235 réponses à ce sujet

[Kusy]

I just finished my first ever FemSep game of Mass Effect 1, I imported the save game to Mass Effect 2 and played around... everything was fine. And then I decided to do the Kasumi mission because I was like "I would love to see that dress FemShep gets in action"...

So after seeing Shepard walking and running like a transvestite before learning how to walk in high-heals:



And then I closed the game and started a new game of Mass Effect 1 with a male Shepard.

Seriously, as far as my love for BioWare goes - this is just sad. So I'm bumping this thread for greater justice.

[Ryzaki]

MsKlaussen wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

JojiGirl wrote...

 are you saying I'm whining?? If you are, I'm not. So many people just don't realize that it offends female Marines they talk about them like they're not females. Female Marines talk about that kinda stuff all the time. Males are naturally stronger than females, eveyone knows that.......at least they should. You would be surprised how many beautiful sexy women people see all the time, and don't even know they're a Marine. Nothing says you can't be sexy and strong at the same time. Also, nothing says a female has to be strong as a male to kick some butt. Shep doesn't use fist anyway,  Shep uses guns and biotic and tech powers. Physical strength has nothing to do with either of those

???

I never said you were whining.


Edit: Though yeah I may have been a little harsh. I really am getting sick of the F!Shep isn't feminine enough. She's a soldier. She shouldn't have to be feminine damnit.

But it's the lack of a middle ground in virtually every case that I've read on here that shares your viewpoint, that is truly perplexing.

Nobody is saying they expect FemShep to curtsy or run to Garrus to have her spiders killed. There is enough room in the game I believe between that and allowing for her to cross her legs while seated in a dress however. Wouldn't you say, or does her 50 pounds of casual clothing prevent her from pulling that off?

And yes, she actually should have to be feminine, if she's going to be an option in the game and there truly is meant to be more to a female lead character than the addition of boobs and a Pouch of Purportedly Everlasting Delights. Otherwise, what did you include a woman as an option for? Being a soldier wasn't justification enough to preclude Bioware from programming EDI to tell FemShep to get out of the men's bathroom though...

All of this attention to detail everywhere but the animation of the main character was too much
trouble?

Where pray tell is the lack in middle ground? What did I say "OMG no BW don't make a new animation rig for femshep!!!"

I have no problems with seperate animation rigs. I just don't want her swinging her hips to bloody high heaven like KOTOR. <_<

Right so FemShep should be feminine...in what way exactly? Maybe its because I'm a tomboy but whenever I hear people go on and on about female mannerisms I want to roll my eyes. And I wouldn't want FemShep to cross her legs in a dress. (Would actually prefer she simply closed them. I dislike males and females sitting with their legs gaped open.)

That said it would be nice if we got two versions of femshep. One uber feminine version and another tomboyish version. (That said the animations do need fixing because they simply do not work with the body model which is annoying).

Frankly I see myself as pretty much on the middle ground. But of course you see that one comment and jump on it so what does it matter? 

Modifié par Ryzaki, 12 mai 2010 - 10:41 .

[Kusy]

@Ryzaki... women don't walk the same way men do. And it's not chauvinism - that's anatomy. And it doesn't aply to Mass Effect 2

[Ryzaki]

Mr.Kusy wrote...

@Ryzaki... women don't walk the same way men do. And it's not chauvinism - that's anatomy. And it doesn't aply to Mass Effect 2

Edit: I know that. I said that the animations didn't fit the body.

Which is why I think the animation rig should be changed. But whenever I hear the word "feminine" I can't help but assume the wide hip swaying which frankly irks me because I do not walk that way naturally or no.

And then I notice something ridculous. Everyone brings up feminine mannerisms but once you bring up the fact that FemShep as the best of the best should have lower stats than Male Shep as the best of the best people jump down your throat.

And granted I understand why BW wouldn't take strength away from FemShep and give her dex or something and vice versa for Male Shep. (Would probably increase replay value if they gave male/female Shepards different strengths, weakness and specializations).

