525 réponses à ce sujet

[Andy_Haugh]

Jimbe2693 wrote...

^ ME1 had 2 models for each weapon, and the rest were reskins.

And your point is..? I'm not 100% sure if you're implying that this is a negative or not, but it seems safe to say that you are.

While ME1 didn't have a huge number of different weapon/armor models, it did have a ton of different skins and stat sets, and this is precisely one
of the things that made ME1 a great game -- people love variety in their equipment. You get to pick from loads of different armor/weapon appearances, and choose whether you want to favor accuracy, damage, or overheat time. More choices equals better gameplay. The fact that there was only a handful of different models is a moot point.

It is sad BioWare didn't devote a bit of time towards adding a few more weapons in ME2 by creating a few reskinned versions. It would have added a lot to the game, and it isn't too time-consuming to do so. (It takes a lot less time to make a reskin than it does to create a new model *and* the associated skin)

Heck, in the real world many guns use the same "model" but can have very different "stats". Look no further than the AR-15 family of rifles -- same physical appearance, yet they come in every caliber from .223 Remington  to .450 Bushmaster. So there is really nothing silly or unrealistic about this approach... and, again, it adds to this idea of more "choice & options" that I keep talking about

[finnithe]

If Bioware actually wants to differentiate the guns (which they did partially in ME2), they should have SMG's or Pistols with different effective ranges, strengths and weaknesses, and they should also vary the firing styles a bit more. ME1's gun system was hardly customization, as the only difference was in terms of damage, shots before overheat, and accuracy, and these were pretty ineffective as some classes of weapons (such as the banshee or avenger), were always the weakest and had no redeeming qualities. This meant that many classes of weapons went completely unused by the player throughout the game. Since it was so easy to receive access to the Spectre weapons, which were better than the more common weapons even at the X level, these weapons pretty much became the default weapon for most of the game. ME1 presented an illusion of choice, and ME2 just gets rid of that illusion. ME3 can fix that, but I think its possible that it might even be fixed in ME2 should more weapons be released through DLC (though I dislike this approach).

In my opinion, the design of guns should be akin to what Valve does with TF2. When weapons take up the same slot in that game, they usually give benefits in some aspects while disadvantages in others. (Direct Hit Rocket Launcher moves faster and if it hits enemy does more damage than the vanilla Rocket Launcher, but it does next to zero splash damage, necessitating better aiming skills)

EDIT: I'd like to add that shots before overheat became almost inconsequential, and not because of Frictionless Materials. Anybody smarter than an apple could figure out that staggering the firing of their weapon ensured that it would not overheat. The differences betweent teh shots before overheat are usually pretty small, so damage ends up trumping this stat. I'm not sure how much of an effect accuracy had on my playstyle, as I would just pop off my weapon skill if I really wanted that.

Modifié par finnithe, 20 février 2010 - 05:33 .

[alickar]

wow kobra if ur gonna complain about this mail it ME@ is better thn ME1!!!!!!!!!!

[alickar]

Kobra bioware wont take ur advice its like 3 or 4 peeps vs all ME 2 fans so wat do u think ME2 got a 5 outta 5 in almost everything this means ur a ME1 nerd

[Jaysonie]

MassEffect762 wrote...

Hey Bioware, I'f you by some long shot chance happen to be reading these type of threads you know you screwed up royally with ME2.

I can understand why you did what you did though.(it was just easier this way)

Have you read threw this thread, 6 pages of disagreeing with the OP and a page and a half agreeing with it.

[D00GS729]

Hey, what happened to that fight between the guy with "irish fighting blood" and the dude who speaks english as his third or fourth language?



That was classic.

[alickar]

just goto gamestop n look at the ratings from ME1 to ME2

[MassEffect762]

SithLordExarKun wrote...

MassEffect762 wrote...

Hey Bioware, I'f you by some long shot chance happen to be reading these type of threads you know you screwed up royally with ME2.

Right because a vocal minority is whining/complaining non stop about how ME2 sucked it therefore means they royally screwed up.

Perhaps I was I bit "harsh" with my choice of words. Anyhoo, If the game had been better "stream-lined"/improved/refined whatever you want to call it I doubt we'd have so many of these "negative" feedback  threads popping up, especially so early on since it's release.

