235 réponses à ce sujet

[Pyrusx]

AngryFrozenWater wrote...

MaleShep or FemShep?

What about if they're both equal?

For both games I have/intend to do 1 play for each class, 3 of each gender. You poll discriminates!

But really, I suppose my first Shepard was male for both games...

[AngryFrozenWater]

Pyrusx wrote...

AngryFrozenWater wrote...

MaleShep or FemShep?

What about if they're both equal?

For both games I have/intend to do 1 play for each class, 3 of each gender. You poll discriminates!

But really, I suppose my first Shepard was male for both games...

I was thinking about that too. Do you think I should add that?

Edit 1: Isn't "Usually" enough?

Edit 2: Once created you cannot change it. I think I'll leave it like that.

Modifié par AngryFrozenWater, 28 février 2010 - 11:01 .

[SirGladiator]

I agree that FemShep should get more attention, obviously certain marketing people are stuck in the past. MaleShep isn't more marketable simply because he's a man, he would be more marketable if he were the superior Shepard, but since he isn't I have no doubt that Hale/FemShep would be significantly more marketable.

[Nyjahl]

To keep the thread on track, I also would like to see female Shepard get more attention for ME3. I've been bringing this up whenever I could in other threads, and will repeat it on this one:
 
I would love to see a high quality head scan used for the default female Shepard. I never understood why Hale's face was never used (if you don't want to use hers, the same company you got Samara's model from has many to choose from).

In my opinion, Hale is the better and more believable voice for Shepard (in both games). As far as animations, sadly, this has been a problem with Bioiware games for a time now (except for ME2 cutscenes, mostly for Samara). I always winced when I saw females walk in Dragon Age during cutscenes...

Modifié par Nyjahl, 28 février 2010 - 12:13 .

[SimonTheFrog]

Ermm... as much as i enjoy reading the controversy about moving like a girl or moving like a man, i think, that this is very much a purely artistic choice. I agree that it feels like as if they cut the female animation and just gave femShep the male one, but i got used to it and its ok. Either way, it's kinda subtle and basically decorative in nature. At least as far as i'm concerned.

I think, that there's a much more interesting issue.

The whole game feels more natural with a male shep than a femshep. And this is a bad thing!
I usually play the girl in any game, if i have the option. And i played ME1 and ME2 quite often, so femShep is my canon Shep and i wouldn't want it any other way.
But recently i made my first playthrough with maleShep (because he has more interesting LI's and for some obscure reason the LI's are very strict about not giving my poor femShep any chance for a flirt. I thought in the future people are more open-minded and natural about their flirting... but anyway )
And it was quite depressing how many dialogs and NPC-interaction are designed for maleShep and then either cut for femShep or just transfered without giving it much thought.

Examples:

Kelly. She's a doll. She's easy to have, always friendly and submissive. I like her but she's a male fantasy. This works very well with a womanizing maleShep (which he is if you play paragon) but it actually feels pretty awkward with a femShep. It would have been the "right" thing to do to have a male Yeoman for femShep if you want to have the not-so-subtle flirt next to the bridge. But they didn't care. They just make the male game and stuff in the femShep. Next.

Giana Parasini, Shiala etc. If you played femShep, you learn to accept that Asari may hit on you. It's first a little strange but hey, they are alien, so its ok. But nobody else in the game (aside the LI's of course) will ever even flirt with you when you play femShep. Then, in marches maleShep. First i flirted with Kelly, she told me that Tali loves me, then i went to Illum where Liara kissed me (poor Tali watching), than Giana kissed me, then Shiala gave me that look. The bartender at eternity, asari, of course, was kinda flirty too, calling be "babe". I don't mind the innuendo at all. It's a bit much (you're chasing bugs that will wipe out humanity... you're at work, basically, but i don't mind). But jeeez, it's all about the maleShep! Where are the femShep flirts? Where are any friendly NPC's besides Asari and Kelly? 

