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All Tali fans, read this! IT'S UP TO US TO KEEP TALI ALIVE! 3.0!!


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#1651
Archonsg

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AddoExAtrum wrote...

Archonsg wrote...


Anyways, it would be REALLY interesting to see how they'll pull off the dead Shepard scenario. I've got just the "sacrificial lamb Shepard" that I'll be running the suicide mission with and botch it all up.


Pointless. If you have a shepard that died in me2 there IS NO IMPORT. you have a generic guy and thats it. If you lose a few characters they will have impacts on their respective parts of the mission I am sure but it will probably be something you can work around. Either through new characters or an old character picking up the slack.

I believe they are doing this specifically to reward the people who bought and played ME1 and ME2. Like my ME1 import character starts ME2 at level 5 with 60k resources and like 350k credits. Its a reward for loyalty


Ohh. okies I think I get what you mean now. Nothing is imported so whatever happened in ME1 and ME2 including who lived or die is all given a "canon" reboot. Shepard never existed? Is that right? Lirra is what she is doing now, Ashley is a ranking Officer, possibly Kaiden is with her as well, Tali never met the player's Shepard but TNG has either helped her or not depending on maybe questionaire chat options. Is that what you mean?

#1652
AddoExAtrum

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Lareit wrote...

*more snipping*
Did you not pay attention to ME1/2 at all? The Rachni war was caused by the reapers. Which means the invasion attempt had failed to go off 2 thousand years earlier then the events of ME1 if not more. You really think it took Soverign 2000 years to figure out how to contact his reaper buddies to come help start the invasion attempt if they could of easily just jumped in through some obscure Mass Relay on the outer edges of the galaxy?




Actually the Rachini queen specifically states SHE DOES NOT KNOW WHAT HAPPENED the SONG WAS SOURED and that she only THINKS it was the Reapers. As for Soverign he has been laying around for 50,000 years watching organics grow and develop. Do you think 2000 years to find out what the hell went wrong at the citadel is really going to bother him that much?

Hell it might even have been their own fault that it took them that long to find out what happened. For all we know the Reapers have been flying to the galaxy for 2000 years and are only now just appearing BECAUSE the citadel could not be accessed.

All in all I think you are forgetting the most important thing about the Reapers. They are sentient machines, time has no meaning to them. They will win in the end no matter what we try because the cycle has been proven more times than can be counted as they see it. Whats an extra 2000 years to them?

#1653
MMA7FF

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so guys apparently hitler does like me2...



#1654
Scy Lancer

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A few things could happen with who is coming back in 3. Jack, Samara, and Thane might not be in for these reasons. Jack is basically there for the ride. No ties to Shepard (unless romanced) or the crew. Honestly I wouldn't be surprised if she just took off. Samara is almost 1000 years old. Thane is dieing and probably wants to spend time with his kid. They could probably come up with reasons to keep them around though. I could see them bringing back Ash or Liara, one or the other or which ever you romanced in ME1. I don't think Wrex will come back. He's got his people to think about.

Garrus and Tali will stick around. Garrus is Shepard's best bud and Tali is his girl... hands down.

#1655
AddoExAtrum

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Archonsg wrote...



Ohh. okies I think I get what you mean now. Nothing is imported so whatever happened in ME1 and ME2 including who lived or die is all given a "canon" reboot. Shepard never existed? Is that right? Lirra is what she is doing now, Ashley is a ranking Officer, possibly Kaiden is with her as well, Tali never met the player's Shepard but TNG has either helped her or not depending on maybe questionaire chat options. Is that what you mean?


Actually Tali wouldnt even be a player for TNG. Wrex would not be alive. if your male ash lives if your female kaiden lives i would assume cause that is the default for ME2. Also you would have Liara doing her own little thing unless she turns up as DLC in ME2 and becomes a squaddie. Then even she would probably be dead and not a viable character for TNG

#1656
Archonsg

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AddoExAtrum wrote...

Archonsg wrote...



Ohh. okies I think I get what you mean now. Nothing is imported so whatever happened in ME1 and ME2 including who lived or die is all given a "canon" reboot. Shepard never existed? Is that right? Lirra is what she is doing now, Ashley is a ranking Officer, possibly Kaiden is with her as well, Tali never met the player's Shepard but TNG has either helped her or not depending on maybe questionaire chat options. Is that what you mean?


