252 réponses à ce sujet

[Qwepir]

 The fact that this thread is 8 pages long disturbs me. Seriously, don't you people have other things you could be arguing about? You know, things that have more than a snowball's chance in hell of happening?

[thatguy212]

tiberius_adamantine wrote...

Sn0wst0rm wrote...

Tekyu wrote...

Puh-leeze. Of course it's possible! Mordin is the Frankenstein/MacGuyver hybrid of Mass Effect, he could have Tali cured and spitting out Shepard's pups in a day or two. Besides, think of the benefits of a Human/Quarian hybrid amongst the migrant fleet? That'd make their efforts to build a working immune system among their people develop that much faster to the point that they could at least colonize.

Just sayin.

Granted, She and Shepard could probably never share a meal without Shepard twisting over and probably dying... But at least the kids'll have the best of both worlds.

Thank you for taking the time to read the entire thread. Oh wait...Nice troll.

Be polite. Being optimistic isn't bad. And for the love of all that is good, stop calling this fanservice! Also note that not everything gives you a heads up, and sometimes it does but is real subtle.

It IS fanservice, there is no good reason to make a freaky mutant child in a game about stopping an ancient threat from destroying the galaxy

[Qwepir]

thatguy212 wrote...
there is no good reason to make a freaky mutant child in a game about stopping an ancient threat from destroying the galaxy

This.

[khaos974]

The thread is still going on, uh?

Making a hybrid is to curing a genetic disease what building a car is to someone who just invented the wheel.

Unless Shepard finds a device which sole purpose is to create alien babies with übertech, finding and understanding the general scientific method to make space babies would imply understanding a scientific background advanced enough to make all other genetic diseases trivial.

In short, if you know the science behind to make hybrids, you know enough about genetics to cure all genetic faults (Drell syndrom, quarian immune system, genophage, Vrolik's syndrom....), you know enough to create a human with krogan-like regeneration and life span (1500 years+), asari biotics, and rachni telepathy.

Since all kinds of genetic problem still exist, I'll let you draw you conclusions.

So either someone made a magic baby machine ™, or Shepard is God (well he/she is one according to Williams), your choice.

Modifié par khaos974, 27 février 2010 - 06:03 .

[tiberius_adamantine]

khaos974 wrote...

The thread is still going on, uh?

Making a hybrid is to curing a genetic disease what building a car is to someone who just invented the wheel.

Unless Shepard finds a device which sole purpose is to create alien babies with übertech, finding and understanding the general scientific method to make space babies would imply understanding a scientific background advanced enough to make all other genetic diseases trivial.

In short, if you know the science behind to make hybrids, you know enough about genetics to cure all genetic faults (Drell syndrom, quarian immune system, genophage, Vrolik's syndrom....), you know enough to create a human with krogan-like regeneration and life span (1500 years+), asari biotics, and rachni telepathy.

Since all kinds of genetic problem still exist, I'll let you draw you conclusions.

So either someone made a magic baby machine ™, or Shepard is God (well he/she is one according to Williams), your choice.

and what about my most recent points?

[Sn0wst0rm]

tiberius_adamantine wrote...

Sn0wst0rm wrote...

Tekyu wrote...

Puh-leeze. Of course it's possible! Mordin is the Frankenstein/MacGuyver hybrid of Mass Effect, he could have Tali cured and spitting out Shepard's pups in a day or two. Besides, think of the benefits of a Human/Quarian hybrid amongst the migrant fleet? That'd make their efforts to build a working immune system among their people develop that much faster to the point that they could at least colonize.

Just sayin.

Granted, She and Shepard could probably never share a meal without Shepard twisting over and probably dying... But at least the kids'll have the best of both worlds.

Thank you for taking the time to read the entire thread. Oh wait...Nice troll.

Be polite. Being optimistic isn't bad. And for the love of all that is good, stop calling this fanservice! Also note that not everything gives you a heads up, and sometimes it does but is real subtle.

It is fanservice, calling something else would not change that. I do not know what you mean by your last sentence.

Modifié par Sn0wst0rm, 27 février 2010 - 06:29 .

[Sn0wst0rm]

tiberius_adamantine wrote...

khaos974 wrote...

The thread is still going on, uh?

Making a hybrid is to curing a genetic disease what building a car is to someone who just invented the wheel.

Unless Shepard finds a device which sole purpose is to create alien babies with übertech, finding and understanding the general scientific method to make space babies would imply understanding a scientific background advanced enough to make all other genetic diseases trivial.