Modifié par Ryzaki, 12 mai 2010 - 10:48 .

[Kusy]

Ryzaki wrote...

Mr.Kusy wrote...

@Ryzaki... women don't walk the same way men do. And it's not chauvinism - that's anatomy. And it doesn't aply to Mass Effect 2

Edit: I know that. I said that the animations didn't fit the body.

Which is why I think the animation rig should be changed. But whenever I hear the word "feminine" I can't help but assume the wide hip swaying which frankly irks me because I do not walk that way naturally or no.

And then I notice something ridculous. Everyone brings up feminine mannerisms but once you bring up the fact that FemShep as the best of the best should have lower stats than Male Shep as the best of the best people jump down your throat.

And granted I understand why BW wouldn't take strength away from FemShep and give her dex or something and vice versa for Male Shep. (Would probably increase replay value if they gave male/female Shepards different strengths, weakness and specializations).

Ahh... don't forget the boobies jumping up and down. Joking.

[Ryzaki]

Mr.Kusy wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Mr.Kusy wrote...

@Ryzaki... women don't walk the same way men do. And it's not chauvinism - that's anatomy. And it doesn't aply to Mass Effect 2

Edit: I know that. I said that the animations didn't fit the body.

Which is why I think the animation rig should be changed. But whenever I hear the word "feminine" I can't help but assume the wide hip swaying which frankly irks me because I do not walk that way naturally or no.

And then I notice something ridculous. Everyone brings up feminine mannerisms but once you bring up the fact that FemShep as the best of the best should have lower stats than Male Shep as the best of the best people jump down your throat.

And granted I understand why BW wouldn't take strength away from FemShep and give her dex or something and vice versa for Male Shep. (Would probably increase replay value if they gave male/female Shepards different strengths, weakness and specializations).

Ahh... don't forget the boobies jumping up and down. Joking.

Actually I'm not going to lie.

I used the toggle in MGS4 to jiggle Naomi's Rosemary's boobs. :innocent:

Edit: wait was it Naomi? It was one of the female characters. They're all equally bland.

Ah it was Rosemary. No wonder I forgot.

Edit: Except for Big Momma and Boss of course. Don't want to get the mess beaten out of me.

Another edit: Though I'm wondering why doesn't Miranda's boobs seem to move at all? Or is it just me? And Samara's looks...weird.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 12 mai 2010 - 11:59 .

[Gundar3]

I probably play more of femshep than maleshep (mostly because of the voice acting), so I support her walking a bit more feminine and her crossing her legs when she sits for some conversations.



I also have to say that Im not really outraged and it wont break anything for me... But it was very evident during some conversations when she just.... lounged...

[silentassassin264]

I would be content with them allowing her to dance and walk like a female.

[Ryzaki]

slimgrin wrote...

silentassassin264 wrote...

I would be content with them allowing her to dance and walk like a female.

She dances just fine in ME1. They sure fixed that, though.

I'm just wondering why on earth does she and MShep do that strange shuffle abomination. I'm not asking for star level dancing that normally takes weeks of training but jeez. Seriously BW none of you guys can dance? Really? 

[Onyx Jaguar]

Ryzaki wrote...

Mr.Kusy wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Mr.Kusy wrote...

@Ryzaki... women don't walk the same way men do. And it's not chauvinism - that's anatomy. And it doesn't aply to Mass Effect 2

Edit: I know that. I said that the animations didn't fit the body.

Which is why I think the animation rig should be changed. But whenever I hear the word "feminine" I can't help but assume the wide hip swaying which frankly irks me because I do not walk that way naturally or no.

And then I notice something ridculous. Everyone brings up feminine mannerisms but once you bring up the fact that FemShep as the best of the best should have lower stats than Male Shep as the best of the best people jump down your throat.

