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[Azint]

You do realize that Liara's sub-plot is under Missions and not Assignments, right? It conjures the thought that not helping her could have some hefty reprucussions in ME3, like mayber her death. What do you thnk could happen if you never tell her of Nyxeris?

[Goodwood]

NuclearBuddha wrote...

Goodwood wrote...
Answer: It was Shepard's death and the aftermath that did it, obviously. If Shepard is any kind of friend, she will help Liara get her head on straight if/when the opportunity presents itself.

Agreed.  What I'm really regretting about ME2 is the inability to resolve lingering issues w/ Liara.  I mean, getting the cheek and head-shake when meeting her on Ilium sure feels like a break-up, but I'd rather really have it out in the open.

So yeah, I'm all for helping her.  If not with the Shadow Broker, then at least with her issues (a Garrus-style intervention maybe).  But the relationship?  It's changed.

Changed? Possibly. Ended? Never (unless your Shep chooses to end it).

Liara cares deeply for Shepard, whether or not you romanced her, which is why she went through hell to have a chance at bringing her back to life. I don't really get the impression that Liara's turned into her mother either; Benezia wasn't always the way we saw her in ME1, in any case. If anything, it's the cutthroat nature of her business and the realities of life on Illium that forces Liara to behave as she does, at least in the initial encounters. My Shep is grateful for what Liara did -- besides, it beats ending up as part of the Human Reaper.

[Phil725]

NuclearBuddha wrote...

Goodwood wrote...
Answer: It was Shepard's death and the aftermath that did it, obviously. If Shepard is any kind of friend, she will help Liara get her head on straight if/when the opportunity presents itself.

Agreed.  What I'm really regretting about ME2 is the inability to resolve lingering issues w/ Liara.  I mean, getting the cheek and head-shake when meeting her on Ilium sure feels like a break-up, but I'd rather really have it out in the open.

So yeah, I'm all for helping her.  If not with the Shadow Broker, then at least with her issues (a Garrus-style intervention maybe).  But the relationship?  It's changed.

That was a major complaint I had with ME2 in general.  They really didn't go deep enough with the ME1 LIs at all.  I would have loved an option to talk things out further with Liara and Ashley.  Ashley moreso, since she sends you an email that leaves the relationship open, yet you can't respond. <_<

It just seems to me like Bioware said; lets make all of the ME1 LIs as offputting as possible, and make breaking up impossible  to see how high we can get the percentage of people who cheated. 

It was the second biggest disconnect for me from a roleplaying perspective behind Tali's face.

[Newcomer11294]

Kinda off topic, but long time lurker here. I'm just suprised the mods havent sent this place on lockdown yet, considerng we're nearing the 4k pages mark.

[NuclearBuddha]

Azint wrote...
You do realize that Liara's sub-plot is under Missions and not Assignments, right? It conjures the thought that not helping her could have some hefty reprucussions in ME3, like mayber her death. What do you thnk could happen if you never tell her of Nyxeris?

I noticed that, too.  I never said I wouldn't help her.  After all, she pretty much blackmails you by promising to kill five people (four of them who don't have to die) if you don't help her.  I have wondered what might happen if you tell her the wrong target, though.

[Azint]

cannedcream wrote...

See, I'm having the same problem at the end of ME2, for the live of me I can't get Tali to be the one who slides down the falling platform. So far I've saved Garrus, Zaeed, and Thane (TWICE).
Damn it, Tali! Let me save you from nearly falling to your death!

It's randomized. No really.

[Strawberry Kiwi]

Azint wrote...

You do realize that Liara's sub-plot is under Missions and not Assignments, right? It conjures the thought that not helping her could have some hefty reprucussions in ME3, like mayber her death. What do you thnk could happen if you never tell her of Nyxeris?

Oh, good point. Nyxeris probably assasinates her. Liara even admits she probably would have been killed if Shepard didn't help her.

[greywarden1212]

NuclearBuddha wrote...

cannedcream wrote...

Strawberry Kiwi wrote...

I always take Garrus and Tali with me. Tried twice to get Tali to shoot him, to no avail. Even tried selecting Tali first, but I believe it doesn't work that way in ME1.

See, I'm having the same problem at the end of ME2, for the live of me I can't get Tali to be the one who slides down the falling platform. So far I've saved Garrus, Zaeed, and Thane (TWICE).
Damn it, Tali! Let me save you from nearly falling to your death!

Dying and having to reload during that section resets the character order somehow.  If you do so w/ Miranda in your party, she does EVERYTHING at the last battle:  Answers TIM's call, hands you the grenade, falls off the platform, and catches Shep.

I wonder why miranda changes it so much i had tali and legion and when tali started to slide i almost **** my pants in surprise.

[NuclearBuddha]

Phil725 wrote...

NuclearBuddha wrote...