Headbutting the Krogan. Now this is a difficult one. I totally love that scene with my femShep. She headbutts the Krogan!!! I love her! BUT: they did NOT design that scene with the girl in mind, never ever. It's a very juvenile, virile power display. Why would a woman do that? She's on a mission, not trying to look good among Krogans. Anyway. Where are special scenes where femShep can kick ass in a woman's way? I'm not sure what that would be. I'm not suggesting seduction, obviously, as this would be cliché and lame (well, ok, maybe if its funny and tastefully done), but i'd suggest some complex mind-game, you know, diplomatic, polite, evil. We have that stuff with Konrad, but it still feels male centered (Konrad says his wife will LOVE the picture of Shepard when he will put it at the wall. She will love a poster of a female commander in her room??? I think not ) No, I'm kinda thinking Parasini... she's doing a cool job. Or femShep could have a sidequest with hired Krogans that beat up someone else for her. Just tossing around ideas. Kinda what Aria does...

Asari. So..... we got a female looking alien race. They are... pole dancing, flirting, serving drinks and shooting with big guns. WHAT??? No comment.

On the other hand, the female VO is much better, the main character is not just a marine but has many different character facets that suit my female character very well (warm-hearted, protective, connected), (s)he's not trying to blow up everything all alone, but builds a team and tries to find allies, bioware very diligently cared for all the he's and she's in dialogs and recorded many many lines double for that and generally took good care about covering up the fact that you actually play a "male" game with a female character (if you choose so). So it's not all that bad.

And also, this is just a minor thing. I was posting this more because i kept reflecting this myself and because it's never a bad thing to think about gender stuff... but it's not a big issue.

Modifié par SimonTheFrog, 28 février 2010 - 12:30 .

[BurstAngel75]

As much as I love headbutting a Krogan (I have a Table Top game with a female fighter that likes to start a fight with a headbutt as an opening move).
But I know for a fact that a real woman would never headbut a man, she'd hit below the belt
And since the Krogan has four, well lets just say its definitely an invitation to show a Krogan REAL pain!
I love to see better, prettier casual clothes and a better walk. I've worn a uniform, the last thing a girl wants in the military is be ugly out of uniform. BDUs are butt ugly and only looks half way decent on a man.  

[Lightice_av]

Kelly. She's a doll. She's easy to have, always friendly and submissive.

Sorry, but aren't you thinking of Liara here? Kelly is friend of all living things to be sure, but not submissive by any account, and though she's flirty as hell, you'll need to jump through as many hoops as with every "real" LI to get her serious interest - saving her life, and all. Kelly is an intelligent noncombatant, something not too often seen in such an action-oriented game as ME.

. But nobody else in the game (aside the LI's of course) will ever even flirt with you when you play femShep.

This I admit is something that female gamers undoubtedly find lacking. Men trying to flirt with FShep wouldn't have been an issue to add, to be sure. But now that I think of it, I can't seem to bring in mind any male NPC who might have fit the job in the same way that Gianna and Shiala do. There aren't very many memorable male NPCs outside your squad who players might show that kind of interest to.

Liara will obviously kiss you only if you romanced her in ME1, so she doesn't count, though.

I love her! BUT: they did NOT design that scene with the girl in mind, never ever. It's a very juvenile, virile power display. Why would a woman do that? She's on a mission, not trying to look good among Krogans.

Because she saw Wrex do it, and correctly deduced that this is how the krogans solve conflicts. She's adapting to the culture around her to get her job done, the culture in question just happens to be very macho. You can skip that part, and instead use words to just as good effect, if you prefer that approach.

(Konrad says his wife will LOVE the picture of Shepard when he will put it at the wall. She will love a poster of a female commander in her room??? I think not )

First, Conrad is very obviously just talking about his wife even though he means himself, but I don't necessarily see why a woman might not admire FShep - she's the walking image of female empowerment!

I've worn a uniform, the last thing a girl wants in the military is be ugly out of uniform.

I'm pretty sure that female soldiers look for practicality over appearance while on duty - and you aren't exactly off duty at any point of the game.

[BurstAngel75]

You if drink or dance when your in uniform, is a BIG no no.

[SimonTheFrog]

Lightice_av wrote...

Kelly. She's a doll. She's easy to have, always friendly and submissive.

Sorry, but aren't you thinking of Liara here? Kelly is friend of all living things to be sure, but not submissive by any account, and though she's flirty as hell, you'll need to jump through as many hoops as with every "real" LI to get her serious interest - saving her life, and all. Kelly is an intelligent noncombatant, something not too often seen in such an action-oriented game as ME.

. But nobody else in the game (aside the LI's of course) will ever even flirt with you when you play femShep.