Actually Tali wouldnt even be a player for TNG. Wrex would not be alive. if your male ash lives if your female kaiden lives i would assume cause that is the default for ME2. Also you would have Liara doing her own little thing unless she turns up as DLC in ME2 and becomes a squaddie. Then even she would probably be dead and not a viable character for TNG




Posted Image That is a rather depressing thought.
Why would anyone want to play ME3 without playing ME1 and 2 then?

#1657
AddoExAtrum

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@ Lariet



also before I forget, yes Soverign might very well have been searching the galaxy for 2000 years to find out what happened to the Citadel for 2 reason i can believe this.

1) In the 50,000 years we have been growing we still dont know wtf happened to the protheans

2) the reapers wiped out almost all traces of the protheans and every other race on every planet. How would he find out what went wrong without knowing where to look? They went to every planet in the known galaxy and wiped it clean, he has no clues as to why the citadel did not answer his signal and that could be why he first used the rachini if it was even him that did it, and now is using saren/the geth in me1.


#1658
AddoExAtrum

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Archonsg wrote...

Posted Image That is a rather depressing thought.
Why would anyone want to play ME3 without playing ME1 and 2 then?


because they read a review that the graphics are great and they want to test it out?

I honestly played ME2 before I played ME1.. then I went out and actually found a sealed PC copy of ME1 on ebay bought it got the DLC and played it all the way through just so I could import my character to ME2 and see all the cool **** that changed.

Thats loyalty lol

#1659
Yazman

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AddoExAtrum wrote...

Yazman wrote...

Archonsg wrote...
*snipped*


That is what bothered me.
If they bring Tali back, then logic would assume that they have to bring all the others back otherwise there will be dissent in why one character was given preferred status right?


No.. because its justified. Tali & Garrus have always been there with Shep.


Again they have already said there is no import to me3 if you died in me2. Dont expect to see any of the old chars then would be my guess even if we all feel they belong there cause it wont be the old shep


They've already said that you get given the default shep in ME3 if your shep died in ME2.

#1660
Lareit

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AddoExAtrum wrote...

Lareit wrote...

*more snipping*
Did you not pay attention to ME1/2 at all? The Rachni war was caused by the reapers. Which means the invasion attempt had failed to go off 2 thousand years earlier then the events of ME1 if not more. You really think it took Soverign 2000 years to figure out how to contact his reaper buddies to come help start the invasion attempt if they could of easily just jumped in through some obscure Mass Relay on the outer edges of the galaxy?




Actually the Rachini queen specifically states SHE DOES NOT KNOW WHAT HAPPENED the SONG WAS SOURED and that she only THINKS it was the Reapers. As for Soverign he has been laying around for 50,000 years watching organics grow and develop. Do you think 2000 years to find out what the hell went wrong at the citadel is really going to bother him that much?

Hell it might even have been their own fault that it took them that long to find out what happened. For all we know the Reapers have been flying to the galaxy for 2000 years and are only now just appearing BECAUSE the citadel could not be accessed.

All in all I think you are forgetting the most important thing about the Reapers. They are sentient machines, time has no meaning to them. They will win in the end no matter what we try because the cycle has been proven more times than can be counted as they see it. Whats an extra 2000 years to them?


It was implied and spectulated heavy in ME1. It was all but confirmed in ME2. The only way it would be more blatant to say the Rachni were indoctrinated would be a Dev comming out and saying it.

Also, Soverign existed back when Anderson was trying to become a Spectre, AGAIN if it was a short trip to the outer relays, why the hell didn't soverign just do that instead of spending 20 years organizing an attempt to safely activate the Citadel's Relay.

You're logic is very faulty in this regard. If they really could just relay in as you mentioned the entire first game is pointless in such an extream it's embarassing. It's also absurd to think they wouldn't of already started comming over before the events of the 2nd game ended.

#1661
Angelraid

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AddoExAtrum wrote...

Lareit wrote...

*more snipping*
Did you not pay attention to ME1/2 at all? The Rachni war was caused by the reapers. Which means the invasion attempt had failed to go off 2 thousand years earlier then the events of ME1 if not more. You really think it took Soverign 2000 years to figure out how to contact his reaper buddies to come help start the invasion attempt if they could of easily just jumped in through some obscure Mass Relay on the outer edges of the galaxy?