In short, if you know the science behind to make hybrids, you know enough about genetics to cure all genetic faults (Drell syndrom, quarian immune system, genophage, Vrolik's syndrom....), you know enough to create a human with krogan-like regeneration and life span (1500 years+), asari biotics, and rachni telepathy.

Since all kinds of genetic problem still exist, I'll let you draw you conclusions.

So either someone made a magic baby machine ™, or Shepard is God (well he/she is one according to Williams), your choice.

and what about my most recent points?

Read my response.

[Devidose]

tiberius_adamantine wrote...

guise709 wrote...

Found it!

Its in the secondary codex entries Humanity and the Systems Alliance under the Genetic Engineering Tab.


http://masseffect.wi...y_Codex_Entries
ENGINEERING: Artificial hybridization of genes from compatible non-human species with human genetic code is illegal. Creation of designed life is broadly legal (and mainly used for terraforming and medial applications), but sentient creatures are heavily regulated, and creation of sapient life is outlawed by both the Systems Alliance and the Citadel Council.

Thank you for finding this information, it confirms a compatibility between living organisms that originate on different planents. I would like to address what some have claimed, that human and alien genetics are incompatible. This simply is not true. As is seen in this codex entry, organisms with very different origins may still be compatible and hybridized. Occording to what some have claimed, this would not be possible but Mass Effect's own codex confirms that it is. They have said that hybridization couldn't occur because the human and quarian are too different, but what do they have to compare it to? Modern science itself doesn't hold all the answers and too many things are unknown. It is not know, for instance, what would occur in this situation because nothing like this has occured. So maybe before the critics cite biology, they should consider the facts. Based on what is known, both through observation and Mass Effect's own entries, and what is unknown to everyone, it is more than possible to have a hybrid child.

Touching back on this, the codex entry reads: "Artificial hybridization of genes from compatible non-human species with human genetic code is illegal."

Key point on the word "genes". It doesn't mention organisms as a whole. Possible reasons for the codex entry and information are that if you are aware of a genetic sequence in a non-human species that produces a benefitial trait in an organims, *cough* Krogan redundant organs, then providing you can replicate the sequence and somehow manage to carry it past the nucleotide sequence stage, then you could potentially end up with a human with 2 hearts, heightened metabolisms, 4 eyes or whatever characteristic picked.

Secondly, in regards to genetic diversity, you don't want to end up with hybrids of everything, as it may result in extinction of the original parent species, or produce hybrids that are actually worse than the parent species, or even just sterile, using the examples mentioned earlier of Mules. Someone even touched on what is refered to as the Species concept theory. A species are a group of organims that are able to reproduce and produce fertile offspring, something that some plants tend to ignore. Even this definition is extremely hard to finalise, as there are many exceptions to the rules, as is the case in nature, all to often.

One of the main problems with hybrids are the number of chromosomes in the parents, and the differences between them. Humans, as again mentioned, have 23 pairs, the last being the sex determination set. So far we have no information on how other races even decide sex. We, and most mammals use the XY sex-determination system, (http://en.wikipedia....mination_system), and so far it's likely we've just assumed that other sapients in MEU do as well, Asari obviously aside. This however is just one of several systems, (http://en.wikipedia....mination_system), and given the range of sapients in MEU, Salarians being warm-blooded amphibians, for example, who is to say they some don't even use non genetic sex determination methods? For all the similarities between the majority of the sapients out there, (see previous post on, and about convergent evolution), the differences still produce a barrier preventing reproduction between species.
Side point, Star Trek gets around this, (just), but eventually going with an idea that many of the sapients are either from the same overall genetic material, or were mod'd in some way by a founder race, one of the ST:TNG eps, can't remember which, and don't want to go looking for it atm.

Yes, I used wikipedia as a reference source, shoot me now, scientific community,

In regards to the comment earlier in the thread about Miranda and engineered from a male template, same deal is done in the Marvel universe for X23 from Wolverine, but that's not really explaining the matter, just pointing out it's not a new concept.

There are many, many well typed out responses here as to why a hybrid would not be viable, Sn0wst0rm, Llandaryn, khaos974 and Uberpenguin7 especially having made some extremely well worded, and backed up points as to why this cannot happen. As also mentioned, ME is effectively a hard sci-fi setting, something that many sci-fi themes are using more often, as people in general question motives and reasons behind events more. The idea of "A wizard did it", and related themes is still an entertaining one at times, but sometimes people want stories/games/entertainment to appear more realistic. Downside to that is "reality" can then block certain concepts, this being an example of one of those.

