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All Tali fans, read this! IT'S UP TO US TO KEEP TALI ALIVE! 3.0!!


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#20301
Phil725

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camoboy_19 wrote...

Phil725 wrote...

camoboy_19 wrote...

Yesterday is history,
Tomorrow is a mystery,
But today, today is a gift,
which is why they call it the present"
The idea is that we can't dwell on what was and what will be. We can only make do with what we may in our own time


Isn't that how Rome fell?  It's a nice quote, but you have to dwell on the future to some extent, otherwise that future is a lot bleaker.

Phil theres a time to end a discussion on a good note and you just passed it. Besides, you could apply that to everything. Rome fell due to events that happened, not a lack of foresight of the end of their expansive empire


Yeah, I'll agree with that.  Unfortunately that debate took us through the high post time for the Tali thread, the next few hours is when it screeches to a halt.  Should've saved the debate for an hour or two :P

#20302
camoboy_19

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Phil725 wrote...

camoboy_19 wrote...

Phil725 wrote...

camoboy_19 wrote...

Yesterday is history,
Tomorrow is a mystery,
But today, today is a gift,
which is why they call it the present"
The idea is that we can't dwell on what was and what will be. We can only make do with what we may in our own time


Isn't that how Rome fell?  It's a nice quote, but you have to dwell on the future to some extent, otherwise that future is a lot bleaker.

Phil theres a time to end a discussion on a good note and you just passed it. Besides, you could apply that to everything. Rome fell due to events that happened, not a lack of foresight of the end of their expansive empire


Yeah, I'll agree with that.  Unfortunately that debate took us through the high post time for the Tali thread, the next few hours is when it screeches to a halt.  Should've saved the debate for an hour or two :P

That woulda been a good idea but that was the main discussion at the time

#20303
cBselfmonkey

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camoboy_19 wrote...

Phil725 wrote...

camoboy_19 wrote...

Phil725 wrote...

camoboy_19 wrote...

Yesterday is history,
Tomorrow is a mystery,
But today, today is a gift,
which is why they call it the present"
The idea is that we can't dwell on what was and what will be. We can only make do with what we may in our own time


Isn't that how Rome fell?  It's a nice quote, but you have to dwell on the future to some extent, otherwise that future is a lot bleaker.

Phil theres a time to end a discussion on a good note and you just passed it. Besides, you could apply that to everything. Rome fell due to events that happened, not a lack of foresight of the end of their expansive empire


Yeah, I'll agree with that.  Unfortunately that debate took us through the high post time for the Tali thread, the next few hours is when it screeches to a halt.  Should've saved the debate for an hour or two :P

That woulda been a good idea but that was the main discussion at the time


Ayup

#20304
camoboy_19

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cBselfmonkey wrote...

camoboy_19 wrote...

Phil725 wrote...

camoboy_19 wrote...

Phil725 wrote...

camoboy_19 wrote...

Yesterday is history,
Tomorrow is a mystery,
But today, today is a gift,
which is why they call it the present"
The idea is that we can't dwell on what was and what will be. We can only make do with what we may in our own time


Isn't that how Rome fell?  It's a nice quote, but you have to dwell on the future to some extent, otherwise that future is a lot bleaker.

Phil theres a time to end a discussion on a good note and you just passed it. Besides, you could apply that to everything. Rome fell due to events that happened, not a lack of foresight of the end of their expansive empire


Yeah, I'll agree with that.  Unfortunately that debate took us through the high post time for the Tali thread, the next few hours is when it screeches to a halt.  Should've saved the debate for an hour or two :P

That woulda been a good idea but that was the main discussion at the time


Ayup

It's fair to say though I'd have Tali's side of that argument

#20305
tiberius_adamantine

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not sure if there is hardly anyone to review it but, would you guys give some feedback on the

newest idea regarding the hybrid child? (please don't throw objects!)

#20306
camoboy_19

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tiberius_adamantine wrote...

not sure if there is hardly anyone to review it but, would you guys give some feedback on the
newest idea regarding the hybrid child? (please don't throw objects!)

 You'd have to clarify that for me

#20307
tiberius_adamantine

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camoboy_19 wrote...

tiberius_adamantine wrote...

not sure if there is hardly anyone to review it but, would you guys give some feedback on the
newest idea regarding the hybrid child? (please don't throw objects!)

 You'd have to clarify that for me


I'm asking if I could post the newest idea here for feedback in a...safe environment.

Modifié par tiberius_adamantine, 27 février 2010 - 05:26 .