Actually the Rachini queen specifically states SHE DOES NOT KNOW WHAT HAPPENED the SONG WAS SOURED and that she only THINKS it was the Reapers. As for Soverign he has been laying around for 50,000 years watching organics grow and develop. Do you think 2000 years to find out what the hell went wrong at the citadel is really going to bother him that much?

Hell it might even have been their own fault that it took them that long to find out what happened. For all we know the Reapers have been flying to the galaxy for 2000 years and are only now just appearing BECAUSE the citadel could not be accessed.

All in all I think you are forgetting the most important thing about the Reapers. They are sentient machines, time has no meaning to them. They will win in the end no matter what we try because the cycle has been proven more times than can be counted as they see it. Whats an extra 2000 years to them?


That makes no sense. If time had no meaning to them why not just wait another 2000 years? Or 50000?
I'm sure they dont worry about time the way we do in growing old or anything but I'm certain they understand the concept of urgency and the longer they wait the harder it's gonna be to win.

The entire point is if it only takes a year or some to get here normally why not just start w/ that as apposed to trying to use the rachni or Saren and the geth or the collectors. Why would sovereign risk his neck when he coulda just waited a few months for all his buddys to show up and THEN take the citidel to see what was wrong. Its just not logical.

#1662
Exakil

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Hehe I did a fresh ME2 to start off, then loaded over a couple ME1 saves, always nice to see what the game is like if you didnt load over a save... makes you feel bad is what it does, all opposite decisions i made, lol. ME3 would probably be like that too, less people because a few died on suicide mission, few side quests complete, all that jazz.

#1663
Scy Lancer

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Ok who thinks Tali will get a new look? Maybe more armor looking outfit?

#1664
Exakil

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Im thinking if theres a new outfit, changes wouldnt be very big, and i cant see her wearing much armor, her enviro suit and the fact she is an engineer kind of suggests that she cant wear alot, just my thoughts :)

#1665
MMA7FF

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ok guys well im headin to sleep

keep the thread rollin

keelah se'lai

#1666
BLACKOUT228

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Geth Hunter Alpha wrote...

AddoExAtrum wrote...

Lareit wrote...

*more snipping*
Did you not pay attention to ME1/2 at all? The Rachni war was caused by the reapers. Which means the invasion attempt had failed to go off 2 thousand years earlier then the events of ME1 if not more. You really think it took Soverign 2000 years to figure out how to contact his reaper buddies to come help start the invasion attempt if they could of easily just jumped in through some obscure Mass Relay on the outer edges of the galaxy?




Actually the Rachini queen specifically states SHE DOES NOT KNOW WHAT HAPPENED the SONG WAS SOURED and that she only THINKS it was the Reapers. As for Soverign he has been laying around for 50,000 years watching organics grow and develop. Do you think 2000 years to find out what the hell went wrong at the citadel is really going to bother him that much?

Hell it might even have been their own fault that it took them that long to find out what happened. For all we know the Reapers have been flying to the galaxy for 2000 years and are only now just appearing BECAUSE the citadel could not be accessed.

All in all I think you are forgetting the most important thing about the Reapers. They are sentient machines, time has no meaning to them. They will win in the end no matter what we try because the cycle has been proven more times than can be counted as they see it. Whats an extra 2000 years to them?


That makes no sense. If time had no meaning to them why not just wait another 2000 years? Or 50000?
I'm sure they dont worry about time the way we do in growing old or anything but I'm certain they understand the concept of urgency and the longer they wait the harder it's gonna be to win.

The entire point is if it only takes a year or some to get here normally why not just start w/ that as apposed to trying to use the rachni or Saren and the geth or the collectors. Why would sovereign risk his neck when he coulda just waited a few months for all his buddys to show up and THEN take the citidel to see what was wrong. Its just not logical.


Time OBVIOUSLY matters. The reapers out in Dark Space only have so much energy. Once they run out, their fleet is toast. That's why the reapers are forcing their hand. They probably have their lead guy get things ready. If he fails, they have their back up plan. (The collecters) and if that fails, they save just enough energy so they can make their way back to the Milky Way so they can control the galaxy. If there wasn't a reason for soverign to force his hand, I doubt Saren would of been the agent he used to make his move. I'm sure it would have been years later.

