, I intentionally made a playthrough where I treated everyone like sh*te and made sure they all died. >:/

I'm not completely against happiness, but when things end with an "all was well" or "happily ever after" I just wanna shoot something to ruin the mood. >

OK, Fenris.... ALMOST everyone.  Just keep the unhappiness away from Kaidan and Shepard.

Frankly, there's enough sad endings in real life.  I want my fiction to ignore that.

[fortunesque]

I agree that drama and death and near death is fine, but I want a happy ending for Shepard and Kaidan. I'm not going to sit around for 4+ years as someone who has been there since the beginning only to have the resolution to the plot be a tragic ending. Quite frankly, that'd be a slap in the face.

[Collider]

Mass Effect is a trilogy. If we aren't able to get a "happily ever after" ending, that's just lame. I can accept it for independent games like Dragon Age. A game that makes no jokes - one that calls itself a dark game. Admittedly I thought they went too far with the darkness in Alistair's romance ending, but players got what they payed for. a dark fantasy game.

Mass Effect though, is a trilogy (edit: just realized I already said this, but what the heck).The player needs to feel that what they did was worth it. They played and paid for 3 full priced games. And several hours of invested time.


If the player is unable to get a satisfactory ending with their romance interest, that's wrong. It's like Luke dying at the end of the original Star Wars trilogy. It doesn't make sense, and it doesn't fit.

Modifié par Collider, 14 septembre 2010 - 05:33 .