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All Tali fans, read this! IT'S UP TO US TO KEEP TALI ALIVE! 3.0!!


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#7476
The_KFD_Case

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Yionel wrote...

I think that rewriting the geth being good or bad gonna be up to shepard's ability to convince the geth and teh quarians to work togheter..this is a typical bioware trap choice..they show you a potentialy long term good decision..and make you hesitate with "probable" short term consequences...in most case its a way to trick the player to think its bad thing to rewrite the geth cause of how you feel about there past..but im 99% sure its gonna pay off in ME3


This. That is precisely how I felt about the Rachni queen option in ME1. In real life I would probably have terminated her due to the version of history I had received about them. I still had doubts about letting her live up until the point we encounter her Asarian representative on Illium. Looks like I made the more beneficial call after all. Oh, and yes, BioWare is known for sneaky choices like that. Makes it easier to second guess them...unless they have caught on to that and are counting on us counting on them counting on us acting/thinking in certain ways. Ahhh! I love it!:D

P.S. Page 300! Woot!

Modifié par The_KFD_Case, 22 février 2010 - 03:02 .


#7477
NuclearBuddha

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Christ, can we get off of page 299 already? I'm sick of the broken tables.

Edit:  NEVERMIND.

Modifié par NuclearBuddha, 22 février 2010 - 03:02 .


#7478
Guest_DrathanGervaise_*

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RevanKun123 wrote...

herbie dog wrote...

Hi again!
Just had my lunch :)
Did I miss anything important?


Let's see...

Mothbanquet and KFD were being wicked.
The tali gift about all the caffeine she took.
The chibi Tali draw.
The legion talk.
I have died again.
And how the heck is it even possible that people are still reading parts of my fanfiction sequel?

Chibi? CHIBI? CHIBI?!?!

I just died a little inside...

#7479
FsDxRAGE

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yay 300! ALL FOR TALI!

#7480
The_KFD_Case

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NuclearBuddha wrote...

Lareit wrote...

I agree
I like legion, I trust him, I also like and trust Edi....but I also can't deny it would be very easy for them to have some logic code built into them that would have them stab me in the back at some point due to some feature of their programming.

AI in general are an intelligence so alien, organics really can't understand how they think. Geth are alien even among other AI's

They might not be devious, but their motivations can't truly be trusted.

Legion concerns me not because he might have some sort of traitor code built in, but because he is essentially a stalker.  And not a clutzy and lovable stalker like Conrad Verner.  He's the kind of stalker that would shoot someone in the head to be just like his hero.

The thing that worries me about the geth is the possibility that the "future" they're building might not have a place in it for organics.  Legion makes it sound reasonable with his "don't involve yourself with us, and we won't involve ourselves with you" but the catch there is that the geth don't care if "their future" is unpalatable to others.


How is that different from the organics? Do they/we care if our future is palatable for the Geth? Nope. Double standard my friend.

#7481
Wally2905

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The_KFD_Case wrote...

Consider a potential positive: The Heretics have hands-on experience dealing with a Reaper and Reaper tech. That could perhaps be used to find a weakness in the approaching Reaper fleet (and it was one of the reasons that made me choose to reprogram the Heretics rather than destroy them). We've got bigger fish to fry than the Heretics or the Geth, and we could sure use their help. The Geth's ability to provide armies would be almost unparalled given the way they can log in and out of platforms without needing training. As long as the hubs aren't destroyed the Geth effectively take no casualties.


Their nigh-immortality poses a problem. Geth aren't Kling...I mean Krogan who live to fight. Looking from their perspective, if they joined withe the citadel against the reapers, they might be in danger of becoming an army of slaves (not really, but I can't think of a better word at the moment). If any organic species says "send in the geth, if they die, we just download them into a new body" - logically they would be correct, because no lives are lost. What's stopping any other species from saying the same thing?

#7482
Sensei Wuzi

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TALI FTW! 300 PAGES FTW!

#7483
herbie dog

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Image IPB300!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Image IPB

#7484
NuclearBuddha

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The_KFD_Case wrote...

Yionel wrote...