And granted I understand why BW wouldn't take strength away from FemShep and give her dex or something and vice versa for Male Shep. (Would probably increase replay value if they gave male/female Shepards different strengths, weakness and specializations).

Ahh... don't forget the boobies jumping up and down. Joking.

Actually I'm not going to lie.

I used the toggle in MGS4 to jiggle Naomi's Rosemary's boobs. :innocent:

Edit: wait was it Naomi? It was one of the female characters. They're all equally bland.

Ah it was Rosemary. No wonder I forgot.

Edit: Except for Big Momma and Boss of course. Don't want to get the mess beaten out of me.

Another edit: Though I'm wondering why doesn't Miranda's boobs seem to move at all? Or is it just me? And Samara's looks...weird.

Western developers put 0 resources in "jiggle" physics

[Ryzaki]

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

Western developers put 0 resources in "jiggle" physics

Yeah I noticed. 

I actually don't mind jiggle physics as long as they don't jiggle so much you start to cringe and wonder why the hell isn't she in pain.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 13 mai 2010 - 02:25 .

[Gundar3]

which they should

[Ryzaki]

Gundar3 wrote...

which they should

Yeah to me this: 

Is reasonable where's this:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0n5BEawIB0M&feature=related is just a wee bit creepy.

But that's more of Silent Hill's fault than the breast physics.

But the way they twitch is just...creepy.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 13 mai 2010 - 02:29 .

[Onyx Jaguar]

Yeah DOA Xtreme is an abomination... I bet it has killed the franchise since that is all they are pumping out... everything about those spinoffs are horrid especially the breast physics...

[MarginalBeast]

FemShep should have more natural animations, but her personality and dialogue are just fine.

JojiGirl wrote...

Second, RyrineaNara, yes, I have seen PLENTY of real female marines, have you? Because the way you're talking it seems the only females marines you have seen are the ones on tv...now THOSE are stereo-types. Anyway, I have plenty of friends AND relatives who are female marines and you know what? EVERY ONE OF THEM CARRIES THEMSELVES LIKE A LADY!! They wear make up, put on sexy clothes, hell most of them even have really sexy walks. well, except my friend Candice, but she's always been a tomboy. So yeah, what does be a marine have to do with FemShep being a lady?? You spend to much time watching movies. Also so you won't get hurt later, a LOT of female marine HATE when people talk about them as if they're no longer women....it really pisses them off......really...

Goddamn, you keep going on and on and on about women being "sexy". Guess what? Shepard has better things to worry about than looking sexy. Plus her body only looks "better" in her armor because of all the padding. Because, you know, it's armor.

According to you, being a lady = wearing sexy clothes, wearing make-up, etc. I guess I'm not a real lady then! Shucks!

And yes, many female marines act like stereotypical females. I know a few myself. There's nothing wrong with that. But that also doesn't mean they're all like that, and that certainly doesn't mean Shepard should be.

Modifié par MarginalBeast, 13 mai 2010 - 04:50 .

[Doctor_Jackstraw]

Jennifer Hale is obviously the reason why femshep is so popular


I wouldn't mind them featuring femshep on the cover in 3 (It's her turn damnit!), although they really should update that default face model to be as high class as maleshep.

[Ryzaki]

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

Yeah DOA Xtreme is an abomination... I bet it has killed the franchise since that is all they are pumping out... everything about those spinoffs are horrid especially the breast physics...

Oh god.

/shakes head at the thought of DOA.

I don't know what they're doing anymore.

[Gundar3]

You mean they dont normally shake violently like that??

I gotta stop getting my anatomy lessons from DOAX :innocent:

[MsKlaussen]

Ryzaki wrote...

MsKlaussen wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

JojiGirl wrote...

 are you saying I'm whining?? If you are, I'm not. So many people just don't realize that it offends female Marines they talk about them like they're not females. Female Marines talk about that kinda stuff all the time. Males are naturally stronger than females, eveyone knows that.......at least they should. You would be surprised how many beautiful sexy women people see all the time, and don't even know they're a Marine. Nothing says you can't be sexy and strong at the same time. Also, nothing says a female has to be strong as a male to kick some butt. Shep doesn't use fist anyway,  Shep uses guns and biotic and tech powers. Physical strength has nothing to do with either of those

???

