193 réponses à ce sujet

[Reaverwind]

UnPlayer88 wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

UnPlayer88 wrote...

I have yet to see where Bioware stated that they will support all major decisions throughout the Dragon Age series. Also, has it occurred to you that if you choose the Orlesian Warden you might hear about another Warden who sacrificed her/himself to kill the Archdemon? Just because the game doesn't connect all the strings for you, that doesn't mean you can't do it yourself in your head. That is where most RP takes place anyway, right? Grow up as roleplayers and realize that the world doesn't cater to your every whim. Thanks 

But isn't that the point of RPing???????????

Flexibility and customization?

I fail to see your point

EDIT: Customization of story is a very advantage of playing video games, lets not make it a disadvantage

My point is valid.  People are expecting this game to cover every possible choice; with the amount of choices in Origins, I find that an unrealistic desire.  I agree that it would be very nice if all the endings were supported in Awakening.  That would mean more development time and more money than the expansion's budget can allow.  I have faith that the developers will deliver an amazing expansion with an amazing story considering the time and money they were allowed.   

Grown-ups realise they shouldn't spend money on products they find unsatisfactory.

[bluewolv1970]

UnPlayer88 wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

UnPlayer88 wrote...

I have yet to see where Bioware stated that they will support all major decisions throughout the Dragon Age series. Also, has it occurred to you that if you choose the Orlesian Warden you might hear about another Warden who sacrificed her/himself to kill the Archdemon? Just because the game doesn't connect all the strings for you, that doesn't mean you can't do it yourself in your head. That is where most RP takes place anyway, right? Grow up as roleplayers and realize that the world doesn't cater to your every whim. Thanks 

But isn't that the point of RPing???????????

Flexibility and customization?

I fail to see your point

EDIT: Customization of story is a very advantage of playing video games, lets not make it a disadvantage

My point is valid.  People are expecting this game to cover every possible choice; with the amount of choices in Origins, I find that an unrealistic desire.  I agree that it would be very nice if all the endings were supported in Awakening.  That would mean more development time and more money than the expansion's budget can allow.  I have faith that the developers will deliver an amazing expansion with an amazing story considering the time and money they were allowed.   

Except that the characters returning versus the characters not returning in Awakeings  DO NOT represent the most likely outcomes of the origins endings...

[wowpwnslol]

Oh noes, a company that created their own world, decided what canon and what isn't! Totally unthinkable and slap in the face to all fat, 35 year old role players around the world. Bioware should support over 9000 different outcomes otherwise, people will make angry forum threads and still buy it!

[Onyx Jaguar]

wowpwnslol



Good to know that you are 35 years old and fat, I really needed to know that information.

[wowpwnslol]

Onyx Jaguar wrote...


Good to know that you are 35 years old and fat, I really needed to know that information.

Good to know sarcasm is completely lost on an average mouth breather who frequents this forum.

[Onyx Jaguar]

Yes it is



*picks up a glass



Indeed



*puts glass in cupboard

[IndomitusRex]

How do you propose that Bioware supports a storyline in which your character is dead. The only real option I can see is you start off as an Orlesian Grey Warden, and there's a footnote that says, "hey, this Grey Warden from Ferelden totally killed the Archdemon". Because it's not like your [dead] character can add anything further to the story.

[Onyx Jaguar]

IndomitusRex wrote...

How do you propose that Bioware supports a storyline in which your character is dead. The only real option I can see is you start off as an Orlesian Grey Warden, and there's a footnote that says, "hey, this Grey Warden from Ferelden totally killed the Archdemon". Because it's not like your [dead] character can add anything further to the story.

So you agree with us.  Basically ???

[Thalorin1919]

They should honor the US ending at least. If you start a new Orlesian grey warden, there should be a big statue in Amaranthine or whatever that honors you. And you should hear a tidbit about you from other characters.



I dont really care that you can play your dead character, but at least mention what I say above. Its just not fair to exclude something like that.

[Greifvogel]

IndomitusRex wrote...

How do you propose that Bioware supports a storyline in which your character is dead. The only real option I can see is you start off as an Orlesian Grey Warden, and there's a footnote that says, "hey, this Grey Warden from Ferelden totally killed the Archdemon". Because it's not like your [dead] character can add anything further to the story.

You're on the right track at least, buddy. You only didn't realize that is indeed what people want. 

[fthg42]

BoomOpCT wrote...

2. Not every ending is meant to continue on. A very good example is Mass Effect 2. ME is going to be a trilogy. However, you can have and "US" ending in ME2 on the suicide mission. Do you honestly think in ME3 they will write out an ENTIRELY new plot and main character to support the loss of Shepard in ME2? no, of course not. US was a noble ending never meant to continue beyond that choice.