I think that rewriting the geth being good or bad gonna be up to shepard's ability to convince the geth and teh quarians to work togheter..this is a typical bioware trap choice..they show you a potentialy long term good decision..and make you hesitate with "probable" short term consequences...in most case its a way to trick the player to think its bad thing to rewrite the geth cause of how you feel about there past..but im 99% sure its gonna pay off in ME3


This. That is precisely how I felt about the Rachni queen option in ME1. In real life I would probably have terminated her due to the version of history I had received about them. I still had doubts about letting her live up until the point we encounter her Asarian representative on Illium. Looks like I made the more beneficial call after all. Oh, and yes, BioWare is known for sneaky choices like that. Makes it easier to second guess them...unless they have caught on to that and are counting on us counting on them counting on us acting/thinking in certain ways. Ahhh! I love it!:D

P.S. Page 300! Woot!


The Rachni thing seemed real clear-cut.  I thought it was already apparent in ME1 that the Reapers had been messing with them to cause the war.  I was a little worried that the queen was just lying (liars worry about being lied to, I guess)  but I didn't really stop and think like I did with the geth.

#7485
The_KFD_Case

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RevanKun123 wrote...

herbie dog wrote...

Hi again!
Just had my lunch :)
Did I miss anything important?


Let's see...

Mothbanquet and KFD were being wicked.
The tali gift about all the caffeine she took.
The chibi Tali draw.
The legion talk.
I have died again.
And how the heck is it even possible that people are still reading parts of my fanfiction sequel?


Mmm. Wicked....:devil:

#7486
NuclearBuddha

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The_KFD_Case wrote...

NuclearBuddha wrote...

Lareit wrote...

I agree
I like legion, I trust him, I also like and trust Edi....but I also can't deny it would be very easy for them to have some logic code built into them that would have them stab me in the back at some point due to some feature of their programming.

AI in general are an intelligence so alien, organics really can't understand how they think. Geth are alien even among other AI's

They might not be devious, but their motivations can't truly be trusted.

Legion concerns me not because he might have some sort of traitor code built in, but because he is essentially a stalker.  And not a clutzy and lovable stalker like Conrad Verner.  He's the kind of stalker that would shoot someone in the head to be just like his hero.

The thing that worries me about the geth is the possibility that the "future" they're building might not have a place in it for organics.  Legion makes it sound reasonable with his "don't involve yourself with us, and we won't involve ourselves with you" but the catch there is that the geth don't care if "their future" is unpalatable to others.


How is that different from the organics? Do they/we care if our future is palatable for the Geth? Nope. Double standard my friend.


When the geth show up at the Citadel petitioning for an embassy to show their good will with regards to coexisting with organics, I will happily retract my statement of suspicion.  Until then, they are talking a good game without any actions to back it up.  That is how it is different from organics.

#7487
Yazman

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Yionel wrote...

Image IPB

*boing boing boing...pounce!!*


Oh man thats so awesome.. :)

I gotta go now guys, time to sleep. Keep spreading the love! :D

#7488
herbie dog

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I gotta go now guys, time to go to work. Keep spreading the love! :D




#7489
The_KFD_Case

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DrakeforBake wrote...

You're forgetting one very important thing in that thought process reaperredeemer. The Geth Heretics are almost the same as husks. They've been forcefully mutated into a reaper's will made manifest.

I'll give an example of what I'm getting at. A woman has been stabbed by a dragon's tooth and been completely converted into a husk. This husk will run around slaughtering anything in it's way but before that it was a wife of 15 years and a mother of 2. You then come across an item that will rewrite the husk reverting it's cognitive functions back to that of the woman that was lost. Fully allowing it to become human once again.

If you could give back what was lost, from a raving stark crazy monster, to return them back to their original way, would you do it? It's not brainwashing in the traditional sense. They've already been brainwashed, that's what caused the error in the code. Is it really so cruel to remove the damage that was done to them to allow them to think for themselves again?

That is why it's the Paragon option, that which is not dead, can always choose to make itself better.

I have a sneaky feeling it will be the "Heretic" Geth which will fight for you and that the Homeworld Geth are the devious ones.

If your curious how I came to that, think hard about Legion.

You slaughtered thousands of Geth. The Geth that weren't being killed then decided to send an autonomous unit solo to find Shepard. A single platform, given enough Geth programs to be fully functional. It's not that they were sent to understand the reaper tech like when you come across him. Legion has been tracking Shepard for 2 years! The beacon problem only occurs recently!

