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[Shadow Paladin]

Sialater wrote...

Well, the thing is, the seemingly moral choices in the game are actually Renegade. Allowing the rachni to live = Renegade. Putting Anderson on the Council = Renegade.... Blowing up the collector base = Renegade (IIRC).

All of which, I did. Garrus can rock his cowboy morals all he wants.

/delurk

Those are actually all of the Paragon choices. The corresponding Renegade options would be: killing the Rachni queen, putting Udina on the council (or just letting them die and having a human council) and letting Cerberus have the base.

The Renegade options tend to have a more "for the greater good right now" feel to them. To me, anyway.

Modifié par Shadow Paladin, 23 février 2010 - 05:44 .

[Sialater]

They were all the bottom choices, IIRC. Are you sure?

[siltsonata]

I know that blowing up the collector base was the top choice. The rest I can't remember.

[Jytra]

I'm pretty sure I remember Anderson being a top choice as well, and the Rachni was a middle option.



Sometimes the game will mix the options based on the conversation paths you took.

[Sialater]

I'm pretty sure the Rachni was the bottom choice. Killing the geth Heretics was the bottom (which is what I did), Anderson was definitely the bottom choice.



So I was wrong on one.



I made Garrus spare Saleon because his need for revenge wasn't personal, it was professional. Saleon did nothing to HIM, per se. Sidonis, on the other hand... it was entirely personal and my Shep put herself in his boots for a minute, remembering the dog tags she retrieved from the Normandy Crash Site. She stepped out of the way.



Doesn't mean I'll do that all the time, just this time.

[Sialater]

Jytra wrote...

I'm pretty sure I remember Anderson being a top choice as well, and the Rachni was a middle option.

Sometimes the game will mix the options based on the conversation paths you took.

I remember the rachni being the bottom for me.  I rarely pick a middle option. 

[Shadow Paladin]

I just recently replayed ME1 after 2 to see if there were any nuances I missed and they were all top choices. Letting the queen live was top right "I'm not going to kill your race" (or something like that). Anderson was top right, then top left and destroying the base was top right ("We don't need it.").

[siltsonata]

Sialater wrote...

I'm pretty sure the Rachni was the bottom choice. Killing the geth Heretics was the bottom (which is what I did), Anderson was definitely the bottom choice.

Killing the Heretics was the bottom choice, but it was also the renegade choice.  I remember, because earlier in the quest during the conversation with Legion, the paragon choice is to refuse to brainwash a race, but then in the end it was the paragon choice to rewrite and I was confused.  (But relieved.  I don't like making renegade choices, but my reasoning was that the Geth aren't like organics, and changing them back was going to help me in the long run anyway. Then it was paragon and I was like "waitwhut.")

[Sialater]

Oh, fine, ruin my theory.



Still, the "paragon" choices are that you end up like Saren. Even better, don't you think?

[Von Verrikan]

Sialater wrote...

Jytra wrote...

I'm pretty sure I remember Anderson being a top choice as well, and the Rachni was a middle option.

Sometimes the game will mix the options based on the conversation paths you took.

I remember the rachni being the bottom for me.  I rarely pick a middle option. 

Saving the rachni is always paragon. Besides, after what we hear in the second game it's clearly a paragon choice. You need their help fighting the reapers - they will be a big deal.

If the Rachni were 'evil' and clearly so, then it would be renegade. As a person who saved the bugs at least 20 times now, believe me they count it as paragon not middle or renegade.

[siltsonata]

Sialater wrote...

Oh, fine, ruin my theory.

Still, the "paragon" choices are that you end up like Saren. Even better, don't you think?

...how so?

[Sialater]

You think you're being a good guy, but end up like the villain in the first game...



You have the geth

You have the rachni

You have an Asari Matriarch (Samara)

You have a cure for the krogan genophage.



So, being the good guy nets you ending up like Saren just a little.

[siltsonata]

Sialater wrote...

You think you're being a good guy, but end up like the villain in the first game...

You have the geth
You have the rachni
You have an Asari Matriarch (Samara)
You have a cure for the krogan genophage.

So, being the good guy nets you ending up like Saren just a little.

AHHHHH I gotcha.  


....Actually that's kinda cool.

[Sialater]

siltsonata wrote...

Sialater wrote...