#20308
cBselfmonkey

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tiberius_adamantine wrote...

not sure if there is hardly anyone to review it but, would you guys give some feedback on the
newest idea regarding the hybrid child? (please don't throw objects!)


The only way that Shepard and Tali could have a child is if Mordin tank-grew them one.

Modifié par cBselfmonkey, 27 février 2010 - 05:27 .


#20309
camoboy_19

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tiberius_adamantine wrote...

camoboy_19 wrote...

tiberius_adamantine wrote...

not sure if there is hardly anyone to review it but, would you guys give some feedback on the
newest idea regarding the hybrid child? (please don't throw objects!)

 You'd have to clarify that for me


I'm asking if I could post the newest idea here. Image IPB

Go ahead. If it sucks though I will throw chairs for the absent krogans

#20310
Phil725

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tiberius_adamantine wrote...

camoboy_19 wrote...

tiberius_adamantine wrote...

not sure if there is hardly anyone to review it but, would you guys give some feedback on the
newest idea regarding the hybrid child? (please don't throw objects!)

 You'd have to clarify that for me


I'm asking if I could post the newest idea here for feedback in a...safe environment.


Its Tali related and no one else is posting much atm, I would say fire away.

#20311
tiberius_adamantine

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I think that in regards to this topic, many people are looking at this the wrong way. Technology in this universe is miles ahead of where it is now. In ME 1, Anderson comments that finding the prothean cache on mars jumped humanities technology forth 200 years. Given this, and how many years this is in the future, new incredible technologies are a given. Research also gains a benefit because different species are able to work together and bring all kinds of new knowledge to the table, also a given.

What isn’t readily known is how much research goes into genetic and bio-engineering. Some have argued that the creation of a hybrid child isn’t likely because there are more pressing concerns in the galaxy than the very small minority of cross-species couples, asari-related couples
excluded because they can breed regardless. Many might not be willing to research into the creation of a hybrid child, but can end up with that result indirectly. Many promising new products and scientific information have their roots in military projects. The internet, for example, was originally, in its previous form, developed by the military but then became adapted and further developed for civilian use. Since then the internet has changed considerably.

So what does this have to do with the topic? This shows that the technology for creating hybrid children could plausibly come from a source that intended to use the information for other purposes. Genetic engineering has already solved a number of problems. In the alliance’s case:
“Most governments provide free assessments and corrective therapy for genetic diseases in prospective parents. This has nearly eliminated everything from cystic fibrosis to nearsightedness.” This is already an indication of changes to what is currently known in genetic engineering, although it is currently being explored.

However, even this has its limitations. Despite how well this works, there are still limitations that could not be addressed so easily within every race. But what one can’t address another might be able to. Sometimes “aliens” have useful genetics that could be adapted to better yourself. So in all likeliness, genetic research is likely being conducted to find ways of using alien traits to address a number of medical concerns and for other genetic enhancement projects, both legal and otherwise.

So what does this matter in terms of plot? As with anything, such engineering could be used with noble intentions or ones far less so. Some are likely researching into this to create such things as “super soldiers” and as potential bio-weapons. Both good and bad potentials are part of the same coin, the potential for a hybrid child being the rim not so commonly thought of.

So then a potential story mission is to investigate a bio/genetic engineering device that has these capabilities. Whether this is new technology, or one created by a previous race doesn’t matter. Sheppard would have to fight his way through enemies also seeking this device for various reasons, such as the Shadow Broker and Cerberus. Who he fights isn’t really important either, but I thought these would be good enemies. After Sheppard finds the device, there comes a debate over what to do with it. Both the potential for good and for bad are stated so Sheppard must now decide what to do with it.

Now, here is where the fun begins! Even though it was designed for different reasons, the possibility of using it to create cross-species children comes up. However, this would receive a small amount of additional, but very interesting, dialog if Sheppard romanced an alien LI (asari excluded). It then turns into a decision on whether or not to destroy the device or keep it, and then how to use it later.

Working the mission this way, different results are able to be achieved based on the player’s personal preference. Those who want to pursue the possibility of using it for medical development could do that, those who want to use it to develop modifications for soldiers and potentially a weapon, could do this, those who want to use it for the hybrid child as a side request could do so, or the player could simply decide that it is too dangerous and destroy it.

This then becomes a mission deemed important in terms of plot that also can have more personal meaning to Sheppard. The way this works is that it has enough options to be used in different ways. You can choose to preserve it for medical research, with or without the hybrid child factor, use it for war, or simply destroy it. This solution should work well for the players, even given differing opinions on the issue.