Why would anyone ever send a single unit out in covert actions against a specific individual that has shown repeated success against your kind? If it were peace talks why not just go straight to the Quarians, losing a few platforms sure but they'd get the hint eventually. Geth do not die so long as they have a FTL comm system to download off, so they could simply keep sending messengers. Legion was sent out specifically for Shepard. Sounding shadier yet?


I like your comparison to the ability to revert a "monster" back to in to its original more human form. As for Legion being "shady", I'm not convinced. I forget exactly what reason Legion gave for seeking Shepard out. I think it had to do with the fact that the Geth are fascinated by his ability to resist a Reaper which is also their enemy. As Legion goes on to say, it would be mutually beneficial for both the Geth and Shepard's forces to work together against a common enemy.

What is fascinating and which may have profound implications appears to be the emergence of individuality in Legion (i.e. holding on to a piece of Shepard's former N7 armor).

Modifié par The_KFD_Case, 22 février 2010 - 03:13 .


#7490
Axnollouse

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THIS. IS. TALI.



Good morning all! What is going on?

#7491
vykvyper1

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Yionel wrote...
Image IPB


I always thought this really showed her personality. She's kinda fidgety and energetic. Plus, her legs have always looked springy. This animation has just always... fit.^_^

#7492
RevanKun123

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The_KFD_Case wrote...

RevanKun123 wrote...

herbie dog wrote...

Hi again!
Just had my lunch :)
Did I miss anything important?


Let's see...

Mothbanquet and KFD were being wicked.
The tali gift about all the caffeine she took.
The chibi Tali draw.
The legion talk.
I have died again.
And how the heck is it even possible that people are still reading parts of my fanfiction sequel?


Mmm. Wicked....:devil:


Take some caffeine...Yes like her.
Image IPB

And stop grinning like mad man...Yes I CAN see you.

#7493
The_KFD_Case

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Wally2905 wrote...

The_KFD_Case wrote...

Consider a potential positive: The Heretics have hands-on experience dealing with a Reaper and Reaper tech. That could perhaps be used to find a weakness in the approaching Reaper fleet (and it was one of the reasons that made me choose to reprogram the Heretics rather than destroy them). We've got bigger fish to fry than the Heretics or the Geth, and we could sure use their help. The Geth's ability to provide armies would be almost unparalled given the way they can log in and out of platforms without needing training. As long as the hubs aren't destroyed the Geth effectively take no casualties.


Their nigh-immortality poses a problem. Geth aren't Kling...I mean Krogan who live to fight. Looking from their perspective, if they joined withe the citadel against the reapers, they might be in danger of becoming an army of slaves (not really, but I can't think of a better word at the moment). If any organic species says "send in the geth, if they die, we just download them into a new body" - logically they would be correct, because no lives are lost. What's stopping any other species from saying the same thing?


The fact that the Geth are sentient. Ask the Quarians how the last attempt at controlling them went....:whistle: Now get them on board as willing partners and it may well be an entirely different story.

Modifié par The_KFD_Case, 22 février 2010 - 03:16 .


#7494
Wally2905

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Giong to go slightly off topic, but I want to share this with you guys. Don't know if you've seen it before, but this gif is really cool



Image IPB

#7495
Sensei Wuzi

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The_KFD_Case wrote...

What is fascinating and which may have profound implications appears to be the emergence of individuality in Legion (i.e. holding on to a piece of Shepard's former N7 armor).


I agree, I think it shows proof of emotion.:wizard:

#7496
Beyonder101

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You guys know what time it is? It´s time to love Tali .come on , giver her your love :wub:

Modifié par Beyonder101, 22 février 2010 - 03:16 .


#7497
R34P3RR3D33M3R

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Beyonder101 wrote...

You guys know what time it is? It´s time to love Tali .come on , giver her your love :wub:


I just did! And now I'm reloading to do it all over again. Might do it a third time before actually starting the Suicide Mission.

#7498
vykvyper1

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Sensei Wuzi wrote...

The_KFD_Case wrote...

What is fascinating and which may have profound implications appears to be the emergence of individuality in Legion (i.e. holding on to a piece of Shepard's former N7 armor).


I agree, I think it shows proof of emotion.:wizard:


I took it as meaning the Geth wanted someone to lead them. After all, the Quarians created them as servants originally. It's only natural that they gravitate toward Shepard. Perhaps they just want a guiding force that doesn't want to kill them:blink:

#7499
The_KFD_Case

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NuclearBuddha wrote...