#1667
Angelraid

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MMA7FF wrote...

ok guys well im headin to sleep
keep the thread rollin
keelah se'lai


Keehal Se'lai freind. Sweet Dreams.

#1668
Exakil

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night MMA7FF

#1669
Scy Lancer

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I would like to see some sort of Quarian commando uniform. Maybe have then do a combat outfit and a leisure outfit. Like how Shepard has in ME2.

#1670
Yazman

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MMA7FF wrote...

ok guys well im headin to sleep
keep the thread rollin
keelah se'lai


Keelah Se'lai my friend :)

#1671
Pauravi

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Geth Hunter Alpha wrote...

I doubt that many of your squad from ME 2 will be returning as squad members. Just from a technical standpoint having to lay out every single senario resulting from who lives and dies at the end of ME2 to start ME3 will take more work than the first two combined. Just too many variables.

Not as many as you'd think.  There only need to be as many variables as characters.  There are two scenarios for each character, alive or dead.  Each character can be thought of as a 'module', containing all their dialogue and their interactions with other story elements.  If they aren't there, those things go away.  The number of different combinations is really irrelevant, you just incorporate as many of the character "modules" as is needed for any particular playthrough.


Say if 3 of your squad die, how are they going to replace them? 3 new squad members? But what if 5 die? Then 5 new members? But how do you decide what new ones you get. maybe the guy who got 5 got a cooler guy than the guy who got 3 just cuase he got more replacements. What if know one died then you don't get to see any of the new characters? Or if everyone died? Do you have to do ME3 alone? And every combination in between.

First of all, you can't have everyone die unless Shepard also dies, and then you can't import the game.  But to address your concern... perhaps they simply won't be replaced?  That is perfectly plausible.  It would certainly give a lot of weight to your actions in ME2.  Or there may be, say, 2-3 new characters, period, no matter how many people died.  No permutations needed.  Simple, effective.


It would be cool if they could do that but the branching would be just too extreme.

Like I said, not really too much branching.  It is fairly binary.  If X character is there, then Y happens.  If X character is NOT there, Z happens.  There is really only those two possibilities for any given situation that your team member would have any effect on.  That isn't too difficult to take into account.  I'm sure in certain situations they could provide more possibilities if you have two particular characters instead of one or none, but it wouldn't be necessary in most cases.


More than likely they will either

A) reset shepard w/ a new squad like they did in ME2

B) have the ME1 squad return

A) would throw away all the character development they have done over the past 2 games and break the continuity of the story, and you know how Bioware loves to develop their characters.  Not to mention that it doesn't make any sense for a whole squad of loyal team-mates to up and leave you as the final challenge approaches.
B) Also suffers from the same problem as A) -- it makes ME2 almost pointless and throws away a lot of well-developed characters.  Bioware isn't going to do that.  They may lose a couple of ME2 characters, perhaps exchange them for ME1 characters, but I don't see them creating so many distinct personalities and LI subplots only to have them up and disappear unceremoniously.

It would be an instant flop among continuing players who loved the characters if they just made a new squad, and you have to imagine that with the huge ME2 sales that there will be a LOT of continuing players.

I really dont see away around it unless ME3 is gonna be like 20 discs worth of data.

Now that's just silly.  Like I said, the story structure isn't branching, it is more binary.  The amount of data required for each additional character increases linearly, not polynomially.  They managed to fit ~a dozen characters and the whole entire story onto 2 discs, I don't see why adding a couple more characters would take ten times more data.

#1672
Archonsg

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Scy Lancer wrote...

A few things could happen with who is coming back in 3. Jack, Samara, and Thane might not be in for these reasons. Jack is basically there for the ride. No ties to Shepard (unless romanced) or the crew. Honestly I wouldn't be surprised if she just took off. Samara is almost 1000 years old. Thane is dieing and probably wants to spend time with his kid. They could probably come up with reasons to keep them around though. I could see them bringing back Ash or Liara, one or the other or which ever you romanced in ME1. I don't think Wrex will come back. He's got his people to think about.
Garrus and Tali will stick around. Garrus is Shepard's best bud and Tali is his girl... hands down.