These threads are becoming repetive, I just hope Bioware learns from them.

Posters on both sides I'm sure feel their comments might sway Biowares outlook on ME3s direction. Everyones just looking out for their own as always in life.

[SithLordExarKun]

MassEffect762 wrote...


Perhaps I was I bit "harsh" with my choice of words. Anyhoo, If the game had been better "stream-lined"/improved/refined whatever you want to call it I doubt we'd have so many of these "negative" feedback  threads popping up, especially so early on since it's release.

Oh please the game has been better streamlined, regardless of whatever bioware does weather it be  stick to the old mechanics like ME1, tweak the inventory a little, these very people would still be whining and whining non stop about how bioware didn't improve the game and they are being lazy blah blah blah.

They can't please everyone and so far the people complaining non stop are just a minority compared to the majority of people enjoying the game.

The damn reason why the game turned out like this is because of these people whining about how clunky the combat was in he first game, the absolutely horrendous inventory system and the lazy cut and paste side quests.

Modifié par SithLordExarKun, 20 février 2010 - 06:03 .

[Jaysonie]

MassEffect762 wrote...

SithLordExarKun wrote...

MassEffect762 wrote...

Hey Bioware, I'f you by some long shot chance happen to be reading these type of threads you know you screwed up royally with ME2.

Right because a vocal minority is whining/complaining non stop about how ME2 sucked it therefore means they royally screwed up.

Perhaps I was I bit "harsh" with my choice of words. Anyhoo, If the game had been better "stream-lined"/improved/refined whatever you want to call it I doubt we'd have so many of these "negative" feedback  threads popping up, especially so early on since it's release.

These threads are becoming repetive, I just hope Bioware learns from them.

Posters on both sides I'm sure feel their comments might sway Biowares outlook on ME3s direction. Everyones just looking out for their own as always in life.

I disagree, fans will complain at the smallest bit of change. No matter what bioware did, this negativity was
inevitable.

[EternalWolfe]

MassEffect762 wrote...

Anyhoo, If the game had been better "stream-lined"/improved/refined whatever you want to call it I doubt we'd have so many of these "negative" feedback  threads popping up, especially so early on since it's release.

These threads are becoming repetive, I just hope Bioware learns from them.

Posters on both sides I'm sure feel their comments might sway Biowares outlook on ME3s direction. Everyones just looking out for their own as always in life.

I doubt anything could have stopped negative feedback threads.  Humans whine, its what they do.  If its not one thing, its another.  If its not one person, its someone else.  Its pretty much a given that no matter what you do, someone will have some complaints.

Personally, I thought ME2 was a good game of its own merits.  I might have preffered certain things done other ways, but in and of itself, it was a good game.  Personally, I hope it moves back towards ME1 - not all the way, but somewhere in the middle, take the best from both games and meld them seamlessly.

[MassEffect762]

EternalWolfe wrote...

MassEffect762 wrote...

Anyhoo, If the game had been better "stream-lined"/improved/refined whatever you want to call it I doubt we'd have so many of these "negative" feedback  threads popping up, especially so early on since it's release.

These threads are becoming repetive, I just hope Bioware learns from them.

Posters on both sides I'm sure feel their comments might sway Biowares outlook on ME3s direction. Everyones just looking out for their own as always in life.

I doubt anything could have stopped negative feedback threads.  Humans whine, its what they do.  If its not one thing, its another.  If its not one person, its someone else.  Its pretty much a given that no matter what you do, someone will have some complaints.

Personally, I thought ME2 was a good game of its own merits.  I might have preffered certain things done other ways, but in and of itself, it was a good game.  Personally, I hope it moves back towards ME1 - not all the way, but somewhere in the middle, take the best from both games and meld them seamlessly.

Agreed.

[Nazo]

I hate myself for replying to these types of threads, but it worries me that maybe all bioware will see are people kvetching about this game not being baldur's gate th... I mean, mass effect 1, and try to please them by rolling back some of their improvements. For what it's worth, I've won ME1 5 times (just played through it again last week), am on my second ME2 playthrough, and it's just a smoother, better game to play. Combat flows and moves instead of 'hide in the entrance corridor and gun them down as they come'.