Ugh, not what I was expecting my first forum post to be.

[Sn0wst0rm]

tiberius_adamantine wrote...

khaos974 wrote...

The thread is still going on, uh?

Making a hybrid is to curing a genetic disease what building a car is to someone who just invented the wheel.

Unless Shepard finds a device which sole purpose is to create alien babies with übertech, finding and understanding the general scientific method to make space babies would imply understanding a scientific background advanced enough to make all other genetic diseases trivial.

In short, if you know the science behind to make hybrids, you know enough about genetics to cure all genetic faults (Drell syndrom, quarian immune system, genophage, Vrolik's syndrom....), you know enough to create a human with krogan-like regeneration and life span (1500 years+), asari biotics, and rachni telepathy.

Since all kinds of genetic problem still exist, I'll let you draw you conclusions.

So either someone made a magic baby machine ™, or Shepard is God (well he/she is one according to Williams), your choice.

and what about my most recent points?

I am pretty sure this is in response to the section in your last big post regarding human augmentation, and how you basically jump from that to assuming that means we would have the knowledge to accomplish the type of hybrid you have been talking about.

[Sn0wst0rm]

Devidose wrote...

Side point, Star Trek gets around this, (just), but eventually going with an idea that many of the sapients are either from the same overall genetic material, or were mod'd in some way by a founder race, one of the ST:TNG eps, can't remember which, and don't want to go looking for it atm.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Chase_%28Star_Trek:_The_Next_Generation%29

That was actually one of my favorite TNG episodes. At the time of TOS, however, Spock's heritage was not explainable, it was there as an allegory for the conflicts that the children of interracial couples had to face.

[JulianusApostate]

Though a hybrid is technically impossibly in this, if genetics are sufficiently advanced in quarian sciences (since we know they are in human ones) the mother's egg or whatever quarians have could be fertilized with Quarian DNA altered so the child would have some physical resemblance to Shepard. And who knows, maybe some other bits of him have quarian cognates. Not really a hybrid, but at least he can say his kid's got his eyes.

[Andaius20]

Yeah that one was pretty good, that all the main species of the Alpha quadrent are really the genetic offshoot of a progenitor race.

[khaos974]

I consider that your recent points were already answered in my previous post, but I'll make an affort to answer them separately while still noting that you don't take into consideration the points I've made, or that you misunderstood them.

[quote]tiberius_adamantine wrote...

I think that in regards to this topic, many people are looking at this the wrong way. Technology in this universe is miles ahead of where it is now. In ME 1, Anderson comments that finding the prothean cache on mars jumped humanities technology forth 200 years. Given this, and how many years this is in the future, new incredible technologies are a given. Research also gains a benefit because different species are able to work together and bring all kinds of new knowledge to the table, also a given. [/quote]

As I already wrote, nothing in the ME lore indicates that such breakthroughs occured, we have seen nothing of this kind in the Bioware universe.

[quote]What isn’t readily known is how much research goes into genetic and bio-engineering. Some have argued that the creation of a hybrid child isn’t likely because there are more pressing concerns in the galaxy than the very small minority of cross-species couples, asari-related couples
excluded because they can breed regardless. Many might not be willing to research into the creation of a hybrid child, but can end up with that result indirectly. Many promising new products and scientific information have their roots in military projects. The internet, for example, was originally, in its previous form, developed by the military but then became adapted and further developed for civilian use. Since then the internet has changed considerably. [/quote]

If such research has been undertaken , we would have seen the effects: cured genetic issues. Since the effect are not seen the research has not been completed.

[quote]
So what does this have to do with the topic? This shows that the technology for creating hybrid children could plausibly come from a source that intended to use the information for other purposes. Genetic engineering has already solved a number of problems. In the alliance’s case:
“Most governments provide free assessments and corrective therapy for genetic diseases in prospective parents. This has nearly eliminated everything from cystic fibrosis to nearsightedness.” This is already an indication of changes to what is currently known in genetic engineering, although it is currently being explored.
[/quote]

As I wrote, curing a eye disease is rewriting one or several genetic sequences, not the whole genone, in other word -  childplay (eg. there are currently rice strands that are made more productive through genetic engineering). In short, does my knowing how to make a wheel grant me the knowledge of making a car? NO!