This I admit is something that female gamers undoubtedly find lacking. Men trying to flirt with FShep wouldn't have been an issue to add, to be sure. But now that I think of it, I can't seem to bring in mind any male NPC who might have fit the job in the same way that Gianna and Shiala do. There aren't very many memorable male NPCs outside your squad who players might show that kind of interest to.
Liara will obviously kiss you only if you romanced her in ME1, so she doesn't count, though.

I love her! BUT: they did NOT design that scene with the girl in mind, never ever. It's a very juvenile, virile power display. Why would a woman do that? She's on a mission, not trying to look good among Krogans.

Because she saw Wrex do it, and correctly deduced that this is how the krogans solve conflicts. She's adapting to the culture around her to get her job done, the culture in question just happens to be very macho. You can skip that part, and instead use words to just as good effect, if you prefer that approach.

(Konrad says his wife will LOVE the picture of Shepard when he will put it at the wall. She will love a poster of a female commander in her room??? I think not )

First, Conrad is very obviously just talking about his wife even though he means himself, but I don't necessarily see why a woman might not admire FShep - she's the walking image of female empowerment!

I've worn a uniform, the last thing a girl wants in the military is be ugly out of uniform.

I'm pretty sure that female soldiers look for practicality over appearance while on duty - and you aren't exactly off duty at any point of the game.

KK, Kelly being submissive is a poor choice of wording. What i meant was that she's basically friendly and excited to be your buddy right from the first dialog. There's no development from "professional" to "intimate" like with most of the LI's. She's unprofessional and i find it hard to respect her as a collegue... 

And about intelligent non-combatant: Dr. Chakwas is kick-ass... she doesn't have much dialogs but everything about her is just great (well, she joins a terrorist organization for no good reason, so she's a terrorist, but a really nice one). I have no idea what i'm trying to proof here, but well, women don't need to be like Kelly to be interesting...

There are no male NPC's worth flirting with because they made the game for the maleShep.

About the headbutt: yes!! As i said, i love to headbutt the Krogan with my femShep. It's awesome. And it's great that the girl got to do it. I'm just saying that they put in a lot of macho content but not so much feminine content. I'm not even complaining about it because i enjoy what's there immensly, just observing.

Conrad's wife might enjoy the picture of a female commander in general, but what wife wouldn't pout if the husband brings home a poster of an adorable woman and puts it on the wall?!  (It's just amusing, not to be taken too seriously)

I agree that Shepard shouldn't run around like paris hilton. Ever. Not even in her shore leave. And i don't even mind that she doesn't have very feminine clothes. I'd dress her sexy if i could, i think, because it's pleasing to look at, but i don't miss it, really. But as i said, i leave that to the designers, if they want femShep to be masculine, why not. If they want her to be slender and feminine, sure, fine too. 

Shepard doesn't win the war by arm wrestling. But by superior fire/biotic power and an awesome team... 

Modifié par SimonTheFrog, 28 février 2010 - 01:33 .

[Lightice_av]

BurstAngel75 wrote...

You if drink or dance when your in uniform, is a BIG no no.

Well, you aren't in the Alliance military, any more. Cerberus is a bit more lax about their rules - as are the Spectres, to be sure.

What i
meant was that she's basically friendly and excited to be your buddy
right from the first dialog. There's no development from "professional"
to "intimate" like with most of the LI's. She's unprofessional and i
find it hard to respect her as a collegue...

She also explains right off the bat that it's her job to be likeable and friendly, because a major part of it is to keep tabs on everybody's mental health, and defuse conflicts before they occur. Basically, she's paid to be everybody's friend. She isn't a soldier, so military protocol means little to her.

I have no idea what i'm trying to proof here, but well, women don't need to be like Kelly to be interesting...

That's not what I was trying to say, at all. I like Dr. Chakwas too, and find it annoying just how few lines she had - once again.

I'm just saying that they put in a lot of macho content but not so much feminine content.

Well, it's a game about a soldier saving the galaxy. FShep isn't exactly the image of conventional feminity. I'm not sure what kind of feminine content you mean in this context. You mentioned resolving conflicts with words, but that's hardly gender-specific activity either, and there's plenty of that in the game, as well.

Conrad's wife might enjoy the picture of a female commander in
general, but what wife wouldn't pout if the husband brings home a
poster of an adorable woman and puts it on the wall?!