This is not an analogous situation at all.  In ME2 the ending where Shepard dies is more of an "undesirable ending", in that pretty much everything possible must go wrong before that can happen.  Even in interviews and press, Casey Hudson repeatedly stressed that, though it is a suicide mission and the possibility of death is very real, it is in your (and Shepard's) best interest to survive, and in game the whole point is that Shepard is the only one capable of leading this suicide mission with any probability of survival.  This is clearly a completely different scenario from the US ending in DA:O, where the US ending is one that requires a deliberate, difficult decision by the Warden (and player) in the endgame, as opposed to the "bad ending" you get if you weren't as successful as you could have been in combating the Blight.  (Something more comparable, in my opinion, would be a hypothetical situation where you do defeat the Archdemon, but at the cost of the near-total destruction of Ferelden; the Blight is ended either way, but...)

Furthermore, the ME is a clear trilogy centering around Shepard, whereas yes, DA was never stated or intended to be a trilogy centering around one character, but it does not follow that you can't continue the world setting that you've been playing and influenced around you by your choices.  Bioware offers you the chance to continue your game from Origins in three of the endings, or the chance to start anew in a default template setting as the Orlesian Warden, but the state of the US ending is still unresolved.  If Bioware came out and explicitly said that yes, the US ending was meant to be a definitive ending to the game and series and was not meant to carry forward, that would be something else altogether, but as it stands, it's still a point of contention.

Also, saying that the US ending was never meant to continue beyond that choice suggests that it is the "undesirable" or inferior of the choices available to you, which I just can't accept as true given the context of the game and in light of Bioware's statements that our choices in DA:O matter and will carry forward in Awakening.

[Axekix]

fthg42 wrote...

Also, saying that the US ending was never meant to continue beyond that choice suggests that it is the "undesirable" or inferior of the choices available to you, which I just can't accept as true given the context of the game and in light of Bioware's statements that our choices in DA:O matter and will carry forward in Awakening.

But it is undesirable and inferior to the far more open ended god baby storyline.  One is a dead end while the other gives the developers a major plot device to build new stories and games from.  How can you not see that?

Modifié par Axekix, 04 mars 2010 - 08:22 .

[romac1314]

While I'm sure Bioware can get something big out of the "God Baby" story line, how can you say that's the ending we should have chose? Everyone plays their game differently, for my PC personally, that was never an option to my play style. I'm not saying I picked the most care bear of options 100% of the time, but for the most part I was a "good" guy, one who would not bring a possessed child into this world to save my own skin. One who would not let a friend take my place under the guillotine.



I'm not a big RPG fan, and I'm new to Bioware games. I bought KOTOR when it came out, but I was never a huge Star Wars nut so I really didn't get into it and quit about 6 hours in. That was my only other Bioware experience. Dragon Age was more my style. I like the "fantasy" setting, and that it was very dark/adult was a plus as well. Anyway, I've never played anything like it, I've never cared so much about the characters involved, or been so wrapped up in a story. Honestly I didn't see the US coming at all, it was a bomb shell for me, and that made the choice that much harder on me. I held out, hoping the other Warden would've made the kill, and when it was my time to step up, I did so, and even still I hoped something would happen, I would be "the one true hero" who withstood the possession and lived or something (surely the game wouldn't kill my character, right?). But the finality of it all was amazing, it was the perfect ending to my story. It cost me everything, but I was able to save my friends and my land.



I'm not saying I want awakening to mention me by first name in every dialogue tree, just have a character or two acknowledge my deed, let the world I created live on past my death, and I'll happily reroll the new Orlesian Warden and begin a new story. But if my ending is ignored completely, it ruins everything I feel like I accomplished in Origins.

[Axekix]

romac1314 wrote...

I'm not saying I want awakening to mention me by first name in every dialogue tree, just have a character or two acknowledge my deed, let the world I created live on past my death, and I'll happily reroll the new Orlesian Warden and begin a new story. But if my ending is ignored completely, it ruins everything I feel like I accomplished in Origins.

I see what you're saying, but they can't cater to every ending.  DAO branches out in several different ways towards the end, and DAA will probbaly do so as well.  What's next?  A game with 20-30 different possible starting points based on both DAO and DAA? 

They have to streamline it at some point for the series to feasibly continue.  If it's the immersion you're worried about, just go back and play through DAO the canon way.  Then DAA will transition seamlessly for you.

[MelodicCure]

Ummm... it does continue. If you died...what do you want them to do? revive you...lollercopter fuk no. here is how it continues...if you died...make a new character and now you are a Warden from Orlias that is continuing the prestige story of the dead Warden by being a new Warden cause the other one is freaking dead....now ify ou don't want to be dead and use the character...than don't die lolz.

[Dave of Canada]

MelodicCure wrote...

Ummm... it does continue. If you died...what do you want them to do? revive you...lollercopter fuk no. here is how it continues...if you died...make a new character and now you are a Warden from Orlias that is continuing the prestige story of the dead Warden by being a new Warden cause the other one is freaking dead....now ify ou don't want to be dead and use the character...than don't die lolz.

The Orlesian Warden isn't continuing the Dead Warden's storyline, it's pretending it didn't happen.

[Angel of Nessus]

MelodicCure wrote...