Naturally the mission doesn’t have to work quite like this, but I think that the general idea is good. It provides something that everyone could enjoy, for one reason or a few. Those who don’t think the technology is close enough to achieve the result, consider this: The Reapers created the keepers using bio-engineering, they also created the husks and the collectors using advanced techniques. Although this differs from the intended use of the device, it remains a stepping stone and leaves the potential for others to also stumble upon some of this field’s secrets.

Even though the player has the option to seek out the hybrid child subplot, it won’t manifest in the story’s quest-line. So then why does it matter? Seeking this option will still provide some interesting dialog with the player’s LI once they have returned to the ship. Additionally, it will also climax within the end movie. One might think that this means the developers will have to make many different ending, but in perspective this isn’t really true. They can set up general guidelines where the issue simply allows all LIs to occupy the same place in the endgame, like what they already do for their in-game movies. A scene involving a child would also work in the same way and not take up too much space.

It has been argued, even if this were legal would it be ethical? My answer is that yes, it is ethical and from a certain perspective not seeking it out would be unethical. Why? Because the issue of “race” often poses a challenge to unity and stability. Sometimes this issue can create problems as the different peoples can be more indifferent to what happens to the others because they are a different race, a different group. Intermarriage has often been a beginning step in resolving differences between these groups who only thought that they were different. In reality they find they are more alike than unalike. This becomes strengthened by the possibility of a hybrid child, said child would blur the walls that divide the different species. It will be difficult at first, such changes usually are at first, but such a development could in the long run benefit the galaxy. Although explaining this isn’t essential to the idea’s potential, I felt it deserved the time to be addressed.

Hopefully this starts to put things into a new perspective. The plan isn’t perfect but the general design should help. I welcome ideas to help improve upon this idea. I know that not everyone will like this, but not everyone is ever happy with anything. Still, I think this is a good compromise. If you must criticize the idea, I ask that you discuss the idea in an overall statement instead of trying to criticize it paragraph by paragraph. It would be frustrating to be criticized with a point that is discussed later after all.

#20312
Phil725

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My god, wasn't aware it was a book, only joking, just gonna take a while to sift through this...

#20313
Jakegnosis

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cBselfmonkey wrote...

tiberius_adamantine wrote...

not sure if there is hardly anyone to review it but, would you guys give some feedback on the
newest idea regarding the hybrid child? (please don't throw objects!)


The only way that Shepard and Tali could have a child is if Mordin tank-grew them one.


I'm doubtful even then.  Their DNA is completely different.  Shepard would have a better chance of impregnating a radish than a Quarian.  I'm afraid the Tali fans that are hoping for a rugrat will have to happy with adoption.

#20314
Shades_Shady

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Can someone summerize Tib's post? Too lazy to read all that. Image IPB

Modifié par Shades_Shady, 27 février 2010 - 05:32 .


#20315
Trueflow

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You guys are making impressive progress. Keep it up and you might hit page 1000 again before Stanley locks it.

#20316
DarkwanderStorm

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holy **** wall of text and this late at night ...

#20317
tiberius_adamantine

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Jakegnosis wrote...

cBselfmonkey wrote...

tiberius_adamantine wrote...

not sure if there is hardly anyone to review it but, would you guys give some feedback on the
newest idea regarding the hybrid child? (please don't throw objects!)


The only way that Shepard and Tali could have a child is if Mordin tank-grew them one.


I'm doubtful even then.  Their DNA is completely different.  Shepard would have a better chance of impregnating a radish than a Quarian.  I'm afraid the Tali fans that are hoping for a rugrat will have to happy with adoption.


Actually, quarians are mammals with similar structure to humans. Real trouble is the amino acids.

#20318
Guest_MarineBorn_*

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Nemory wrote...

MarineBorn wrote...

tiberius_adamantine wrote...

MarineBorn wrote...

HEY! plz snip the quotes.


r u military?

Lance Corporal David Lance, 0311 Riflemen currently waiting at Mojave Viper Infantry Training Installation for a flight to my next duty station which will be Quantico and from there....no idea?


OpSec, buddy.

Hey, hey. Whats going on. Don't know a whole hell of a lot about you fellas but from what i hear ya'll keep us from blundering into a **** storm.

#20319
camoboy_19

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OK I just read ALL OF IT. And I concur with your argument. With the technology developed and existing in the ME Universe, this idea would be very influential and possible. The implications of a medical advances and cross-species offspring and war show a developed line of thought. It would definately be something I would do. If they can raise you from the dead then someone must have thought of how to cross totally different genetic codes. Wouldn't mind having a little Half-Human Half-Quarian kid in future ME

#20320
Angelraid

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tiberius_adamantine wrote...