As I said, Conrad is obviously talking about himself, just using his wife as an excuse. Though it doesn't seem that he's admiring the Commander as a sex-symbol, but genuinely idolizes her for her heroic reputation.

But as i said, i leave that to the designers, if they want femShep to be masculine, why not.

I really don't see FShep as masculine even as she is. She is a professional soldier who needs to above all else to give a strong example to her crew. Being a tough pro isn't automatically unfeminine.

[A Fhaol Bhig]

All I want is a different playthrough when playing as either Gender.

Males and Females are perfectly capable, I know one girl who broke a guys face with punch. She broke her hand yes, but she did do it. Than she kicked him in the stomach and cussed at him. I should mention she weighs 111 pounds, and looks (in the standerds of modern society) absouletly gorgeous. Just because she's tough, doesn't mean she isn't femmine. She'd have no trouble headbutting a Krogan, does that make her less of a girl? No. I mean she has hips, and yes, she swishes while walking, that doesn't mean she isn't capable of breaking your arm if you touch her. She already joined the Marines, and I know she's going to be one of the best recruits their. Because she's tough and strong, being a girl has nothing to do with her capabilities.

5 page arugement summed up for me here: I don't care for either gender to act to their role to the T, I just want an altered playthrough for each one, different in small areas so it gives the feeling of something new and different.

And yes I'm a guy.

Modifié par A Fhaol Bhig, 28 février 2010 - 02:27 .

[AsheraII]

I know a very femine girl, stands just 5 ft tall, C cup, can walk on stilettos like a model (though she prefers flats), whereever she goes men stare at her and have to restrain themselves from whistling.

She's also been a a karate champ and could easily break the spine of most men, including the fake marines who will probably call BS on that idea.



Lethal and sexy women do exist. They're not common perhaps, but when a woman puts her mind to it, she can definitely outperform a man who doesn't. Idiots who believe men are unquestioningly superiour to women are first to fall because they're simply not prepared.

[Kuhkren]

I understand the desire for a difference in playing the female and the male, but why does there only have to be one option? I like in ME2 playing as female shepard because she wasn't really that feminine, essentially a tough soldier dedicated to her duty with a serious demeanor. What I am seeing on here is that people want a more feminine and sexy shepard, sure, but I would rather not lose the cold competent b**** I like to use. Women don't have to act very feminine, as I'm sure many female marines do, and they don't have to overcompensate for their gender which the femshep doesn't come across as doing. To me femshep and maleshep share similar personalities, not mental gender associations.

Edit: On the subject of women being weaker than men for the game Shepard uses a gun most of the time and striking arts rely less on muscle mass and more on speed on contact and technique. The running slower is godd*** stupid in my opinion, if you train in that armor over time you will adapt. Considering you are just sprinting to cover any difference in gender in my opinion is negligible. Longer distance sprinting and endurance, yes there will be some differences between genders in trained athletes. Also lifting the gun, its called training. The muscle will be built and become effective from training. Because you are big and buff doesn't mean you can carry a gun well. A good example is one of my old teachers who could hold her baby in her arms for hours while her husband became tired after twenty minutes in spite of being a consistent and strong weight lifter. You are training the muscles for different purposes, constant pressure or bursting in that situation.

Modifié par Kuhkren, 28 février 2010 - 03:23 .

[A Fhaol Bhig]

AsheraII wrote...

I know a very femine girl, stands just 5 ft tall, C cup, can walk on stilettos like a model (though she prefers flats), whereever she goes men stare at her and have to restrain themselves from whistling.
She's also been a a karate champ and could easily break the spine of most men, including the fake marines who will probably call BS on that idea.

Lethal and sexy women do exist. They're not common perhaps, but when a woman puts her mind to it, she can definitely outperform a man who doesn't. Idiots who believe men are unquestioningly superiour to women are first to fall because they're simply not prepared.

My point exactly.  How a person acts, should be the judge of what they are capable of, not Gender.

Kuhkren wrote...