I never said you were whining.


Edit: Though yeah I may have been a little harsh. I really am getting sick of the F!Shep isn't feminine enough. She's a soldier. She shouldn't have to be feminine damnit.

But it's the lack of a middle ground in virtually every case that I've read on here that shares your viewpoint, that is truly perplexing.

Nobody is saying they expect FemShep to curtsy or run to Garrus to have her spiders killed. There is enough room in the game I believe between that and allowing for her to cross her legs while seated in a dress however. Wouldn't you say, or does her 50 pounds of casual clothing prevent her from pulling that off?

And yes, she actually should have to be feminine, if she's going to be an option in the game and there truly is meant to be more to a female lead character than the addition of boobs and a Pouch of Purportedly Everlasting Delights. Otherwise, what did you include a woman as an option for? Being a soldier wasn't justification enough to preclude Bioware from programming EDI to tell FemShep to get out of the men's bathroom though...

All of this attention to detail everywhere but the animation of the main character was too much
trouble?

Where pray tell is the lack in middle ground? What did I say "OMG no BW don't make a new animation rig for femshep!!!"

I have no problems with seperate animation rigs. I just don't want her swinging her hips to bloody high heaven like KOTOR. <_<

Right so FemShep should be feminine...in what way exactly? Maybe its because I'm a tomboy but whenever I hear people go on and on about female mannerisms I want to roll my eyes. And I wouldn't want FemShep to cross her legs in a dress. (Would actually prefer she simply closed them. I dislike males and females sitting with their legs gaped open.)

That said it would be nice if we got two versions of femshep. One uber feminine version and another tomboyish version. (That said the animations do need fixing because they simply do not work with the body model which is annoying).

Frankly I see myself as pretty much on the middle ground. But of course you see that one comment and jump on it so what does it matter? 

Ummm...

"But it's the lack of a middle ground in virtually every case that I've read on here that shares your viewpoint"

I think I made it fairly clear that I was referring to a multitude of different posts expressing the same thing. Not just yours. Now as to that middle ground:

I'm athletic and always have been. I've played softball, run track, played tennis, trained in Aikido, and played volleyball all my life. I am in extremely good shape. I do not run or walk in a way that could be mistaken for a man in a million years. I've put on my brothers football equipment and still could not have had my movement mistaken for that of a man.

You can be as tomboyish as you want to be and I'm quite sure that your body still does not move like it has muscle density that does not appear on a woman.

Women walking around using male mannerisms and behaviors are either gay, mocking someone, or looking patently ridiculous. Just like women who sag their pants down to mid-thigh so they can look "gangsterish" like men, or roll cigarette packs up in their shirts, spit on the floor, grab their crotch, burp out loud, snot-rocket, or do anything else that they think makes them look like Bowser from Sha-Na-Na. It just doesn't work. So...

Middle ground, is somewhere between that, and Jessica Rabbit. Shepard's animation in ME1 was the middle ground. Why does "middle ground" turn into "uber feminine version" when you say it? And why to so many who are so vehemently opposed to a realistic representation of a woman's mannerisms and body motion in this game must the next step be to completely alter the character so she can barely perform the actions required by the game because a realistic woman should be "weaker" than a man?

You know, it's almost as if there are people playing this game who actually think a man can be hit in the face by a rocket and survive, who feel hustled when they see a woman do the same thing because Bioware isn't "keeping it real". 

[Ryzaki]

MsKlaussen wrote...

Ummm...