You think you're being a good guy, but end up like the villain in the first game...

You have the geth
You have the rachni
You have an Asari Matriarch (Samara)
You have a cure for the krogan genophage.

So, being the good guy nets you ending up like Saren just a little.

AHHHHH I gotcha.  


....Actually that's kinda cool.

And very twisted. 

So yes.  Garrus is working for Saren's... 'replacement'... and in some cases... sleeping with her.

[Punahedan]

Garrus' romancing option was put in the lower-right, and the paragon option was the equivalent of "Let's just be friends"; the others have their romancing in the upper right, which is why it's so confusing when you're clicking your Paragon options up there and then suddenly you've just been shenanigan'd into throwing yourself at Jacob or Thane.

silentstephi wrote...

Hawkeyed Cai Li wrote...

Garrus drunk would be unsettling. And the reason I don't think he turned to it when things when to hell was because he likes to get things done. Drinking doesn't get things done. *HCL stample of approval on proactive Garrus*

Get'r duuuuuuuuun!

*snorkle*

*snort* Should'a known someone would read it that way.

MarginalBeast wrote...

WindOverTuchanka wrote...

One thing I liked about Thane in my playthroughs is synchronicity.

There
is him-the sniper, the target, the well-aligned shot waiting to be
fired, the girl who stands in the way of his bullet. The girl refuses
to move, he falls in love, the target walks away unharmed.

And
then, on the Citadel, there's another sniper, another target, another
well-aligned shot waiting to be fired. Another girl stands in the way
of the bullet and refuses to move. Thane falls in love (but alas, this
time it's unrequited), Sidonis walks away unharmed.

Mind = blown.

I highly doubt that was intentional, but if it was then my respect for the writers just got a lot bigger.

Agreed! Holy damn. I did not make that connection. Nicely done. >.> Rather tempted to write this, myself, but nah.

Anastassia wrote...

Edit to add: This was posted in another thread. I warn you, it's NSFW, but it is hilarious. It's a parody of something a really awful older brother did to his little sister. That's sibling justice!

LOL. Oh God. LOL. That is SO funny. Zaeed's such a troll... and Joker's gonna be forced to dance by Shep, I swear...and really, being #2 on the list doesn't seem like a great place to be...though I guess it means fewer space STDs. And the CSI... LOL. *wipes tears from eyes* 

Okay. Okay. I can breathe again.

[siltsonata]

Sialater wrote...

siltsonata wrote...

AHHHHH I gotcha.  

....Actually that's kinda cool.

And very twisted. 

So yes.  Garrus is working for Saren's... 'replacement'... and in some cases... sleeping with her.

Oh man.  I finally read Revelation a week ago, and am I the only one who gets an insurmountable amount of glee knowing that while Shepard is getting it on with Garrus, Saren is probably rolling in his grave?

You became the first human spectre.
You stopped his plans.
You put a human on the council/MADE A NEW HUMAN COUNCIL
Then to top it all off, you starting sleeping with a turian.

Rolling. In. His. Grave.

[Sialater]

siltsonata wrote...

Sialater wrote...

siltsonata wrote...

AHHHHH I gotcha.  

....Actually that's kinda cool.

And very twisted. 

So yes.  Garrus is working for Saren's... 'replacement'... and in some cases... sleeping with her.

Oh man.  I finally read Revelation a week ago, and am I the only one who gets an insurmountable amount of glee knowing that while Shepard is getting it on with Garrus, Saren is probably rolling in his grave?

You became the first human spectre.
You stopped his plans.
You put a human on the council/MADE A NEW HUMAN COUNCIL
Then to top it all off, you starting sleeping with a turian.

Rolling. In. His. Grave.

Somersaulting.  A complete Floor Program.

You stopped him and then took over.  And did it better. 

Oh, and then there's the turian boyfriend.

[Tikonov]

You'd think shephard could spring for some new armour for garrus, the damage looks cool to start with but after you've used him half the game and even got an alternative costume for him its still cracked

[siltsonata]

Tikonov wrote...

You'd think shephard could spring for some new armour for garrus, the damage looks cool to start with but after you've used him half the game and even got an alternative costume for him its still cracked

Totally.  It's so impractical for a suicide mission to have one of your best guys running around in broken armor.<_<

I support new armor for Garrus in ME3.