I understand the desire for a difference in playing the female and the male, but why does there only have to be one option? I like in ME2 playing as female shepard because she wasn't really that feminine, essentially a tough soldier dedicated to her duty with a serious demeanor. What I am seeing on here is that people want a more feminine and sexy shepard, sure, but I would rather not lose the cold competent b**** I like to use. Women don't have to act very feminine, as I'm sure many female marines do, and they don't have to overcompensate for their gender which the femshep doesn't come across as doing. To me femshep and maleshep share similar personalities, not mental gender associations.

*nods*
I don't want sexy dancing shepard, but I do want something different, mostly just dialouge wise. I mean, not matter how much you cry for it, Shepard is never going to change beyond "get the job done" male or female. No amount of swish added will change that.

[Kuhkren]

-A Fhaol Bhig Quote



Agreed, especially different dialogue for each gender would be lovely.

[A Fhaol Bhig]

Kuhkren wrote...

-A Fhaol Bhig Quote

Agreed, especially different dialogue for each gender would be lovely.

I'm not saying like 100% different diaglouge, that would be insane.

But like 40% different, I only notice differences in the major conversations, or a few minor ones.

[Kuhkren]

Of course, I had no intention of appealing for completely different dialogue just some difference is good for me.

Modifié par Kuhkren, 28 février 2010 - 03:40 .

[A Fhaol Bhig]

Kuhkren wrote...

Of course, I had no intention of appealing for completely different dialogue just some difference is good for me.

haha, I meant like instead of this:

MaleShep: I'm going to punch you

It'd be like this

FemShep: I'm going to kick you

Thats what I meant when I say different dialoge, just enough of a difference in alot of the conversations to make a minor varience. Thats what I want more off.

[xxSgt_Reed_24xx]

Honestly, It's not about any of the stuff y'all are talking about....

its the work involved. For bioware to make them different, have different movements, dialogue, etc. would be more work and bioware doesn't wanna do it. LAZY

so you get the same stuff with both genders.... copy/paste style.

That being said.... I'd like less giraffe neck out of armor please. Better looking bewbs out of armor and a different walk when NOT wearing armor (should walk the same as MaleShep in armor cause that ****'s heavy lol).

Modifié par xxSgt_Reed_24xx, 28 février 2010 - 03:55 .

[A Fhaol Bhig]

xxSgt_Reed_24xx wrote...

Honestly, It's not about any of the stuff y'all are talking about....

its the work involved. For bioware to make them different, have different movements, dialogue, etc. would be more work and bioware doesn't wanna do it. LAZY

so you get the same stuff with both genders.... copy/paste style.

That being said.... I'd like less giraffe neck out of armor please. Better looking bewbs out of armor and a different walk when NOT wearing armor (should walk the same as MaleShep in armor cause that ****'s heavy lol).

*coughs*

[xxSgt_Reed_24xx]

A Fhaol Bhig wrote...

xxSgt_Reed_24xx wrote...

Honestly, It's not about any of the stuff y'all are talking about....

its the work involved. For bioware to make them different, have different movements, dialogue, etc. would be more work and bioware doesn't wanna do it. LAZY

so you get the same stuff with both genders.... copy/paste style.

That being said.... I'd like less giraffe neck out of armor please. Better looking bewbs out of armor and a different walk when NOT wearing armor (should walk the same as MaleShep in armor cause that ****'s heavy lol).

*coughs*

*gives you Halls breezers cough drop*

feel better? 

[LiquidGrape]

I wish people would stop deferring to the heteronormative of what constitutes femininity.
Shepard kicks ass just fine the way she does.
- Please don't start molding her into a definition of gender.

Modifié par LiquidGrape, 28 février 2010 - 04:11 .

[Kuhkren]

LiquidGrape wrote...

I wish people would stop deferring to the heteronormative of what constitutes femininity.
Shepard kicks ass just fine the way she does.
- Please don't start molding her into a definition of gender.

This. What I said in a nutshell.

And Fhaol variation is nice indeed.

Modifié par Kuhkren, 28 février 2010 - 06:47 .

[AngryFrozenWater]

A little update... Currently there are about 100+ votes in and it turns out that a lot of people seem to play as a female Shepard. So, keep this thread alive to get some attention from the devs.

[A Fhaol Bhig]

LiquidGrape wrote...

I wish people would stop deferring to the heteronormative of what constitutes femininity.
Shepard kicks ass just fine the way she does.
- Please don't start molding her into a definition of gender.

I wish you would actually read the thread, or at least the posts on this page and see that not everyone is doing that.