I don't know, Samara's code might just might not have anything that covers this. Shepard could put it in this way "What does your code say about protecting the innocent? Walking away from what we do here means that you will allow true innocents who's only reason why they will be killed by the Reapers is simply because they are alive. Does your code allow you to walk away when you can help prevent their deaths?"
Or something like that.
I don't know.

Thane ya, poor bloke will die before Shepard faces the reapers unless as I said in a previous post, Bioware comes up with a plot device that allows for the reapers to get to known galaxy in a hurry.

And i hope you are right. ME3 will definitely feel ...wrong...without either.

#1673
AddoExAtrum

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@Geth Hunter Alpha and Lariet

Ok I dont want that huge quote here

First off  they specifically state in ME1 that it is believed the Reapers retreat to dark space and power down leaving 1 of their number behind to signal the citadel which in turn signals the rest of the Reapers for the return and subsequent annihlation of all things living.

secondly if the rest of the fleet is offline as stated what the hell would they care about 2000 years? that would mean that Soverign is alone, unable to contact the rest of the fleet because of distance or whatever and unable to access the citadel when his signal is not answered because the organics are powerful enough to destroy a single Reaper

thirdly who is to say that Sovereign didnt send a message to the fleet to activate them asking for aid or advice and it took 2000 years to reach them? or even say 500 years or whatever. When it did they sent Harbinger.

fourth Why the hell does anyone think what I said means that they can just appear after 20 years of flight? At the end of ME2 they appear out of the dark space heading for the galaxy. For all we know they have Mass Effect Relays built into their very systems and are able to jump to any relay within a certain distance, or maybe they will take their time and just cruise in over the next 1-5 years. Does it really freaking matter?

fifthly as for the Rachini again I state, the reapers wiped out all traces of civilization, sovereign tries to access the citadel. Nothing happens. he recruits the rachini as you suggest, krogans wipe them out but sovereign is never noticed in the entire thing? Thats fine i suppose.... then he recruits saren and the geth quite a while later because he still isnt able to figure out what the hell has gone wrong on his own and hasnt received an answer from his reaper brethern perhaps? he hits the citadel and maybe while he is connected he wakes up harbinger and that is why the collectors show up 2 years later?

Does any of that make any sense at all? Not in the slightest. maybe harbinger woke up all on his lonesome and just started having fun. Maybe harbinger was there the entire time in ME1 lurking in the shadows enjoying himself with his pets until Sovereign went silent. Why then would harbinger build a human reaper instead of coming in himself to activate the citadel?

#1674
Scy Lancer

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Archonsg wrote...

Scy Lancer wrote...

A few things could happen with who is coming back in 3. Jack, Samara, and Thane might not be in for these reasons. Jack is basically there for the ride. No ties to Shepard (unless romanced) or the crew. Honestly I wouldn't be surprised if she just took off. Samara is almost 1000 years old. Thane is dieing and probably wants to spend time with his kid. They could probably come up with reasons to keep them around though. I could see them bringing back Ash or Liara, one or the other or which ever you romanced in ME1. I don't think Wrex will come back. He's got his people to think about.
Garrus and Tali will stick around. Garrus is Shepard's best bud and Tali is his girl... hands down.



I don't know, Samara's code might just might not have anything that covers this. Shepard could put it in this way "What does your code say about protecting the innocent? Walking away from what we do here means that you will allow true innocents who's only reason why they will be killed by the Reapers is simply because they are alive. Does your code allow you to walk away when you can help prevent their deaths?"
Or something like that.
I don't know.

Thane ya, poor bloke will die before Shepard faces the reapers unless as I said in a previous post, Bioware comes up with a plot device that allows for the reapers to get to known galaxy in a hurry.

And i hope you are right. ME3 will definitely feel ...wrong...without either.

My thing with Samara wasn't her code. My point was she is almost 1000. Asari don't live much longer then that if I remember right.

If they picked the story right up from where 2 ended they could get every one in it. I can wait though.

#1675
AddoExAtrum

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Scy Lancer wrote...


My thing with Samara wasn't her code. My point was she is almost 1000. Asari don't live much longer then that if I remember right.

If they picked the story right up from where 2 ended they could get every one in it. I can wait though.


Oh no... Mordin is 50 on the Codex but Salarians only live to 40... wait... oh crap...