I love ME1 and I miss customization because I love tweaking characters and equipment endlessly, but ... that's just not this game/series. It is what it is, and it's pretty awesome.

[hex23]

yoomazir wrote...

no, people bought ME2 because they thought they would get a ME game with  corrected defaults and didn't expect to receive a straight foward shooter in exchange.
And for the critics, well most of them loved Gears of War and Uncharted so obviously ME2 got good reviews but not necessarely for what defines Bioware.

You're assuming why people bought "ME2" and honestly you have no idea. The first game took 2+ years to sell 2 million units, this game is at around 1.5 million in 3 weeks. So no, the vast majority of people buying this game don't necessarily have any ties to the first game.

You obviously didn't read any of the reviews praising "ME2" for it's story and RPG elements, not because "it's like Gears Of War ot Uncharted 2".

It's currently at 96% on Metacritic. Actually read the reviews instead of assuming why it's getting the praise it's getting.

[hex23]

Andy_Haugh wrote...

Sorry, it really isn't so simple... "Critical acclaim" doesn't mean everything, and sometimes it means very little. Over the last 15 years I've seen countless games get fantastic reviews when in reality the game has serious issues. For example, Empire: Total War got fantastic reviews last year, but even the developers themselves have admitted the AI is so broken that it will never function remotely close to as well as it was supposed to. (One quote said something about the game engine being as powerful as a "V12 from a supercar", yet it was only capable of firing on two or three cylinders at once)

Also, note that many people would be unaware of the massive changes to core aspects of ME's gameplay until after they bought ME2 and played it. Anyway, it was a given that ME2 would be a hit... it is a great sequel to one of the best PC games of all time.

Clearly these changes have left a lot of people upset, disappointed, or even outraged (That's why threads like this exist). Darth Drago is of course correct in saying that changing genres in the middle of a series is not a good idea. That is really quite obvious... people expect certain things from sequels. Fortunately for us, BioWare executed those changes about as well as it could possibly be done.

The only time critical acclaim means nothing is when people choose to disregard it for obvious reasons. For example, being disappointed in something. Then it's "oh, what do those critics know?!". That has nothing to do with the actual quality of what's being discussed.

Basically, something isn't bad just because a few people feel it is.

The vast majority of people are happy with the game. It's currently holding two spots on Direct2Drive's top 10 and in the top 10 best sellers list on Steam also. It just sold another 100k+ this week according to VGChartz, and is at around 1.5 million, if not more total sold. Averaging 96% on Metacritic....if "a lot of people" were upset you'd think it would be reflected in other places outside of this message board....sales would be plummeting, reviews would taper off as the hype dies down....something. There is literally no indication that "a lot" of people dislike this game.

[TallBearNC]

SithLordExarKun wrote...

We dont need another useless whine thread.

LOL how absurd. Let's just get rid of the forums then shall we?

Although some of you might not like what the OP has voiced, but that's what the forums are here for

1) Spoilers / Non spoilers
2) Game Discussions (praises, comments, flaws, etc)
3) Tech help
4) Quest/Mission help

I'd say that's about the top 4 reasons to have teh forums.

The OP didn't "flame" BW or the game. He pointed out, what he thought, are flaws in the game. Some I do agree with. Some I do not.

I really felt "limited" in ME2. Especially at the Citadel.... I agree with the OP on the shops... they were limited.... the romantic scenes were "toned down" and I did NOT like the FPS aspect to the game. That's annoying. However more and more people (especially younger people) are hot to trot over FPS games and the RPG style seems to take more of a back seat these days. So I do agree with the OP in this area strongly. 

... but that beind said... I still loved the game.. and I will be doing a 2nd playthrough

Modifié par TallBearNC, 20 février 2010 - 07:07 .

[Darth Drago]

hex23 wrote...

yoomazir wrote...

no, people bought ME2 because they thought they would get a ME game with corrected defaults and didn't expect to receive a straight foward shooter in exchange.
And for the critics, well most of them loved Gears of War and Uncharted so obviously ME2 got good reviews but not necessarely for what defines Bioware.

You're assuming why people bought "ME2" and honestly you have no idea. The first game took 2+ years to sell 2 million units, this game is at around 1.5 million in 3 weeks. So no, the vast majority of people buying this game don't necessarily have any ties to the first game.