Goodwood wrote...
Answer: It was Shepard's death and the aftermath that did it, obviously. If Shepard is any kind of friend, she will help Liara get her head on straight if/when the opportunity presents itself.

Agreed.  What I'm really regretting about ME2 is the inability to resolve lingering issues w/ Liara.  I mean, getting the cheek and head-shake when meeting her on Ilium sure feels like a break-up, but I'd rather really have it out in the open.

So yeah, I'm all for helping her.  If not with the Shadow Broker, then at least with her issues (a Garrus-style intervention maybe).  But the relationship?  It's changed.

That was a major complaint I had with ME2 in general.  They really didn't go deep enough with the ME1 LIs at all.  I would have loved an option to talk things out further with Liara and Ashley.  Ashley moreso, since she sends you an email that leaves the relationship open, yet you can't respond. <_<

It just seems to me like Bioware said; lets make all of the ME1 LIs as offputting as possible, and make breaking up impossible  to see how high we can get the percentage of people who cheated. 

It was the second biggest disconnect for me from a roleplaying perspective behind Tali's face.

I can only hope they've got some real drama planned for the confrontation.  I guess it will be worth it then.

[Phil725]

Azint wrote...

You do realize that Liara's sub-plot is under Missions and not Assignments, right? It conjures the thought that not helping her could have some hefty reprucussions in ME3, like mayber her death. What do you thnk could happen if you never tell her of Nyxeris?

My problem with that is that the whole reason that Bioware gave for excluding Liara/A/k, was to make sure they were alive in ME3.  Pretty pointless to set it up like that and have a hidden decision to kill her off anyway.  I don't really put much stock in the mission/assignment thing.  Random coincidence/oversight is my opinion.

If anything, it may set her pursuit of TSB back some.

[NuclearBuddha]

Goodwood wrote...
Changed? Possibly. Ended? Never (unless your Shep chooses to end it).

Liara cares deeply for Shepard, whether or not you romanced her, which is why she went through hell to have a chance at bringing her back to life. I don't really get the impression that Liara's turned into her mother either; Benezia wasn't always the way we saw her in ME1, in any case. If anything, it's the cutthroat nature of her business and the realities of life on Illium that forces Liara to behave as she does, at least in the initial encounters. My Shep is grateful for what Liara did -- besides, it beats ending up as part of the Human Reaper.

Agreed again:  she'd have to do something totally out of character, like try to kill Shep or something for the relationship to end.  But as for what things were like before the destruction of the first Normandy?  It's tough to go back.

No lack of gratitude over here, either.  Just sadness and disappointment (and a touch of guilt) in what happened to a lover and a friend.

[greywarden1212]

antilles333 wrote...

THIS PAPER IS

DESTROYING MY BRAIN

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!

Makes ya wonder don't it = /

[Phil725]

NuclearBuddha wrote...

Azint wrote...
You do realize that Liara's sub-plot is under Missions and not Assignments, right? It conjures the thought that not helping her could have some hefty reprucussions in ME3, like mayber her death. What do you thnk could happen if you never tell her of Nyxeris?

I noticed that, too.  I never said I wouldn't help her.  After all, she pretty much blackmails you by promising to kill five people (four of them who don't have to die) if you don't help her.  I have wondered what might happen if you tell her the wrong target, though.

She kills that target and then says it wasn't the right person afterwards. 

I know because I messed up the first time.  Didn't put two and two together that the observer was female, and krogan females didn't leave the homeworld.  The krogan isn't mentioned anywhere else, so I thought that was it.  It really is pretty tricky the first time around, although the none of the above option just screams pick me

[NuclearBuddha]

antilles333 wrote...

What? I told Liara she should've left my ass dead.

Do you recall how that line goes?  I haven't had the heart to pick that option.  Because, well, I'd be glad to be alive.

[DrakeforBake]

antilles333 wrote...

What? I told Liara she should've left my ass dead.

Ouch man. Did you at least have the courtesy to have your romanced Tali wait outside?

[cannedcream]

NuclearBuddha wrote...
You know, that's a good question in general.  Are some people always monsters just waiting to have something uncover it, or doe trauma actually create a monster inside someone.

I'd like to say:  "anyone is capable of anything" but that doesn't really answer the question.  So what I will say is that Liara, despite being very learned and well-traveled, has led a basically sheltered life.  Until the events of ME1 her idea of excitment was digging up something.  If there was a dark core to that innocence, it couldn't help be revealed when everything is stripped away from her during the events following Shep's death.  Especially if she and Shep had formed a relationship along the way.