I think that in regards to this topic...... *snip*


Yeah wasn't gonna post all that quote. I'm only sorta here but when I saw this mother of a WoT I had to see what it was. And now I must shoot it down.

Even though its an interesting concept as stated before something like this wouldn't work. Even a mordin tank baby wont work for the same basic reason. Essentially it's like this. Quarian and human dont mix genetically - I think thats pretty much establihed. The problem with genetic manipulation and bioengineering is that. If you alter one of the parents DNA in order to make it compatible with the other then the DNA is in fact no longer the DNA from the original race and thus the child is not a hybrid at all but is a genetic construct that is niether race nor a mix of the races but is in fact a new race created in a lab.

Modifié par Geth Hunter Alpha, 27 février 2010 - 05:39 .


#20321
camoboy_19

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Geth Hunter Alpha wrote...

tiberius_adamantine wrote...

I think that in regards to this topic...... *snip*


Yeah wasn't gonna post all that quote. I'm only sorta here but when I saw this mother of a WoT I had to see what it was. And now I must shoot it down.

Even though its an interesting concept as stated before something like this wouldn't work. Even a mordin tank baby wont work for the same basic reason. Essentially it's like this. Quarian and human dont mix genetically - I think thats pretty much establihed. The problem with genetic manipulation and bioengineering is that. If you alter one of the parents DNA in order to make it compatible with the other then the DNA is in fact no longer the DNA from the original race and thus the child is not a hybrid at all but is a genetic construct that is niether race nor a mix of the races but is in fact a new race created in a lab.

Well I'd give it a chance considering the numerous technological advances in medicine and biology (HOLY **** MEDIGEL!!!!!) I think its an idea worth consideration

#20322
FsDxRAGE

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uh... my back hurts from typing fanfic

all for Tali though

i saw someone typed an insane post. very big

#20323
Phil725

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tiberius_adamantine wrote...
It has been argued, even if this were legal would it be ethical? My answer is that yes, it is ethical and from a certain perspective not seeking it out would be unethical. Why? Because the issue of “race” often poses a challenge to unity and stability. Sometimes this issue can create problems as the different peoples can be more indifferent to what happens to the others because they are a different race, a different group. Intermarriage has often been a beginning step in resolving differences between these groups who only thought that they were different. In reality they find they are more alike than unalike. This becomes strengthened by the possibility of a hybrid child, said child would blur the walls that divide the different species. It will be difficult at first, such changes usually are at first, but such a development could in the long run benefit the galaxy. Although explaining this isn’t essential to the idea’s potential, I felt it deserved the time to be addressed.


I realize you said you didn't want people cherry picking paragraphs, but this one seems seperate enough, and I'm pretty much expanding on your point.

I think potential ethics in the Mass Effect universe are much more complex and hard to predict than anything regarding technology.  At least technology follows a simple direction, up.  Ethics are always changing, and in my perspective, the ME world is a lot less ethical than ours.  Take Mordin's conversation with his assistant.  Where he says that hes a doctor and should try to help people, Mordin's response that there are multiple ways of helping, including killing dangerous people is against current ethics in our world.  In ME its par for the course.

What your arguing almost seems more diplomatic than ethical when you factor in that it changes two large groups of people's opinions.  Diplomatically it definitely makes sense.  Ethically, I think were in too nebulous of territory to even speculate.  I think ethics are the least of your concern on this matter.

Just my two cents.  The rest, I'm bringing a sword to a gun fight, but I'm all for a Tali/Shep baby.

#20324
camoboy_19

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FsDxRAGE wrote...

uh... my back hurts from typing fanfic
all for Tali though
i saw someone typed an insane post. very big

It was for Tali too

#20325
tiberius_adamantine

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Geth Hunter Alpha wrote...

tiberius_adamantine wrote...

I think that in regards to this topic...... *snip*


Yeah wasn't gonna post all that quote. I'm only sorta here but when I saw this mother of a WoT I had to see what it was. And now I must shoot it down.

Even though its an interesting concept as stated before something like this wouldn't work. Even a mordin tank baby wont work for the same basic reason. Essentially it's like this. Quarian and human dont mix genetically - I think thats pretty much establihed. The problem with genetic manipulation and bioengineering is that. If you alter one of the parents DNA in order to make it compatible with the other then the DNA is in fact no longer the DNA from the original race and thus the child is not a hybrid at all but is a genetic construct that is niether race nor a mix of the races but is in fact a new race created in a lab.


Not you again! Where did you come from?!Image IPB lol, jk.

Modifié par tiberius_adamantine, 27 février 2010 - 05:46 .