How do you come to that conclusion? If ME1 sold 2 million and ME2 currently has sold 1.5 million, why would you assume that out of the 2 million people who bought ME1 most of them didn’t buy ME2? Going by these numbers BioWare/EA lost half a million customers from the first game so far. And quit bringing up how long it took ME1 to hit 2 million it has absolutely nothing to do with anything. Anyone with common sense could tell you that a sequel to almost anything will sell a large amount of copies on its release because it is a sequel, not some unknown product. The people who, in this case played the first game regardless of when they got it, likely went out to get the next chapter of the series when it was released.

[The_mango55]

K0braTh0r wrote...

- extremely simplified market (buying items without the possibility to sell them?!?);

Seems reasonable to me.

Why don't you take all the stuff you don't want anymore to your local wal-mart and see how much the cashier offers you for them.

[n4d4n]

OP, most of what you mentioned are minor things which do not really affect the game as negatively as people have made them out to in my opinion. ME2 is still Mass Effect in every way, feels the same as ME1 with a continued story and darker feel to it. It's definetly not a shooter, even this morning I spent 30 minutes scanning a planet, listening to the codex, handing in a side quest and talking to some crew members with my morning coffee. That's definetly not a shooter to me.

I love the balance between being able to just do main missions, or go exploring locations, scanning planets, talking to your team, doing side quests, researching upgrades, listening to the codex etc. Bit off topic, but makes my point that Bioware didn't just dumb this down to be a shooter, they just tried to fix some systems they believed to be broken in ME1, maybe they could have implemented them better but ME2 is still ME.

Modifié par n4d4n, 20 février 2010 - 07:59 .

[Acero Azul]

I like it so ill play it no need to tell everyone how much you dislike it. If you need to see how that turns out go to socom.com they really went downhill when people started crying about the game.

[Jigero]

Oh look it's another one of those threads where the self proclaimed hardcore RPG fans complain about lack of RPG elements and they don't even know what RPG elements are.

[thebwolf33]

I never really reply to forums just read them and i find it funny. I find it funny because of everyone saying this game suck or no its not you do. Me I like ME2 a lot and i have played every game bioware has made since the gate games and i see both points true and false but you have to see the big picture.genres of games grow if they dont grow then they die. just look at the wing commander games very big back then but they didnt grow thats why no more wing comander games and no more mechwarrior games. Devs try  to grow the genre to make it better or different thats how we got the first Me1 if you think about it all the games they made before ME was leading up to this.ktor with the converstions and the real time frighting then came jade empire with the more action in it that you had to hit a key scene and rpg with it.Ever game they make they change things up because thats what good companies do.I for one am proud to be a fan of bioware and all i have to say is keep it up.

Modifié par thebwolf33, 20 février 2010 - 01:08 .

[TornadoADV]

Jigero wrote...

Oh look it's another one of those threads where the self proclaimed hardcore RPG fans complain about lack of RPG elements and they don't even know what RPG elements are.

Oh look, it's another one of those self proclaimed hardcore RPG fans who thinks an RPG is just a coherent story.

Modifié par TornadoADV, 20 février 2010 - 04:07 .

[Obadiah]

I think if I hadn't played ME1 or DA:O, I'd think ME2 was awesome. As it is, I just think it is good.

Modifié par Obadiah, 20 février 2010 - 03:58 .

[InfiniteCuts]

At some point people are going to have to accept that the game has strength and flaws and that forum members have the right to comment on either. There's no reason to attack the OP over his opinions... simply give your own and move on, or don't comment at all. Mass Effect 2, great as it is, is quite a different game than the first and has its own set of weaknesses. People here would have you believe no one can ever bring these up.

When the community loses its ability to be critical about a game, progress is hampered for the devs and the result is Halo Effect 3. If you see someone being critical about the game, just don't take it personally and ask yourself if that person's opinion has any possible credence. If not, give your arguments with as little insult or patronizing as possible (adds nothing, anyway). BioWare is one of the few devs I know of that listens to their fans so much so as to incorporate them into the game itself... don't squander that opportunity by trying to silence critics.

Modifié par InfiniteCuts, 20 février 2010 - 04:35 .