[quote]
However, even this has its limitations. Despite how well this works, there are still limitations that could not be addressed so easily within every race. But what one can’t address another might be able to. Sometimes “aliens” have useful genetics that could be adapted to better yourself. So in all likeliness, genetic research is likely being conducted to find ways of using alien traits to address a number of medical concerns and for other genetic enhancement projects, both legal and otherwise.
[/quote]

As I wrote, being able to make a hybrid implies you already know how to implement the optimizations you wrote. You even write "genetic research is likely being conducted", which means the ME universe is at the beginning of such a process. Making a hybrids is at the end of such a process, hence, it is not possible with citadel/cerberus level bioengineering.

[quote]
So what does this matter in terms of plot? As with anything, such engineering could be used with noble intentions or ones far less so. Some are likely researching into this to create such things as “super soldiers” and as potential bio-weapons. Both good and bad potentials are part of the same coin, the potential for a hybrid child being the rim not so commonly thought of.
[/quote]

As I wrote creating a super soldier/curing evolutionary defects (ie. bone and muscle density change, tweaking of nerve signals.../immnune system, adaptation to humid environments ) is a hundredth the scale of making a hybrid. So the super soldier plot is unsusable.

[quote]
So then a potential story mission is to investigate a bio/genetic engineering device that has these capabilities. Whether this is new technology, or one created by a previous race doesn’t matter. Sheppard would have to fight his way through enemies also seeking this device for various reasons, such as the Shadow Broker and Cerberus. Who he fights isn’t really important either, but I thought these would be good enemies. After Sheppard finds the device, there comes a debate over what to do with it. Both the potential for good and for bad are stated so Sheppard must now decide what to do with it.
[/quote]

So you find a piece of tech by some ancient race, why not? Either Shepard uses it with no scientist in citadel space understanding how it works, or scientists spend time on it and 30 years later all the genetic problems that have plagued the galaxy or will occur have already been solved by this tech. This makes the device über ie not a good plot point.

[quote]
Now, here is where the fun begins! Even though it was designed for different reasons, the possibility of using it to create cross-species children comes up. However, this would receive a small amount of additional, but very interesting, dialog if Sheppard romanced an alien LI (asari excluded). It then turns into a decision on whether or not to destroy the device or keep it, and then how to use it later.

Working the mission this way, different results are able to be achieved based on the player’s personal preference. Those who want to pursue the possibility of using it for medical development could do that, those who want to use it to develop modifications for soldiers and potentially a weapon, could do this, those who want to use it for the hybrid child as a side request could do so, or the player could simply decide that it is too dangerous and destroy it.
This then becomes a mission deemed important in terms of plot that also can have more personal meaning to Sheppard. The way this works is that it has enough options to be used in different ways. You can choose to preserve it for medical research, with or without the hybrid child factor, use it for war, or simply destroy it. This solution should work well for the players, even given differing opinions on the issue.
[/quote]

No here is the end!!! This device allows making space babies: level
9000 in difficulty, making a near perfect biological entity level 7000? It's possibly
easier. As Mordin says "working within constraint of shep/tali
genetics, very difficult, easier to build from scratch", just replace
shep/tali by genophage and you have the real quote.

[quote]
Naturally the mission doesn’t have to work quite like this, but I think that the general idea is good. It provides something that everyone could enjoy, for one reason or a few. Those who don’t think the technology is close enough to achieve the result, consider this: The Reapers created the keepers using bio-engineering, they also created the husks and the collectors using advanced techniques. Although this differs from the intended use of the device, it remains a stepping stone and leaves the potential for others to also stumble upon some of this field’s secrets.
[/quote]

I already wrote about this plot idea, and you are wrong about the collectors, the only thing the Reapers did was GETTING RID of genetic material, the result as Mordin explains "no art, no culture, no progress: replaced by tech": not the best exemple of genetic engineering, the Reapers ended up with a race that does less.
And the husks: no intellect just instinct, not even sapient, not a good exemple either.

[quote]
Even though the player has the option to seek out the hybrid child subplot, it won’t manifest in the story’s quest-line. So then why does it matter? Seeking this option will still provide some interesting dialog with the player’s LI once they have returned to the ship. Additionally, it will also climax within the end movie. One might think that this means the developers will have to make many different ending, but in perspective this isn’t really true. They can set up general guidelines where the issue simply allows all LIs to occupy the same place in the endgame, like what they already do for their in-game movies. A scene involving a child would also work in the same way and not take up too much space.
[/quote]

Why not? Shepard saved the galaxy from the Reapers, cured all diseases, has a space baby, does Shepard walk on water and turn water into wine?