Ummm... it does continue. If you died...what do you want them to do? revive you...lollercopter fuk no. here is how it continues...if you died...make a new character and now you are a Warden from Orlias that is continuing the prestige story of the dead Warden by being a new Warden cause the other one is freaking dead....now ify ou don't want to be dead and use the character...than don't die lolz.

You're right; the first warden IS FREAKING DEAD.  His story dies with him, and the Orleasian's story begins.  LOLZ.

[BoomOpCT]

Look at it this way, the US ending can't work on a production level. Think about it. If you play the god baby ending, yourr charcter lives. So every charcter you meet in in awakening will refer to "you". Refer to what "you" did. How they know "you". Ask "you" questions about what you experienced. Ohgren would play the whole game as if he knows ad fought aongside "you". And the whole Grey Warden world knows "you" are special because you are the only warden ever to survive his fate.



Now, switch over to playing as the Orlesian Warden. If it carried over your dead warden's info...every bit of dialouge in the game that references the the warden now has to change. Ohgren's entire relationship with you not only has to change because you are orlesian, but his dialouge would have to have to differ in terms of the warden he fought with and what choices that warden made for him.



However, after saying all of that, I really think you guys are worrying for nothing. I have a feeling it works different from what you guys think. If you play as a dark promise character, it makes sense tht Alastair/Loghain, who is alive/dead, and who is king/queen would influence your game. They know who you are and would obviously intearct with you. The orlesian warden...not so much. The scenes involving any of these characthers will probably never take place as the orlesian....which means the game state of the rest of Fereldan won't be mentioned and therefore whatever your reality in your head is, is all that matters. Any reference to the US warden would be simply in that reference alone. "The warden who gave thier own life" or something to that degree. In conversations like that, who was king/who is alive/dead from the old party would never come up. anyone else get what I am saying?



If I had

[Bryy_Miller]

wowpwnslol wrote...

Oh noes, a company that created their own world, decided what canon and what isn't!

More like allowing the player to make the canon. If you made the US, and you don't want to play as your dead character, simply do not import him. The consequences of killing your main character in regards to the importing feature should of been clear to people from the get-go.

[Onyx Jaguar]

*Continues beating dead horse



*Someone walks by*



"Hey what are you doing there?"



^This horse didn't make it, I'm beating it with a shovel^



"what are you talking about, it looks perfectly fine to me"

[Feraele]

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

IndomitusRex wrote...

How do you propose that Bioware supports a storyline in which your character is dead. The only real option I can see is you start off as an Orlesian Grey Warden, and there's a footnote that says, "hey, this Grey Warden from Ferelden totally killed the Archdemon". Because it's not like your [dead] character can add anything further to the story.

So you agree with us.  Basically ???

Sounds like it..and thats all we've been saying....might be nice if before they jumped into a thread to complain about the subject of conversation...they actually took time to READ and UNDERSTAND.

I  realize that is too much to ask these days..when putting punctuation and paragraphs in their typing..is considered to be "roleplaying"(according to an actual post I saw)   LOL I wonder how they manage at school ..or maybe they don't.

The roleplaying reference was from another thread where someone refused to make it easier for the rest of us to read what the  heck he was saying.  

[Feraele]

Bryy_Miller wrote...

wowpwnslol wrote...

Oh noes, a company that created their own world, decided what canon and what isn't!

More like allowing the player to make the canon. If you made the US, and you don't want to play as your dead character, simply do not import him. The consequences of killing your main character in regards to the importing feature should of been clear to people from the get-go.

DID YOU READ the subject of this conversation...AT ALL?   We KNOW ..that the easy solution is to just omit the fact that you played that character for 50 to 80 hours..that Bioware has decided that making your dead warden walk around after dying ..IS MORE IMPORTANT ..than continuity of the story...therefore the Ultimate Sacrifice is NULL AND VOID.

This conversation has been going on for 19 days now, if you are so willing to jump in and offer advice, also be aware of what the issues are.

People posting their thoughts in these two threads are NOT willing to hand-waive and pretend  their warden never died, even though he or she did.

Even though we as Grey wardens are taught that we must kill the Archdemon...because WE ARE THE ONLY ONES THAT CAN DO IT this has suddenly become...not important.  Non-existant, never happened...denied.    Null and void.

When you die..there should be some sort of credit passed onward..some sort of acknowledgement of your sacrifice.  A small conversation with "someone" that gives credit where credit is due.

This of course won't matter to some person who zips thru cut-scenes..escapes dialogue and plays for the achievements and moar uberness. 

It does however, matter to those of us who play the story for the rpg aspects, therefore...when Bioware makes it more important..to allow the dead to walk, than to give some small credit to the most heroic ending there can be in Origins.....there's something wrong with that picture.

[Axekix]

Feraele wrote...

It does however, matter to those of us who play the story for the rpg aspects, therefore...when Bioware makes it more important..to allow the dead to walk, than to give some small credit to the most heroic ending there can be in Origins.....there's something wrong with that picture.

Then roleplay the right ending and move on.  You can play for the RPG aspects and do the dark promise ending.   I did.

US is the most limited from a storyline perspective.  It's not worth the extra effort/money/development time to support it.