[aznsoisauce]

Anastassia wrote...

I didn't get Newfie and Albertan from Kenneth and Gabby. Kenneth is a Scot, and Gabby sounds vaguely Brooklyn to me.

Edit to add: This was posted in another thread. I warn you, it's NSFW, but it is hilarious. It's a parody of something a really awful older brother did to his little sister. That's sibling justice!

BY THE BEARD. That...there are no words to describe how awesome that is. "Garrus Vakarian - Jesus, Joseph, and Mary. I will do anything he wants. I will be anything he wants."

Re: Paragon/Renegade choices - Of all the choices, I distinctly remember Anderson for Human Councilor being the Paragon choice while Udina was the Renegade one.

[squidbunny]

Two suits of busted-up armor later I was surprised when he showed up in Shep's quarters for the romantic interlude in casual clothing without realistic battle damage.

[aznsoisauce]

I'm sick of people pointing out the placement of Garrus' romance dialogue. It is the same with every ME2 LI.

To START flirting with any of the LIs, it's in the upper right corner. Conversations after that put the "Let's stop this" option in the upper right, while the lower right or middle right option is to continue the romance.

And FINALLY, letting Garrus know you have been seduced when he comes up to your room before the Omega 4 relay is a PARAGON interrupt. He's the only LI that gets an interrupt, iirc. The fact that it happens to be a Paragon one should say something.

...sorry for the outburst or whatever.

[cedardryad]

Anastassia wrote...

I didn't get Newfie and Albertan from Kenneth and Gabby. Kenneth is a Scot, and Gabby sounds vaguely Brooklyn to me.

Edit to add: This was posted in another thread. I warn you, it's NSFW, but it is hilarious. It's a parody of something a really awful older brother did to his little sister. That's sibling justice!

EPIC WIN! I loved the original and I love this one. And I do agree with Jane Shepard that Kelly was the one responsible for the scale itch.

[Von Verrikan]

IRT Garrus armor.



The worst part about that is the obvious danger of vacuum. You don't want your turian lover entering areas with a hardsuit that's barely holding together. The structural integrity of that suit would be a joke.



Makes me horribly nervous when I take him anywhere

[Nightfire78]

[quote]Sialater wrote...

You think you're being a good guy, but end up like the villain in the first game...

You have the geth
You have the rachni
You have an Asari Matriarch (Samara)
You have a cure for the krogan genophage.

So, being the good guy nets you ending up like Saren just a little.

[/quote]

 I kind of like the irony of you getting everything Saren was trying to force into his corner (without too much success in the case of the rachni... and Benezia ends up spilling all his secrets the second she gets the chance) by just being decent and helpful and, you know, talking to people/aliens instead of going all overlord on their collective arses. It's like when TIM says he doesn't agree with your methods but can't deny your results and Shep (mine at least with the comment I picked) says he could try diplomacy/being nice on occassion too

quote]siltsonata wrote...

[quote]Sialater wrote...

I'm
pretty sure the Rachni was the bottom choice. Killing the geth Heretics
was the bottom (which is what I did), Anderson was definitely the
bottom choice.
[/quote]

Killing the Heretics was the bottom
choice, but it was also the renegade choice.  I remember, because
earlier in the quest during the conversation with Legion, the paragon
choice is to refuse to brainwash a race, but then in the end it was the
paragon choice to rewrite and I was confused.  (But relieved.  I don't
like making renegade choices, but my reasoning was that the Geth aren't
like organics, and changing them back was going to help me in the long
run anyway. Then it was paragon and I was like "waitwhut.")
[/quote]

I've noticed that sometimes paragon/renegade depends on the information/choice you have. During the first convo it's not clear that the only alternative to rewriting them is blowing them up. At this point saying you don't think it's right to "brainwash" them is the "moral" choice, but then Legion tells you that you either kill them or rewrite them, so when you get to the end and are present with mass murder or brainwash... well yeah brainwash turns into the "better" option at that point.
I must admit, though, that it confused me a bit initially too... while i also felt brainwashing was wrong until i realized it was that or killing them all, I thought the game was indicating killing them all was preferable so I was expecting to get renegade points when I didn't... I was very happy to see that it morally adjusted itself in the same manner I did, as it were.