[quote]
It has been argued, even if this were legal would it be ethical? My answer is that yes, it is ethical and from a certain perspective not seeking it out would be unethical. Why? Because the issue of “race” often poses a challenge to unity and stability. Sometimes this issue can create problems as the different peoples can be more indifferent to what happens to the others because they are a different race, a different group. Intermarriage has often been a beginning step in resolving differences between these groups who only thought that they were different. In reality they find they are more alike than unalike. This becomes strengthened by the possibility of a hybrid child, said child would blur the walls that divide the different species. It will be difficult at first, such changes usually are at first, but such a development could in the long run benefit the galaxy. Although explaining this isn’t essential to the idea’s potential, I felt it deserved the time to be addressed.
[/quote]

This I'll answer by an in-game analogy, too many unknown parameters, "uplifing krogan was wrong, culturally not ready, ended up posing a danger to the galaxy". Given the state of the galaxy, the number of crime lords and shadowy institutions, opening the door to a level biotech high enough to make near perfect sentients spells doom and pandora's box. "uplifting the galaxy was wrong, culturally not ready". not to mention the scientists would have to spend decades to understand all this new science.

Simply put, finding such a device would be equal in importance for the Citadel race to the discovery of the Prothean ruins on Mars for Earth Alliance.

[quote]
Hopefully this starts to put things into a new perspective. The plan isn’t perfect but the general design should help. I welcome ideas to help improve upon this idea. I know that not everyone will like this, but not everyone is ever happy with anything. Still, I think this is a good compromise. If you must criticize the idea, I ask that you discuss the idea in an overall statement instead of trying to criticize it paragraph by paragraph. It would be frustrating to be criticized with a point that is discussed later after all.
[/quote]

Your new perspective wasn't new, if you read between the lines the asnwers were already in my n-3 post. I criticized the general idea in my previous (n-1) post in its globality, but since you did not understand the criticism I feel obliged to comment it point by point.

Modifié par khaos974, 27 février 2010 - 08:34 .

[Devidose]

JulianusApostate wrote...

Though a hybrid is technically impossibly in this, if genetics are sufficiently advanced in quarian sciences (since we know they are in human ones) the mother's egg or whatever quarians have could be fertilized with Quarian DNA altered so the child would have some physical resemblance to Shepard. And who knows, maybe some other bits of him have quarian cognates. Not really a hybrid, but at least he can say his kid's got his eyes.

As you said, (and I will say now, despite how this reply might come across, it is not intended to be "you are wrong" type of response), this doesn't really create a hybrid tho', just a Quarian(/species of choice) with a modified appearance, to look slightly human(/desired species of choice), which you could technically do with any species, providing the changes are not dangerous. Just look at Shiala from Feros, and if you carry her into ME2, Ilium. She's (eventually) green, due to the Thorian getting it's tentacles on her, (woops). Yes, there are also other changes she has, and as admited by her, the changes are not benefitial, but pigment changes could be one of the less problematic things to change, especially if there are multiple pigments to start with, (something the Asari don't have, however.)

Think about what will happen if(/when?) in the future you can mod a human to change various pigments in the body. Hair, eyes, skin and others could be changed/patterned to end up with things like multiple hair colours simply growing in, unnatural (human) eye colours, (Red/Purple eyes? Yes please ) as well as patterns, (Sharingan contacts already exist, as well as other options, [one of the easiest examples to go with]) and "naturally" grown into body patterns that could replace tattoos. This is all theoretical, and briefly covered, as side effects are unknown, as well as if you are able to carry out these proceedures, then you could theoretically continue to modify them afterwards if they are undesirable at some point, or fashions change.

The Shadowrun game touches on this, as do other sources, with cosmetic surgeries and gene therapies to change appearances to be similar to those of other races, SR, and others, going with pointed ears to replicate the stereotypical Elven ear designs and so on.

As a possible side note, I don't know if the Conclave and Admiralty Board would even allow such modification. Ok yes, super secret base can make attempts to do it anyway, but then you end up with what, a pariah? (Altho' the meaning of that word is somewhat questionable now) A race that has 2 main goals; reclaim homeworld/deal with Geth may not be able to afford resources, in this case ovum (assuming Quarians even have them, or something close), to attempt hybridisation with other species.

[Ultai]

Schneidend wrote...

As much as I love Tali and the Talimance, if Shepard and Tali have a baby I will burn all of my Mass Effect-related merchandise.

[ElizabethDeLoria]

WHY WON'T THIS THREAD DIE?!

[ResidentNoob]

Have us Talimancers really fallen this low just because we can't see her face?



I'm happy for adoption, but only after we, you know, save the galaxy together and all?