"But it's the lack of a middle ground in virtually every case that I've read on here that shares your viewpoint"

I think I made it fairly clear that I was referring to a multitude of different posts expressing the same thing. Not just yours. Now as to that middle ground:

I'm athletic and always have been. I've played softball, run track, played tennis, trained in Aikido, and played volleyball all my life. I am in extremely good shape. I do not run or walk in a way that could be mistaken for a man in a million years. I've put on my brothers football equipment and still could not have had my movement mistaken for that of a man.

You can be as tomboyish as you want to be and I'm quite sure that your body still does not move like it has muscle density that does not appear on a woman.

Women walking around using male mannerisms and behaviors are either gay, mocking someone, or looking patently ridiculous. Just like women who sag their pants down to mid-thigh so they can look "gangsterish" like men, or roll cigarette packs up in their shirts, spit on the floor, grab their crotch, burp out loud, snot-rocket, or do anything else that they think makes them look like Bowser from Sha-Na-Na. It just doesn't work. So...

You're right I don't move like a man. At the same time however I don't move like a average woman either. (Might be due to the fact that I shattered my left leg) and that sway my mother tried to instill in me tires me out.

And this is wear I fail to take you seriously because you're relying on sterotypes and blatant baiting. I actually use male mannerisms naturally because I *gasp* grew up around a lot of males. I don't do it for attention. It is a completely normal way that I act. Maybe that's hard to wrap your mind around but people often emulate what they're taught. You think effeminate males do it for attention? Or because it feels natural? Nice exaggerations though. I sit like a male don't realize I'm doing it half the time. I have a very abrasive "male" way of speaking. Because of who I  was taught and raised by. I have a very "masculine" like personality. As well as a supposedly "male" outlook. But of course I'm not you or fit into your experiences so apparently I don't exist.

Oh noes. I don't fit into predefined gender sterotypes. Whatever shall I do? <_<

Also: Nice on the whole butch lesbian sterotype. Really. I'm so impressed by your superior knowledge of the female mind. You obviously know enough to speak for all females in the world! What is your secret? 

Edit: Guess this makes me a lesbian. Because apparently me liking baggy jeans, big belts and my uncle's loose clothing as well as liking fighting with guys, cursing, rolling around in mud, joining in spitting contests, arm wrestling (and losing) making stupid bets, watching football (even though it bores me), watching basketball (which I actually enjoy) and playing said sports with men makes me a butch lesbian. Even though I've been attracted to men all my life and only appreciate females on a purely asethic level.

Hm...you somehow know more about me than myself and everyone in my life? 

What is your secret?!?

Edit: Hm...who knows I might not be a woman at all. With your superior knowledge of every woman's on earth mind I obviously must be a man.

All this time? And I never knew?!?

Middle ground, is somewhere between that, and Jessica Rabbit. Shepard's animation in ME1 was the middle ground. Why does "middle ground" turn into "uber feminine version" when you say it? And why to so many who are so vehemently opposed to a realistic representation of a woman's mannerisms and body motion in this game must the next step be to completely alter the character so she can barely perform the actions required by the game because a realistic woman should be "weaker" than a man?

You know, it's almost as if there are people playing this game who actually think a man can be hit in the face by a rocket and survive, who feel hustled when they see a woman do the same thing because Bioware isn't "keeping it real". 

I think you've completely misread my intentions. I actually want her animations to return to what they were in ME1. (Except for the dancing. The dancing was always terribad. Maybe not so much as ME2 but still pretty terribad.)

Also: What is wrong exactly with femshep being weaker in some ways than MShep? Why do people get so angry about that? It is realistic. I'm not saying that FemShep should be weaker than MShep just because she goes back to the way she was in ME1 but it is realistic. I'd expect FemShep to be more persuasive and able to trick males more easily as well. And for Male Shep to be slightly more intimidating (though MaleShep could stand to be a bit bigger) and for FemShep to be easier to talk to.

Also: As much as I exaggerated the feminity you exaggerated the gender differences. I have no intention of making FemShep a limp wristed bratty girl who can't tell the difference between similar guns and cries out for help whenever she gets in trouble. That's not making her slightly weaker than Male Shep that's making her pathetic.