The_KFD_Case wrote...

NuclearBuddha wrote...

Lareit wrote...

I agree
I like legion, I trust him, I also like and trust Edi....but I also can't deny it would be very easy for them to have some logic code built into them that would have them stab me in the back at some point due to some feature of their programming.

AI in general are an intelligence so alien, organics really can't understand how they think. Geth are alien even among other AI's

They might not be devious, but their motivations can't truly be trusted.

Legion concerns me not because he might have some sort of traitor code built in, but because he is essentially a stalker.  And not a clutzy and lovable stalker like Conrad Verner.  He's the kind of stalker that would shoot someone in the head to be just like his hero.

The thing that worries me about the geth is the possibility that the "future" they're building might not have a place in it for organics.  Legion makes it sound reasonable with his "don't involve yourself with us, and we won't involve ourselves with you" but the catch there is that the geth don't care if "their future" is unpalatable to others.


How is that different from the organics? Do they/we care if our future is palatable for the Geth? Nope. Double standard my friend.


When the geth show up at the Citadel petitioning for an embassy to show their good will with regards to coexisting with organics, I will happily retract my statement of suspicion.  Until then, they are talking a good game without any actions to back it up.  That is how it is different from organics.


Circular logic given that any Geth craft would be attacked on sight. That's the re-occurring "disconnect": The Geth uprising gave them a bad reputation (which was deserved to an extent at the time but as with other things they have grown and changed during the passage of time). A Reaper then shows up and corrupts a fraction of Geth whom are allowed to leave the Geth and end up becoming the Heretics. Those are the ones that continued to attacke organics thus further cementing the negative and ignorant perception the organic races have of the Geth (they fail to distinguish between the two factions). So if the Geth - the true Geth - were to send emmisaries odds are they would be destroyed on sight. Bear in mind the Geth are logical beings and how many times do you attempt such contact before deducing logically that it is a futile effort? Furthermore, the Geth freely acknowledge that they don't understand organics which is one of the reasons they monitor organic broadcasts. There's a lot of confusion, incorrect/warped perceptions and misunderstandings flying around between organics and synthetics and that's the "disconnect".

#7500
damage incorp96

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DrakeforBake wrote...

You're forgetting one very important thing in that thought process reaperredeemer. The Geth Heretics are almost the same as husks. They've been forcefully mutated into a reaper's will made manifest.

I'll give an example of what I'm getting at. A woman has been stabbed by a dragon's tooth and been completely converted into a husk. This husk will run around slaughtering anything in it's way but before that it was a wife of 15 years and a mother of 2. You then come across an item that will rewrite the husk reverting it's cognitive functions back to that of the woman that was lost. Fully allowing it to become human once again.

If you could give back what was lost, from a raving stark crazy monster, to return them back to their original way, would you do it? It's not brainwashing in the traditional sense. They've already been brainwashed, that's what caused the error in the code. Is it really so cruel to remove the damage that was done to them to allow them to think for themselves again?

That is why it's the Paragon option, that which is not dead, can always choose to make itself better.

I have a sneaky feeling it will be the "Heretic" Geth which will fight for you and that the Homeworld Geth are the devious ones.

If your curious how I came to that, think hard about Legion.

You slaughtered thousands of Geth. The Geth that weren't being killed then decided to send an autonomous unit solo to find Shepard. A single platform, given enough Geth programs to be fully functional. It's not that they were sent to understand the reaper tech like when you come across him. Legion has been tracking Shepard for 2 years! The beacon problem only occurs recently!

Why would anyone ever send a single unit out in covert actions against a specific individual that has shown repeated success against your kind? If it were peace talks why not just go straight to the Quarians, losing a few platforms sure but they'd get the hint eventually. Geth do not die so long as they have a FTL comm system to download off, so they could simply keep sending messengers. Legion was sent out specifically for Shepard. Sounding shadier yet?



Good point, and I understand where you are coming from, but in your example if you brought the woman back it would cause more harm imo. We need to know if they retain any memories of being a husk before we can determine what to do. If she has no memory, sure let her go on her way and live out her life. If he remembers every person she tore limb from limb, she will go crazy once you bring her back. I understand geth don't have the same feeling as that woman does, but would they also have a 'mental' breakdown?