I honestly don't think that an event, no matter how tragic, can ever turn a person into something unless those tendencies were not already inside of them.
I think when a tragic event happens in our life, we take that time and decide (not always concisely) if we should let these parts of us out. Now, I'm not speaking ill of Liara. I do like her, just not as much as I used to. However, I think there were always these bits of her mother inside of her and the death of Shepard, the person who (could) break her out of her shell (for the reasons you listed) hardened her. I think she's becoming the copy of her mother's darker side because it's a defense mechanism to keep her at an emotional distance from the rest of the world. Losing the first love of her life right at the peak of their romance has probably devastated her in a way that many of us will hopefully never have to understand.
Rather then pick of the pieces, she became obsessive over finding Shepard and somehow resurrecting him (I'm not saying that her reasons weren't pure, but I am saying that it was a pipe-dream at best). With that done she didn't seem to have purpose anymore, so rather then return to what she knew and once enjoyed, she embraced this darker side of her, perhaps to take out her own personal misery on others.
Even when Shepard does return, she does little more than offer him a brief kiss before pushing herself away. It seems to me that she's truly bent on removing herself from the rest of the world.
Basically, I think she's acting this way simply because she doesn't want to be hurt again.

Or I could be full of it. I dunno. I only minored in Anthropology, so. . .take all that with a grain of salt.

[greywarden1212]

NuclearBuddha wrote...

Goodwood wrote...
Changed? Possibly. Ended? Never (unless your Shep chooses to end it).

Liara cares deeply for Shepard, whether or not you romanced her, which is why she went through hell to have a chance at bringing her back to life. I don't really get the impression that Liara's turned into her mother either; Benezia wasn't always the way we saw her in ME1, in any case. If anything, it's the cutthroat nature of her business and the realities of life on Illium that forces Liara to behave as she does, at least in the initial encounters. My Shep is grateful for what Liara did -- besides, it beats ending up as part of the Human Reaper.

Agreed again:  she'd have to do something totally out of character, like try to kill Shep or something for the relationship to end.  But as for what things were like before the destruction of the first Normandy?  It's tough to go back.

No lack of gratitude over here, either.  Just sadness and disappointment (and a touch of guilt) in what happened to a lover and a friend.

the sort of relation with most shep's and liara are at the point of CLOSE friend not having to get intimate, she has an almost family bond with you, it seems.

[Azint]

antilles333 wrote...

What? I told Liara she should've left my ass dead.

That's pretty harsh...

[NuclearBuddha]

Phil725 wrote...

NuclearBuddha wrote...

Azint wrote...
You do realize that Liara's sub-plot is under Missions and not Assignments, right? It conjures the thought that not helping her could have some hefty reprucussions in ME3, like mayber her death. What do you thnk could happen if you never tell her of Nyxeris?

I noticed that, too.  I never said I wouldn't help her.  After all, she pretty much blackmails you by promising to kill five people (four of them who don't have to die) if you don't help her.  I have wondered what might happen if you tell her the wrong target, though.

She kills that target and then says it wasn't the right person afterwards. 

I know because I messed up the first time.  Didn't put two and two together that the observer was female, and krogan females didn't leave the homeworld.  The krogan isn't mentioned anywhere else, so I thought that was it.  It really is pretty tricky the first time around, although the none of the above option just screams pick me

I arrived at the correct answer in the wrong way:  I was looking for whichever target wasn't mentioned in the fragments.  Each race was mentioned, so I figured it had to be none of the above.  My bad logic resulted in good results.

[Commander Marrek S]

Greetings. Back. How goes thread? Good, yes?

[Goodwood]

NuclearBuddha wrote...

Goodwood wrote...
Changed? Possibly. Ended? Never (unless your Shep chooses to end it).

Liara cares deeply for Shepard, whether or not you romanced her, which is why she went through hell to have a chance at bringing her back to life. I don't really get the impression that Liara's turned into her mother either; Benezia wasn't always the way we saw her in ME1, in any case. If anything, it's the cutthroat nature of her business and the realities of life on Illium that forces Liara to behave as she does, at least in the initial encounters. My Shep is grateful for what Liara did -- besides, it beats ending up as part of the Human Reaper.

Agreed again:  she'd have to do something totally out of character, like try to kill Shep or something for the relationship to end.  But as for what things were like before the destruction of the first Normandy?  It's tough to go back.

No lack of gratitude over here, either.  Just sadness and disappointment (and a touch of guilt) in what happened to a lover and a friend.

Of course you can never go back to the way things were. These are the kinds of events that shape and define a person; either they find themselves or they find themselves lacking. Liara has the strength and the gumption, of that I have no doubt. Given what the SB put her through, and what he/she/it/they nearly did to Shepard, then I have no problem with helping to eliminate him/her/it/they.

I would go so far as to suggest that, after the SB is no more, LiLi incorporates what's left of the organization into her own network, and she and Shepard turn that into the core of the anti-Reaper movement.

[greywarden1212]

antilles333 wrote...

greywarden1212 wrote...

antilles333 wrote...

THIS PAPER IS

DESTROYING MY BRAIN

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!

Makes ya wonder don't it = /

I have written 17 pages on the PRI party of Mexico.

I CANNOT push out three more. I have enough fluff in this paper to fill a pillow.

hope you're getting sleepy lol