[SirGladiator]

Science Fiction isn't really the place for closed minds and limited imaginations. There really is nothing to argue about here, simply open your mind and let your imagination roam free. Forget what 'seems' possible, don't look at reality and ask 'why?' just look at what you want to happen and ask 'why not?'. You've got unbelievably advanced technology to begin with, you have some of the greatest scientific minds in the galaxy (such as Mordin) capable of advancing technology even further any time he's given an assignment, I mean just look at all the scientific achievements we've already seen. There is just no way that something as simple as coming up with some kind of device/implant/procedure/whatever to allow Shepard to combine his or her DNA with Tali's in a manner that allows them to have a child would be too hard to accomplish. Certainly it wouldn't be REMOTELY as hard as, say, finding a way to destroy all of the unbelievably powerful Reapers, something that no doubt is also entirely doable some way or other . So yes, let Shep have a child with Tali, or any of the other aliens he or she might be romanticly involved with by the time ME3 is over. Its not like they even have to show a picture of it, they can just mention it in the post-game comments, or Tali could mention how excited she is to be having Shep's child, whatever would be best. They could save showing the child for ME4, and in that one we could see him or her already as an adult.

[Andaius20]

everyone just got done telling you "why not" though.....

[Devidose]

SirGladiator wrote...

Science Fiction isn't really the place for closed minds and limited imaginations. There really is nothing to argue about here, simply open your mind and let your imagination roam free. Forget what 'seems' possible, don't look at reality and ask 'why?' just look at what you want to happen and ask 'why not?'. You've got unbelievably advanced technology to begin with, you have some of the greatest scientific minds in the galaxy (such as Mordin) capable of advancing technology even further any time he's given an assignment, I mean just look at all the scientific achievements we've already seen. There is just no way that something as simple as coming up with some kind of device/implant/procedure/whatever to allow Shepard to combine his or her DNA with Tali's in a manner that allows them to have a child would be too hard to accomplish. Certainly it wouldn't be REMOTELY as hard as, say, finding a way to destroy all of the unbelievably powerful Reapers, something that no doubt is also entirely doable some way or other . So yes, let Shep have a child with Tali, or any of the other aliens he or she might be romanticly involved with by the time ME3 is over. Its not like they even have to show a picture of it, they can just mention it in the post-game comments, or Tali could mention how excited she is to be having Shep's child, whatever would be best. They could save showing the child for ME4, and in that one we could see him or her already as an adult.

Mass Effect is a planned trilogy, so ME4, not so sure on.

In regards to the bit i've underlined, destruction is always easier than creation.

[staldore13]

ElizabethDeLoria wrote...

WHY WON'T THIS THREAD DIE?!

because people like you keep posting on it

[Missouri Tigers]

The quarians definitely evolved from space monkeys.

[Elnino135]

OR!

We could borrow James Cameron's brain device thingy, from Avatar..

Create Shep Clone --> Transfer brain activity (if any) --> ??? --> Succes!



Besides, who says anything about Shep and Tali actully having sexual intercourse?

Who says quarians have vaginas in the first place?

Tali talks about skin against skin, which could mean just holding each other tight. Nothing about "mixing genes".



Lets face it! Quarians' real faces are where their crouch "should" be! But because constantly starring at other species' crouches is less than appealing (ever wondered why Voluses are so cranky?), they added a camera on top of their shoulders.

However as this makes them resemble the so hated Geth, they decided to cover it with a helmet, and add an extra flashlight, so other species would take them as eyes.



/troll

[Varenus Luckmann]

Sn0wst0rm wrote...

Devidose wrote...

Side point, Star Trek gets around this, (just), but eventually going with an idea that many of the sapients are either from the same overall genetic material, or were mod'd in some way by a founder race, one of the ST:TNG eps, can't remember which, and don't want to go looking for it atm.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Chase_%28Star_Trek:_The_Next_Generation%29

That was actually one of my favorite TNG episodes. At the time of TOS, however, Spock's heritage was not explainable, it was there as an allegory for the conflicts that the children of interracial couples had to face.

Ah, yes. One of the episodes the producers of Star Trek: Enterprise obviously hadn't seen, what with the whole T'Pol/Trip thing. In Star Trek, that single episode is the entire basis of why radically different races can all interbreed.

[Varenus Luckmann]

ElizabethDeLoria wrote...
WHY WON'T THIS THREAD DIE?!

Interesting. I was just thinking the same thing. Then I saw a comment on Star Trek, and posted.

It's a devil-child of a thread, I tell you! Spawn of Satan!