However FemShep's punch will not have as much power as MaleShep's would. (Granted I doubt it matters seeing how X would go down anyways). Among other differences. As it is FemShep is just Male Shep with boobs. Whoopdeedo.

There's nothing wrong with acknowledging the differences and strengths and weakenesses of both genders. :mellow:Isn't this whole thread about that? But of course when it isn't in your favor all of a sudden its insulting and exaggerations.

Edit: Also you guys have made me see the light. I officially want FemShepard more feminine. :innocent: And it wouldn't really hurt to have some nice revealing casual outfits. The dress from Kasumi's outfit is fine but FemShep doesn't really work it like Miranda could.

Though I draw the line of stripper armor. I have some standards.

...

...

Maybe if there was decent boob physics and FemShep had some bigger boobs....

...

....

And a better face creator wouldn't hurt.



Disclaimer: The above post is filled with snark and sarcasm.

Except for the last bit.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 13 mai 2010 - 08:03 .

[Fraevar]

Oh Ryzaki - you made my morning, thank you!



In all seriousness, though. Yes, it would be nice to get the ME1 walk back, as well as a proper way for femShep to sit/move around in a dress, now that the DLC actually has her contextually doing that.



As for her punch not packing quite so much wallop - sure, but how are BioWare going to implement that in the game? Unless they start deliberately scripting encounters differently for maleShep and femShep, I don't see how they could get that point across. That being said, I wouldn't mind some more diversity between playing maleShep and femShep.

[Ryzaki]

Delerius_Jedi wrote...

Oh Ryzaki - you made my morning, thank you!

In all seriousness, though. Yes, it would be nice to get the ME1 walk back, as well as a proper way for femShep to sit/move around in a dress, now that the DLC actually has her contextually doing that.

As for her punch not packing quite so much wallop - sure, but how are BioWare going to implement that in the game? Unless they start deliberately scripting encounters differently for maleShep and femShep, I don't see how they could get that point across. That being said, I wouldn't mind some more diversity between playing maleShep and femShep.

Truth be told I just want more dialogue options dang it. And I know its just a pipe dream but it would be great if the game felt completely different depending on being a male or a female.

And truth be told I wouldn't mind different classes and abilities due to gender (of course then you get QQ'ing about why can't MShep do this! Or why can't FemShep do this! Which would get annoying quickly). Or heck different companions! (I think Star Ocean 2 spoiled me on that font). And even different endings and different events!

Of course BW doesn't have infinite resources so that's pretty much a pipe dream.

Though as it stands I just want FemShep's animations back from ME1. I'm not desperate and it doesn't break my game but yeah I'm watching her move now and yeah...she needs her animation rig back.

(Of course if motion capture was used this wouldn't be an issue but as the saying goes money doesn't grow on trees).

Modifié par Ryzaki, 13 mai 2010 - 08:28 .

[Fraevar]

Ryzaki wrote...

Truth be told I just want more dialogue options dang it. And I know its just a pipe dream but it would be great if the game felt completely different depending on being a male or a female.

And truth be told I wouldn't mind different classes and abilities due to gender (of course then you get QQ'ing about why can't MShep do this! Or why can't FemShep do this! Which would get annoying quickly). Or heck different companions! (I think Star Ocean 2 spoiled me on that font). And even different endings and different events!

Of course BW doesn't have infinite resources so that's pretty much a pipe dream.

I agree - more dialogue would be nice, the amount of non-combat solutions to problems in ME2 was rather small. The class/gender differences are probably not gonna happen, but if they added more dialogue solutions to problems, I honestly wouldn't mind getting stuck with the same classes. But getting the walk back would be a nice start. I honestly thought there was going to be more scenes like the one we had with Harkin in ME1 where he acts totally differently if it's a femShep than a maleShep.

Le sigh. Can only hope that now that they've gotten the combat to a point they like, that they actually spend time on these other things in ME3.